James Corden on the UK’s posh actors: ‘I fear acting is becoming an elitist sport’

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James Corden covers the September issue of British GQ. I like the cover, but the inside photos aren’t that great, because they came in too close on Corden’s face. Magazines do that with women who are a bit heavier too – like, readers will be “upset” if they see a heavier person photographed from the waist-up, or even a full-length photo. Corden’s interview is pretty great, and I want you to keep in mind two things. One, he’s speaking to a British audience about how they did not treat him fairly. Two, he specifically speaks about how posh British actors are given all the break and name-checks Tom Hiddleston, and British GQ included this cover line: “How to be attractive… Hint: Be more like Tom Hiddleston” right next to Corden’s face. Passive-aggressive editor, I’m just saying. Some highlights from Corden’s interview:

His dream Carpool Karaoke guests: “Kanye has been booked to do Carpool Karaoke now twice and both times something came up. He’ll do it eventually. He wants to do it. [When he cancelled he sent] about three dozen white roses, of course. Arranged in the shape of a cube. What could be more Kanye than that?… [The dream would be] Beyonce. It would break the internet. She’s on tour right now. We’re working on it.”

How the American audience has embraced him: He says that there was an “expectation of failure” in Britain when he launched his show in the U.S., noting: “If we’d made this show for ITV to air at eight o’clock on Saturday night people would have destroyed it.”

The UK is becoming culturally elitist: “I’ve come to the conclusion that it is about class… Look at my career: I was in a really good play at the National Theatre, The History Boys, which then moved to Broadway and won six Tony awards. We came back. I wrote a sitcom (Gavin And Stacey) that did really, really well. I did a couple of films, got a play in New York, One Man, Two Guvnors, and subsequently won every best actor award going. I mean, that’s quite a lot of good stuff! Douglas Booth has got a great career, he’s a brilliant actor, but he’s never going to encounter the sort of sh-t like I’ve had. Nor will Tom Hiddleston. Nor Eddie Redmayne. Nor Benedict Cumberbatch. I fear acting is becoming an elitist sport and I worry about where that lands us culturally. I really do.”

[From British GQ]

Regarding his comments about how his show would have been destroyed if he had done it in Britain, I think he may be right. I remember reading a lot of British critics stick their noses in the air about how Corden was going to hugely fail in America, and then when his show was successful, those same critics say that it’s because Corden is “too American,” meaning that he’s gauche, or too happy, or that he doesn’t have enough of a stiff upper lip and a dry, sardonic sense of humor. So many British entertainers try and fail to find success in America, and I don’t think many in the UK thought that Corden would end up being embraced by American audiences.

Regarding his comments about posh actors… it’s been a topic of conversation amongst British actors for years now, as the Hiddlestons, Cumberbatches and Redmaynes started gathering up all of the roles. For the most part, it’s the posh actors being forced to talk about how they benefit from Britain’s deeply ingrained class system, and rarely is it the James Corden-type of actor/entertainer saying he was always treated differently because of his working class background. I think the root of it – as an outsider looking in on Britain’s class system – is that it doesn’t feel like British celebrate the upwardly mobile. If someone working class strives to better himself, he’s cut down with insults that he’s getting above his station. Tall poppy syndrome or whatever. That’s so foreign to me, and to most Americans. The upwardly mobile narrative is part of our national identity.

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Photos courtesy of British GQ.

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105 Responses to “James Corden on the UK’s posh actors: ‘I fear acting is becoming an elitist sport’”

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  1. Neelyo says:

    Meanwhile here in the US, actors better have a famous parent if they want a career.

    • Kate says:

      I was going to comment on the rampant nepotism and how actors with famous parents don’t even have to be good to get roles.

    • Betti says:

      Nepotism is rampant in the UK industry as well, i could spend all day listing the people who have careers primarily due to family connections opening doors for them.

    • Snazzy says:

      Yup, a different kind of elite, but elitist nonetheless

    • Sixer says:

      Same structures; different flavours.

    • lilacflowers says:

      Gwyneth, RDJ, Jake and Maggie, Jeff and Beau Bridges, Sean Penn, Dakota, the Gummers, on and on and on,

      • FingerBinger says:

        Everybody you’ve mentioned ,except for the Gummers ,have become successful in their own right. The jury’s still out on Dakota.

