Chloe Sevigny was papped in NYC yesterday wearing a trash-baggy jacket over one of those tank dresses from the 1990s. On anyone else, this outfit would look ridiculous. The jacket remains hideous, but Chloe somehow pulls it off with her effortless, hipster ways. Chloe is one of those celebrities who disappears for months at a time and only gives interviews when she has a project to promote. She’s currently pushing The Cosmopolitans pilot for Amazon. The satirical show is about a group of expat friends living in Paris. Chloe plays a fashion editor.
The last time I spoke of Chloe, she was lamenting the jock takeover of NYC. Now she’s discussing how much she enjoyed filming on location in France. She also speaks out against the horrors of sample sizes. Playing a fashion editor meant wearing designer duds, and Chloe says her wardrobe was filled with size 0 clothing. Chloe is usually a 4 or 6. Talk about discomfort. I’ve cobbled together two interviews, one from Lucky mag and the other from Radio Times. Some highlights:
Her fave travel item: “Lavender oil. I like to put it on the pillow in the aeroplane or the hotel room. It helps me relax, especially when I’m dealing with jetlag.”
Filming in Paris: “I loved being there, and quasi living there. I really like Père Lachaise. I like cemeteries a lot. I love the gardens. My advice would be to sit down somewhere and people watch. Let yourself go and don’t feel like you have to run around and see everything. Experience it in the non-moving sense.
Her style changed in Paris: “I hear my mother’s voice in my head. She always told me ‘you better dress nicely.’ People treat you better when you’re dressed well. Which is true. I mean, she’s right–it’s really annoying. But if you’re traveling or in a restaurant and you look nice and have a nice bag, you’re treated better than if you look schlubby.”
Sample sizes on set: “It was a bit of a struggle. For me, wardrobe is always a bit of a struggle. They pull samples and then I’m left trying to fit into sample size, which is always a head trip. Instead of going shopping and buying, like, size four or six, I’m trying to squeeze into a zero. And that happens on photo shoots as well and it’s really unfair. I can’t imagine if I were any heavier or a different shape how much more difficult it would be.”
If she was a fashion editor IRL: “Oh, what would my fashion magazine be like?…I think I would have more real girls as models and less of this idea of young and skinny. I think I would have more street style. I always love those pages where they have more girls on the street. I’d have a lot of in-depth articles dealing with women’s heath and women’s issues–a bit like what Sassy magazine did, that kind of trailblazing.”
Her reading material: “I read New York magazine and I read The Atlantic. But I don’t really look at any fashion magazines right now, because as I said before, I’m having a fragile moment. It’s too hard not to compare.”
[From Radio Times & Lucky]
Chloe’s sample-sized clothing dilemma sounds awful. The wardrobe department had no way of making those clothes larger, so I don’t know how Chloe coped. Model Crystal Renn has advocated for sample sizes to be changed to an 8, which is much more reasonable. It’s possible to alter clothing down a few sizes if necessary (not vice versa). I guess fashion thinks it’s a lot easier for all models and actresses to stop eating than to bother with alterations. What’s sad is that sample sizes were usually a 2 a few years ago. Now they’re a 0. We’re moving backwards on progress of size acceptance, right? Ugh.
Photos courtesy of Fame/Flynet & WENN
Size 0 !!?? Pure nonsense
If models and actresses just refused to TRY to fit into sample sizes then they would probably increase as fashion houses want their fashions out there on display.
Models might have a tougher time but caresses? They could they just WANT to fit into them, wear them .. it might take awhile but eventually designers would stop making doll clothes.
If models and actresses “refused” to try to fit into sample sizes they’d just get new models and actresses to fit the clothes. Change has to happen at the designer level. The CFDA is encouraging designers to use larger models and make sample sizes bigger.
@ Sugar. Exactly. The individual women working as models and actresses face immense pressure to be thin.
Imagine going to work everyday and being told you need to lose weight. You need to be smaller. Sadly, it is part of their job to maintain an extremely slender physique. If they can’t make the size, they are easily replaced with women who can.
Hadlyb – ITA. I mean yeah for every woman with self respect there’s another waiting to undermine her efforts. Women didn’t create this culture but we sure as hell can try not to be complicit in it. As much as Chloe irritates me, I will give her props for not selling her soul to this industry.
They keep changing how small a 2 is though. Smallest stays the smallest size in measurements, but suddenly is called a 2, then it’s a 0, then it’s a 00. It’s called size inflation.
