Anthony Bourdain: Trump got elected because liberals are smug & contemptuous

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As many of you know, I’m not really an Anthony Bourdain fan-girl. He’s grown on me a little bit over the past few years, but mostly I think he’s a loudmouth sh-t talker who needs to grow up a little bit. Anyway, Bourdain has a new-ish interview with Reason, and I did find it interesting. I don’t think he’s right about everything, but… he has opinions. He traveled all around America and all around the world, and he has thoughts about Donald Trump, Trump voters and liberal smugness. You can read the full piece here. Some highlights:

What concerns him about Trump: “What I am not concerned about with Trump? Wherever one lives in the world right now I wouldn’t feel too comfortable about the rise of authoritarianism. I think it’s a global trend, and one that should be of concern to everyone.

He’s liberal, but he criticizes political correctness: “I hate the term political correctness, the way in which speech that is found to be unpleasant or offensive is often banned from universities. Which is exactly where speech that is potentially hurtful and offensive should be heard. The way we demonize comedians for use of language or terminology is unspeakable. Because that’s exactly what comedians should be doing, offending and upsetting people, and being offensive. Comedy is there, like art, to make people uncomfortable, and challenge their views, and hopefully have a spirited yet civil argument. If you’re a comedian whose bread and butter seems to be language, situations, and jokes that I find racist and offensive, I won’t buy tickets to your show or watch you on TV. I will not support you. If people ask me what I think, I will say you suck, and that I think you are racist and offensive. But I’m not going to try to put you out of work. I’m not going to start a boycott, or a hashtag, looking to get you driven out of the business.

On red-state America: “The utter contempt with which privileged Eastern liberals such as myself discuss red-state, gun-country, working-class America as ridiculous and morons and rubes is largely responsible for the upswell of rage and contempt and desire to pull down the temple that we’re seeing now. I’ve spent a lot of time in gun-country, God-fearing America. There are a hell of a lot of nice people out there, who are doing what everyone else in this world is trying to do: the best they can to get by, and take care of themselves and the people they love. When we deny them their basic humanity and legitimacy of their views, however different they may be than ours, when we mock them at every turn, and treat them with contempt, we do no one any good. Nothing nauseates me more than preaching to the converted. The self-congratulatory tone of the privileged left—just repeating and repeating and repeating the outrages of the opposition—this does not win hearts and minds. It doesn’t change anyone’s opinions. It only solidifies them, and makes things worse for all of us. We should be breaking bread with each other, and finding common ground whenever possible. I fear that is not at all what we’ve done.

His opinion on Bill Maher: “Insufferably smug. Really the worst of the smug, self-congratulatory left. I have a low opinion of him. I did not have an enjoyable experience on his show. Not a show I plan to do again. He’s a classic example of the smirking, contemptuous, privileged guy who lives in a bubble. And he is in no way looking to reach outside, or even look outside, of that bubble, in an empathetic way.

[From Reason]

First of all, Anthony Bourdain describing someone else as “insufferably smug” and “self-congratulatory” is a bit rich. Is Bill Maher smug and self-satisfied? Yes. He is. So is Bourdain. They are birds of a feather. As for what he says about red-state America… that whole section reminded me so strongly of the arguments Jon Stewart made following the election. Do I think the left has its own echo chamber? Sure. Do I think that “East Coast elites” should dial down the smugness sometimes? Sure. But I reject this notion that we should treat Trump’s ideas and his supporters’ ideas with anything less than contempt. The reality that millions of “red state” people voted for an unhinged fascist moron/sexual assailant speaks volumes about their values and how little they respect themselves and this country. Are we supposed to hold their hands and listen to them regurgitate Trump’s white-supremacist talking points? Because that’s what it feels like Bourdain wants us to do.

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245 Responses to “Anthony Bourdain: Trump got elected because liberals are smug & contemptuous”

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  1. Maya says:

    No – Trump got elected because of Putin, Assange, Comey and the rear of the republicans who chose party over country.

    And Trump supporters all deserve what is going to happen to them with no medical care, high tax etc.

    It will poetic justice if Trump pisses of China so much that they release their info on Trump and RNC. Let’s see if the republicans then brush over that as well.

    • Kiki says:

      @Maya. And let’s not forget, the wages are going to so low, they will ask how are they going to feed their families. The trump supporters made their beds, they will lay in it. The republicans will wallow in their own filth and that includes that P**** Paul Ryan.

      • Maya says:

        Exactly – this is the time for the Democrats to stay silent, observe, collect evidence and then arrack the republicans during local elections.

        The democrats have to go full war when it comes to senate and house elections and regain both back on such a way that the Republican Party will forever be labelled as traitors.

      • Timbuktu says:

        Unfortunately, his supporters aren’t the only one who will have to lay in that bed. They will take a lot of people who opposed this down with them.

      • Megan says:

        Republicans control the White House, Congress, 33 governorships and 32 state legislators. If you aren’t willing to understand the motivations of Republican voters then be prepared to accept their vision of the world because you are going to be living it for a long time.

      • Lightpurple says:

        The party yes. But not individuals. Individuals making their displeasure known stopped, okay, delayed, the gutting of the Office of Congressional Ethics. For the last 3 days. Ryan has announced a new horrible initiative almost hourly. Congress needs to be hounded and pounded with outrage constantly. The democrats can use that public outrage for leverage

      • Megan says:

        @lightpurple That got killed because the party leadership did not want it. Do not expect to see similar capitulation on Ryan’s agenda.

    • Mrs. Welin-Melon says:

      I supported Hillary but she did not make even one visit here in Wisconsin.

      • BnA fn says:

        Mrs Welin, if Hillary had made 100 visits to Wisconsin it would not have made a difference. Imo, the deck was stacked against Hillary, from the doc leaks, Comey opening up the rigged investigation and DT with his lying to his racist voters. Hillary was doomed the last 2 weeks, to many things stacked against her. Remember DT yelling that the election was “Rigged”. They knew, ask Morning Joe and Rudy Guilliani.

