Day 1 of the DNC was pretty raucous. Everyone was still dealing with the fact that someone (coughRussiacough) hacked into the DNC emails, which led to everyone finding out the brand-new information that DNC chair Debbie Wasserman Schultz was pro-Hillary Clinton and very suspicious of Bernie Sanders. So Wasserman Schultz quit as DNC Chair on Sunday, and the aftertaste was still very bitter to the ride-or-die Bernie-or-Bust people. You knew the Bernie or Bust people had lost the thread of this thing when they BOOED Bernie Sanders at his speech early in the day.
Once the convention got underway last night, the Bernie Bros were trying to disrupt all of the speeches, chanting and booing throughout. Then former Bernie Sanders supporter Sarah Silverman came out to introduce Paul Simon. And that’s when magic happened. Even Republican operative Nicole Wallace called this one of the best, most compelling arguments for Bernie supporters moving their support to Hillary Clinton.
Her prepared remarks were compelling, and I do think the majority of Bernie supporters feel that way – they were for Bernie, but they’ll vote for Hillary. But the Bernie-or-Bust Bros don’t want to hear it. The unscripted moment comes around the 5:50-minute mark. Silverman and Al Franken had to vamp because Paul Simon wasn’t ready, apparently. Silverman tells the booing and chanting Bernie-or-Bust Bros: “Can I just say, to the Bernie or Bust people: you’re being ridiculous.”
The Bernie-or-Bust Bros also disrupted Cory Booker’s speech, Liz Warren’s speech and then they went a little bit crazy when Bernie Sanders came out at the end of the night. Here you go.
Photos courtesy of Getty.
A-a-a-a-nd she’s right. I understand their passion, their frustration, and their disappointment. But what I don’t understand is why they don’t understand that they won! We have the most progressive platform in history. That’s what we ALL wanted and I’m thrilled and grateful to Bernie AND his supporters for that. (For reference, I would vote for either Dem candidate because I know they’d appoint reasonable, thoughtful justices to the Supreme Court–and in this day and age, that’s all that matters.) But now it’s time to unify and put this platform into action. Let’s get it done!
–TheRealPinky
+10000
yesssssssssssssssssss
Spot on.
Well said.
If they believe in his message and platform, there is still a long road ahead, so they shouldn’t start of by shooting themselves in the foot with a Trump presidency.
and yet they are. . . they are calling silverman a sellout, digging their heels in deeper, complaining about the lack of empathy for them because they’ve been called out for being beyond rude chanting loudly most of speakers of color and women and crying that Clinton voters are harassing them and being smug (which is why they need to use their vote to protest ?!)
Because how many of those people genuinely cared about a Progressive plan? I don’t say this about all Bernie supporters but there is a large and passionate strain of them that wanted Bernie period. They weren’t well versed on politics, not particularly informed about the world. Despite being liberal they held many conservative beliefs and would resort to a racist sexist opinion in the safety of anonymous websites. They did NOT want Hilary and tbh I don’t think they wanted any woman. The second Bernie started trying to support Hilary they started switching their votes to Johnson or Trump. What does that tell you?
Eternal Side-Eye, I’m tempted to copy and paste your post in to Facebook (fully attributed, of course). You’ve summed this up so beautifully.
EHE – well said. This particular sub-group now calling Bernie a sell-out and worse were only ever Anti-Hillary people. They don’t care about the issues facing the nation and more importantly the solutions. They will shift their support to whomever but not before causing some real damage. Frankly they sound like a bunch of entitled brats.
If you believe the statistics about 90% of Sanders supporters now plan on voting for Hillary Clinton, which is actually a higher number at this point than Clinton supporters that planned on voting for Obama in 2008. As a big supporter of Sanders in the primary, I am actually pretty offended by your characterization of his supporters. I am and have been very politically aware and active and I supported Sanders policies and character over Clinton’s. However, I am now in that 90% of Sanders supporters and I will be enthusiastically voting for and supporting Hillary for president.
Jenny –
“I don’t say this about all Bernie supporters but there is a large and passionate strain of them ” I think that should clear it up. Side eye literally said she didn’t mean ALL supporters – only that there was a loud group of them that are like that. And it’s true. It’s 100% true – there were a lot of asshats that were acting like spoiled little kids when it came to this campaign. They were the ‘Bernie-bros’ type. Not the majority of supporters – but they were a loud minority.
@Erinn
Thank you.
@Jenny
I don’t really know how else to say I’m not speaking about all Sanders supporters as a whole without resorting to caps lock and multiple exclamations. I do not judge all Bernie supporters, they are not all the same, but there is a small and passionate group that does and says everything I mentioned. I can literally provide you with links of their comments and pushing for Johnson.
I understand that it is frustrating that some people view elections as more of a popularity contest and don’t pay attention to the policies or the consequences of their choices. However, Sanders supporters have been continually characterized this way.
When you say not all, but a LARGE and loud group of Sanders supporters, it certainly implies more than the 10% or so that fall into what you would call Bernie Bros.
ESE, I have to agree with Jenny. I too supported Bernie. I’ve been politically active my whole adult life. I am not a bro. I’m a middle aged woman of colour. I had no idea who he was until I started hearing about his political positions which aligned with mine. I volunteered on his campaign and attended a huge rally where I had an opportunity to meet with and talk to other supporters. They had very specific and thoughtful reasons for supporting him.
Obviously there are elements of his supporters who are problematic but certainly it is not the majority and the use of the word ‘large’ in your comment indicates that. Some Hilary supporters can be problematic, never mind what we’ve recently learned about the DNC and Wasserman Shcultz.
I seriously doubt that Hilary will follow through on the platform that has been set, though I would love nothing more than to see those ideas come to life and reverse the growing inequality in this country. I do think that if Trump wins, we will see a very ugly cultural environment of hatred toward marginalized groups. The amount of hate he has unleashed in his campaign is horrific enough, I can’t imagine what it would be like if he rules the country for the next 4 years.
@ ESE, I think you are correct about Hillary not putting in Bernie’s policies. But she won on her platform, which means there are more people supporting her. I hope the platform Bernie spoke about during his speech was truly agreed upon and there is a weaving of initiatives in the Democratic policies.
I am not American, so I am just an observer. But I don’t think there is a willingness among the larger American public to put in many of Bernie’s policies. They are too dependent on public funding (ie. taxes), and almost half the country vote for a party that believes in smaller government (unless it has to do with women’s issues and incarceration), and a chunk of democrats who aren’t willing to move that far to the left. When you think about how far your country has come in human rights legislation since B Clinton (DADT for example and 3 Strikes), there has been significant social progress.
Not to beat a dead horse, but I was just reliving the 2008 election where 50% of Clinton supporters said in exit polls that they would not support Obama for president (also threatened to make a scene at the convention, vote for McCain, etc.) and all of the seriously nasty racial and un-American based dog whistles blown by the Clinton campaign that year. I’m going to stop now before I make myself even sadder that the Obama presidency is almost over (and that we are losing Michelle as FLOTUS).
@ Jenny, yes, and we all voted for Obama after not disrupting the convention. No one cared to mollify us, no one cared to gentle us, there was no real talk of Obama having to choose Hillary as VP candidate. We realized after a few weeks of hurt feelings due to losing that it was McCain-Palin or Obama-Biden. And we voted Obama.
I’m truly not trying to be pedantic but I do feel something is being mischaracterized in my words either from reading too quickly or misunderstanding:
“but there is a large and passionate STRAIN”
Focusing on the part large and not strain is the mistake. If I had said there is a large and passionate streak I don’t think anyone would have doubted it meant a small but apparent diversion in the normal pattern.
Definition of strain:
a : lineage, ancestry
b : a group of presumed common ancestry with clear-cut physiological but usually not morphological distinctions ; broadly : a specified infraspecific group (as a stock, line, or ecotype)
c : kind, sort
a : inherited or inherent character, quality, or disposition
b : trace, streak
“I seriously doubt that Hilary will follow through on the platform that has been set,”
This is where the American people have the power, and they CHOSE not to use it.
If the progressives who support Bernie had been there for Obama, electing a progressive congress and causing a ruckus when congress defeats the causes supported by the American people, I’d have more faith in the Sanders movement. When it comes to legislation, the President has to sign or not sign what is in front of them which is created by Congress. If the Sanders supporters really want Clinton to hold tight to the platform, they need to apply pressure to congress consistently. They need to show up for midterm elections.
Exactly. And we have seen how Bernie supporters (“bots”) have treated women and primarily Black women online and have consistently condescended to POC voters, from straight up abuse to directly or indirectly claiming stupidity or lack of awareness or intellect on the part of those who would not vote for Bernie.
They are generally anti-woman and anti-Black, anti-POC. They do not represent a “progressive” movement any more than Hillary does. And the fact that they would resort to not voting, to basically casting their vote for Donald “neo-Hitler” Trump rather than vote for Hillary, tells us all we need to know.
Studies show that Black women have statistically saved this country’s ass voting-wise consistently, especially over the last few elections and the turnout will be even more so this election. So once again, you’re welcome, America.
You are really willing to put the blinders on if you don’t believe one or two people in the DNC chose the candidate.
@Anna
Well damn girl.
MyHiddles: no. We chose Hillary of our own free will.
Question is will the few holdout Bernie supporters show up in November and in two years?
Woot woot! Thank you!
No, she is not right. The Bernie supporters have every right to protest, especially given how the emails are showing that their campaign was deliberately squeezed out by the DNC. SS is the ridiculous one.
I had many younger relatives supporting Sanders. I feel foolish now because all their lives I touted the electoral process then Wikileaks dump implying a fix (one person basically deciding the nominee) was such a punch in the eye.
I wasn’t going to vote the same way as the younger ones, but they knew I wasn’t going to be sour if their candidate won. That’s the way the voting process is supposed to work. The people are supposed decide the President, & there were 8 votes to my one.
Now the process looks to be tainted, and a generation of people that grew up the rug constantly being pulled from under them got rug-pulled again.
Ummm. The DNC did the same thing 8 years ago to push Obama forward. Bernie was instrumental in coaxing the superdelegates in that direction.
Sanders is disingenuous.
You’re wrong about what the e-mails show. There’s a confirmation bias in your argument. The e-mails demonstrate that the DNC might’ve wanted a particular candidate, but nothing they did (and they didn’t really implement anything) impacted the outcome of the primaries. If there were a strong causal link for Clinton’s triumph, there would’ve been calls and a need for a lot more than DWS’s resignation. But there aren’t, because there wasn’t much ammo in those leaks Russia is trying to weaponize in order to disrupt our democratic process. As many have said, Sanders could’ve run as a progressive on a progressive ticket, but chose to run as a democrat and push a far-left leaning agenda. He got so much of that agenda put onto the party platform, that anyone who is still griping about “unfairness” and “disenfranchisement” is unequivocally privileged and likely blindingly white. They’re people who are too young to understand what compromise is–who’ve never negotiated for anything in life, and, therefore, are in for a rude awakening when they finally get their first jobs out of college. Because it only gets harder and less idealistic. Welcome to reality, folks. Now grow up.
–TheRealPinky
@Pinky
“They’re people who are too young to understand what compromise is–who’ve never negotiated for anything in life, and, therefore, are in for a rude awakening when they finally get their first jobs out of college. Because it only gets harder and less idealistic. Welcome to reality, folks. Now grow up.”
You’re so right about not understanding/being willing to compromise when you’re young.
The others, though, older white men, Susan Sarandon…. no excuse except selfishness.
Pinky,
That’s exactly it. My relatives that preferred Sanders are all young, they’ve not seen the willow bend of politics before. I lived through Watergate trials, etc.,
They are hurt and angry that their candidate went no further than he did. And at their age, I would have been angry, too.