      • mp says:

        you know who i think is the best example? Eva Amurri, I think the only reason she’s in movies is because they will get Susan Sarandon (because Eva always plays the younger version of her mother)

      • Lilacflowers says:

        They got opportunities others would not have had at the start of their careers because of their families

      • Neelyo says:

        @mp – but I did enjoy her in SAVED!, haven’t seen her in anything else but I know she played the young Susan in that Marilyn Monroe Lifetime miniseries.

        I think the best example of Hollywood nepotism is Alison Eastwood. Remember her? Clint cast her in a few of his movies ad all she proved was she had no talent and then she disappeared. The only reason she got onto the soundstage was because of her dad.

      • mp says:

        oh wow, Saved was the best (I just rewatched it on Netflix, like 2 days ago!)

        But come on, Eva is always in a movie with her mother: that Adam Sandler movie, the Marylin Monroe, I think she played her daughter in Banger Sisters, and even appeared on that Friends Episode where Susan Sarandon plays a soap opera actress……

    • Nicole says:

      Yes and no. At least here there are people that break in the business and are not Hollywood royalty. And the US loves an underdog story. But there are absolutely nepotism castings all the time

      • Timbuktu says:

        Well, I mean, those people exist in the UK as well, clearly Corden is one of them. The point is not that such people are non-existent in the UK, it’s that a proportionately smaller class contributes a disproportionately large amount of “talent”. That does not mean that no one poor or not connected ever makes it in either industry.

      • Sixer says:

        Some figures:

        7% of British children are privately educated
        67% of British acting Oscar winners were privately educated
        93% (yes, 93%) of British Oscar winners overall were privately educated
        45% of BAFTA winners were privately educated

        That’s the level of over-representation just in TV and film. That’s before we get to 75% of high court judges, 60% of the top tier of doctors, 50% of the government cabinet, 71% of colonels and above in the armed services, etc ad infinitum.

    • Jess says:

      That’s one reason why I respect Jennifer Lawrence. She had no famous parents or connections in the industry yet she’s the top actress in the field right now.

  2. Palar says:

    Agree with him. We have tall poppy syndrome is Australia too (we inherited it from the mother country LOL) but we don’t really have the class system in place that only allows for “posh” people to be successful. We cut all successful people down in Aus, not just upwardly mobile working class.
    I’m very jealous of the celebrate the successful culture in America!

    • Locke Lamora says:

      Does the US celebrate upward mobility? I have the feeling it celebrates being rich, no matter where you started. Because Donald Trump seems to be getting equal praise to someone who started at the rock bottom.

    • Algernon says:

      But isn’t tall poppy syndrome more about not bragging or getting a big head? Is it really about tearing down someone lower/middle class purely because they’re finding success? I thought it was more about saying, “Good on you, but don’t forget your roots,” which can be a helpful way to keep an ego in check.

  3. Betti says:

    The ‘upwardly mobile’ attitude is what i love the most about people from North America – you celebrate success.

    British theatre is very very snobby and i agree with him there – both the plum roles and drama school places go to people from a certain background (regardless of talent). I do a lot of amateur dramatics and one of the directors i work with a lot used to be a professional actor (went to drama school) and he and his gf (also a trained actress) both agree that its hard for actors from working class background to get their foot in the door. He has commented on occasion that just because you went to drama school it doesn’t mean that you are a good/great actor.

    He’s not the first actor to talk about this – Helen Mirren has, thou wasn’t she dragged for it?

  4. mkyarwood says:

    Agreed, I’ve had enough of the Eton Mess.

  5. Bex says:

    He isn’t wrong. It seems that a lot if not most of our most prominent actors come out of the most prestigious universities like Oxbridge or the London drama schools. It’s really difficult to fund your training and then life afterwards as a jobbing actor if you don’t have a family that can support you financially. Then there’s the lack of connections if you don’t have the ‘right’ background.

    The tabloid press here were pretty incredulous that he got the job. I’m glad he’s doing well. I’ll always like him for Gavin and Stacey- that was a genius show.

    • Jellybean says:

      I don’t have a problem with successful people coming out of top Universities; anyone can get a place there if they have the talent and the inclination. My problem is the Eton, Harrow, Stowe brigade. Even without Oxbridge they get doors thrown open for them and if they want the extra level of privilege that comes with making connections at Oxbridge, then their public schools have teams of people on hand to help them: I can assure you that very few state schools are able to offer that support. It is funny that James Corden had his break through playing a student at a state school which did do Oxbridge entry prep.

      Anyway, I have a lot of time for Corden. He is a very talented man. He did become a complete d**khead for a while, but he was young and he seems to have worked hard and learned from his mistakes. I am all fro second chances.