      • Timbuktu says:

        Does it really matter?
        I honestly don’t understand this argument. Would you have personally gone to see her? How many people would? How many people would get to speak to her directly of those who went? How many stories will she be able to hear and remember in the crowd’s hustle and bustle?
        In our day and age, one does not need to go to Wisconsin to know the struggles of the people of Wisconsin.

      • Dani says:

        BnA fn – she could have me 1 visit or 10000 visits, it would have made a difference because it at least would have showed that she gave a shit. Not showing up even once just proves everyone in that state right to what they’re thinking. A good friend of mine, a crazy Hilary lover, who lives in Wisconsin for work was so disappointed in her not showing her face even once. She would have gone to every rally, even if she were the only person. There could have only been 100 people at the rally, but at least it shows her appreciation to her very small group of supporters.

      • Timbuktu says:

        @Dani,
        but you do realize that with her campaign schedule and the expense of traveling all over the country daily, sometimes several times a day, going somewhere to talk to 100 people is just not possible or smart?

      • NotSoSocialButterfly says:

        Her polls were high before Comey’s bomb.

      • Megan says:

        Since Wisconsin was essential to Hillary’s electoral college strategy, not making a single stop was both stupid and arrogant. State visits are enormously important to voters because they demonstrate that the candidate represents them.

      • lobbit says:

        A mistake, imo. She had plenty of money – she could afford to host a rally every other day. She lost by such slim margins in most states, and I think that’s due in part to her team taking the support of states like Wisconsin for granted.

      • Dani says:

        Timbuktu – with all due respect, she made time for the states she wanted to go to, more than once. She could have spared ONE day to visit Wisco.

      • Lightpurple says:

        Federal court ruled after the election that WI unconstitutionally suppressed votes in democratic regions of the state in 2012 and 2014 and those barriers were still in place in 2016. She could have moved to WI but Walker, the Kochs, Ryan and others weren’t going to let her win

    • BnA fn says:

      Maya, I totally agree with your comment, “and trump supporters all deserve what is going to happen to them…”. We have to remember we all are going to suffer for what they did on Election Day. I’m so sick of the whole lot from the Pres elect ect. I turn the tv when they are on. I’m really afraid for what is going to happen to this country.

    • Jayna says:

      So true, Maya. I have a lot of Republican friends and co-workers and neighbors. None are regular church-goers, if at all, one is gay, one is bi-sexual. They have always been Republican and never sway on voting Republican. And their snobbery and contempt for the Democratic Party is always in full force, like when we got back in the White House with President Obama. They bring out the same tired cliches about how Republicans are more fiscally conservative. They are rabid about their dislike of the Democratic Party. I don’t get it.

      • Aims says:

        I have been a Democrat since I was 18. I don’t I feel the need to explain why, and yes I am socially progressive . I have heard that democrats are “snobs.” I feel the opposite is true. This is the party of the middle class, the party of equality. Somewhere down the line our message got lost, which is unfortunate .

        Hillary is unlikable . Even I as a die hard Democrat struggle with her. She wasn’t my first choice for the nomination. It is time my party to dig deep and figure out how to be approachable and welcoming to all.

      • steerpike says:

        Aims, why is Hillary unlikable? I liked her. She has always struck me as much more likable than most of the republican candidates? She always seems like she cares about helping people and is really interested in figuring out how to do it. Not trying to be argumentative, I just never understand why people dislike her so much.

      • Aims says:

        Steer

        I felt that she wasn’t honest. I also felt a little irritation when she said she stood up for women , while she has allowed herself to be disrespected by her own husband .

        I also felt taken advantage by that just because I live in a blue state doesn’t mean you shouldn’t come over and make an appearance . Yes we’re going to vote for her, but don’t take us for granted . That’s why I was and am a huge Sanders supporter. He worked hard and he came across totally transparent .

      • Lightpurple says:

        True fiscal conservatives would never vote on a bill they knew was going to be vetoed. True fiscal conservatives would have been appalled at the amount of time and money wasted on several years worth of Benghazi hearings. True fiscal conservatives would never waste $40 million to discover that an admitted adulterer committed adultery. But hey, let’s tell that story again about the welfare queen buying lobster and cake and driving a Cadillac and argue that all welfare recipients should be tested for drugs, at a cost of $47 per kit, although the courts have found such testing unconstitutional and when FL did it, they only found 3 people and had to pay hundreds of thousands in court costs to learn it was unconstitutional.
        The fiscal conservative argument doesn’t go well with me.

      • Tiffany :) says:

        Exactly. The right and the “red states” are just as contemptuous of the left, the difference is that the left isn’t trying to stop conservatives from voting. In North Carolina, the legislature did research on what impacts voters by race and then enacted laws whose sole purpose was keeping minorities from the polls.

        To act like the left is just smug, and not outraged at TRUE INJUSTICE, is not accurate.

      • Hazel says:

        Nixon was hardly likeable. Where’d we get the idea that we have to have ‘likeable’ presidents? Because we sure as hell don’t have that in the next one, as of January 20.

      • Really? says:

        Who are these “privileged left”? Poor African Americans, Mexicans, Muslims, ect. are Democrats who voted for the Left and are still suffering. And why does everyone seem to believe that Trump supporters are all poor, working class white people? The Trump supporters, on average, made over $60K annually and are solidly middle class and white. The ones surrounding me in a Blue state all work in Finance and make bank. Obviously, the President-elect’s faults didn’t dissuade them from voting for a racist, misogynistic fraud as all they care about are their tax rates. Of course, they won’t admit that and instead spend their time insulting Hillary.

    • milla says:

      stop placing blame. how many people did not bother to vote?

      it does not matter why she lost, but if things don’t change, republicans will get another four years.

      i try to stay out of it, since i have nothing smart to say. i agree with Springsteen, he made great points and that is all i got. look into the future and simply talk to people. this is not about him or her, this is about what the eff is going on with the States.