It’s like Cat Steven’s “Father and Son”- comes a time when we all understand both verses.
She IS right. I was so glad she said that.
The Bernieorbust crybabies literally booed over John Lewis’ and Elijah Cummings’ speeches earlier in the day, and for that alone they should have been punched in their mouths and had their credentials taken away. I am so offended that they would behave so disrespectfully to a Civil Rights ICON. Bernie has done NOTHInG compared to Lewis and Cummings.
It’s all so #whiteprivilege and gross. If they don’t consider themselves Democrats and don’t want to vote for the Democratic nominee if it’s HRC, then they need to leave the convention.
I agree with you 1000%. I wonder how many of them are even aware of Lewis’ and Cummings’ achievements. Disgusting.
@Alex
“The Bernieorbust crybabies literally booed over John Lewis’ and Elijah Cummings’ speeches earlier in the day, and for that alone they should have been punched in their mouths and had their credentials taken away. I am so offended that they would behave so disrespectfully to a Civil Rights ICON. Bernie has done NOTHInG compared to Lewis and Cummings.”
Yes.
This x100000 White privilege never stops rearing its ugly head…
Thank you Pinky well said! I supported Hillary in ’08 and then (happily) voted for Obama. That’s how it should be. Support your candidate but if that doesn’t work out, support your party.
SUPREME COURT! SUPREME COURT! SUPREME COURT! I will continue to scream this at the top of my lungs at any Bernie Busters that refuse to see the light. This isn’t about YOU, this is about the big picture of our nation, for decades to come. We are looking at at least TWO appointments in the next four years. For this reason alone, those supporters should be terrified of a Trump presidency.
And keep your passion for Novemeber, of this year and many, many more to come. If you want to affect change, it starts from the bottom up. Vote local and don’t get lazy. We need a Congress that is willing to compromise. Get started there. For a lot of young people, this was their first dip in the political pond. Do not be disillusioned. I’m a Hillary supporter but I respect the tenacity of Bernie’s supporters.
The Bernie or Bust Bros should realise it’s now Hillary or Hell.
I don’t understand why everyone is upset that people are becoming passionate about politics. This is exactly what we should want and what makes a democracy work. Why are you alienating the people advocating for a positive change in this country. Dismissing them as “bros” is not helping your case. Why not provide reasons why these people should vote for your candidate? That would be the “adult” thing to do.
Also, this is possibly the least progressive platform at this point. We keep voting for more of the same and complain when things don’t change. A vote for Hilary is a vote for keeping this countries policies in the dark ages. Prepare yourselves for a war in the Middle East over oil by next spring and an even greater wage gap. I hope everyone can afford to get by for the next four years. x
Helen, people have provided reasons on here ad nauseum! I don’t recognize your screen name, but I’m going to assume you’ve been here.
And this is the most progressive presidential platform of my adult life. A vote for Hillary – note the two ‘Ls’ – is a vote to keep the country going in the right direction. A vote for Stein is one you may as well cast into the toilet.
You want continued progress? Don’t let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
@Betsy
Once again we are forced to choose between two white, wealthy, privileged people with proposed policies that are at least 20 years behind our first world counterparts. Please tell me how this is progressive? And now people are being bullied for wanting something more progressive? If you don’t vote for Hillary, then you must support Trump who is racist (and simply not qualified to be president). It is a terrible position to put people in.
@Anna,
yes, yes, and yes. The misogynistic air of the Bernie bros is remarkably disturbing for people who claim to be so progressive. Not to mention, the Bernie or Bust people don’t really seem to have legitimate reasons for being anti-Hillary other than slanderous views and name-killing.
Today’s little walk out protest is a good example. There were women (!) holding signs edited to say, “Not Her.” Its really interesting to see the internal misogyny these Bernie or Bust women deal with.
Yes!
Signed,
A thankful Bernie supporter who is voting, proudly, for Hillary
Again I say, we’re a nation of eleven year olds. So flipping embarrassing. I voted for Bernie, too, but guess what, he’s not the candidate now. Move the F On!
His former spokesperson took to Twitter last night later the hack and flat out said no cheating occurred and they lost. Bernie sent out a letter via Twitter with basic instructions to behave during the convention. Then after Bernie’s speech when he laid out why Secretary Clinton was the better candidate and gave his endorsement , some of his supporters were interviewed and they said they were still not convinced and will do a write in. SMH.
One 66 year old man stated he would rather Trump as POTUS over Hillary because Trump would be out in four years and how much damage could he wreak in four years? That’s when I gave up on Bernie supporters and claims of their progressiveness. Much was accomplished by dedicated, hardworking people. A roll call will be done so Senator Sanders supporters can state their choice on the floor of the DNC and show the support that exists for the changes they believe in. They can give Senator Sanders his due. Yet many actually believe their voices remain unheard.
As far as I’m concerned you are cutting off your nose and spiting MY face. If you really believe what is coming out of your mouths than, yes, you are correct. Your voice is NOT being heard because you are saying nothing.
“Trump would be out in four years and how much damage could he wreak in four years?”
Those people must have been sleeping when G. W. Bush was president. Twice.
Anyone asking how much damage Trump could do as president in 4 years should look at how much he did as a candidate in just two. The amount of hate crimes, criminal actions, negligence and lies linked to this man should make anyone pondering break out into a cold sweat.
Just his obsession with Megan Kelly is enough to make me go hell no.
Same as you: I’m a Bernie supporter who is moving on.
I don’t know how to handle adult humans that act like this.
I’ll tell you how – they are the ones whose lives will not be directly negatively impacted by Trump in the short run.
From the (small) sample of my facebook friends – it is only the middle/upper class white males that are running around saying they won’t vote for Hilary because Bernie or nothing. The rest (minorities, people with massive student loans, women) tend to be leaning towards the ‘anyone but Trump’ side, even though they were previously Bernie supporters. (again – this is a narrow sample from my fb friends, but I think it’s pretty indicative)
That is spot on Clare. It’s easy to say all or nothing when you won’t lose either way.
Clare, frustratingly enough, I do know gay and POC Bernie or bust people. I just don’t get it. These are all adults who are 30 plus, too. They all agree they hate Trump and that he cannot win, but say they cannot vote for the “corrupt, lying corporate shill” Hillary. Well those are your only two options people! Voting for Jill Stein or Gary Johnson or writing in Bernie is throwing away your vote and giving it to Trump.
@Shark
I’ve seen a few of those people too and at least in my experience they can’t even quite tell you why the current system is so bad expect in the most general terms. Most couldn’t fully elaborate on Bernie’s plans and I started to get the feeling they were just tagging along for the ride because they were connected enough to that original core group (white young male) to think they were all in this together and could weather the storm with snarky comments and stubborness.
@sharkbat lucy2 I recall a slogan from when Chiraq was up agaisnt Le Pen in France some years ago – something along the lines of ‘we’ll take the crook over the fascist’ – blows my mind that seemingly intelligent/educated american’s dont get that.
Not suggesting Hilary is a ‘crook’, but she certainly is viewed as one by some people who will let trump take office based on unsubstantiated (based on who you talk to, I suppose) allegations.
I live in Canada as a dual citizen, so on paper it would seem I would be protected from a Trump presidency, but that’s so wrong. I have the security of my retirement funds, my Social Security and Medicare to think about, right alongside opportunities for me and my family members and friends, right alongside the welfare and continued existence of the ENTIRE FRIGGIN’ PLANET.
I am disgusted with the short-sighted and self-centered dithering of people who want to protect their delicate “consciences” or who think they live in “safe states” electorally. There are no true safe states. And if you really think you live in one, go campaign in battleground states. Waste your vote whereever you want, but help people who actually act as if theirs matter.
Same @kitten. I voted for Bernie but he lost and he lost by over 4 million votes. Even without the superdelagates he still lost. So in November I’m voting for Hilary. Our system system doesn’t run on what ifs, its about the votes. I’m embarrassed what the Bernie voters did last night and they were 100% being ridiculous.
If you are a woman or love one do not vote for Trump/ Pence! Pence is so anti choice he wanted women to not be able to terminate severely birth defective pregnancies and weirder if she was trying for a baby and suffered a miscarriage he wanted to force cremation/ burial which costs $3,500 – $10,000. I mean think about the kind of awful guy he is. Anti gay and anti all the Bernouts ideals to boot. Stop being crazy and realize you need to vote for your beliefs local and nationally! I am with Hillary because similar stance on the issues as Bernie and she is not anti everything free and good about America!
“If she was trying and suffered a miscarriage he wanted to force cremation/burial”
Oh. my. goodness. I stopped and thought about that for a while. He is one sadistic f&#$.
Indiana just sentenced a woman to 20 years in prison because she had a miscarriage that they said was feticide. It is a really tragic story all around.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/04/01/indiana-woman-jailed-for-feticide-its-never-happened-before/
What the hell.
The more you look into Pence the more scared you should be! I am 43 and for the first time in my life I live somewhere that family planning choices are limited. If I accidentally got pregnant here in Wi gov. Scott Walker has taken safe accessibility and made it harder than ever. I would have to go 100 miles to Madison WI. I really want to get out of here after family aging issues are resolved and go back to WA state. They tell you not to vote out of fear but they give women good reason to be scared of not having control of their lives!
See, Susan… this is what grown-ups do.
As an aside, regarding a discussion about white privilege…THIS (Bernie or Bust threads) is where it belongs… where it’s real.
Yes! Susan looked like a spoiled brat all night long. Whoever would have guessed that Sarah Silverman would outclass her. Sarah Silverman = Grown Up Goddess.
And Rosario could learn from Sarah too.
Yes. Rosario, too. I agree.
And, BTW, celebrity privilege (and stupidity) is, more often than not, colorblind.
I was really getting irritated in advance of FLOTUS’ speech, thinking she was going to be booed too. I don’t think I heard any then, though. Did anyone?
You do not boo FLOTUS. Don’t even think about it.
I was worried about that too. The heckling of speakers was so disrespectful. Yes, the Bernie or Bust people have a legitimate complaint concerning favoritism. However, Hilary got the most votes, the primary was not rigged. Get over it. Your guy lost and he has endorsed Clinton.
Exactly. Trump is the enemy; he is horrifying.
@lisac. are you serious? your dismissive attitude appalls my non-american brain. it’s like, “meh, black people have been historically disadvantaged by the system but who cares. at the end of the day, white people got more money,powerful position. get over it. ” you literally sound like that. there was a fundamental rigging against Bernie but you just get over it? wow.
@pretty – whoa, comparing the plight of African Americans to what’s going on with Bernie is a bit too much. Yeah, maybe he was not treated fairly but it’s politics unfortunately. Remember 2000?
@pretty – there was no rigging. None.
If you read the emails, there was no actual rigging. Just discussing why Bernie in a national election wouldn’t work.
Hilary won. Bernie conceded. No one is asking for the Bernie supporters to be silenced but damn…how rude to be so disruptive to Warren and Booker and everyone else last night. At least they were polite to FLOTUS.
@pretty
That is an inaccurate and offensive comparison.
@pretty. There is no evidence whatsoever that the primary was rigged. I say that as a Bernie supporter, who actually worked on his campaign and with “get out the vote” initiatives. I have worked my ass off for the Democratic party since I turned 18 in 2000. I saw first-hand the unmitigated disaster that was the Bush-Gore race that year and I certainly don’t want another disastrous “republican” Trump in office. Trump – who is (at best) an unknowing stooge for Putin – and (at worst) colluding with Putin and Russia to influence this election Plus, Trump’s racism, sexism, etc.