  6. Guesto says:

    You co-wrote a sitcom with the very talented Ruth Jones, James. Just correcting that for you.

    I’m genuinely glad he’s doing so well in the US but let’s not forget that he became unbearably obnoxious for a while and that’s what put a lot of people off him. So to say that it was just begrudgers begrudging is not quite the whole story.

    • Lurker says:

      Agree with both your points. I think he’s great on his show, I love Carpool Kareoke, love A League of Their Own, really enjoy James in general, but he was unbearable there for a while.

      I remember him accepting a BAFTA for Gavin & Stacy and complaining that the show hadn’t won one of the categories it was nominated for?? Something like that?

      There’s no real harm in having an ego, and by all accounts he had to learn tough lessons in the public eye, but I don’t think that ego will ever reduce or go away. He’s just announced that he’s “won every acting award going”, ffs.

      • Betti says:

        He just learned token the ego under control but it’s still there, the awards comment shows it. He doesn’t have an Oscar or GG so no he hasn’t won every acting award.

      • Guesto says:

        @Lurker – yes, the arrogance and sense of entitlement is still there and writ large, not just in the boastful ‘I won every award going’ but particularly in the ‘I wrote a hugely successful sitcom…’

        Apart from the fact that it was co-written, Ruth Jones is acknowledged as the creative brain behind G&S and, if anyone doubts that, have a look at what Cordon wrote without her input. 😉

  7. Hindulovegod says:

    I find most of that private school crowd so underwhelming as actors. James McAvoy’s or Idris Elba’s range compared to Hiddleston’s or Redmayne’s? The latter two are among the best of the posh boys, and yet. . .

    • Arlene says:

      Ooh, and McAvoy, I’d forgotten him in my lower comment.

    • sunny says:

      I love both of those actors and marvel at their terrific range! James especially is such a brilliant actor.

      I think one of the major problems of class and theatre in Britain is that their is a real risk of it becoming a self-selecting field. If only the posh and well-connected are getting plum roles will the Idris’ and the James’ try out for those roles/places in drama school or will some of them not even try to compete? It is like they are significantly limiting the pool.

      • Brittney B. says:

        And that’s the tragedy, isn’t it, sunny? The world is deprived of so much sheer talent and passion because we’re only looking for it in certain places. If meritocracies were real, upper-class white men would have farrrrrr fewer opportunities. But… I think I just answered my own question. Sigh.

    • Brittney B. says:

      I’d take an Idris or James performance over the others ANY day. There’s grit and soul and depth that reminds me more of the theater than glossy Hollywood films.

    • Nicole says:

      AGREED. I’ll take James and Idris any day although I do have a soft spot for Eddie too.
      James the US would love to keep you. I’ve been a fan for a while esp his broadway career and I adore carpool karaoke. James is so charming and delightful to watch

  8. Erinn says:

    I love this man. He’s incredibly witty, and charming and I find him super cute as well. He has stunning eyes.

  9. HH says:

    I’ve seen him in a few things, and just knew he had a familiar face. However, I fell in love with him from the Hulu series “The Wrong Mans.” I love that show! It’s probably not his best work, and I’m not saying that based upon performance (because he was great). I just have accepted that I have poor taste in shows/movies/music.

  10. Sixer says:

    I think Britishers snoot at anyone going for the US chat show market – Piers has been on the receiving end (yes yes, Piers deserves all crapola ever thrown but lots of it was the same motivation). It’s a “Use us to get a name then abandon us for American money” thing.

    Aside from that, he is entirely right. Austerity programs have taken huge amounts of opportunity away from working class people, who were already under-represented. And it’s also given permission to some people to air their snobbish opinions. So Corden has had not just the usual going-to-America Britisher moaning; he’s also had the snobby but-he’s-a-chav-they-shouldn’t-like-him moaning.

    • Div says:

      I read an interview with Julie Walters a few years ago where she basically went off on austerity programs in the U.K. and said she wouldn’t have been able to establish her career in the current environment. I believe she or James McAvoy also discussed how casting directors/directors also favor the lanky posh types. The sort of class elitism is very much at odds with the American ideal of “pull yourself up by your bootstraps” (granted, we have our own severe flaws). Some American actors really try and play down their wealthy backgrounds.

      It is interesting. Michael Caine, Helen Mirren, Peter O’Toole, Patrick Stewart, Ian McKellen, etc. did not have posh backgrounds. The “new” group of big actors in the U.K., on the other hand, are almost exclusively from posh backgrounds.