When I got married, I was a 0 or 2 in modern clothing, from regular retail and department stores. I wore my grandmother’s 1950 wedding dress (silk black and peach dress) for my rehearsal dinner, and it fit like a glove, though no room to gain even 2 lbs. It was a size 13. Size 6 was the equivalent in the 70s, and now the same size is about a 2. You could call it a 28, it’s still the same size. It’s just labeling companies do to make you feel good and buy their garment because you’re apparently a 4, and don’t you look good??
I was just thinking the same thing. What’s even the definition of a true size 0, 2, 4 or 6? At Banana Republic and Old Navy, I’m a size 0 (which I’m really NOT), but if I shop anywhere else, I’m anywhere up to a 6.
This is 100% true and the sizing is not even standardized between designers. Some marketing genius figured out if you call a size 10 a 6 and call a size 6 or 2, women will buy more clothes. We are too hung up on numbers, be it the ones sewn into clothing, the number on the scale or our age.
In 1985 I was a size 8 and now I weigh 20 lbs more and I’m still size 8!! hmmm that’s weird
HA – I am fairly old, but petite and fairly fit. I have worn (over the years in USA) A 7, 9, 11, 10, small, medium, and now – I have one pair of pants in size 8 that fit beautifully, but most are 10. Stretchy skinny jeans are a 12, petite sizes are even more bizarre. Size means nothing other than you are small, medium, large, short or tall. Purchase clothing accordingly.
I never bothered to find out what a 0 would be in EU sizing. I suspect insanely tiny. My left arm would possibly fit into a pant leg and that would be it.
These fashion people are pretty damn good at their job of mind f*cking us on a daily basis though. The vast majority of women cannot fit into a 2 or 4, much less a zero (I suspect, whatever that actually looks like) but somehow, most of us still think that’s the objective when really, the objective should not be for millions of women to try and adhere to the standards set by a small group of Anna Wintour lemmings. It’s kind of pathetic and still, I’m no exception. Look at Chloe for God’s sake, she has a fantastic figure and is still having a “fragile moment” after being subjected to this bs. Ugh.
I think a zero is a European 4. Next aspiration will be a minus. Awful.
Chloe looks great, always quirky, sometimes odd but what the hell.
Alright, I caved. When it doubt, google that sh*t. A size 4 is a German 34??? WHAT? That means we don’t even have 0 or 2. 34 is where it ends, anything smaller is children’s sizing. I can’t with this. …. Wait Kim K. claims she’s a size 34 then??? Someone help me out because I must be wrong here, yes?
A size 0 is the same size as childrens’ clothes here. Obviously the tailoring and styling is different, but yeah. I’m glad it exists, of course, because very thin women need clothes too and shouldn’t be relegated to the children’s department. And to be fair, it isn’t just size 0’s– the overlap goes all the way up to a US size 6-8, which is about 14-16 in US girls (I used to shop interchangeably between the two when I was transitioning into women’s clothes). But to make 0 or 2 the fashion standard, especially in an industry that emphasizes height (and thus the models should theoretically need bigger clothes to have a more proportional figure to most of the population)–that part is just weird.
And no, KK is not a 4 (or 34) anywhere but in her damn mind. Which is fine, so she should stfu about it.
We actually have 00 and XXS in the US, which is RIDICULOUS.
Size 00 and XXS aren’t ridiculous for the women who need them. I am very grateful when I see 00 dresses because I know they will fit my petite frame. I’m a healthy weight and height, but can’t do anything about being extremely small framed.
What’s ridiculous is not making smaller clothes for women who truly are petite.
What’s troubling is lowering the size numbers.
I took a theology of popular culture course from an older white male grad school professor about ten years ago. He said, “Women’s clothes are being advertised in Size Zero now. Think about that. Zero. What’s next? That they disappear entirely?”
He taught us to look at the sexualization of advertisements. Women in print ads for men’s products tend to look right into the camera, because They Want You. They are available. Men are often more removed, looking off into the distance. They could take you are leave you. That professor was a cool dude.
Don’t let’s disappear. No Matter Our Size, We Matter. Let’s be women of substance, unabashedly.
It’s bloody infuriating.