    • isabelle says:

      Whats really funny about all of this Trump is basically backstabbing the FBI because they as well are one of the 17 agencies saying there is evidence of hacking. Wish he would rearrange them just because the rogue agents deserve it.

    • LoveIsBlynd says:

      Kaiser, your writing keeps me sane. Thank you and also I’m so appreciative of the commenters. This man is a study in projectith much? And I applaud everyone for calling him out as a blaming yet smug and elite liberal. I’ve never seen him breaking a liter of soda while watching duck dynasty in the trailer of a rust belter? I’ve seen him in Greece researching ancient ingredients written on papyrus. Puhleeze. “Political correctness” isn’t an option, it’s compassionate effort because for centuries our “not’ American melting pot was a xenophobic ladder climbing mess of bigotry, and that’s a lot to undo whist having the discipline to unthink and unsay generational prejudicial things. I’d agree that comedians can have free reign on opinions, but our elected public officials are hired to represent all Americans and need to speak and act in an humanitarian egalitarian manner. Trump didn’t get into office because I make the effort to consume quality food vs soda, nor did the orange apocalypse happen because I outspokenly loathe bigotry over humanitarian values. Trump stole the election with the help of Putin, neo nazis and republican base strategists combined with the intellectual destitution of the mid and rust belts. Bam.

    • almondmilk says:

      +1

      Thank you @maya

      Also, this is where privileged white guys like Bourdain go wrong. Was with him until he started kicking Bill Maher and whatever he calla. Smug liberals in the head. Their disdain did not elect Trump. The reichwing’s Obama’s bashing racism and xenophobia elected Trump, it’s been a steady drum beat from the tea party, hate radio and Fox News for 8 years. That you are less of a white man because a Black Man is your President. The demand that they disdain black people (and others of color, also Jews) so much that if they see a grown man tossing a little schoolgirl who’s black across a classroom, their reaction is to knee jerk side against the injured child crumpled on the floor…BECAUSE SHE IS BLACK. It’s insecurity, it’s fear it’s a need to hang on to something that doesn’t exist. No, open carrying won’t give you a bigger d* and no, it doesn’t mean you’re braver than a black child walking home with skittles. It means you’re a loser who will pull us all down just to salve your male ego and white fragility.

      Next Wednesday, get ready – you will see a majority of Republican working class and working poor cheering the fact that they’re sick child or ill mother will no longer have health care. They’ll be cheering the fact that we will go back to Health insurance providers turning you down for insurance because you were treated for cystic acne on 2002. Why will they do this?!

      To best the Black President.

      They win.

  2. trillian says:

    So the sheep elected the wolf to get back at the smug shepherd… Sounds reasonable.

    • MsGoblin says:

      This ^ exactly.

      Oh, Anthony. You just dusted-away the last vestiges of my crush.

      • Kitten says:

        “The utter contempt with which privileged Eastern liberals such as myself..”

        He’s including himself in these statements. I don’t agree with every single thing he says but he sounds really self-aware to me, which is not a quality that I typically associate with celebs.

      • MamaHoneyBadger says:

        Kitten, that’s how Bourdain operates: he thinks self-deprecation grants him the right to say whatever he wants in a “Hey, I’m including myself too!” way. He’s gotten very far doing this shtick, too. And I say this as a former fan who loved “Kitchen Confidential” (the book).

      • ctgirl says:

        True. He is a aware of his own accountability. Having grown up as an eastern liberal and surrounded by eastern liberals, many of them with lots of money and connections, I have witnessed the the contempt they exhibited towards anyone who disagrees with their liberal sensibilities. It’s both staggering and hilarious. As is the idea that all Trump supporters deserve contempt . . . Really? The parents in coal country who can’t afford to feed their children deserves contempt for their hope that someone outside the established political machine can help them find a job so that they can feed their children deserve contempt? That’s the kind of less than humane response by eastern liberals that has led people out of the eastern liberal mindset. It’s also the kind of thinking that draws supporters to Trump. BTW, I’m not a Trump fan and voted for a third party candidate.

      • Kitten says:

        @MamaHoneyBadger- Maybe you’re right that the self-awareness is a shtick to absolve himself from being held responsible for some of the more incendiary thins he says. The thing is, I find it hard to believe that he wouldn’t have a true sense of self-awareness simply due to the fact that he HAS traveled so much. He’s engaged with so many different people from different cultures/ethnicities that I would imagine it would be impossible to not develop a sense of where he fits into the larger world as a white liberal male.

        @CtGirl-Yes this is a common complaint from third-party voters about neoliberals. You and my BF should talk. ;)

      • ctgirl says:

        @Kitten, until this election I wasn’t a third-party girl. Hillary and Trump turned me :-)

      • MC2 says:

        I agree with the sentiment of ctgirl above. My personal politics line up way more with 3rd party- very left. But I pushed myself to the middle for the better of all of us. I was so scared of Trump that I put all my eggs into the basket that had more of a chance of winning- the candidate that had played the game for decades & was just waiting for her trophy that already had her named engraved on it. I feel like I frequently take one for the team and didn’t vote for who I (personally, just me) would have loved but instead voted for what was best for our country as a whole (including the coal miners) and……..now I am more left today then ever before. I am not super happy about 3rd party voters in this past election- it stings SO much to know that we could have avoided this fate of ours & the coal miners- but I am moved away from the middle & more vocal about it then before.

      • Tiffany :) says:

        “The parents in coal country who can’t afford to feed their children deserves contempt for their hope that someone outside the established political machine can help them find a job so that they can feed their children deserve contempt”

        In that scenario, the disappointment comes from the way those folks allow themselves to be used as pawns. Government didn’t create the demise of coal…natural gas did. That is how capitalism works, and the GOP loves capitalism. Coal is much more expensive to produce than natural gas, so energy companies stopped going after coal. The coal country voters that turn away from Democratic proposals for new investments and training in green energy, and turn towards the GOP’s impossible plan to bring back coal, deserve some responsibility for their part in electing those who lie to them.