      • Lurker says:

        Yeah, I remember that too, and I remember Laurence Fox, the definition of posh privilege, saying that she “should have shut up”.

        Ain’t no privilege like that posh British privilege.

      • Sixer says:

        So many of them are talking about it – David Morrissey always sticks out to me, but also Eddie Marsan.

        This is why I always get so exercised when Hiddlesburp, Cumbersquatch, Norton et al go on record to try and say that they have it bad with all the reverse classism about. Does my bloody head in (because these are the times one needs to use working class idioms)!

      • Betti says:

        @lurker. Laurence Fox, talented guy but has an attitude problem and have heard stories about how he can be a douche. From what i can recall, he got a bit of stick from the British press when he first started out about his family connections.

        Its an industry thats all about who you know, talent often never comes into it. I’ve heard stories about people who got into prestigious drama schools purely because Mummy/Daddy has connections.

  11. Stella in NH says:

    I first saw James Corden on a Doctor Who episode. I LOVED him. I was so excited about him coming to do a late night show. He is a man of many talents. I am glad that he is here and successful

    • Brittney B. says:

      I didn’t even realize it was him until a year or two later. Did you catch both episodes? The Doctor met him in one, returned to his family’s flat in another.

      • mp says:

        Ohhh i remember him from Teachers, with a young Andrew Lincoln, that show was great.

      • Stella in NH says:

        Yes. He was absolutely adorable as Craig. When I saw the advertisement for his late night show I did a double take and immediately called my daughter. We both think that he is one of the best re-occurring character on the show.

    • eto says:

      He was so great on Doctor Who!

  12. Arlene says:

    I don’t know; Idris, Tom Hardy, Taron Egerton, Jamie Bell, Simon Pegg, Daniel Radcliff, there’s probably a ton I can’t quite recall off the top of my head, but I wouldn’t consider these (male) actors members of an elite class. I suspect there’s more of a mix than people realise.

    • Nina says:

      yeah and the american president is black. that does not mean there isnt a problem with racism.
      its about the upper class people having a way easier life. douglas booth skates by on his looks . emma watson has never had a good performance in almost 20 years of acting etc etc.

      • Arlene says:

        Okay, you’re putting words into my mouth. I never said a word about upper class people having it easier or not. I said I suspect there’s more of a mix than people realise.

      • Bob says:

        @Nina, Douglas Booth is so pretty he should be able to skate by on his looks, but I think he’s a decent actor as well. I liked him in Christopher and His Kind, and he was perfect in And Then There Were None.

    • Sixer says:

      Recent study by the LSE found only 27% of British actors are from working class backgrounds. It’s a real problem and there are initiatives to help (Actor Awareness and Arts Emergency are two off the top of my head) but they themselves are under-supported.

      Same study also found class discrimination at auditions and elsewhere.

      https://www.theguardian.com/culture/2016/feb/27/class-ceiling-working-class-actors-study

    • Div says:

      Tom and Daniel are both from wealthy families. They aren’t from super posh families like Benedict Cumberbatch but they aren’t exactly working or middle class, either.

      • Cee says:

        Cumberbatch isn’t as posh as he likes to think. He attended Harrow on a scholarship and his mother had to do a lot of commercial work to make ends meet and give him an education. He has a posh sounding last name, and some family history, but that’s it.

        Eddie Redmayne is truly posh.

      • Algernon says:

        Tom Hiddleston’s mother is from a super connected family, though, isn’t she? His dad is a normal person, but his mother isn’t.

      • ElleBee says:

        @Cee I think it’s funny that you think that Cumberbatch is a posh name. In Barbados (where his ancestors owned plantations) that name is beyond ordinary and common.

      • Cee says:

        @ElleBee – I don’t, actually. Mainly because I’m not British, nor have I ever lived there, so I can not tell between posh and non posh surnames (except the famous ones).

        But he does present himself as posh. The way his surname sounds helps, too.

      • PikaBoo says:

        Tumblr fans already did some in-depth “research” and apparently Hiddles is more posh than Cumberbooo. There’s a website that shows aristocratic ancestry and Hiddles family is in it.

        Of course no can be more posh than Kit Harrington. He’s the poshiest of them all

    • Persephone says:

      It seems to go in cycles of posh actors getting all then attention then working class and back again. With social media and the rising cost of university education it’s more in your face.