After your comment I tried to look for it but it seems to be practically non-existent. By logic it would correspond to something like a 28 (since an american size 4 is a 32 European). This is complete non-sense! I can’t even remember ever to wear something close to that, since from the moment I could use non-kids clothes I was only for a little while in the 32 (that in my country is the smallest you can find and not very often) and jumped immediately to the 34-36 and I was really very very slim (people would tell my mum to keep an eye on me since they thought I could have an eating disorder!). This is totally disgusting! Chloe looks healthy and thin and she shouldn’t care that someone thinks she should fit in kids clothes.
Yeah, I looked it up too. I found a 4 to be a 34 but sizing is iffy most of the time. Still, I very very rarely see a 32 in stores. If ever. 30 does not exist to my knowledge. Thank God.
LOL I’m confused. If this is really how sizes translate I can’t wrap my brain around it! And yes, how would Kim K. be a size 4??! This world…
I can’t really think of it in terms of EU sizing, I should have been more specific. I need German sizing. A US size 6 is a German 36, that much seems clear. Then we only have 34, which would be a US 4. That is incredibly slender and NOT what KK wears unless she’s only a foot tall. There seem to exist 2 smaller US sizes: 2 and 0. We do occasionally (!) have 32. Whether that would be 0 or 2, who knows. I don’t know anybody who would fit into that, even the smallest girl I know wears a 34. You would have to go to the children’s department or find a store that caters to smaller and larger people. I’m shocked. And hungry.
American size 4 is closer to a 36 or 38 Euro (not Italian, that would be a 40). When I was a size 2 I could wear 36s in France, when I was a (more comfortable) 4 I could wear 38s and most of my clothes are 38s as 36 is generally cut too small in the armpits, etc. for my frame regardless of my weight.
A euro size 34 would be like a US 0. And there ARE much much smaller women than me because I consider myself a Medium – I am often a Medium, sometimes a Small and when I wear a Small I think “what do all those smaller people wear?”
@ littlemissnaughty.
I don’t agree with a 36 being a 6. No way. More like a 4. A German 32 would be close to a 0 I think.
I remember being in the States when I was about 13-14 and it was just around the height of everyone clutching their pearls over Calista Flockhart’s frame on Ally McBeal. I picked up a size 0 skirt because I wanted to see just how small she was compared to me. I could get that skirt around my thigh (1.76 m and at the time about 48-50kg depending on the day). I just have to block out the fact that clothing sizes like 00 exist now.
I’m a size 36 in Europe and have found that to correspond to a size 4 in US sizes, so a size 0 would probably be a 32.
I only have one person in my acquaintance who fits a size 0, and she’s 4’11” and 98 lbs. Sometimes the zero sizes are too large for her – because the trade off to being that tiny is that she has very straight hips and very small breasts. It’s ridiculous to consider that the standard when so little of the population fits that demographic. We wonder why there’s so many eating disorders on the rise in young people – just look at what we’re establishing as a media standard!
I used to be self-conscious about my body, and then I realized just how miserable I was trying to punish myself for the things I couldn’t change. You can’t “fix” bone structure, and I wouldn’t want to. I love who I am now and won’t apologize for it. It’s pointless, anyhow – with all the vanity sizing these days, the numbers are fundamentally meaningless. I have clothes in my closet ranging from 6-12, and I’m sure there’s a few 14s that may be lingering around from European brands. I dress how I want to flatter my body, not when the industry thinks my body should be.
The outfit in the top photo is amazing. She’d fit right in here in East London.
I LOVE that outfit! She has great legs.
Why does your name say you’re “opriginal”? Has it always said that, am I just didn’t notice?
You down with OPP (yeah, you know me)?
Her legs are amazing!! Covet.
Lol @TheOPrigionalKitten, come on, come on, now let me tell you what it’s all about!
I agree, I especially love the tank dress, but maybe I am stuck in the 90s? I love how they are simple but feminine at the same time because they tend to float over curves.
Those legs. Sigh…
She does have killer legs. Actually, her body is ridiculous. As frumpy as they made her in Big Love, the skin scenes always had me so envious of her figure.
Her body is def all that. I still remember that famous nude spread she did, I think during BL first season?
Killer body. Those legs!
She has my ultimate celebrity body jealousy.
I love how honest she is without sounding self-pitying. Her comment on not reading fashion mags because “it’s too hard not to compare” is the stuff of a lot of women’s lives.
Chloe doll, you look hot as lava. The sample sizes are too tight because they can’t contain your personality. 🙂
I love your comment, INeedANap!
I definitely intend to tell at least one person today that they are as hot as lava!
If I thought like that I’d have to avoid all media and trendy suburbs.
INeedANap, I love your comment! 😀
She has perfect body!