      • ctgirl says:

        @Tiffany, you totally missed the point. The comment wasn’t about coal country. It was about hard working people who are struggling. BTW, you just totally proved my point about liberalism without humanity. :-)

      • Tiffany :) says:

        How is it “without humanity” to be disturbed when politicians lie and manipulate people who are out of work, and to be disappointed when they get tricked by the con? You are the one getting on a high horse here, darling. I don’t think most liberals have “contempt” for people in coal country. I think most are disappointed with the way they are used by politicians who do not have their best interest in mind. But go on, be snarky and pretend I am the one without humanity, while your fellow Americans are being conned by the snake oil salesman.

        :D

    • Esmom says:

      You could not be more wrong about my very large circle of white liberal friends, many of whom who work on the front lines with at-risk populations and who are active politically to help give voice to the marginalized. In fact, you’re describing a pretty decent sized chunk of conservative white women in my neighborhood, with their country club lunches and second homes and so-called Christian values work who are so threatened by anyone who’s not like them that they voted for Trump.

      And it’s funny that he claims liberals have contempt for conservatives…when all I see/hear are cries of “libtard” and other choice insults whenever someone on the left tries to engage in reasonable debate or discourse.

    • Rico Shew says:

      I’m a social worker at a not for profit community health centre where my job is provide housing and community support to disadvantaged and marganilzed people. My team mates and I are working class not middle class. I’m always a little bit dubious when middle class white liberals from gentrified suburbs preach about social justice and criticize other people’s privilege while ignoring their own.

      • jc126 says:

        Every single person on this planet could benefit from actually spending time with people very different than themselves. It might make one more empathetic, it might make one less idealistic in the face of difficult facts – it’s a learning experience, for sure.

    • Tiffany :) says:

      trillian, that was brilliant comparison.

  3. HK9 says:

    “denying them their basic humanity”…..um no. As a black woman, I can safely say that no one is denying people in the red states their basic humanity. People are allowed to disagree with you. You deny people their basic humanity by agreeing with sentiments such as all Mexicans are murders and rapists, all black women are welfare queens etc… which is what Trump supporters overtly/covertly agree with. They have no problem stereotyping people, which dehumanizes them so they can rationalize their actions. That’s denying people their basic humanity. Don’t even go there. No Satan-not today.

    • Jade says:

      Exactly. Stop making excuses.

    • MellyMel says:

      This!

    • Annetommy says:

      Well said. And Bourdain’s thesis ignores the fact that many relatively affluent people voted for Trump as well. THEY weren’t the marginalised and dispossessed. There is an attempt in the UK to make the same argument: that the so-called elite voted to stay in the EU, whereas the marginalised voted leave. Far too simplistic. In this scenario, why did working class people in Scotland and Northern Ireland vote to remain? I think in the case of the UK and the US, Trump and Farage were supported by people who were pis@sed off that they weren’t automatically at the top of the pyramid, and who saw the limited progress made by “others” as too much progress. Ironically in both cases they supported people who are the very definition of privilege. It is valid to try and understand the reasons for Trump support, just as history analyses the reasons for the rise of demagogues and dictators. But Bourdain comes close to condoning it.

      • Fiorella says:

        True he’s only talking about one”kind ” of voter and besides he could be wrong. But I think it’s fine to not talk about the whole chunk of trump voters , and to break it down and try to figure it out. He didn’t address the issue of rich people voting for trump, only the issue of liberal elites talking down to/about poor country folks. like someone said somewhere maybe this is about his beef being humiliated by bill maher?

    • DetRiotGirl says:

      HK9 – EXACTLY. I’m so tired of this “well, they’re poor and the economy was hard on them” crap. That is not an excuse for supporting a man like Trump. I work 60 hours a week and still struggle to stay afloat, and yet I have zero sympathy for these people. They voted for a man who thinks sexual assault is ok if you’re rich. They voted for a man who think most Mexicans are rapists. They voted for a man who wants to restart the nuclear arms race! Nothing justifies that! NOTHING!

    • Rico Shew says:

      I’d argue that Trump has some racist supporters AND that some middle class white liberals are sanctimonious and smug. I find both equally offensive.

    • Tiffany :) says:

      Being outraged that our fellow citizens are being discriminated against, threatened and disenfranchised is not being smug.

  4. Kris says:

    He is very orange.

  5. N says:

    I strongly dislike both sides.
    Bury them and let something new rise from the ashes of the old.

    • CItyHeat says:

      Hyperbolic. But yeah…..hard to find much to want to align with on either side.

      #StuckInTheMiddle

    • Betsy says:

      The false equivalence is strong.

    • Megan says:

      There is nothing I desire more than to see the end of our two party system. Think of what America would be like if we had multiple parties that were forced to work together to forge a majority. The partisan divide we have today is like a growing cancer.

    • Tiffany :) says:

      What if the thing that rises is an authoritarian government? Could be a monster lurking in those ashes.

  6. wheneight says:

    Amen to this post! Agree with you 100%. Another thing that bothers me about this is the whole idea about political correctness being a political issue (which I think you reference tongue in cheek-ly by “he’s liberal, but he criticizes political correctness”). It’s a cultural, issue, people! Trump, Hillary, Obama – no president gets to dictate how PC we are as a culture. Why do people keep connecting the two like the American executive branch is charge of whether Americans as a whole are overly politically correct or not?

    • lightpurple says:

      I have learned that the second someone says “political correctness,” he or she is about to unleash something rude and bigoted. What is wrong with being polite?

      • NotSoSocialButterfly says:

        What happened to civility? I feel a good portion of it went out the window in the “Either you’re with us or against us” era.

      • Esmom says:

        NSSB, I feel like it went out the window when Sarah Palin burst onto the scene with her brand of “spunky” snark, which stunned me with how utterly contemptuous it was, for Obama, for facts. I swear her convention speech was the precise moment we started the descent to hell in an uncivil handbasket.