Again, the primary was not rigged. Yes, there was favoritism – there is always one favored candidate, but that does not mean that the primary was rigged. For it to be rigged, there would have to be much more plotting and organization at the state and regional levels of the party. Each state has its own rules for primaries and caucuses. Nothing in those emails shows that there was anything but suggestions back and forth between DNC higher-ups – no actual plans taking place. At this point, Hilary had millions of more votes than Sanders. I was on Sanders campaign at the times of those emails, and he was already thinning out his regional offices. He knew that he wasn’t going to win at this point, and as much as I would have liked to have seen a President Sanders, I am happy that he (with other progressives) have pushed the party platform left. THAT was the true Sanders victory.
I find it really offensive that you take my comment and equate it with white supremacy. I know that this is an anonymous internet message board and that you know nothing about me – but I am half Black and I am proud of my heritage and I think that I know a little bit about how it feels to be discriminated against in the US. My grandmother marched with Dr. King to Selma, and members of my family have fought for the civil rights of African Americans, Hispanics, and immigrants for decades. You know, the people that Trump and his cronies are targetting? We don’t have the safety blanket of white privilege if Trump gets in the White House.
@pretty. No, it’s not like that at all. This election is not about theoretical arguments or hurt feelings for not realizing that politics is a nasty game. It’s about keeping a psychopath from having the nuclear codes; It’s about not having a Supreme Court that will roll us back to the 1950s. All this other $#!+ can be addressed after the election. Right now, we need to come the eff together.
@pretty, perhaps your “non-American brain” shouldn’t be preaching on subjects you’re misinformed on. And stop with the attempting to drag race into this. For all you know, Lisac is a black woman, and here you are, trying to explain to her how she should be feeling as an American – which you know nothing about. Someone’s being dismissive – YOU.
@Betsy bahaha you didn’t read the leaked emails did you. you think switching votes is the only rigging? DNC has to remain neutral but they intended to make hilary the nominee from day 1. and they tried to come up with a strategy to smear bernie from various angles. it’s unbelievable how dense people are. wow
@lisac. That was a beautiful, measured response to a ridiculous accusation. Thank you.
@Pretty, rigging would have kept his name off ballots and contrived some way of making it difficult to vote. None of that happened. His name was on ballots. His voters had the same access. He got to appear in debates. Nothing was rigged. She got more votes. It is that simple.
@pretty
So why did your candidate decide to run as a democrat after years of condemning them and being an independent?
What was his motivation there?
When it comes to something like ensuring we don’t roll back to the 1950’s or have presidential candidates imprisoning women who get or seek abortions the DNC didn’t have a lot of love for the curmudgeonly old man who suddenly switched parties to be more popular.
Oh @pretty – maybe think twice before you start accusing people of things and bringing in really very serious issues of race and inequality… I don’t think you’ve read the leaked emails because yes there was favoritism but there was no rigging – check what Bernie’s own former rep had to say. In fact – even if there WAS rigging, you comparison is still offensive given the history that you are alluding to.
@mytake – Wait, “politics is a nasty, immoral game of power” but the people booing throughout the convention were still “disrespectful”? And @Kitten, you said the DNC was “neither the time nor the place to throw a tantrum” regardless of “whether their reasons for feeling disenfranchised were valid or not.” But if the Democratic Party’s big meeting isn’t the place, then where is? I think the degree to which Booker supports the charter school movement or merit pay for teachers could be considered disrespectful to both teachers and students. I think Warren’s contention that it is a “moral imperative to support and defend Israel” could be considered disrespectful to Palestinians living in apartheid. But there could also be some nuance in their proposals, some grains of truth I’m missing.
I was a Bernie supporter, and I recognize without reservation that Bernie neither earned the nomination nor did he win in terms of popular votes. I recognize without reservation that Hillary Clinton is a better candidate than Donald Trump, and she’s the ONLY candidate on the ballot that stands a chance of beating him (even though other candidates might be more in line with my personal politics). But I just don’t get the impulse to want to silence these objectors, ridiculous and out of touch though they may seem. The Republican Party is a damn mess, but just because Hillary is a better candidate than a man as buffoonish and volatile as Trump doesn’t mean the Democratic Party doesn’t need to be reminded what a disaster it is. True there may be better ways than infantile booing during an organized meeting, but outright dismissal of these objectors at their party’s own convention confuses me. It’s their convention, too. The Democratic Party should be embarrassed of itself, too.
@lisac – I second what SusanneToo wrote, what a greate response. I honestly don’t know what set @pretty off cause it can’t have been your original comment.
@pretty – just don’t. Learn how to talk to people before you venture on another comment section. If you have to resort to rudeness and ridicule to get your points across it’s time to reevaluate what you’re trying to say.
I think the legend of “the emails” is more damning than what is actually in the emails.
@pretty
I could be wrong about the exact number, but, I believe there were 7 out of 16,000 emails that suggested ways to disable Sanders…they were all, summarily, rejected.
@Iyka – I cannot speak for others, but I don’t think anyone is trying to slam the supporters or protestors for their dedication, hard work, passion and fundamental beliefs. They definitely bring value to the policy platform and process. It is the people who would vote for Trump over Clinton without sound reason just because they are mad, and those who are booing every speaker up on the DNC stage. They want their voice heard, but they aren’t willing to allow others to speak. It is hypocritical and counterproductive.
Yes, Pretty, I did. Six out of 20,000 had something of interest. Sent after it was mathmatically impossible for Bernie to win.
Bad words do not a rigging make. Do not take down the little progress we have made because you know politics was ugly.
@pretty its true, Hilary got over 4 million votes than Bernie. She won, period.
In the coverage that I saw, some of them turned their backs on her or put their heads down and didn’t look up or clap. All because she endorsed Hillary, the actual candidate. Also, I’m sure the RNC had a candidate they wanted that wasn’t Trump and wanted to keep him out of the running, yet he still won the vote. Hillary won the vote because she had the support of African Americans and older democrats. I love Bernie and voted for him, but he is not the candidate and no magic will make him be. I have seen grown adults wishing for some sort of miracle at the convention, hoping Hillary “does the right thing” and steps down giving the nomination to Bernie. Fat chance, this has been Hil’s lifetime goal.
I had no worries about people booing FLOTUS. Michelle Obama seems a wonderful woman and she would not put up with such nonsense. She would respectfully put those people in their place. In public. On television. In front of millions.
Ugh, please ignore my reposted comment above!
It comes to a point where or you accept this choice or you bust and ler Trump win. Do the people who likes Bernie prefer this scenario
I think many of them do. I watched when MSNBC interviewed three young B or B supporters at the end of the night and they were so misinformed, so full of the Fox version of Hillary. I believe they really don’t care if a megalomaniac and his crass family move into the WH, anyone as long as it’s not Hillary.
I hope their friends and family call them out. It is just sad to see alleged liberals spouting Fox quality talking points. It reaffirms my belief that a lot of people hate Hillary for really awful reasons they can’t articulate – like sexism, for one.
Few of the Bernie or bust people will be adversely affected by Trump policies. And the ones that will be adversely affected are too ignorant to understand the severity of their choices.
This is the real problem. They are the ultimate self interest only voters and a Trump presidency would actually favor their demography in many ways. Their boos are a middle finger to every minority. I’m so tired of those dbags
My friends who don’t fit the typical Bernie or Bust stereotype really confound me. They will say oh we hate Trump, but Hillary is an evil liar. They are getting their info from facebook memes and their pothead older cousin who hates that “corporate Wall Street shill.” My cousin is gay and she was going on about how she hates Hillary and that one of her high school friends worked for the Clintons and mysteriously disappeared and that crossing them in any way leads to death. I was like, “Sure, Jan.” Since Trump picked Pence she says she will vote for Hillary, but only for the Supreme Court picks and because she is really voting for the democratic party.
Thank you. THIS. Being a Hillary supporter, being happy she won the nomination, and wanting her to win does NOT equal disrespecting the right of Bernie supporters to have and express their own viewpoint. But as a fellow citizen of the country – for that matter, the world – whose future will be affected by YOUR VOTES, I have every right to ask Bernie or Bust people to take a really hard, honest look at the choice before them, and what each option means for ALL OF US. Because the choice is now Hillary or Trump, no matter how hard you might wish it otherwise. If we had 100% turnout (ha, never) and every last anti-Hillary, anti-Trump voter in the U.S. united behind one write-in or 3P candidate, it wouldn’t be enough – they’d just be spoiling, most likely in Trump’s favor.
If you really honestly believe that a Trump win is “still better than Hillary” then I’m confused as to how you even supported Bernie, frankly, but that’s your right. But we’re sharing this country, and whatever future our votes produce, we’ll share that, too. So I BEG you to reflect honestly – not wishfully – on whether “President Trump” (and the multi generation impact of a Trump-packed SCOTUS, not to mention a man like Pence being your day-to-day real chief exec) is a future you’re willing to inflict, just to teach Hillary a lesson. Because Hillary – disappointment aside – will be fine. All the people Bernie championed? Less so.
People really need to stop with this, “I’m going to vote for the Green party” nonsense. Doing that is a vote for Trump. It’s really not that effing complicated.
Must admit, after watching 3 Bernie-or-Bust backers on MSNBC last night, I’m scared. And WHOA was I filled with my first true surge of get-off-my-lawn energy. The terrible 3 were vapid, whinny, self-absorbed know-it-alls.
Yep.
I was furious during Elizabeth Warren’s speech, a true liberal in the Senate, and they were really almost overpowering her speech and message, because it continued throughout a good portion of her speech with the chanting “We Trusted You.” I guess they were all bent out of shape because she is supporting HIllary for POTUS now since she is the nominee.
Yes! The disrespect shown to Cory Booker and E. Warren had me old lady yelling at the TV, “Disrespectful!”
And look, I get it. People feel disrespected. But come on. Politics is a nasty, immoral game of power. Always has been, always will be. If people don’t think — don’t KNOW — that the GOP is manipulating the media in the same way, well, they’re living in a fantasy bubble. Even the Green Party has some ugly skeletons in its closet. It just seems incredibly naive to think politicians always play above board. Yes, it’s mostly theater, because how the sausage actually gets made is uncomfortably messy. As a party, we need to grow up and realize this. Because being forced to watch and stomach some sausage-making is a damn site better than letting Donald Trump, essentially, pick the next Supreme Court.
Regardless of whether their reasons for feeling disenfranchised were valid or not, that was neither the time nor the place to throw a tantrum.
Very disrespectful to Mrs. Warren and Mr. Booker.
@mytake
I think a lot of them previously didn’t have much interest in politics based on the levels of misinformation they spouted and Bernie through a simple message made them feel like politics could be idealized. Like it could all be so wonderful with free colleges and the world becoming perfect.
Note, I’m not mocking Bernie or the idea of trying to create cheaper college but rather this Disneyfied version of him many of his supporters had. Same with Warren. She was a goddess to them a few weeks ago, once she stopped fitting their fantasy she became another person to insult.
@mytake – Wait, “politics is a nasty, immoral game of power” but the people booing throughout the convention were still “disrespectful”? And @Kitten, you said the DNC was “neither the time nor the place to throw a tantrum” regardless of “whether their reasons for feeling disenfranchised were valid or not.” But if the Democratic Party’s big meeting isn’t the place, then where is? I think the degree to which Booker supports the charter school movement or merit pay for teachers could be considered disrespectful to both teachers and students. I think Warren’s contention that it is a “moral imperative to support and defend Israel” could be considered disrespectful to Palestinians living in apartheid. But there could also be some nuance in their proposals, some grains of truth I’m missing.