      • LAK says:

        I was going to say this. The 80s were all posh actors – Brideshead Revisited lot – Merchant Ivory lot – culminating in 1994 with Pride and Prejudice ( Colin Firth era) / FOUR WEDDINGS AND A FUNERAL lot. Mid-90s the pendulum swung the other way starting at the rise of Ewan Macgregor and TRAINSPOTTING lot through the Guy Ritchie cockney/Mockney phase of working class actors that lasted until mid 00s when the pendulum began to swing the other way again. We are now in a posh actors upswing, soon we’ll go back the other way and so on and so forth. The cycle seems to be 10-15yrs in any given direction.

        A quick analysis of the 60s and 70s shows the same. You have the working class actors doing very well in the 60s /70s – Sean Connery, Michael Caine, Terence Stamp, Peter O’Toole, Richard Burton etc

    • Alexa says:

      Daniel Radcliffe had a very middle class background and had parents that knew the producer who was making Harry Porter. Hardy pretends to be working class but is actually public school educated. Though he has a far more colorful past than most, I imagine. People often cite Keira Knightly as well but her parents were in the business so she had an in. I am Not having a go at you but I think there are a lot of actors in the UK who are privileged despite not nessarily going to Eton/Harrow/ect.

      • Cee says:

        yeah, working class and middle class are not the same thing.
        I think Hardy comes from a theatre family and attended some public school though I remember reading something about being expelled from somewhere.

      • Mira says:

        @Arelene
        Tom Hardy is nowhere near working class, hes a public school boy from Richmond who likes to talk in a working class accent don’t let the mockney accent fool you, hes as working class as Guy Ritchie that is to say not at all. Daniel Radcliffe is upper middle class and extremely well connected in the entertainment business . Taron Egerton is also middle class although hes played a lot of working class characters.
        Of the two you mentioned only Jamie Bell and Idris would be considered working class. But they aren’t exactly proving that working
        Jamie Bell was a child star who was plucked from obscurity because they were looking specifically for a working class boy to play Billy Elliot. I believed he went to live with the director of the movie at a young age when he was making his way in hollywood after the success of Billy so he had advantaged not known to the general working class actor.
        As for Idris he has spoken at length about how he didn’t get work in the UK so he had to leave, he was only offered leading man parts in the Uk after he had made it in America so his case very much shows that there is a glass celling for talented working class actors.

    • Maum says:

      By the way Tom Hardy is privately educated. So he counts as a ‘posh boy’.

  13. Grace says:

    The UK is… just becoming culturally elitist? Isn’t it elitist since always?

  14. pikawho? says:

    I remember reading an Eddie Redmayne interview about how Eton has a huge professional quality theatre and that the plays there have adult crew members who actually work in the industry– including real professional directors who come in for a few weeks. Its insane! What chance does a kid in a small village theatre group have against that?

    • Grace says:

      Though not impossible, it would be difficult. What class/privilege bring is an endless cycle: more money = better school = better connection = more opportunity = fame = more money = better connection… and concerned parents would try anything to get their children into better school to get in on that cycle.

  15. manta says:

    Is this really the case? On the top of my head: Michael Caine, Michael Sheen,Gary Oldman, Anthony Hopkins, Tom Wilkinson,Robert Carlyle or Mark Strong all come from middle or working class background and my perception is that they’re generally well liked. But being a non Brit I can totally be mistaken.

    • Bex says:

      They’re all older though. It is true of the generation of actors that have come through more recently- the article Sixer posted up thread on the subject is interesting. It’s not just the case with the men either, there aren’t many acclaimed British working/middle class actresses around (though obviously there are just fewer parts going for women in general)

    • Sixer says:

      The problem is (currently) that the austerity agenda has put all the gains in expanding opportunity and reducing class discrimination into reverse. So yes, reasonable representation in the older generation but you’ve got to look at who is coming through. And, because everything is getting culturally homogeneous again, you start to see the snobbish sniping and carping that Corden is talking about.

      • Jellybean says:

        No rep, no grants, outrageous rents in the cities and probably no job at the end. Having a rich mummy and daddy is a wonderful safety net. It really irks me when these rich kids are credited with artistic integrity because they haven’t done a commercial or made a bad film that gives them the money to put their kids through college. I saw an interview once with Jeremy Renner in which the interviewer clearly believed he had lied when he said he had had to managed on a food budget of $5 a week. Renner then just listed what he had routinely bought, how many days it would feed him for and how much he paid. I can’t imagine Tom Hiddleston having to make a tray of reduced donuts last for 5 days.