    • Megan says:

      Remember when Jerry Seinfeld said racist and sexist jokes fall flat with millennials? Comedians aren’t being PC, their audiences just don’t think jokes based on negative stereotypes are funny so they have to come up with new jokes. Frankly, I am happy to see the change.

    • GMonkey says:

      Trump turned “anti PC” into a political movement. He said things like, “We’re gonna be saying Merry Christmas, again folks!” I think that a lot of people honestly think that being called a bigot or a mysogynist is actually worse than being subjected to bigoted and misogynistic behaviors.

      Calling liberals “snowflakes” when they brought up something they disagree with, while they cry “oppression!” when someone doesn’t follow their religion, or calls them out on their poor behavior.

  7. savu says:

    I agree with Bourdain whole-heartedly. And I respectfully disagree with you. I think we need to understand why people voted for someone who seems to betray what many of us believe is sacred about our nation. I promise you, there are things they believe sacred, and most of them love this nation just as much. So instead of demonizing these people, we need to understand them. Understand why they voted for a man whom I find abhorrent, and whose personal issues many of them disagree with. I have met so many who dislike Trump, but are so sick of the status quo they could overlook it. Is that right to me? No. But just listen. And see ourselves as no better than them.

    • Alleycat says:

      Nope, I’m better than them. I’m not going to try and normalize their racist, sexist, homophobic stances. The status quo was too much for them, but this Cheeto was going to do what? Be on their side? I do understand them. I understand that they are uneducated and ignorant.

      • Lingling says:

        @allycat

        Please for the love of God read that back to yourself. You are superior to no one. Please consider some self reflection.

      • Alleycat says:

        @Lingling I’m going to have confirm I’m better than racist, sexist, homophobic people, thanks. If those people can change their minds to reflect equality for everyone, then we can talk.

      • supposedtobeworking says:

        @alleycat, I think you are missing the point – not all are racist, sexist and homophobic. The people that voted for Trump, and are not those things, need to be understood. There are absolutely complete jacka@@s who fall into that category, and their voices had a megaphone during this election. But not all.
        Trump spoke to a group of people who are decent and hard working in a way that resonated with a significant challenge they are living with. Many people are opposed to the bloat of government, and see others receiving what they work hard for. When people don’t see themselves getting ahead, they will act in their own best interest. That doesn’t mean they are sexist – it means they are highly motivated by their own needs more than they are motivated by the needs of the group, which include significant human rights at this time. Self serving behaviour will often tale precedents over altruistic behaviour when people feel disadvantaged. Those are complex decisions and you doubling down on the simplistic reason doesn’t make you right. What it does is create a vacuum for dialogue and understanding. And that seems to be, in part, what happened with the Democratic party this time around.

      • Megan says:

        Many working class white voters chose Obama in ’08 and ’12, but chose Trump in ’16. Do you think they got more racist and ignorant over those eight years? Or did they just get sick of hearing promises from Democrats that are never fulfilled?

      • Bridget says:

        That’s really going to change the hearts and minds of people who either abstained or voted for Trump.

        Serious question: is it more important that you’re acknowledged as being ‘right’ or that we get out of this mess? Because both aren’t going to happen.

      • Alleycat says:

        @Supposedtobeworking No I get the point. I’ve heard this side quite frequently for months now. The fact that a person voted for Trump (no matter the reason) shows me you side with racist,sexist, homophobic ideals, so yes you are part of the problem. They aren’t voting for their best interest though. Trump isn’t draining the swamp, he’s adding to it. He just added a man for secretary of labor who doesn’t believe in overtime or minimum wage. There is literally nothing about this billionaire man that will support middle class or below. Trump just gave those who feared change a voice.

      • Robin says:

        No, you’re not better than they are, alleycat, you really aren’t. Your posts show just as much ignorance as you accuse Trump supporters of having. And savu, while I agree that people should try to understand others’ viewpoints (which many on the left are NOT good at doing), you make it sound like an anthropology study.

      • siri says:

        I believe this attitude to be one reason why so many people voted for a rather fundamental change, even though it might not deliver the one they expect, and I actually give Bordain credit for being self-reflective.

    • Amelia says:

      Agree! I live in a red state. It’s so sad when you see the poverty in rural areas. It’s a struggle to find sustainable safety net programs and stop the drug abuse. Far more challenging than inner city, I can tell you that (public health worker from LA to Kentucky). So I’ve met good people. Black and Hispanics who’ve expressed that they felt forgotten and just want jobs and they saw him as the one to do that. One even said she hated herself for it bc he made fun of the disabled reporter, but she had to get a job. This is a woman who gives her kid mtn dew bc it’s cheaper than bottled water. We shouldn’t have contempt for these people. KKK, yes! But not those hurting so badly.

      • lightpurple says:

        But he is NOT going to create jobs for those people.

        ETA and there are no sustainable safety net programs in those areas because they don’t vote people into their state governments who are going to fight for those programs.

      • Jade says:

        Hi Savu, Amelia! Perhaps I can put it this way. I can understand why they voted for Trump. Thus far, what are the concrete plans to help them?

      • K says:

        But that poverty and lack of safety net comes from their republican governors and state houses. So yes I feel terrible for anyone suffering I truly do I think facts need to come into play that state governments are denying theses services not the federal. Heck obama tried to mandate the expansion of Medicaid and republicans went nuts, sued and stopped it.

        Also while yes there are poor suffering people the other fact that needs to be addressed is the economy is growing and is doing really well and has been for years, especially in some of those red states. It is just different then the 50,60s or even 80s.

        I think it would be wise for liberals to listen and understand but that goes both ways, they need to stop attacking New York and California at every turn. I’m not a bad person because I went to college and believe in equality.

        Although that said I agree with him about the comedians.

      • Amelia says:

        @jade are you asking for my plans or the trump administrations plans? The latter I can assure you will do nothing. My plans are to keep doing my work in public health out reach and supporting my people in social justice positions so they can help develop infrastructure to rural areas so they may benefit from exsisting safety net, welfare and education programs.