I was a Bernie supporter, and I recognize without reservation that Bernie neither earned the nomination nor did he win in terms of popular votes. I recognize without reservation that Hillary Clinton is a better candidate than Donald Trump, and she’s the ONLY candidate on the ballot that stands a chance of beating him (even though other candidates might be more in line with my personal politics). But I just don’t get the impulse to want to silence these objectors, ridiculous and out of touch though they may seem. The Republican Party is a damn mess, but just because Hillary is a better candidate than a man as buffoonish and volatile as Trump doesn’t mean the Democratic Party doesn’t need to be reminded what a disaster it is. True there may be better ways than infantile booing during an organized meeting, but outright dismissal of these objectors at their party’s own convention confuses me. It’s their convention, too. The Democratic Party should be embarrassed of itself, too.
@ Iyka. I don’t want to silence anybody. But I do want to type my opinion in saying BorB people are being bratty and self-absorbed to a dangerous degree. DANGEROUS.
I was a Bernie supporter, too. IN fact, I gave his campaign a nice chunk of money. But I also recognize that stomping my feet because he didn’t win is, well, childish.
lyka, I completely disagree with the idea that having different ideas on policy is a disrespectful thing. Disrespect is not about having different ideas, it is attacking and demeaning one another for having those different ideas. Warren and Booker were not disrespectful in any way, but they were disrespected when they were shouted over during their speeches.
I do think the convention is a time for the party members to air their grievances and work to make changes. However, I think that is better suited to the platform discussions and vocal voting moments, and not during prepared remarks in the evening ceremonies.
@mytake “politics is nasty” – yes, and there is only one winner. Those Bernie or Bust protestors are acting like they grew up in the culture where everyone got a trophy.
One of the girls interviewed on MSNBC said she was so annoyed a the Hillary love-fest and that she had to wait until 10:40 to see Bernie speak. That’s what winning the ticket is about! The party rallies around the winner! I do not understand the idea of demanding respect when you are unwilling to behave in a way that is respectful to others.
@supposedtobeworking – YES! The young woman who was whining about the 10:40 speaking slot. Just….unbelievable and uninformed. That was a Prime Time viewing slot!
It is not nonsense. All of you are contributing to the illusion that a two-party system is the only one that works. More people are wanting more than just two options and they have the right to vote for anyone they please who isn’t Trump or Clinton.
+1 @Asiyah
The Bernie or Bust strategy eludes me (they’re making no friends or headway but still refuse to reorganize or change their tactics), but they’re right in one respect. The thing is rigged. It’s all rigged. The last time the Economic Policy Institute crunched the data, money recovered for victims of wage theft who complained to federal or state agencies was $933 million (in 2012). That’s only the people who complained, or realized what was happening to them. Meanwhile the total amount of property value of stolen goods from robberies of all kinds (including banks, residential thefts, gas stations, vehicles, etc.) in that same year was only about $341 million. The number of Fair Labor Standards Act cases filed in federal court has increased each year since 2008, and the number of case filings is more than 5 times what it was 20 years ago (7,764 in 2013). Something is fundamentally WRONG with the way our laws work, the way our capitalism fails the poorest people in the country, the way these figures get obfuscated by identity politics and party allegiances. No, the DNC didn’t literally rig the election for Hillary. But there’s a much more insidious fix out there. Bernie’s DNC platform proposals – progressive though they are – won’t erase that, and sometimes it’s okay for people to get really mad about it and speak their truth.
Tbh I would be curious if a three-party system would work well in this country.
The truth is we’re a country of metaphorical black and white, yes and no, the degree parties we do have and have had for decades plus (if people are looking for alternative parties to vote for) have never been able to capture enough interest or percent of the vote to even get on some ballots.
I personally believe most people find their needs and ideals met in the majority parties and those that don’t do have the options of other third party groups. But that doesn’t mean those third party groups will ever have a true established role in the majority of American citizens interests.
When I took a quiz on my political leanings Jill Stein came in third for me behind Bernie and Hilary. That’s two options of major candidates from major political parties that would serve my interests before the fringe candidate who might not even get on a ballot and I’m a hard working voter actively trying to inform herself. The rest of the public that simply knows what their opinions are and isn’t interested in doing extra work likely will never invest in a third party.
I actually think third parties work best in places where voting is mandatory. In our country voter apathy is too consuming.
lyka, appreciate your comments
I’m curious too ESE. How would a multiple party system end up looking in the US?
There are 2 ways it does work:
1) Preferential voting (like in Australia), where you get to rank everyone on the ticket in order from most liked to least liked OR just vote for one party and – if they’re not going to win – they decide where to hand on your preference. Multiple parties work in this scenario because parties cut deals with each other for preferences. For example, the Greens will send their votes to the left or right major party, depending on who promises the most environmentally friendly policies.
2) Parliamentary systems, where neither major party has enough seats to win in their own right and have to form a coalition to from government.
In both of those cases, the big two parties have a reason to co-operate with the minor parties – they won’t get into power unless they compromise. But as far as I can tell (and I’m a foreigner, so might be missing something) there’s no real incentive to co-operate in the US system. Elect more independents or minor parties and what happens? Would things just grind to a halt because no-one can muster up enough votes to pass ANYTHING? Would you end up with lots of back-room dealing (if you vote for this, then I’ll vote for that)?
YES Lucrezia! I hear so many people mention third parties but no one ever seems to go into depth into the actual mechanics.
Third party political groups are like guns in the U.S. vs other countries. I am a strong supporter of gun control and look to other countries with their positive results in enacting it, but I also note the differences between our nation’s that make one course of action able to succeed in someplace like Australia vs the U.S.
With mandatory voting and an established system of compromise and rating of different groups (or voting for a group and allowing them to nominate their own individuals) I can see how that is successful. But then I look to the U.S. and much like you said the flaws come out.
We had a govt. shut down because there was no compromise. One party wanted to showboat (with many politicians admitting they did it to appeal to their voters without any real plan for the consequences) and the other party refused to sacrifice more of our waning rights in order to appease them. Add in more parties and do you avoid another shut down or merely guarantee it? Especially small parties like The Green Party that have neither clout or power (I’m truly trying not to offend Green Party supporters) to really challenge a group more opposed to them like the Republicans.
I truly believe the majority of Americans don’t have Libertarian leanings. Even the ‘small govt’ party knows the power of Social Security and that if they ever threatened cutting that social program their supporters riot. Those are the major third party groups, from there you just go into…the wackies.
I’m not sure how realistically a third party could be established OR the current parties would really be able to have any power even if they were given a larger platform.
Most people want a million dollars, I want a smaller waist, I want to go to Paris France, whatever. Those are dreams and its dream to believe you will have any other choice beside Hilary, Donald, Jill stein, Gary Johnson. Thats it. Its reality and your wishes & hope of another choice isn’t reality. Too want something else is wishing in one hand and spitting in the other. Your apathy is nothing more than a vote for Trump. Pulling the lever for Trump is the reality of what you are saying because how our system works isn’t based on your hope of it.
@Asiyah right now, it IS nonsense, because we only have a few more months till election day. We’re at Threat Level Trump, right now. It’s not the time. After this election is done, Bernie supporters should stay active and push for changes. After we neutralize Trump, and ensure he’s not the person picking the next Supreme Court justices, nor has access to nuclear codes, super left-wing democrats can gather to develop a viable 3rd party. But right now? No, now is not the time.
@mytake x1000 exactly. Now is not the time to take votes away from HRC that will cause Trump aka neo-Hitler to win. If you want a three- or multiple-party system, start working on that now for 2020, not working to derail any chance of defeating Trump. That is so short-sighted, selfish, and privileged. Look at what just Trump’s campaign has spawned in less than a year. We can’t even imagine what four years of Trump (and who knows how many more years after that if he gains the right kind of control) will be like…well, actually, we have seen it. We have seen it in Hitler. We have seen it in Mugabe in Zimbabwe. There is not one area where Trump excels, not in business, not in politics, not in any kind of leadership or knowledge of world policy and he is leading a KKK revolution. *That* is what Bernie supporters are actually supporting if they refuse to vote or to support Hillary in this election.
Work on other parties for the future. Now is the time to unite and put aside the bullshit.
@Tiffany
You’re misreading my comment. I didn’t say (nor do I think) disagreements on policy issues are disrespectful. I said some *policies* can be considered disrespectful because they legitimately harm people, i.e. merit pay for teachers or Israel’s occupation of Palestine (another major example would be anti-choice policies which are sometimes considered disrespectful to women). My point was specifically one of language and rhetoric, and I was taking issue with the assertion that the booing last night was uniquely “disrespectful” when potentially harmful policies espoused by some of the speakers could also be considered disrespectful. Disagree with me all you want! I promise I don’t think it’s disrespect; just a healthy dialogue 🙂
Gary Johnson actually said he was going to smoke less pot during the election cycle, maybe cut it out completely if he makes it to the WH lol. That he is one of his strategy. Just because they are a rebel 3rd party doesn’t mean they are better choices than our two choices.
In a similar vein, isn’t Jill Stein anti-vaccine?
She is anti-vaccine as well as Trump. She also uses crystals to heal people.
I am terrified that this leak will basically guarantee a Trump victory. Clinton is not a lot
Of people’s first choice but moderate Republicans would lean toward her than Trump. Now it is easy to say “shes
Corrupt! The DNC is corrupt!” And not vote for her. I’m truly scared for our country.
You’re not wrong. There is a much greater chance now of a Trump victory because of this debacle, which was compounded by giving Wasserman-Schultz an “honorary” chair position as soon as she resigned. I have NEVER liked DWS, and she should have been gone several years ago.
Meh. It was honorary in the sense that it’s a face-saving measure for someone who gave five years to the DNC and got fired, basically. It doesn’t mean anything.
Clearly DWS knows where the bodies are buried. From Obama’s glowing remarks on her resignation, to this honorary position-it seems like they are all more worried about Debbie’s ego than winning. Obama and Clinton have both been quietly trying to push out DWS since 2014-2015, neither of them are big fans of hers.
The position is a shut up and go away, we’re letting you save some face position. But MAN oh MAN are the optics bad.
But Ms Wasserman-Schultz has been a great spokes woman for Democratic values and outspoken defender of President Obama for YEARS. Before these primaries Liberals loved her and you can find clips of her on political shows breaking down the lies and push-backs from the Republicans trying to stop policy proposals from Prez Obama and other Democrats.
She has been great for the party and was trying to ensure a win for Democrats. Bernie was not a Democrat. Furthermore we and Hillary need her to win Florida. Right now that is her most important asset. I agree with Hillary keeping her on for all the above stated reasons. Why toss aside a loyal Democrat who has served the party well for decades?
Many Bernie or Bust supporters have obviously not paid attention to the day to day hard work of Democrats in the trenches before Bernie decided to join the party to win an election!
Except Obama Aides have been trying to oust her since 2012. She’s not exactly beloved by libs as she has always had issues with fundraising. Obama decided it wasn’t what he wanted to focus on in his second term-but he’s never liked her.
The Clintons were suggesting it in early 2015 and have never been big fans of hers either. The only reason they aren’t tossing her aside is that they want her to keep her mouth shut (which is pretty much the reason she wasn’t pushed out sooner)
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/07/debbie-wasserman-schultz-dnc-226100
I so worry too,, even though people keep saying, don’t worry, we have months to go. Memories are short.
I felt better after some truly amazing speeches last night laying out the reasons why Hillary should be POTUS and why Trump shouldn’t. And Bernie did a tremendous job laying out all of those reasons why it is so important to vote for HIllary.