Agree! Amazing legs.
+1
I get it for designers if they want to see how their clothes “hang”. Typically the skimny models we see are easier to use as a ” blank slate “.
BUT, 0 shouldn’t be the only sample size. I get why they’d use 0 for step one in designing and showing. (But they really could go back to size 2 and that would be at least a step in the right direction.) I don’t understand how they don’t have a few sizes on hand to lend out. That’s ridiculous.
“I think I would have more real girls as models and less of this idea of young and skinny.”
Young and skinny women are “real” too, flesh and blood. We need to get away from this language that suggests some women aren’t actually human beings. Just a pet peeve.
Also pet peeve? Dude’s key chain hanging in the one spot where it *really* shouldn’t be hanging.
I hear you, but I think people just mean that the vast majority of us don’t have the same weight and build at 30 that we did at 14. Some do, but probably 90% don’t. Yet the fashion industry behaves as though all adult women have their 14 year old body. I don’t think it’s intended as a slight to those who do. Maybe “realistic” would be a better term than “real.”
Exactly. It would bother me more if the comment was coming from someone who wasn’t slender, it would seem like a put-down but I think she’s really just advocating for variety and FTR, I agree with her.
I agree that his “real women” language is not great but I have no problem with what she’s saying here, mostly because “young and skinny” go hand in hand in her comment. Young and skinny may be real for 16-year-olds but it is NEVER a reality for someone over 30, at least not by what the fashion world sets as a standard for both attributes. I would say that young and skinny is not realistic for most women. It’s not the norm.
ETA: Ha! @GNAT Didn’t see your comment before I posted. 🙂 Yes, I agree.
“I think that young and skinny is not realistic for most women”
On a long enough time line it’s not realistic for any woman. But I’m told the secret to feeling young and skinny is to hang around with people who are older and fatter than you.
Wise words. Now please tell my friend to go to town on the nearest buffet! 😉
I think she’s specially referring to models. In magazines and on catwalks and uber styled by designers. When she’s talking about ‘real women’ she means women literally walking down the street. She even goes on to talk about people’s street style and what they pull together. Even the skinniest girls I see walking around don’t look like the models in the magazines.
I agree with the general scope of what you’re saying, but the flip argument is – how many of those models are exhibiting their “real” build? Some of the articles on the crash diets these women perform before shows are ridiculously unhealthy. Look how much weight Tyra Banks gained after she moved out of modeling and into media. She still looks great, and I don’t doubt she takes care of it still, but there was obviously pressure to keep her body at a size lower than it naturally falls. I exercise regularly and keep an eye on my calories*, and I guarantee you that I will never have a model build. Even at my smallest, when I was walking/biking an hour to work back and forth every day, working out 3-4 times a week, and eating healthy, I didn’t fall below a 6/8. I think the actual intention of her statement isn’t suggesting these women aren’t “real” but more the idea of where the median falls outside of the industry. How realistic is it that most women can achieve or maintain that form naturally? How many even within the industry have to go to extremes to maintain it?
*Not obsessively. I have a neurological disorder that facilitates impulsive eating. Tracking it via my phone just allows me to keep an eye on it.
That is absolutely insane. For frame of reference: I am 5’1 and 105 lbs’ and I can’t even wear a zero most times. Usually a 2 and sometimes 4. When I weighed 98 lbs in high school I could get into a zero.
So how skinny are these chicks that are 5’5 or 5’8? They have to weigh somewhere in the 90’s. That is severely unhealthy and disturbing!
She has a great body and though she’s a bit strange she is a very talented actress
One great thing about living in Seattle– because all the rich people were computer schlubs, customer service people were generally nice to to everyone because they didn’t know if they were serving a broke hipster or a millionaire.
🙂
What am I missing? Why don’t they get her clothes that fit her? Because it would be too expensive and they wouldn’t get the clothes free? I couldn’t fit into clothes two sizes too small. How does she do it. I’m confused.
If they want something from the latest collections, there wouldn’t be any bigger sizes available yet. Hence the samples. You would need a much bigger name and budget to get a designer to make larger versions of very recent collections. They would’ve had to put her in “older” clothes and I guess they didn’t want to? I can’t fit into something two sizes too small. No way.
Oooooooh. That makes sense. Thank you!
But you’d think if the designers would like their work to be featured on a show, they’d send over a size that actually fit the actress.
They obviously have to make bigger sizes if they sell retail, so they should be designing to that as well.