      • Sixer says:

        All of that, but also in the UK it is the effortless moving from social network to social network, conferred upon you by your background. And when the social networks dominate various areas of public life – media, arts, judiciary and politics are the chief areas here – then you do end up what we’ve ended up with.

        I think it’s bad for the country. It stifles innovation and creativity for sure because new ideas are only drawn from a very narrow base.

      • Jellybean says:

        I couldn’t agree more Sixer. Way back as a student I can remember being gob smacked when the seven people I shared a house with suddenly got a huge poll tax bill. The Tory government recognised that the unemployed couldn’t afford to pay it and students couldn’t afford to pay it, so niether group was charged. But, when one of us finished his course and didn’t immediately find a job, the combination meant we were all liable for the cost of the whole house. The politicians or civil servants simply hadn’t thought about the fact that people who are living in basic, shared accommodation might not fall into the same classification. I jokingly suggested we kick the poor guy out onto the street and was told it might be the best option to encourage him to find somewhere else to live. I swear these people have no idea how the rest us us live and they are running the country.

        As far as innovation is concerned, it doesn’t help either when politicians not only come from the same social background, but often study the same courses. A few more scientists and engineers and far fewer lawyers making policy decisions would be a bonus.

      • Sixer says:

        The dreaded PPE!

  16. Cee says:

    The upward mobility thing is also foreign to me. We celebrate those who better themselves.

    Maybe it’s because both the US and my country were colonies built on the basis of inmigration? Our ancestors escaped wars, civil disputes and poverty, and found new, rich lands, and opportunities.

    • Locke Lamora says:

      I have a feeling we don’t celebrate anyone. We had communism so we don’t have old money, or an elite. But because the transition to capitalism was poorly done, and because there are people who profited from the war, the general sentiment is that all rich people are crooks ( which is sadly true 90% of the time). Unless success is achieved trough education ( and those people rarely get to be millionaires), the general opinion is that it’s done illegally and/or on someone elses expense.

      As for Corden, I’ve been watching him for years, and he got incredibly cocky for a while. And he was always too happy for my taste But I’m suprised because I really like him on Late Late Show. And I don’t think the sarcastic humour is an upper class thing. I follow a lot of British comedians and a lot of them are working class and the best ones are quite dark and sarcastic.
      Heck, in my country everyone is sarcastic, that doesn’t exactly makes us posh.

  17. shelly says:

    Laughing at the headline “How to be more attractive. Hint: Be more like Tom Hiddleston”
    On the cover of that GQ.

    As for being posh it’s all relative, anyone not working class, seems posh to me. Regardless of what school they went to.

    I suppose there are just different degrees of poshness.

    • Sixer says:

      I try to explain that posh is a relative term all the time hereabouts! But it all gets a bit meta-level, trying to explain that saying you’ve got a posh next door neighbour because they like the opera and holiday in Tuscany or wherever isn’t the same as moaning about the Eton-Oxbridge stranglehold on multiple forms of British public life.

      • shelly says:

        Indeed Sixer.

        Exhibit A: Posh spice.
        She isn’t posh although she didn’t grow up working class either, she does not fit into the genuine posh catergory imo.

        Which means I’ve just contradicted myself, never mind.

        Getting back to acting, Laurence Fox, public school education and scion of nepotastic acting family, told Julie Walters to shut up about the class divide in acting.

      • LAK says:

        It’s hard to get into the nuances of micro poshness, much easier to reduce it to what school one attended. Which is not indicative of anything because people can attend Eton on scholarship and or have parents who decide that’s what they want for their kids and *sacrifice accordingly.

        *sacrificing so that the kids can attend the best public school seems to be an immigrant thing. Centuries settled British people don’t necessarily understand that level of sacrifice.

      • Locke Lamora says:

        It’s really hard to understand social classes in Britain. Here you’d be working class if your parents are actual factory workers or something similar, and only the very rich ( and very stupid) go to private schools. So when I hear British people describe themselves as working class but they spent vacations in Spain, or middle class and they went to a private school it’s very weird. It reminds of the time Lupita said she’s middle class but she went to school in America. Each country has it’s own way of describing class.

      • Sixer says:

        It does, Locke. For example, many self-identified working class people in the UK (I’m thinking skilled trades, etc) would probably self-identity as middle class in the US. Plus, as I say, it gets confused with the term posh, which has so many shades of meaning and context in the UK, you probably have to be Britisher to fully get it.