I was so proud to be a Democrat last night.
There was one email with the infamous suggestions. ONE email. That was never acted upon. No one is without bias. It was NOT acted upon. Everyone is buying into the corporate media/Trumpian memes.
What’s terrifying is Trump’s business ties with Russia, Wikileaks shady association with Russia, and the fact that Trump is a psychopath- he will do anything to win. Does anyone believe a guy who’s been shady all his life is not capable of making deals with other dictators? There’s a reason he hasn’t released his tax returns. There’s a reason the only plank on the platform he cared about was weakening the NATO bonds making it VERY easy for Putin to take over.
Sometimes, there is no conspiracy, it really is happening. It happened with Watergate, and as happened with Watergate, it’s time to “follow the money”. Why isn’t MSM investigating further? Instead, they endlessly dwell on the trivial.
THIS! THIS! THIS! Major US banks have blackballed Trump. I believe his companies are heavily leveraged and propped up by foreign money from sketchy people. Among his inner circle of advisors are people with close ties to Russia and Putin. Trump is beholden to much more nefarious entities than Clinton.
Trump is hiding a lot of shady stuff by not releasing his taxes.
x1000000000 And the truth is even worse than we can imagine, I’m sure
Honestly, I was more baffled by people who read these emails and were shocked that stuff like this even went on behind the scenes in the first place. It takes millions, if not billions, of dollars to get a candidate into the office of president, and a loss generally means getting swept out of the competition permanently because of the toll it takes on the individual’s reputation. Of COURSE both parties have a few specific candidates in mind going forward – it would be financial and political insanity otherwise.
The DNC likely thought Hillary was a sure bet because she had a strong hand in prior governance and represented a progressive image – the first female president! – that followed their electing the first black president. OF COURSE they were pissed when an independent candidate switched parties to run against their primary candidate, undercutting her lead against the Republican party. I’m angry with them for overlooking the problems in her administration beforehand that wound up dragging down the election, but the way people are reacting to these emails like it’s revelation to see how these political processes is just mind blowing to me. It wasn’t rigged to destroy Sanders – the system has always been set up that way! If people want to talk about election reform, I am behind them 100%. The system is the definition of a media circus that drags on far longer than necessary and presents a serious financial obstacle to anybody but the wealthiest to approach office. That’s the real core of the matter, and it has nothing to do with anything the DNC did specifically in this single election.
Wow! Her speech almost choked me up and I am not even American.
I got a HUGE lump in my throat and started to tear up listening to FLOTUS.
At the risk of sounding inarticulate, she’s the effin BEST.
I so loved Sarah in that moment.
Can I just say Corey Booker gave such an inspiring speech, so unifying and uplifting. He is truly one of the Democrats shining stars not only right now, but for the future of the party. And Donald Trump gave a nasty tweet after his speech. Donald Trump’s lack of character never ceases to amaze me, to tweet something like this after a brilliant and passionate and heartfelt speech. And what, was he threatening Booker, like he had info on him?
Trump tweeted: “If Cory Booker is the future of the Democratic Party, they have no future! I know more about Cory than he knows about himself.”
And Michelle Obama, wow, wow, wow First of all, she looked so beautiful. She is like fine wine as she ages. She actually looked the most beautiful I have ever seen her. Stunning.
And her speech, ah-mazing. It is one for the ages, and will go down in history as one of the best speeches ever given at the Democratic National Convention. I was in awe listening to her. Also, she made a great case for Hillary as POTUS, and it was authentic in her passion for the reasons, never came off as perfunctory, like she had to do it.
President Obama was so proud, as his tweet afterwards evidenced.
“Incredible speech by an incredible woman. Couldn’t be more proud & our country has been blessed to have her as FLOTUS. I love you, Michelle.”
Aw.
I listen to a lot of news while I’m at work. And one thing I really like about MSNBC is that they play the entirety of Trump’s speeches, live, unedited, uncommentated upon (I don’t think that’s a real phrase, but stay with me here). They just let his crazy hang all over the place. And I think that if most people who are actually FOR Trump, actually listened to what he says – it would be over for him. He literally sounds like he’s drunk… can follow no topic for more than 10 seconds and is purely a self aggrandizing dictator. It’s really sickening to listen to, but I make myself do it.
Agreed on all points.
–TheRealPinky
Trump’s daughter and son-in-law campaigned for and bundled a $40,000 contribution for Booker. Guess we’re supposed to forget that.
LOL, not surprised. I bet Ivanka and her husband will secretly vote for Hillary too.
I’ve been following Booker since he was mayor of Newark, I think he’s a good guy who isn’t afraid of hard work and actually listening to the people he represents.
lucy2, isn’t it great that the rest of the country is getting to see the awesomeness of Corey Booker that us JERZ folks have seen for a few years now?
this is a guy that literally opened his home just after Superstorm Sandy to those who still didn’t have power when he did. LOVE that man.
Ivanka spoke like Democrat during her speech. bet she is secretly a Democrat.
Booker is rumored to be gay and I, and lots of others, took the tweet to be a threat to out him.
That’s the only thing I could come up with. I think Donald Trump as a candidate can’t go any lower with his disgusting remarks, but he shows he can, iike with that tweet, trying to threaten a senator giving a speech.
I, honestly, think I hate Donald Trump. He is a despicable human being and not fit to be POTUS. The things he says that are blatantly homophobic, racist, misogynistic, on and on, and he has all of these supporters and is the nominee, just wow.
And the mocking of a journalist with a disability might be his lowest point ever. Anastasia Somaz’s speech was so moving in her response to Trump. I loved how the audience was rooting for her during her speech.
“And the mocking of a journalist with a disability might be his lowest point ever.”
UGH. I keep pointing that out to people. if nothing else, mocking a disabled person should be enough to show you what kind of person he is. such a scumbag.
That’s what I think the tweet was implying as well. I haven’t seen any kind of discussion on it, but maybe I missed it given everything going on last night.
I worked in DC and think gay rumors are very false. He has called himself a straight man but isn’t offended by the gay rumors and won’t defend them. Hate that because he is single not married man in his 40s he assumed to be gay. Says a lot about the public thinks of single people, its never just a choice is it? Donald was probably talking about a million dollar scandal with a watershed program in NJ that Booker was linked to but nothing came of it. He also tweeted a stripper in Portland for a bit and got some media for it. Donald’s scandal is probably something he found on a Google search.
Aww everything you said was what I felt, my heart was swelling watching everything last night.
I’m going to miss them so much. For so many reasons but as a family unit they have much for which to be admired. The optics alone speak volumes.
Jayna, I agree, she is an amazing women, and speaks in such a genuine caring way. She should run for president in the future, but I am so glad her speech was so well like and she gave Hillary a glowing review.
They disrupted ELIZABETH WARREN. These idiots should hang their damn heads in shame right now.
I’d hoped that Hilary would tap Booker for her VP, there was chatter about that at one point.
I understand their anger.
Yeah, I do, too. I understand they’re too immature or stubborn or biased (or all of the above) to move on and show the nation the united front the Dems so desperately need right now. Continuing to talk trash about Hilary, or vowing to vote Green or doing Bernie write-ins is just foolish. Trump is no joke and he’ll have the last laugh if they don’t pull together for the same goal–completely and irrevocably dismantling his public image and shady platform, piece by piece, before November.
I’m a Bernie voter and I don’t. Think they were behaving like spoiled losers.
I have been a Hillary voter the entire time because she is the lesser of two very despicable choices, and I voted for Obama in the last two elections, yet I completely understand their anger and find it fascinating that our party which claims to be based on equality and civil rights so quickly wants to shut down any dissenting voices. You do realize that Bernie delegates — DELEGATES — who had earned that right were being told that if they didn’t relinquish their signs away that their passes would be revoked. They were not being violent or even that disruptive when that happened. To then be “scolded” by a wealthy celebrity who benefits from the very policies of corporate greed only reinforced their disdain for the process and the false facade of “equality” that the DNC puts forth.
If their candidate had just “lost,” it would be one thing, but the disgusting things said not only about Sanders but also about the courting of the Hispanic vote in the “taco bowl engagement” and other racial mockery showed a constant thread of ugliness that patriots should rally against, be it from the buffonish Trump or worse, those who claim to be defending the rights of those very people.
So I don’t think they are spoiled brats or “ridiculous.” This woman is “ridiculous” to belittle people just because she was booed, a laughable irony since her entire career, consisting of blackface and other “edgy” mockery, consists entirely of belittling others.
I will still vote for Clinton and her conservative, gratuity-taking corrupt VP nom regardless of her corruptness and incompetence because the alternative is worse, but don’t be surprised if the continued dismissal of the Demexit movement ends up with devastating results for the country. Belittling them and stifling their voices certainly will not make them “grow up.”
KD – the taco bowl joke was a comment on Donald posting a picture of himself eating eating a taco bowl on Cinco de Mayo.
I read a really interesting comment over on 538’s live feed last night. The commenter basically posited that the only reason Bernie or Bust people are that way is because they have the luxury of being so. They don’t really face the dangerous repercussions that so many would if Trump were elected. They are, primarily, not minorities in any way. So they have the option to be a stickler, or vote 3rd party.
I’m ashamed to say, as a lifelong Democratic voter, that this is an accurate depiction not just of Bernie or Bust types, but of the party as a whole. And it is so embarrassingly tone deaf and entitled-and it has just gotten worse over the lest few years.
Most of the people willing to throw their votes away on a third party vote, or worse-those actually saying with a straight face that they will vote for Trump now that Bernie is out because “there’s no difference between Hilary and Trump” sit in the luxurious positions of only being peripherally affected by the disastrous consequences of a Trump presidency.
I agree with this @grabbyhands, and I find it a much more compelling argument than all those dismissing them or calling them whiners or “ridiculous.” The entire party is full of white elitists who aren’t recognizing how disconnected they are becoming from the working class. Mocking them constantly and pegging them as Walmart shopping trash spits on ALL of the people who do so and alienates them all. So when the Repubs are xenophobic corporatists and the Dems are limousine liberals, what do you think will happen? That plus the literal wall built by the DNC to keep out the Bernie Bros shows the elitism of both parties and worries me people who would be voting for SANITY will stay home or vote in rebellion.
That’s the way I feel. It’s mostly a group of entitled people who aren’t actually being threatened by any of Trumps proposals(or at least think they aren’t). I also think they’d rather have the high of protesting and being a wronged party (eventhough they are mostly white & privileged ) then actually doing the dirty work of compromising and holding Hilary accountable and making sure their ideas are heard. They are the ones that think Trump and Hilary are the same because only the economic policies they want matter. The rights of LGBT, Muslims, Hispanics etc aren’t important to them.
Yeah this has been noted many times around here. They’re not called the “Bros” for nothing: predominantly white, male, and upper middle class.
Yup.
What “Obama boys?” I have never heard that.
The point is, it’s over, done. Bernie endorsed HRC. We have to go after Trump, he’s is the real enemy.
Well done to those people who has the maturity to pick the country instead of their selfish goals.
And I am still waiting for the evidence which shows how DNC rigged the election. In the emails they are only talking about few stuff but never did anything.
Hillary won fair and square and if those Bernie or bust people have any decency or cares about the next generations, they will vote for Hillary.
If you vote for Trump then you are a selfish male chauvinistic racist – simple as that.
There is no evidence of “rigging.” Bernie lost. His main problem was that his numbers with African Americans–and generally people of color–were abysmal, and you can’t win the Democratic nomination without that critical demographic.
Pretty much this. But facts get in the way of their tantrums.
If you read the full email chains (of which there were only a handful out of 20K), all of the discussions about Bernie were in May after the election was already decided. AND they all began with sharing negative statements from Bernie or his campaign manager.