It really depends on the designers they chose, she doesn’t specify. But like I said, it depends on the designer because some of them don’t need the exposure. In fact, the big brands might even think it tacky. IF they had to go out of their way to supply the clothes. I don’t think Tom Ford would make a dress in a size that fits Chloe before the collection goes to retail only to be featured on that show.
Some of the stuff on the runway never makes it into retail stores, or is changed considerably before it does. Some is only available in very limited runs. Some of it is on the runway 6 months before manufacturers are ready to start producing mass quantities. Some of it’s so expensive to produce it’s only put into production after orders have been taken, so unless the TV show is ordering and paying the full price they aren’t going to get anything but samples.
And the big designers don’t need this kind of exposure. In fact the TV shows and movies and most magazines need them far more. Someone like Tom Ford for example has no interest in doing anything more than sending out samples he’s already had made for other purposes because he doesn’t need to put any more effort in to that side of his business.
She looks fantastic in that black lace dress… although I think I would prefer it without the white puffy shoulder/arm thing. But I guess that’s what makes the dress different to all the other black lace dresses out there??
since this is really only a celebrity problem, cant her publicist or manager or whoever just ask for some bigger sizes?
That’s what I was trying to ask. I don’t understand.
It could be that they’re trying to put her in really recent stuff that just went down the runway – in that case there may be only one or two “samples” of the design – in the model size 0?
I honestly don’t know how the size 0 thing is possible except on very small framed women or petite women.
I mean for someone who is 5″6.5 and medium framed that’s an impossibility with a capital I unless i want to look like the human skeleton.
But what baffles me is that surely not all models are smallframed(taking into fact their tallness) ? I mean how can a 5’10 woman with medium or large frame wear a size 0?
Well she wouldn’t be a model, in that case. Models are TINY… you don’t realise it until you see them in real life, tall with a petite body type. I remember how shocked I was when I saw Natalia Vodianova… her waist is the size of my thigh! And she’s had 3 kids!
It’s just down to genes really…
They are now, but they didn’t use to be sooo tiny.
The Cindy, Naomi,Claudia Supermodels had figures and were size (Cindy )6 yes that’s slim, very slim, but when I saw Cindy, she looked like a pretty, healthy tall slim lady with hips and boobs, and Claudia tall slim, with but with a shape.
Now the models are so thin it’s crazy.
I don’t know how those girls get down to size 0 it’s insane, unless they are naturally that size.
Some old modeling cards. Cindy is listed as size 8 on one card and 7 and 6 on another.
http://forums.thefashionspot.com/f96/famous-models-past-comp-cards-60403.html
Yes I live in NYC and during Fashion Week you do see a lot of working models hustling from point A to point B.
They look like spiders. But it is genetics mostly. Tall spider people.
Cindy and Claudia and Elle and a lot of the famous 80’s and 90’s models weren’t really the standard runway model even then. They were the exceptions, and the runway stuff was a bit of a sideline for most of them.
They were more like VS models or SI models are today. They had to keep a bit of weight on because their real money came from make-up brands, swimwear brands, lingerie brands etc., not the Chanel runway. Someone like Stella Tennant is more representative of what the majority of runway models looked like then.
If celebrities hadn’t taken over there’d be more ‘supermodels’ with bigger frames today.
So when people get to this mythical size 0 do they get a prize or something?
A lovely, no expenses paid trip to your local hospital?
I wear a size 4 and I don’t think I could ever be much smaller than that. I think it would be physically impossible for me to fit into a size 0 even if I had absolutely no body fat. It really is a genetic thing to be able to fit in that size and still be breathing.
I have to ask. Is your screen name an x-men reference? If so can we be best friends? If not we can be best friends anyway.
I wish I was cool enough to say it is an xmen reference but its not. I’m still in the market for a best friend though if you feel like educating me in your comic book ways! I’ve always secretly loved those who dress up for Comic Con! 🙂
Crazy, my 13 yo is 5’1, 95lbs and a size 0. It is about infantilizing woman physically and psychologically. Like we should never progress beyond our teen years. My now 16 yo battled an eating disorder a few years ago and at 5’3 and 89lbs she got positive comments from grown women wherever she went. “You’re so willowy”, “I wish had I had your legs”, “You should be a model”. Grown woman who wanted to look like a 13 year old who was starving herself to death.
ah, so sad and true.
i was once 5’3 and 89lbs -right after my final growth spurt. i looked starved, even in pictures. as an adult people i know ask me if i am ill if i drop below 115lbs.
i think it is so sad that for some people, when you don’t know a person you idolize the thinness you think you should be but if you know the person there is concern for there well being and health.
there’s a terrible disconnect there.
i’m glad your daughter is recovering.