        The actual, structural problem here is that in many areas of public life, not just the arts, the 7% of the population are privately educated take at least 50% of the positions, often more, leaving the other 93% to compete for the rest.

        This isn’t a dearth of aspiration. This is an actual, structural problem that self-replicates via nepotism, connections and all the rest of it. Just look at Cambridge Footlights to see the perfect example of how the exclusionary social networks are formed.

        It’s not that people are doing it consciously, on purpose, for horrible reasons. It’s that the routes and structures need to be forced to open up.

      • Locke Lamora says:

        I’ve read a few things about it, and it’s horrible. We’re lucky here that university education is free, and the only way into acting or arts in general is trough Art academies which are state universities. Sadly, there’s been quite a push recently to legitimise private colleges ( they can’t have the title of an university) and it’s sickening. There are also more and more private primary and secondary schools, which were unheard of just 5 years ago. Thankfully, the opinion about private eduaction is still very negative ( their diplomas are wothless papers for people who weren’t good enough to make it in a real school), but I am worried that in 50 years we won’t look like America or the Uk in terms of private education.

  18. manta says:

    OK. I understand that the exemples of actors I gave upthread aren’t exactly newcomers and that ones coming from modest or non connected circles are rare in recent years . But what I get from the article is that the general audience, the media can’t wait to see them fail.
    Is that really the case? I expected the opposite, some recognition for a more difficult journey.
    Or is this kind of mentality directed only at those who try to make it in the US?

  19. Frenchne says:

    It’s true about Actors that they do get favored if they are from a posh background even though I could imagine Booth, Hiddleston, Redmayne or Cumberbatch all have encountered folk at boarding schools and elsewhere who are way posher than them. Sure they might have gone to same boarding schools as Prince William or Baron whatshisface but none of them were invited to their for ex. weddings, were they?
    Something else as an outsider I have noticed the dominance of posh people in acting but in writing of novels it’s not the case, is it? Or at least the British novels that become successful come from writers of Middle class background. At least that’s my impression. Because writings from people who have no connection to “ordinary people” tend to just be very bloated with words but no really addressing of issues.

    • Sixer says:

      It’s true that working class writers are much better represented in the UK. Also (white) women. There is a representation problem for POC, however, which replicates across festivals. However, the back room people are overwhelmingly a) middle class/posh, b) white and c) female. As a fiction editor, I work regularly with about thirty other professionals. In that number, only two are men and only one is not white. Seriously!

      • Betti says:

        @Sixer: ITA about ‘backroom’ people. I’ve worked on the fringes of the industry and most agents/casting directors etc.. were white, female, posh, middled aged and middle class (with that typical middle Englander attitude). Nice enough people to work with but were quite snobby/bitchy when it came to the talent and often went for people that were like them, regardless of ability to do the job. It was quite an eye opener.

      • Sixer says:

        I don’t encounter much snobbishness in publishing, to be fair. But then, I kinda “pass” as posh, despite being from a working class background.

  20. InvaderTak says:

    This topic has gone from a serious social discussion to useless pop culture talking point. Don’t get me wrong, I see why it comes up and even as an American I can see the problem (we most certainly have our own version of it). but whenever this issue comes up it boils down to “posh white guys should apologize and step aside for the working class white guys’. No one talks about this issue from a female standpoint, or *gasp* a POC standpoint. Has anyone ever dared to ask Emily Blunt, Lily James, Emma Thompson, Alice Eve, Lily Allen, Miranda Hart, et al about this in a real way (like they have with Hiddles)? I know I shouldn’t expect Pulitzer levels of hard hitting cultural discussion, but I can’t get over the irony that a discussion about class exclusion is only being discussed by a precious few.
    If I’m totally off base here, let me know. But that’s what I see whenever this topic comes up.

    • Decca says:

      So true. It really is a conversation that has been dominated by men’s experiences. The female examples you list are on point. As for POC? Yeah right.

    • Sixer says:

      I think that’s more a fear of identity politics. It’s easier to challenge a privileged man than it is a privileged woman because you have no fear of getting intersectionality back in your face when you challenge the men. It’s rare to see a posh male POC (eg Ejiofor) challenged about class, too. I must say, just going by the coverage here, Americans are much better at this than Britishers. Everyone can be challenged about everything.

      We have good domestic discussions about representation for women and POC, but you may not see them.