      • Jade says:

        @Amelia, genuinely asking what is Trump’s concrete plan to help them. I’ll take your answer. Just to add, great that you’re contributing to your community…

      • blairski says:

        Kitten asks:

        “@Savu- Why do we have an obligation to change their minds? Why should we feel responsible for their incredibly poor choices?”

        For one reason and one reason only – we want to win. We need to win. We need to change the elected leaders, so they will make decisions that will save our planet and support our people. “We” are technically the majority (those who believe in climate change, choice, social safety nets, public education, etc.). So why did we lose? I think that’s why what Bourdain is saying is important. Honestly I think we need to listen to everyone who has an idea of why these people are voting against their self interest so we can develop campaigns that speak to them.

      • Kitten says:

        @ Blairski-You’re assuming that we can change their minds.
        Do you HONESTLY think that people who vote out of spite or because they believe in miracles (like a billionaire bringing back coal jobs) will change their minds because we change our party’s platform or because of solid, cogent reasoning?

        What do you suggest the Democrats change in terms of policy to appeal to these people?

        I can only speak from my own experience with Trump-supporters and there is quite literally NO amount of sheer WRONG that can turn these people– from hacking, to conflicts of interest to racist cabinet members to the dismantling of the ACA, SS, and Medicaid. NOTHING will scare them away.

        The idea that if ONLY we can appeal to them is, quite frankly, a preposterous one. Our only hope at this point is getting an inspiring candidate who motivates more people to vote next term. I think it’s simply spinning our wheels to pander to these people and I for one, am finished with the coddling.

      • kentuckygirl says:

        @Amelia – I’m glad you understand the struggle that poor rural people go through. I live in Kentucky which until recently was a staunch Democratic state. It was taken for granted that we would go Democrat every election at every level. But little by little people realized that their lives weren’t getting any better. There are just no jobs in many parts of our state. The person who commented about how you can educate yourself through the internet and the library has no idea or understanding what poor rural life is like. We have places without running water in homes. That statement was so naive and ignorant at the same time it made me want to laugh and cry. These people need jobs. They want jobs. They are nice, decent, proud people who are pretty easy going about a person’s race or sexual partner. When Clinton went against coal she never stood a chance here. They gave the Democrats a chance for generations and things only got worse. Can you truly blame them for changing and giving the other party a chance? I ask that you put your stereotypes of poor whites and people of color in rural America aside and look at what is truly going on here.

      • isabelle says:

        Yeah….I come from of these poor areas and the reason why they have stayed poor is they continually vote against their own self-interests….and @kentuckygirl, as a East TN girl they at one time around 40 years ago voted blue (with the exception of Clinton winning some states), until the Civil rights act was passed and Democrats were more conservative. Some state houses were blue but that also has been longer than recent. So even then when they voted blue it was when Dems were more conservative and Republicans more liberal

      • Megan says:

        Obama didn’t create jobs for them either. When they ask themselves, are they better off than they were eight years ago, the answer is no. The issue isn’t about converting the tradition Republican base, it’s about understanding why we lost a critical swath of the traditional Democratic base and what we can do to get it back.

        Moreover, you can change people’s minds, Howard Dean’s “50 State Strategy” was about reaching out to traditionally conservative communities and it worked. The Democrats took back the House in ’06 and Dean’s plan was the foundation on which Obama’s ’08 campaign was built.

      • Amelia says:

        @isabelle, I’m not sure the point you’re making? Are you saying we don’t cut them a break bc they voted wrong or that they votes wrong bc of poor infrastructure in rural areas.

        @megan and kentucky girl glad you all see what we are trying to say, what born and raised urban Americans struggle to understand. This is more about the differences between urban and rural poverty. There are no gov funded fire departments, there are no homeless shelters, soup kitchens (save for the ocassional church). Where there is water, it’s full of lead and other toxins so they drink the next cheapest option which is mtn dew. I know it’s easy to say, read a book, get a job, have a social conscious (bc republicans always tell libs and minorities it’s sooo easy to get by), but it’s truly a different beast in rural areas.

      • isabelle says:

        @Amerlia Red states, particularly in the south keep voting Republican over and over again, especially in state houses and Congress. All the while their states are failing, dead last in everything from education, income, to health care. So even though Obama is President they vote against their self interests by electing Republicans to represent them who then treat them like dirt and continually lower help their standard of living. Red States where Republicans are elected consistently are behind blue states, from the highest food stamp numbers, high poverty levels, horrible educational systems to drug addiction.

      • Amelia says:

        @Isabelle. Since you didn’t come right out to answer my question, I’m going to assume you mean that poor rural red states made their bed and they should lay in it. You make a good point that it’s not just the presidential election that counts, but the state level. Here’s the thing though, no democrat or republican has really attempted to address rural poverty. I mean a real legislative effort to provide the basic infrastructure needed to start improving those vast areas. so yes, they may have shot themswlves in the foot, but that doesn’t mean they voted for trump because they are racist. They voted without an education on what’s what in politics. Which, sidebar, always cracks me up when people encourage everyone to vote. No, just no. Educated people who have given this thought should vote, people who write in Harambe for president should go eff off.

    • Lynnie says:

      On every political thread there’s this same type of inane comment, and every time AT LEAST 5 people (eloquently and with multiple points) explain why the whole “they’re decent people, they’re just desperate1!!!1″ theory just does not hold water. At. All.

      It’s tiring. It’s annoying. It’s honestly stupid. These are the same people who’ve consistently been voting against their self-interest for decades. Staying in their little bubble is a source of pride for them. At the very least they’re uncomfortable with the fact that formerly disenfranchised people around the world are starting to get their piece of the pie through globalization/social change. Trump voters want a status quo which frankly doesn’t exist anymore, and elected the worst possible candidate to attain their goals. No amount of mental gymnastics will change the fact that many people were willing to overlook the fact he’s a piece of scum and supported said piece of scum for a pipe dream that tramples on the rights of others. (As one poster said below desperation is not an excuse for lack of critical thinking.)