So true, and my heart goes out to your daughter’s struggles. Sometimes it just feels like the fashion industry is telling every woman “I hate your adult body! STARVE, bitch!”
I once had a nurse who was prepping me for a colonoscopy after I had lost 20lbs in 2 months and was down to 90lbs tell me I was so lucky I was so skinny!
No joke.
…??!!? Wtf is wrong with some people?
She needs to visit a Cancer ward to see how stupid she is.
How wonderfully sanctimonious! Do you think when asked about her role as a fashion editor, she should clear her throat and say, ‘Why are you asking about that when there are cancer wards in this world?’ Alrighty then!
How do you know she hasn’t watched one of her own loved ones die of cancer? Why don’t YOU visit a cancer ward, instead of complaining about a woman complaining about her little life annoyances?
We’re all dying, we all know it, but jesus people we still like to talk to each other about our trivial little issues and the banality of daily existence…
I might be in the minority here, but all I can think of her moaning about size 0 is STFU.
It reeks of Gwyn. Bitching about sample sizes, on the set of her show or a photo shoot? who is she kidding?
Poor baby, I am making millions but my clothes are tight for a few hours! Pity me.
true, that’s a good point
it isnt like she has to keep them or pay for them
She can’t win. If she was squealing about how fun! and amazing! it is to be able to wear size 0 fashion, you’d accuse her of bragging.
Within the context of the interview, I took her “it’s unfair” comment as a critique of the sizing of women’s clothes in general, not a personal complaint about how hard it is to have to wear size 0 clothes.
I honestly don’t see how people can fault her for speaking the truth.
I’d accuse her of bragging?
or “you’d” plural?
I can fault what she is saying because it comes across as entitled and whining. If she chose to take on the inequity in sizing for actresses and models because she felt strongly about it, then more power to her.
However, she is not doing that, she is moaning about the clothes samples sent to her not fitting, while doing photoshoots and her TV show. She sounds like Gwyneth Paltrow moaning about how hard it is to be a working mother.
I still fail to see it as complaining.
The fact that someone as thin as she is is STILL considered too large to fit into a sample size is pretty problematic. I like that she took the time to point that out.
Excellent comment, TOK. This is an issue that effects all of us, good for Sevigny for pointing it out.
TOKitten
I agree with that you are saying, it IS problematic, and a symptom of how women are perceived.
I also think she is not actually pointing out the problem to further change, but rather complaining that what she is sent doesn’t fit. Sent to her, for her photo shoots. It’s the context in which she said it, it reads to me as entitled and whining “it’s unfair”.
I suppose we’ll see, in future days, if she brings the topic up again, has any solution to her wardrobe issues, or if she was just moaning about it.
I’d like to add that in my defense, I tend to have a higher tolerance of celeb entitlement. Or maybe I have trouble recognizing it.
I’m able to stomach Goop’s crap better than most people as well…maybe something’s wrong with me.
Not at all, I am wiling to bet you’re a nicer person IRL than I am!
Is there actually one single person outside her immediate family who even remotely cares about this woman or her opinions?
Change it to a size 8? No, thank you. Try a size 2 and 4 instead of 0.
Fashion needs to be aspirational. It is not a ‘come-one-come-all’ buffet.
So everyone that’s not extremely petite or rail thin should just forget about it and wear mumu’s?
And I say this as a size 2 person, so, no, I’m not jealous. I just think everyone should be able to wear fashionable clothes.
I am talking about sample sizes. SAMPLE SIZES. Most brands won’t make clothing over a size 10 anyway. Even that is pushing it. But lifting sample sizes to a size 8? That should NEVER happen. Size 0 is extremely petite and unreasonable for the majority of the women/models over 22.
It is what it is. It is extremely difficult to be ‘fashionable’ when you are extremely overweight. btw, an overweight individual can still buy accessories, jewelry, make-up and perfume… which all make or break an outfit anyway. You can be stylish with those alone. Just not ‘fashionable’, but who cares about being fashionable when you can be stylish?
@ Al maybe I’m being a little oversensitive here, but did you say that you consider a size 10 “overweight”? Also, I wouldn’t call the fashion industry dictating a size 0 or 2 “aspirational” but “delusional’, but that is just me.