Petty reactions to petty complaining. There was no fixing. He lost.
I had no idea that maturity was about settling for the status quo and “lesser of two evils” argument. I guess I was mistaken.
Life is about the lesser of two evils. The Presidency has ALWAYS been about the lesser of two evils…like Syria for example. (Choose Your Own Adventure Time!)
A leader is killing civilians in massive numbers. Do you:
A.) Start a war to take out the leader, killing civilians, US and foreign troops. Spending tons of money. Possibly enabling a worse leader to come into power after first leader is taken out.
OR
B.) Don’t go to war, then the leader keeps killing civilians. Regional factions continue to kill each other. Give supplies to those groups who are fighting dangerous leader, but being unsure exactly who are the “moderates” fighting the leader and who is associated with ISIS.
“The lesser of two evils” is a crappy place to be, but major life and country decisions come from such a place. Life won’t always listen when you demand a clear and pristine option that is 100% perfect. The goal is to make the best choice, even if it isn’t totally satisfying. I think there is so much going on in this election that clearly shows which of our options is the best choice.
@Tiffany
Thank you, I’ve always felt that the idea there isn’t a ‘best of two evils’ aspect to the Presidency is puzzling. Life is full of choices between two difficult perspectives, as President there is a reason they age 10 years faster in a shorter span of time. They have to make many difficult decisions that do sometimes come down to putting numbers to human lives. It’s not a job I’d want but I’d want someone mature and willing to look with calm infprmed eyes at the information and make the hard choices.
Welcome to adulthood. Now just remember to actually vote in the midterm elections, when it counts just as much as a presidential year.
Look, I’m a hardcore independent. I’ve voted outside of the normal party lines or I’ve ticket split the entire time for the majority of the elections of which I’ve partaken in my life. In any other circumstances, I would probably do the same this year. But this election is serious shit. You’ve got a major party platform running on nationalistic ideals. In the year 2016, the RNC had a Senator – A SENATOR – stand on a podium and basically state that whites were the only people who really mattered to human history. We have a presidential candidate that has stated plans to push his political power onto his VP – a VP with a history of misogynistic policy making. I cannot, in good conscience, vote independent in a year where it may indirectly contribute to Donald Trump’s rise to power.
Compromise for the status quo? Yeah, it sucks. But in this case, it might actually save lives.
A vote for Trump is always going to be a vote for “me first, screw the rest of you”.
Silverman got booed at the time, but in the long run she’ll be admired for having the guts to confront them. Heck, I admire her now! What she said, had to be said.
And Booker and FLOTUS–just amazing.
Ditto!
And she was a Bernie supporter, but she accepted that Hillary won and now she has to support her, thats what everyone has to accept now, or Trump is going to win.
Bernie Bros is sexist and the idea that most of his supporters are young men has been debunked on Slate. Perhaps if everyone wasn’t so dismissive of them and their ideas they’d vote the party line.
Then they need to stop acting like entitled children and act like adults.
Sigh.. This is why they’re alienated and telling them to grow up is really not going to have the desired effect. I’m saying this as an extremely reluctant Clinton voter.
You’re absolutely right, Greenleaf. Telling them to grow has not had the desired effect. They are still behaving like spoilt children not getting their way. Spot on. They should all look up the name Ralph Nader. A lot of us are terrified of a repeat.
This!
That goes both ways.
If they want to be approached and treated like an adult then they have to approach the discussion like adults as well, booing and screaming isn’t the way to endear people to want to approach you and hear your ideas.
At the end of the day idealism is great but I think listening to a lot of Bernie supporters there was a lot of tone-deafness from them as well. Complaining about Clinton getting the majority of the African American vote, complaining the system is rigged, not understanding when and where they needed to vote, not comprehending how caucuses worked, becoming disruptive and physical at public events.
Unfortunately neither party really reaches out for younger voters because the percentage of individuals who vote under 35 is absolutely abysmal. We have to do better of being a block that needs our concerns met rather than doing nothing till we start to feel the consequences of others votes for us.
…because some women are in the die and ride bus with Bernie doesn’t mean there isn’t a sexist undertone to the beanie Bro movement. Im a Bernie supporter and have encountered some of these bros. TBH I prefer Trump voters over them. Some of the ones I’ve encountered foam at the mouth loath Hilary for the mere fact she won. They have said atrocious things, heard a man call her the c word. Women often align with sexist men to gain their favor, this is nothing new since junior high.
Exactly! Have any of you actually been out to the protests in Philly? Very few are the frat boy types that are being portrayed here. There are actually a shocking number of middle aged women and minorities represented.
But Gloria Steinem is a genius for telling women to vote for Hilary because she’s a woman. That’s not ridiculous. The whole circus is ridiculous in the worst way.I can’t stand this party anymore. And I’ll have to vote for them. I hate this whole thing.
Genius? Most people here slammed her for that.
And I was one of them. I forgot to use my sarcasm/cynic font. My point was that it’s ridiculous to say that one side is any better than the other right now. No one is interested in being better, everyone is just interested in being “right” and silencing anyone that disagrees. And I can’t stand it. The politics of “me” rule everyone right now and I’m sick of listening to people pat themselves on the back for “winning” something this election cycle. I don’t understand why people hold politicians up as saviors and I never will. There’s nothing inspirational or hopeful about any of this. It all stinks and I’m tired of the side I thought I was supporting devolving into this raving, naval gazing pile of crap that it’s become.
Spot on Sarah!
Can I just say, among friends..WHAT IS WRONG WITH THESE BERNIE OR BUST FOOLS?????
I was watching their whiny, smug, self righteous interviews at the end of the evening and their “Jill Stein” endorsements and I was truly disgusted. And their uncontrolled sobbing when Bernie Sanders spoke. Really? Michelle’s speech was the most moving I’ve heard in so long. That should have brought you to tears. You are being self entitled and so disrespectful and you are really trying to “bern” it all down.
I’m sorry folks, I have had it.
+1,000,000,000,000
I’m so glad someone else noticed the sobbing. I love the guy, but come on! This over dramatic reaction, the robin hood hats, the chants, them booing Sanders at an earlier speech when he told them to vote for Clinton, the disruption of other speeches. People are being dismissive of the Bernie or Bust crowd because of these childish theatrics.
THE FRICKIN SOBBING. They looked like Beliebers. Just out of control, shaking. Passion is fine but that was over the top and weird. And I felt bad for Bernie when he got booed. The look on his face when he Felt The Bern was sad. He looked so dismayed. Kind of a what have a wrought moment.
I’m not a Bernie or Bust person but I am a Jill Stein supporter. Perhaps plenty of “Bernie Bros” are supporting Jill Stein because, guess what? Her stances are more similar to what they believe in. I’m sorry to be rude and condescending but many people actually vote out of principles and issues.
Then please understand that your “principles and issues” will give us President Trump. You MUST grasp what you are actually saying.
It’s actually sad how few Bernie supporters are going to Jill Stein compared to Johnson. Johnson (someone with ideals completely opposite Bernie) has gotten a nice boost that puts him close enough to that 15% goal than Jill who’s still lingering far behind.
The specific BOB people interviewed who were rudely chanting and yelling during speeches by people who have EARNED respect (Congressman Cummings!) and then these people hatefully bashed Hillary and almost smugly said they were voting for Jill Stein. It really appeared spiteful more than principled. These are the BOB people that my comment refers to.
Those who supported Green party without this “revenge” motivation are a different group than what I saw last night.
If Trump/Pence win, and Pence essentially picks the next 3 Supremes while Trump is “making America great again” who knows what rights we’ll (women) even have in the next election. Seriously.
@Asiyah : @honeybee blues x1000000 Folks need to wake up and smell the coffee. Set aside idealism and realize that a vote for Jill or abstaining is a vote for Trump. Maybe his reign will not affect you but that’s doubtful if you are a woman, person of color, black in particular, have a disability, have any connection to or are immigrant or Muslim or Sikh or any other non-“Christian” faith, are not the wealthiest 1%, need reasonably priced healthcare including OB-GYN and prenatal….and and and….anything else I’m forgetting?
And Bernie’s speech was not good. Can we acknowledge that too?
The unity only needs to come to play on election day. I dont mind their enthusiasm for 3 months as long as we’re on the same page on the day it counts, which i think we will be bc Trump is Bat S crazy.
I think the validation many people have since the leaked emails will help, bc it does shine a spot light on russian/trump ties and that people did notice the narrative, between the the party to the media, regarding Bernie. And some can say Hills won fair and square, but others can say that mainstream media and the party manipulated coverage. Coverage that many basic citizens use to obtain information on candidates, which does put its own sway on results.
SS has never been funny to me after 3-4 min. After 4 min I’m done paying any attention.
Thanks for showing this side of things! Go silverman
If it wasn’t paired with such dire consequences, I’d say the vote 2016 is the best reality show of the decade.
I think that winter is coming to Europe too. With France in a state of emergency from last November! and the latest developements here in Germany I think it’s a matter of time we have it as well and under such circumstances there will be no vote 2017.
So enjoy the last throes of the democracy as we know it.
I tried to be understanding of the protestors. After all, I fully supported those protesting at the RNC. But the disrespectful chanting was so distracting. And WTF? How people could attempt to shout down Booker quoting Maya Angelou. It proved to me that those people care nothing about the struggle leading up to the last monumental election, and the upcoming election. They weren’t inspired by Booker’s electric speech. They built strength during Warren’s speech and tried to shout down someone they supposedly adored. And then proved what absolute fools they were by booing their idol.
They really ruined so much of the emotion I was feeling. By the end, I was channeling Trump. “Can someone please just tase those motherfuc*ers so I can hear what’s going on???” Nothing will appease them. They don’t care if they hand the election to Trump. They’re hoping he will destroy our government as we know it and bring about a “revolution”. No concern at all about the resulting destabilization of our government, or the resulting stock market crash. These people need to step out of their privileged existence and take a trip to a third world country. Maybe signup with the Peace Corps and do some good in the world.
It was rude. It was childish. It was hateful. Way to bring the hate, children. It was endlessly annoying and disrespectful to the speakers and ruined moments for me as well. They were from CA as I understand it (luckily, a blue state). They’re just another kind of fanatic. They need to grow up.
I totally agree, they are ruining it for me too. But please don’t let Bernie off the hook. He spent well over a year telling them the primary was rigged, he told them that over and over. He refused to concede. He refused to drop out. He told them he could still win, that he would still win, long after it was mathematically improbable and later, impossible.
Bernie built this. Never forget. Never forgive.
Bernie built this. Never forget. Never forgive.
That attitude is part of the problem. Move on.
Never forgive? That sounds like some super-right-wing rhetoric.
With all due respect, it’s really not that serious for anybody to say “never forget. never forgive.” And before anybody says, “not that serious? Have you heard Trump?” YES I HAVE. And I’ve also heard Hilary. And I’ve heard for many years before I even heard of Bernie how the system is flawed. Bernie didn’t built this. Let’s not give him that much credit. He simply spoke about it openly.
Good thing Bernie refused to drop out. Why should anybody be bullied or intimidated? Either way, he ended up doing exactly just that and is telling everybody to vote for Hilary.
Every movement has fanatics, and those who can’t think independently. Bernie did what all politicians do. He is a politician not some pure avenger. It’s as much his fault as it is the fault of every politician for misleading their supporters. It doesn’t help to be naive about politics.
I heard commentary on this last night @Tara. By continuing to campaign so long after he had mathematically lost, he continued to divide the party (which isn’t even his party, as an Independent). That’s something he has to accept responsibility for.