      • Kitten says:

        Agreed. Literally EVERY. SINGLE. POST.

        It’s tiring as hell.

      • Jade says:

        Indeed Lynnie. Informed liberals have to make the effort to understand their displacement and bitterness, but they can’t make the effort to inform themselves. It’s only emails and Benghazi to them, never mind that Republican Bush also had the same issues. Everything Hillary does is a damn abomination but everything Trump stands for or has said is misunderstood or a rumour. Everywhere in the world is the same. You have to change your mindset, upgrade yourself and of course the government must also invest in education and new industries. Not go back to the past. And who is in Trump’s team now? People who look at the bottom line! So much for being anti-establishment. These disgruntled people blame everything else and the Democrats but will be the first to feel the pain once the cheap things that are made by China (and they willingly consume) are no longer affordable. You can live with your choice. Also I will never get what they really want. They want the government to take care of them but they reject more regulations on corporations, healthcare, insurance, banking, tax, gun control and even vitamins! What do you want? Both government and citizens must work hand in hand. And for the love of God, being politically incorrect is not about shooting your mouth and putting people down.

      • Savu says:

        @Lynnie and Kitten, I’m sorry my opinion is that common and tires you. Lynnie you go on to do exactly what Bourdain is talking about: judge people it sounds like you don’t know. My point is that even if it doesn’t make sense, even if it works against their interests, even if they’re voting for someone who is objectively hurtful… No one will change their mind by lumping them together as idiots. Maybe we could teach them something if they didn’t feel like all liberals see rural America as gun-toting uneducated morons. If they felt listened to, maybe we could get through.

      • Amelia says:

        Yes Savu!

        And for clarity, I’m not defending my super nice white neighbor couple who denies systemic racism, or my best friend who does not see her own privilege. I’m saying there are people who are not racist, some of them people of color (not Stacey dash), who are so hungry, so cold, so desperate and saw trump as an option because of various reason (non politician, bringing jobs back). Even though they are dead wrong about him and have been fooled, they aren’t bad people. The good news is no matter how hard you hate on them, we can’t marginalize them any further. You keep judging, I’ll keep working to show them a better way.

      • Kitten says:

        @Savu- Why do we have an obligation to change their minds? Why should we feel responsible for their incredibly poor choices?

        Sorrynotsorry. I don’t recall people on the Right reaching out to people on the Left after Obama was elected a second term trying to understand why we would vote the way we did.

        I’m so damn TIRED of it always falling on the Left to reach out with an olive branch. I’m not here for that shit anymore. I’m done infantilizing *precious* people who believe that an old white billionaire will save them from poverty. I’m done apologizing because they have hurt feelings over being called an “idiot” (because “libtard” is SO much nicer), and I’m done worrying about people who care NOTHING for my rights as a woman or the rights of PoC, the LGBTQ community and anyone who isn’t a rich, white male.

        If you want to be the person that compassionately engages with them, then have at it–I sure as hell won’t stop you. But please stop lecturing/shaming those of us who are done trying to rationalize with the irrational.

      • Lynnie says:

        @Amelia I’m not showing closet racists and idiots any remorse sorry not sorry. These are people who would love to see my humanity ripped away if it meant they could climb up the ladder. I don’t f*ck with those type of people needless to say.

        “They are prisoners of their circumstances. They have nothing to pull them out of it and learn better.” Straight up lies in the age of the internet. I’m a college student, and I’m broke and busy too. You’re not going to see me jet setting to any countries soon, but that doesn’t mean I can’t read about them on wikipedia. Everyday the History Channel/Nat Geo/PBS have documentaries/great programming on every sort of topic running all day long. Talk radio (and actual talk radio not just demagogues) is super entertaining. Most phones nowadays have access to a free news aggregator app where you can get articles/publications from every sort of field imaginable instantly. The library is my favorite place in the world. Being friends with all sorts of different types of people goes a longgggg way. Hell, even making classes like Human Geo, World history, or AP US History mandatory in the public school system helps. (Not gutting the public school system also helps, but that’s a discussion for a different day). Of course you don’t have to devote tons of time to any of these mind-broadening measures, but the beauty of each one is that no matter how little you participate in it you pick something up. A great majority of Trump voters are sticking to one or two sources, if at all, and see no reason/do not want to change.

        Of course, desperation is a reason for lack of critical thinking, but if you reread my earlier point I said it couldn’t be an EXCUSE. Minorities in the same desperate situations as their white counterparts overwhelmingly went for Clinton. Why is it that they managed to find an alternative last hope and others didn’t?

        My sympathy for “true desperation” is limited when people elect the same horrible types to governor or senate over and over because they happen to have a strong pro-life policy or nebulous “American” values, or pursue short-term policies vs. reinvesting in education, healthcare, or other delayed gratification type things. At what point are they going to take responsibility for that?

        @Savu. Lmao @ “people I don’t know.” I live in Florida in a prime snowbird county, go to school with their kids, and increasingly have begun to see uglier and uglier sides of them after Trump’s election. They don’t just want to be listened to they want their POV as the reality. Give them an inch, and they’ll take a mile as the election has showed us.

      • OriginallyBlue says:

        Some posts don’t have the reply button so I will slip in here.
        These people vote against their own self interest every single time and when things stay the same or get worse they don’t reflect. Their Republican run state government cutting funding to education, social services and damn near bankrupting the state and God knows what else, yet they blame the “liberals” conveniently forgetting that the liberals aren’t running their communities. No jobs and no social programs because they vote for people who are opposed to them.

      • Birdix says:

        So this is interesting, because maybe it’s changing. This op ed in The NY Times described a distinction between right and left (which fits but from these comments seems to be getting tired):
        “The difference between Republicans and Democrats is that Republicans believe people are fundamentally bad, while Democrats see people as fundamentally good,” said Mr. Watts, … [cut section]
        Mr. Watts talked about the 2015 movie theater shooting in Lafayette, La., in which two people were killed. Mr. Watts said that Republicans knew that the gunman was a bad man, doing a bad thing. Democrats, he added, “would look for other causes — that the man was basically good, but that it was the guns, society or some other place where the blame lies and then they will want to control the guns, or something else — not the man.” Republicans, he said, don’t need to look anywhere else for the blame.”