Like I said, maybe I am just a little sensitive and you didn’t mean any of that.
Meh, I’m a size 10 and I’m quite heavily overweight, in fact I’m edging very close to obesity.
I love her! Great actress, rockin body, lovely legs. But the sandals are gross with the dress.
At 5’4″ and running 10K races, I weighed 115 and was a healthy size 8 in 1980. Something tells me that sizing has changed. Oh, and Kim K lies. A lot.
yes, the sizing numbers have gone down while the clothing has actually increased in size, especially in the US.
vintage 50s-60s clothing in a size 8 is about a current size 0-2.
the lies we believe from marketing!
the truest indication of size is using a measuring tape.
Yep. My grandmother was considered pretty plump in her youth, but I have one of her old gowns which is labelled two sizes larger than I currently wear. I can’t get the damn thing past my calves.
It’s called vanity sizing. I started my adult life in the 1980’s as a size 5 and am now a 0 – and I haven’t lost a single pound. Size XS use to fit me perfectly and just recently I’ve noticed it’s starting to look big – and I haven’t lost any weight. I have a feeling the reason sample sizes changed from 2 to 0 is because the 0 of today is the measurements a 2 used to be years ago. And I say this as someone who experienced firsthand my own size go from 2 to 0 with no change in my body weight.
I don’t for a minute think that she is squeezing her size four frame into a size zero. Sorry, not going to happen without looking completely ridiculous and unfilmable. You can’t get a zipper zipped, buttons simply won’t close and fabric gets stretched in really unattractive ways. I’m an American 6; thinner than Chloe I’d guess from the pictures, but there is no way that you could stuff me into two sizes smaller. Physics still applies.
Sometimes they actually don’t zip zippers or close buttons. For example I’ve seen them use large clamps to hold a garment together. Of course there are terrible gaps, which they disguise with jackets, or blazers, or very deliberate camera framing. The technicians in film and television are incredibly talented, and have lots of little tricks to make seemingly unfilmable things beautiful onscreen.
Like the Windsor’s cousin, Zara Philips at a photoshoot, she was wearing a dress and look at the back!
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/11/13/article-2232253-160089AE000005DC-137_306x846.jpg
I loved her interview. She looks great in that photo. I love that she says she wears a four or six usually and that others in interviews like Kimtrashian always say they wear a two and I’m thinking, yeah, sure you are, from a few labels that adjust their sizes to make the rich happy. I’m not a six. I’m a two, a four.. I see that all the time by certain wanabees in interviews, bragging about the size two, like a four is unmentionable and forget a size six. LOL
I don’t need some of my actors or actresses to always be so perfect and saintly in interviews. If they are intelligent and are good at what they do, their quirks or arrogance at times doesn’t bother me. It sure beats the always perfect and celeb-friendly persona put on by many.
Why are we defining ourselves by a number? Who cares what size the outfit is considering sizing is arbitrary at best. If it fits well and looks good, great! Besides, it is the person inside the outfit that counts.
I remember when samples were size 10, then 8. That was in the eighties. I used to buy all the time at a store that sold them. I had the world’s most wonderful designer wardrobe!! Then the store closed (I have never recovered!). I guess it was because sample sizes went to 6 at the time, and no real people could fit into the 6, let alone 4, 2… 0! countdown clothes. Anyway, whatever, with menopause and all that… today I buy XL at Costco *sigh*.
Sample sizes have actually stayed the same for a very long time. But vanity sizing came along and what was once an 8 is now called a 0.
I have some old clothes from the 80’s in a size 10. I wear a size 10 now, but my new stuff is literally twice the size of my old stuff. My 80’s size 10 jeans are smaller than one leg of my current size 10 jeans.
I’m a size 6-8, I have not worn a size 0 since I was 11 or 12 years old. How ridiculous and extremely unfair to all women that sample sizes are set to a size 0.
I like Chloe, and her body is amazing. I also love love her brothers bar in NYC.
Old modeling cards from the 90s.
Cindy and Cristy Turlington , Christy Brinkly, Etc numbered sizes,
6, 7, even 8
I’m not advocating that size 0 is a reasonable size but when did we all get so fat that nobody can fit into a smaller sizes. Sample sizes maybe should be a little bigger but America needs to also get a little slimmer.