This. They want to spill over the apple cart not realizing that someone has to be around to pick it all up when it’s done. Keep this up and it’s going to be Trump and then they will LONG for the days when they were able to boo at conventions and have their political views heard. There’s not going to BE a apple cart, or third party, or progressive platform if Trump comes to power.
Whenever they talk about revolution all I can think is
“Y’all are entirely too skiny, soft and fragile for any wars or fighting. Revolutions are not fought or won on iPhones or in fantasy leagues”
Revolution is never as pretty as young idealists think it is.
I think, for a lot of the Bernie people, this is the first time they have ever taken an interest in politics. They literally don’t know how all this works.
If not getting their way this first time out makes some of them this petulant, rude, and disillusioned, it only serves to show how naive they are. Bernie hit a nerve, in a good way. No go out into your communities on a LOCAL level and try to enact change. Don’t bury your head in the sand while the rest of us watch the rights of everyone who isn’t a rich white man get thrown into the dumpster fire that is Trump Pence. I don’t know if the notorious RBG can hold out another 4 years on the Court.
Maybe some of them. THe ones I know are the old 60’s left, and they are the worst. And this is far from their first rodeo.
My friend and her boyfriend are almost 40 and they won’t shut up about how they are hoping for Clinton to do the right thing and hoping for some sort of miracle with the delegates and delegate math. She said this is the first time she has had a presidential candidate she believed in and who really wanted to change the world and do the right thing. Her boyfriend constantly posts anti Hillary memes and videos on social media as well as puts up anti Hillary graffiti around the town they live in. I wish the busters I knew were just teenagers or bros because that would be way less depressing and weird.
We noticed the petulance, too. Especially the three young women who were interviewed on MSNBC after Bernie’s speech. Their worlds seemed fundamentally shaken because they didn’t get their way. That’s how it came across! Like a temper tantrum. And NONE of them had anything substantive to say. Shocking, the vapidity was.
I love her & she hit the nail on the head, they are ridiculous. I was ready to tear my hair out watching last nite; not only the heckling, but of course, the press interviewed the most ignorant, uninformed of the Bernie or bust crowd. Young, inarticulate, not able to communicate why they hate HRC, except that they do . These entitled millennials have no idea what they’re in for with a President Trump.
Yeah the press was nutpicking. Interesting they couldn’t find one Hillary supporter in the crowd? What a joke.
“Nutpicking” Typo or deliberate? Accurate and funny either way.
I wasn’t sure Rachel Maddow was going to keep it together listening to those foolish, naive women. I just wanted to scream. They obviously have no grasp of not so ancient history.
Did you see the interview with the one woman who said “I’m going to vote with my heart not my brai–Well, whatever.”?! I have never wanted to punch anyone so badly in my life.
I don’t want to vote for Bernie but he seems like an interesting man and a character who I just want to go to lunch w at a Brooklyn diner.
I guess I’ll never get the appeal of this hectoring old man who has one speech he gives over and over and over and over…
To each their own, but really? Talk about your male privilege.
Eh, a decade ago it was the Tea-partiers doing the whole ‘our policies or bust’ thing, and it’s worked out damn well for them. The Republican party as a whole took a turn to the extreme right and they got a whole lot of their own people elected.
It’s about time some Democrats stood up and demanded a more progressive party line. Every election the party creeps closer and closer to to being center-right, and every election it’s not the right time to fight it because the Republicans are scary…but they’re scary because they get their way so often because the Democrats give themselves so little room to negotiate. Negotiation and partisanship doesn’t work when one side is straddling the fence and the other is on the edge of the field, the group straddling the fence has nowhere to go but deep into the field.
We need a huge push for more progressive candidates. There’s never going to be a good time. Forget Trump, every Republican candidate was a nightmare. Every potential 2020 candidate is a nightmare. It’s never going to get better, so we need some true leftists and socialists instead of a bunch of people who would have fit right into the Republican party in the 80’s.
Actually the Tea Party or Bust fundamentally contributed to the destruction of the Republican Party.
We can talk about the dramatics of Trump and the awful things he says and does all day but this is a man who follows the crowds and money. The Republican Party was struggling and had lost much of its voting block to Independents, in order to maintain enough power to get votes and keep their status quo they started actively courting the more uninformed, working class, angry conservatives who typically did not vote. In doing so they actively pushed the working class Everyman as a prop, someone to trot on stage who didn’t know his elbow from his asshole. Joe the Plumbers and Sarah Palin became the mascot of this new Republican Party and the fire was reignited.
But the problem was the intelligent and more moderate Republicans were merely saying whatever this group wanted to hear knowing they couldn’t or wouldn’t do many of the outlandish claims they made. They didn’t have an alternative to Obamacare, a govt. shutdown would hurt actual people with incomes, there was no comprehensive plan among their own party for Iraq so what happened? The Tea Party crew grew frustrated again. This party STILL wasn’t conservative enough for them, angry enough, willing to take charge enough. So they splintered off from the Republican party and in many cases ran AGAINST republicans in small ticket races. Many lost but the damage was also done. This was a party divided and attacking itself.
The problem with turning your party to the far left or far right is that simply that’s not where the majority of people are. In a presidential race with 15 options espousing Republican ideals and beliefs it is a sad shameful mockery that the majority of votes from Republicans went to a former Democrat who openly and viciously attacked every other challenger. Not on their plans and principles but on their faces or their height. The majority of people not aligned with a political party are not going to support that.
Trump and courting the Tea Party has given the Republican Party a flame that both energizes and destroys them. They’ll never be able to reach democrats or independents with racism sexism and xenophobia. Conversely if they DON’T use that racism and anger they can not even get their own party to give enough of a damn to get them to the convention. Kasich the most reasonable Republican candidate had no real interest and was deemed boring and barely clinging on for months because he didn’t shout like the others, he didn’t say flashy things like the others, he wasn’t ‘telling it like it is’ (read: insulting and outright lying in some cases) like the others and as a result his entire campaign was a mediocre run that ultimately went nowhere.
As it stands right now the Republicans right now are damned if they do and damned if they don’t. Without the tea party they don’t have enough base support but with them they end up sacrificing national support. It’s not a plan is recommend the Democrats follow.
Well said @The Eternal Side-Eye
Wonderful response!!!
Well said @Pepper.
Yes, Bernie totally got a huge portion of his agenda onto the party platform for the DNC. But there were some glaring exceptions: opposition to TPP, opposition to Israel’s occupation of Palestine, banning fracking, and enacting a carbon tax. Initially, Bernie wanted to put those proposals up for for a vote on the floor by submitting “minority planks” for each of them. This has worked in the past (Hubert Humphrey got the DNC to add support for civil rights to its platform in 1948 via minority plank, and Jesse Jackson brought contentious debates to the floor in both 1984 and 1988). But in the end Bernie’s camp chose NOT to bring those issues to the floor for vote out of concern that the media would paint his supporters as obstructionist or divisive. Read what you want into that decision, but obviously it’s ironic because doing so left those supporters with literally no protest options at the DNC outside of vocal antipathy to the party agenda. And now they look obstructionist and divisive anyway! So there was really no way for their progressive agenda to win in the court of public opinion, regardless of how “civil” their discourse was or was not.
The Bernie supporters were so annoying. I supported Bernie, but Hillary is our candidate and that is what the people chose. Get over it and move on. I was particularly annoyed when Elizabeth was making great points, points that I as a former Bernie supporter agreed with completely. Yet, the booing and chanting were so disruptive that I really had to pay attention to hear her speak. We’re all in this together. Let’s not shoot ourselves in the foot and hand this to Trump because we can’t act like ADULTS and move on.
If these people really want change, they need to stop worrying about Hillary and start working on a progressive Congress. Those are the people who really make the laws and the ones who can actually get you what Bernie promised. It drives me up a wall that people worry so much about the president but don’t care a whit about the Senate.
88% of Congress is up for reelection. That is where the B or B folks need to direct their energy.
THIS!!!!
Yes!!!!! this x100000000000
THIS I agree with entirely!
Bernie supporter. Moving on. I would love for the Bernie or Bust people to focus on drowning the Republicans with protests in order to get the SCOTUS process started. It’s incredibly frustrating that they complain about Obama not doing his job and when he does his job they refuse to do their jobs. SHAME.
She is absolutely right. I’m beyond frustrated with friends who are Bernie supporters (note: I support him, too) and are now saying they’re not going to vote at all or will write in a name, which is essentially the same. That’s utterly absurd to me. We supported someone who didn’t make it all the way. It sucks. Oh well. Time to move on. It’s amazing in itself that Bernie made it as far as he did, and indicates that change IS possible, which I think is fantastic. But for right now, this is who we’re working with: Clinton or Trump. I’m no fan of Hillary by any stretch, but I have to look at this election as voting AGAINST Trump, rather than “for” anyone. Is it ideal that we so often have elections that make us choose between the lesser of two evils? Of course not. But let’s not pretend that Clinton and Trump are anywhere NEAR the same level of evil. Clinton is your typical untrustworthy politician, while Trump is a truly hateful human being. The choice is easy. I just want someone to become president who won’t usher in the apocalypse, you know? Not exercising my right to vote just isn’t an option to me.
We need to focus on a more progressive Congress if any change is to be made—those votes will matter so much this election season.
I find it interesting that their response is to do nothing with the whole message from Bernie was to get involved and engage.
I can’t believe we are all so complacent in this supposedly great country that we truly don’t even consider third party candidates. Look at some of the comments here mocking or belittling the Green Party or saying a vote for anything other than the two major political parties is a waste. “Oh this is how the system works.” Guess what? The system hasn’t worked. It’s failed us. And maybe many people don’t want to continue participating in this sham known as voting. Maybe it’s not about being hurt that your particular candidate didn’t make it. Maybe it’s disgust at the idea of having to choose between two despicable candidates. What a concept.
“But that’s not realistic!” We, as the people of a democratic nation, make the reality. The Republican Party began as a third party. Look where it is today. It started out as the party of Northern States, anti-slavery, etc. and it changed. THINGS CHANGE. Anyway sorry for being “idealistic” but I will take everyone’s advice and instead of typing all of this and heckling at the conventions I will take my issues to the voting booth and continue “wasting” my vote.
Why, then, did Bernie, a lifelong, registered independent, choose to run as a Democrat?
Obviously BECAUSE the two-party system in this country is monolithic, and there would be literally no other way for a larger swath of people to be exposed to his progressive platform than for him to run in one of the two major parties. He actually explained that several times on the campaign trail, so I couldn’t begin to fathom what your point is.
I’ll say to you what I have been saying to all the other smug third partiers- you want a viable third party? Get off your ass and get out to your state and local primaries and mid-term elections instead of whining about how disaffected people are but doing little else besides trotting out a third party candidate with no chance every four years. News flash-viable candidates don’t get to move from zero to president just because they say they disagree with the two party system.
Really want to make a difference? EDUCATE YOURSELF. LIVE IN THE REAL WORLD. As far as I can tell, most third partiers live in a wholly unrealistic universe where they really believe that you can put an unknown candidate on the national stage and people will actually vote for them (whether or not their slate is realistic, whether or not they’ve had ANY experience) and magically Congress falls in line and we all live in utopia. It is a foolish child’s fantasy and it is dooming this country.
#Grabbyhands, I’m giving you a standing ovation.
Amen! Huzzah! Boo-ya! And, yeah, you’re damn straight, grabby!
Seriously!!! Bravo!