      Also, class is the great taboo. Lots of cheers and little backlash when you mention race or gender under-representation but fewer cheers and lots of backlash when you mention class. Perhaps this is a difference to the US, where mention of race and gender seem to get cheers and backlash in equal measure.

      Either way, it’s all intersecting inequality: race, gender, orientation AND class.

      • InvaderTak says:

        I know there must be discussions about this for real in GB and I just don’t see it because I’m American; I wasn’t trying to call out Brits as whole about this, just trying to point out something that appears to happen in the Brit celeb coverage. But as usual, I can’t phrase things worth crap.

        Basic point being, If you’re going to put guys like HIddles on the spot with the question, then you can do the same with, say, Emily Blunt. But they don’t because of your first point-identity politics. There’s a golden opportunity for an actress to give some thoughts on a relevant, real issue but the question won’t even get asked-not even by feminist writers it would seem- because of the reasons you stated in your first paragraph. It irks me to no end.

      • Sixer says:

        I’m completely with you!

  21. bcgirl says:

    another excellent post.

  22. Janey says:

    uk film industry is so elitist.
    The latest example is cara delevigne who is getting truly horrible reviews for sucicide squad. How does someone with No acting experience or training land so many coveted parts? It’s all about class and connections.

    • Betti says:

      Daisy Ridley is another example – no real experience or training yet got opportunities within the industry due to family connections.

      As for Cara – she wasn’t that great a model either.

  23. ECAM says:

    Tall poppy syndrome is a very negative universal human trait – the plain fact is that nobody likes it when someone is successful because they are jealous and feel “why couldn’t I be successful one?” So to compensate people make others feel badly about succeeding, which is entrenched in the class system worldwide, shaming those who want to make their lives better and find success. Humanity in general is just plain old shallow, petty and envious.

  24. JaLa says:

    Interesting. I’ve wondered why David Tennant has missed the boat that Hiddleston, Cumberbatch and Redmayne caught. Sure he had a massive exposure in Doctor Who, but his forays into film seemed to go nowhere as did his attempt at American network TV, Gracepoint. And yet, he’s not a darling of independent stuff like Ewan McGregor has done. Is it a class thing?

    • Annetommy says:

      David Tennant is middle class. His late father, Rev. Sandy MacDonald, was a former Moderator of the Church of Scotland (the nearest they get to a Bishop).

  25. PikaBoo says:

    Atleast we have James McAvoy. The guy deserves all his success.

  26. BSK2 says:

    He’s not wrong. Acting (and the media in general) in England is infested with the upper/middle-class (UK definition of middle-class that is).

    Really, there’s hardly anyone who doesn’t have a posh, rich family and/or connections in the industry; all the people he mentioned as well as the likes of Daniel Radcliffe, Henry Cavill, Orlando Bloom, Kit Harington, Cara Delevigne (who is finding out to her cost that while your father can buy you a modelling career, he cannot buy you acting talent), Sienna Miller, Eddie Redmayne (who openly lies that he had no connections when his very rich father is a noted behind-the-scenes film financier)….

    The only person I can think of who isn’t posh and/or connected is Sam Claflin and he’s hardly setting the world on fire. The fact is that if Sean Connery, Michael Caine or Terence Stamp came through today, the absolute best they could ever hope for would be a part on EastEnders.

    Ricky Gervais has intimated much the same numerous times (rather more subtly) and has also been correct.

    However.

    The main reason Corden gets no respect is because while he is talented enough and sticks to the sort of schtick he does very well – in addition to having a knack for sucking up and hooking up with people he can work with to get material for himself (which he generally takes all the credit for) – he is deeply unpleasant and very egotistical. In the UK, he was young and foolish enough to let this out in public, which turned a lot of people against him. Since moving to the US, he’s managed to cultivate a new persona, but the real one still squeaks out in articles like this.

    The posh crowd, entitled though they may be, generally exude class and letting out how angry you are that you aren’t getting the kudos you feel is yours by right really doesn’t do you any favors. However fair unfair that may be.

  27. Geneva says:

    I am such a fan of Australian and New Zealand actors (not the big names but the working actors)…Brett Tucker, Craig McLachlan, Patrick Brammall, Myles Pollard.. and better known Rose Byrne, Emilie de Ravin….they are known actors in Australia and move to LA to make it or try to and do well. Point is as far as I know, they are neither offspring of Hollywood royalty or posh British upper class. Well trained actors in theater and film and TV…I find it inspiring. Perhaps we should see them as the actors and actresses who deserve more support and recognition for their perseverance.