One reason sample sizes are now 0 is due to the cost of materials and making the item. Less material and labor means the sample is less expensive for the designer. I’m not advocating for samples that are size 0 at all, just trying to provide some context. It definitely doesn’t justify the body image issues the fashion world and society have caused.
can we please stop bashing women based on their sizes? (i’m not talking about chloe, i’m talking about some of the comments here.) everyone is saying how a “size 0 is not realistic,” how a size 0 should “be in the hospital.” one person commented on how she’s 5’1″ and still can’t fit into a size 0, thus a size 0 must be ridiculous. why does no one see a problem with this? if people say a woman is overweight, they immediately get criticized as insensitive for “fat shaming.” why do people then think it’s okay to shame women who are naturally petite and thus can fit into a size 0? (i’m not talking about models who are 5’11” and who fit into a size 0. that is most likely not natural, but i can’t know what’s natural without looking at someone’s genes anyway) why is it that people equate being a size 0 to being unhealthy, or unnatural, or infantilized? some women really are a size 0, and that’s their healthy weight. let’s not make people feel wrong for being where they (and their doctors) feel they are healthiest and happiest.
I hear ya. But at a certain point you have got to stop giving a sh-t about other people’s opinions. Caring too much about other people’s opinions is part of the problem.
Excuse me. I was the 5’1-er. I merely said I was a size 2 at 105lbs. I was not shaming myself. I was merely pointing out that much taller people (generally) would have to be extremely underweight, according to most bmi standards, to be able to fit into a size 0. And I didn’t say a zero was ridiculous for people who are actually at a healthy weight for their height and frame.
Very few people who are 5’8 or above who are wearing size zero are at a healthy weight. Yes of course there are exceptions, as with everything. Are you saying that the modeling industry is just fine, thank you, because all of those girls are at a healthy weight? Have you ever seen anything behind the scenes from modeling shows? These girls do not eat. There’s no shaming in pointing out that our culture has severe issues with body perception and eating disorders.
@sigh((s)): of course i’m not saying the modeling industry is “just fine, thank you.” if you re-read my comment, you will see that i said that models who are 5’11” and fit into a size 0 are “most likely not natural.” i recognize that models often go to extremes to fit into sizes their bodies can’t healthfully achieve. i don’t think extremes are every the way to go. statistics show the majority of our country is obese, so i was merely commenting at the fact that people get upset when someone is called overweight, but when someone is called too skinny, people think it’s okay. i wasn’t attacking you specifically. i was just making an observation about the comments on this thread in general, and i happened to paraphrase you as one of many examples here.
since you mention your original comment, i’ll clarify what i meant. i know you prefaced your height and weight by saying “for frame of reference.” however, you also said at 5’1″ you usually fit a 2 or a 4 (rarely a 0), and only truly fit into a 0 when you were in high school at 98 pounds. that seems to implicitly state that one cannot possibly be a size 0 as a fully grown adult woman because only a child (i.e. someone in high school) could fit a size 0. even if you didn’t mean too, which i’m sure you didn’t, you joined the ranks of women who infantilize smaller sizes. personally, i am also your height. at 5’1″ i weigh 100 pounds, and i do fit a size 0. i fit a 0 in high school, and i fit one now at 32 years old. every year i get a physical and always get a clean bill of health from my doctor, so he deems my weight adequate. does my clothing size make me better than women who fit a size 8 or higher? NO, it does not. it just makes me different. all body shapes and sizes are unique, and all of us ARE REAL. while i do think it’s dangerous to idolize a fashion industry that perpetuates BMI’s of < 18.5, i also think it's a sign of our country's complacency about obesity that the mere thought of anyone fitting into a size zero causes people to collectively clutch their pearls in shock.
Seriously, you can always count on at least one person piping up to complain about ‘skinny shaming’
I totally agree with Getittogether. WHY are all these discussions always about who may or may not be “too skinny” when the real problem is rampant obesity? Underweight people are rare. And while most people are simply not built to fit into a size 0 the fact is that the smallest size has not gotten smaller the name of it is just smaller now thanks to vanity sizing, a 0 was like a size 8 in the 50’s. Clothes are not getting smaller, sample sizes are not getting smaller, the average person is getting bigger and sizing systems are getting smaller thanks to out of control vanity sizing.
Annie, yes to everything you said! i couldn’t have said any of it better myself. vanity sizing is the new norm.
and to Bridget: why shouldn’t “at least one person” complain about skinny shaming? if people on this thread started fat shaming, MANY people would complain. overweight women deserve courtesy but thin women don’t? we should not size-shame anyone.