Wow @grabbyhands. What a cruel response to a very measured comment. It’s not fair to imply the poster is “smug” because they call for a reconsideration of the two-party system. And it’s not realistic (or helpful) to assume this person doesn’t vote in down ticket elections or isn’t attuned to local politics. You literally don’t know a thing about them, and you’re bizarrely silencing conscientious objection by pre-supposing the objector is uneducated or uninterested in close analysis of the political system, from the community to the national scale.
Well, the two party system is fragmenting before your eyes. Both parties are blowing up. The DNC may be putting on a slicker production this week but the societal political divisions are real. JMHO, both parties have no one to blame for their current state but themselves.
2/3 of the voters in the US are going to get someone they don’t like for president. Maybe 3/3.
@lyka Cruel? Please. It is reality.
If people voting third party were truly realistic and educated about how voting, elections and Congress actually worked instead standing on a shaky pedestal of idealism, we would be fielding viable third party candidates now. Clearly that has NOT happened and will continue to be a black hole of wasted votes until people start accepting that all of that doesn’t happen overnight. You can’t hashtag it into existence by ignoring the very real stakes we’re all playing for.
But I suspect that this is all wasted on you. I hope it is all a comfort to you if Trump gets elected and proceeds to torpedo civil rights, reproductive rights, dooms our healthcare, environment and whatever else he can burn down before he leaves office.
I want to frame this comment, Grabbyhands.
I wrote a longer comment above but I’ll just repeat that I don’t see third parties having any realistic chance in a country where the majority of people don’t vote, and not simply because they’re disgusted with the system but because they are content, indifferent, or any of the other reasons people have found.
If you have truly found a third party option that accurately represents your goals and that you are passionate about then you should vote for them.
to add to that, it can create more paralysis in the system (not always). You will often have a minority government that relies on other parties to support their initiatives. So while you may vote for a Green Party, you are very likely to have that party putting forth Democratic or Republican policies so they can put forth their own agenda too. That’s not to say that the two party system doesn’t work that way too, but a third party system doesn’t make that part of governing go away – from a citizen of a country with a multiparty system
Yeah multiple party political systems are not necessarilly the paradise they’re being made out to be. With them comes flaws that many Americans simply have not been trained to accept from their govt. and there is a room for more corruption or stagnation.
PREACH. I’m voting for Hillary even though I think she’s a shady corporate shill, but I can definitely understand your point of view.
The two party system is the death of democracy. I was hoping that there would be viable third party candidates on both sides of the aisle. That would really shake things up.
No, what’s needed as someone so sagely suggested a few days ago is to go grassroots. This is just one election among many downticket elections. If you’re part of a movement, you need to organise at the grassroots to become a viable party and work for decades for validation. Are you willing to do that?
Even Bernie himself has said that the movement continues. And yet people simply threaten to take their toys and go home. They sound easily discouraged. Look at Clinton. She has lots of reason to be discouraged, especially because she is a woman. And here she is. It’s the long game that matters. Not a losing blip in history.
The last time someone considered a 3rd party (Nader), we got chad-gate. From there we had 8 years of Bush, Iraq and what is today the middle east and all its problems. So unless there is a viable third party, I am not going to go there. Yes the top two are not ideal but I’d rather go with Hilary than Orangino. As of the now, the 3rd party will only give us Bush/Gore redux. Who wants the fate of the presidency to be in the hands of Florida again?
Thank you, Asiyah. It seems to me that all of these responsible, respectable, mature adults are fine with the exponential proliferation of poverty, homelessness, inequality, pollution, corporate crime, climate change, racism, classism, criminalization of the black community, illegal wars, imperialism, etc., etc,. etc. I guess being an adult means rationalizing and accepting a thoroughly corrupt system/society that is ultimately putting the survival of the human species in peril.
A third party is pointless until we start filling Congress seats with alternative party candidates. I say this as a registered independent – a third party candidate is a lame duck without congressional support. People who are frustrated with the current system need to focus their energy on the bigger picture than just the president.
This!!!
I always thought Sanders was a hypocrit, attacking HRC for taking money from Goldman Sachs for speaking fees, when his own wife Jane took home a $200,000 golden parachute upon her departure as president in 2011 from Burlington College after nearly bankrupting it over a bad real estate deal.
The poor and middle classes are lucky to get two weeks’ notice when they get fired. Talk about inequality. Excuse me if I see a bit of hypocrisy in the Bank of Sanders.
Lol at Burlington College being compared to Goldman Sachs. Lol at a severance package after 7 years of service being compared to a one-time speaking engagement. Lol at “nearly bankrupting it over a bad real estate deal” being used to describe a campus expansion campaign very common to private colleges.
Hey I’m not a Hilary fan either but I’m realistic. The other alternative is Orangino and I don’t want him and his weird family in the White House! The Bernie Bust people need to be realistic about this. What’s the alternative?
Exactly. I was not a huge Hillary fan. However, I feel that the biggest moral obligation now is preventing a Trump Presidency. I think the damage he could cause may be almost irreparable. Also, I support the democratic platform and really like Tim Kaine.
I’m gonna call Ivanka and see if I can go into business with her and China making some nice 1950s style aprons with “Bernie or Bust” on the front. We’ll all be wearing them after 8 years of Pence more or less in charge and we’re transported back 50 years in policy. Contact me now if you’re interested in being a partner! 😉
I wish Bernie-or-Busters pay attention to Bernie about this convention.
“And at a press conference Monday held by the Bernie Delegates Network, delegates didn’t rule out staging a walkout during Clinton’s acceptance speech on Thursday.
Sanders urged delegates to avoid such protests on the convention floor.
“Our credibility as a movement will be damaged by booing, turning of backs, walking out or other similar displays,” Sanders wrote in a text message to delegate leaders. “That’s what the corporate media wants. That’s what Donald Trump wants. But that’s not what will expand the progressive movement of this country.”
When even the threat of a Trump presidency can’t make an alternative candidate palatable (never mind a sure thing) you’ve got a really really big problem.
So glad she called out those people. Trump will be laughing all the way to the election if this continues.
From the outside looking in, all of this is just mental. From the RNC to the DNC, to the all out brutal bashing of one group of voters to another.
I get that different parties have different views, that is how it works, it’s like that up here too. However, once a leader has been chosen, the whole point of the system is to have everyone from that party gather behind that person and be united. Watching the infighting between nominee supporters, particularly in the DNC, has been unbelievable. These are parties divided and it truly shows the dysfunction of the US system.
I don’t believe that conventions where a party nominee (or leader) should be televised. This should be a party only, members only vote, that the rest of the world cannot see. Will there be difference of opinion? Yes? Will there be infighting? Absolutely. This is not the time to air your party’s dirt laundry to the world. It is the time for the party to decide who will be the best representative and then that person should be announced to the world with the full party support behind them, whether you agree or not. This should be run no different than any other party, board, committee, etc. What happens behind closed doors, stays behind closed doors and the world sees something united, not this fractured, insane, vile display that the Dem and Rep parties are showing to the rest of us. All we see is an entire nation that is so dysfunctional that it can’t even get it’s own parties in order.
If you think that all Canadian Liberals were thrilled with the choice of Pretty Boy Justine, then you would be very very wrong. He was not everyone’s choice but he won the leadership vote and that’s the way it is. Mulclair was not the first choice for a lot of NDP supporters, but he won, so that’s it. Stephen Harper was not the choice for many Conservatives, but again, he won. None of the in-fighting showed up on TV or in the news 24/7. It shows the public that the parties are unified within themselves and this is the face they show the world.
I also believe that the POTUS race goes on for far too long. We all get to watch the candidates for party and the POTUS tear each other apart for YEARS. WTF is up with that? Here, our minimum election race time (Federally) is 36 days. The last election was our longest, at 11 weeks. That was the longest 11 weeks of bullsh*t we have ever had to listen too. I think that maybe someone down there needs to start looking at how the electoral system works and think about an overhaul. It’s too long, too vile and way too public.
I don’t understand what the Bernie or Bust people are hoping to accomplish with their behavior at the DNC. I’m sure they get alot of personal satisfaction out of boo’ng speakers but what is their end goal? Debbie Wasserman Schultz is out and the DNC apologized, we have the most progressive Dem platform ever, every bad thing you could dream up about Hillary applies to Trump one thousand times over (but with a personality disorder and calculated racism, misogyny, and xenophobia thrown in to boot), etc What do they want? Do they want to help elect Trump? Is their goal to make things worse for folks so it can get better? I.e., spur on the “revolution”?
Right now it seems like they are doing all they can to help Trump. It’s also interesting how the GOP was able to silence the #NeverTrump people with procedural rules and behind the scenes strong arm tactics. Even though I find the boo’ng annoying I’m proud that the Dems are allowing the dissenters to have their voice.
I really am not sure that Hillary is the door-stop that keeps Trump out of the White House.
I get the exigencies of supporting Hillary to defeat Trump, but there is absolutely no evidence that she’s able to do so. That the Dems could field absolutely no other candidates except a socialist septuagenarian( that gave her a real run for her money) shows how deeply dysfunctional the Dems are as well. It appears Clinton will have the coronation she wants in her own party but her candidacy is as fraught with public apprehension as Trumps’.
Politicians choose to run for president. Three other politicians ran against Hilary Clinton in their attempt to reach the highest office in the country. Two of them could never gain enough steam to make it anywhere and the third got a lot of attention and passion but his supporters did not translate that to votes. This had a lot to do with him not being able to gain enough traction with minority voters. In the end he was bested by Clinton in both the popular vote and the delegate count.
Public perception is not always based on well informed fact. Sad but true public opinion is easily swayed and shaped by phobias and whatever story is repeated often enough. There’s a large portion of the U.S. that still believes Obama is a Muslim.
Well, the fact that Dems, early on emphatically dismissed any alternatives to Hillary (Bernie aside) doesn’t mean that the public or even the party has to be happy about the outcome.
It doesn’t make Hillary a more viable candidate. Not everyone wants to take the medicine. Even the spectre of Trump’s chaotic run can make her truly popular which I think is evidence of very shallow enthusiasm. The party is fractured because it’s fractured. A giant swath of disaffected voters may not like either dysfunctional choice. The outcome will not be pretty.
Dem’s dismissed?
Please. One of the guys running against her was from my state and I STILL didn’t vote for him. I’m voting based on competence and capability and in a room with Hilary and the other three there wasn’t much competition. For a time I liked Sanders but his overly idealized repertoire started to feel dry to me. A great speech is a great speech but he lacked the ability to make me believe he’s actually be able to push through and achieve his plans.
Both of the early candidates did not get enough public support or votes. Bernie got a lot of attention but not enough votes. 4 million more votes than Bernie suggests for the those who actually did vote their choice was her. A lot of people don’t like anything tbh, there are people right now complaining about attempts at creating a national health care system, attempting to fix the immigration failure, attempting to secure rights for women and attempting to protect gay marriage.
It’s one thing to be unhappy, it’s another to be unhappy with a well rationalized and intelligent reason.
Dws booed off stage by her own florida delegates which is why she didnt speak at dnc, thank god..that woulda been a spectacle!
Yes..agreed! And i really dont think dems needed any more boos/spectacles in one night…yikes.
I can see what she’s saying, and I basically agree, but I don’t like to belittle people. However, IF your goal is to defeat Trump – all the raucousness that goes on at the DNC isn’t going to attract undecided voters to your cause, for the most part. It looks bad. When you only focus on your niche issues and don’t look at the bigger picture, you lose 100% instead of maybe winning on at least a few things.
The job of the DNC is to get Democrats in office. Period. Bernie was a “Democrat” for about 20 minutes. I am not surprised that Democratic leadership looked askance on him. The DNC is not like judge who is supposed to be neutral. They are supposed to make sure Democrats win.