      • Amelia says:

        My last thoughts bc I don’t see us agreeing here.

        @Lynnie. You as a poor college student with a smartphone, maybe a car or public transportation and a library are far ahead of the people I’m talking about. These people have pay by the minute flip phones if any at all, they don’t have local libraries, they don’t have internet, they do not have education. They have NOTHING to grab ahold of to pull themselves out of this. Trump lent his tiny hand and convinced them he was different. It wasn’t hard to do because they are desperate and have been their whole lives. No it is not your responsibility to each racist or homophobic people better, but that’s not who I, savu or Anthony are talking about. We are talking about people who don’t give a shit about any of that bc they are barely eating everyday. They have needs that this country has failed to meet for them and they are looking for any hope out of their darkness. They would have taken and gay, black woman who practices Islam if she convinced them she cared. So please, as you would expect anyone else to look at us liberals with open minds and hearts, give them that decency.

      • Lynnie says:

        @Birdix I’m really glad you brought this up, because it’s a phenomena that’s been researched several times. I wrote a paper on this last semester lol, so I’m just gonna copy and paste what I learned and wrote from there.

        “The Moral Foundations Theory is one formulated by Jonathan Haidt, and other social psychologists, that says there are several core systems universally shared that individual cultures then build upon to get the varied belief/behavioral systems we see around the world. They are as follows: ‘Care/Harm, Fairness/Cheating, Loyalty/Betrayal, Authority/Subversion, Sanctity/Degradation, and Liberty/Oppression.’ (Rempala 705) Not only do these dualities have a macro effect, but their influence can be seen on the micro level as well, particularly in political affiliation. Individuals that emphasize the Care/Harm and Fairness/Cheating system more when deciding something is moral or not are more likely to be liberal/Democrat, while those who are conservative/Republican treat all of the pairs equally when making a moral decision. (Rempala 704)”

        I thought it was really interesting, and definitely seems to be applicable in this case.

      • Little Darling says:

        Kitten/Lynnie – yes yes yes yes yes.

        YES.

      • Esmom says:

        Birdix, thanks for that tidbit. It reminds me of an argument I had when the Aurora Colorado movie theater shooting happened. She couldn’t believe that I didn’t feel single-minded rage at the shooter and instead was feeling distraught at how badly the system had failed this severely mentally ill young man. For some reason I kept thinking how it could be my son someday. I never saw our debate through a right/left lens but that’s pretty much spot on.

      • Lightpurple says:

        @Amelie, sorry but no, I will have no remorse for anyone who voted to deny me medically necessary health care because I had the audacity to survive cancer. Trump is NOT going to help them.

      • Lady Rain says:

        Thank YOU Lynnie! Fantastic comment.

        I’m so tired of hearing about “poor, rural voters,” as if their plights are somehow worse than others all over the country.

        Others all over the country are just as hard-working and decent, yet they remained steadfast in voting against Cheeto because they knew better than to vote against their own interests.

        What’s the point in trying to reason with certain Trump voters who knowingly voted against their interests and values just because they want to maintain a certain status quo? The reality is those days are disappearing for good.

    • GMonkey says:

      Agree. We’ll get nowhere without listening. Listening and being reasonable isn’t the same as normalizing or accepting bad behavior. Understanding people’s motivation doesn’t equal throwing roses to Hitler. You know why so many Dems lost in House and Senate in 2010? They and Obama pushed through the ACA when that wasn’t even topmost in the public mind. I’m not against the ACA, and I hope that a version of it is able to last, but the nation was reeling from the recession and it should have just waited a bit.

  8. Winterberry says:

    From the two Trump voters I know I have yet to hear a reasonable argument for having supported him. I think we do need to engage with the people who felt he was their best option, but they too have an obligation to think critically and be informed.

    • Kitten says:

      That’s kind of the problem, right? People keep calling for civility, kindness, and rationality but that’s hard to do when the very people you’re trying to engage with put their hands over their ears and shut “But Hillary” over and over again.

      • Jade says:

        Hi Kitten! Did Hillary visit these states? I do think if she didn’t, she could have. Strategy wise, I think it’s important even if it was a lost cause.

      • Timbuktu says:

        I recently read a spectacular rant by a Trump supported and a gun enthusiast (of course), who was basically saying that one day our economy will collapse and all of us liberal coastal elites would starve to death. In the meantime, the rednecks will be fine, huntin’ and fishin’ and farmin’, and we better not come for their food, because they will shoot us without a warning.
        That just struck me as such a perfect illustration of everything I find wrong with that mindset. So, they have no problems benefitting from “our” accomplishments, i.e. from the accomplishments of people who create think up their technology, who operate on them, and do a variety of jobs that are essential to our economy right now. They don’t think of the fact that “liberal elites” don’t go around yelling “we’ll make you write 2 pages of code just to get online, and if you’re stupid to code, then don’t go online”, for example. Or “I will make you recite the periodic table of elements (or Neruda by heart, or whatever it is they think we do on the coasts) before I operate on your brain, and if you can’t, then I won’t bother saving your stupid brain”. They don’t think of the fact that we’re all interdependent and that they rely on “us” as much as we rely on “them”. They don’t even think of the fact that there are plenty of farmers and hunters on both coasts…
        I think they also don’t realize how much harder their farming will be without technology and science. How many farmers today can farm without fertilizers and machines and produce reliably decent crops? Heck, how many farmers could do it back in the day, when famines due to drought or flood were not uncommon? And if farming goes, how much fishing and hunting will they be able to do with everyone else fishing and hunting?
        This vindictive, “hope-you-fail-and-I-watch-you-suffer” attitude seems to me just plain incompatible with living in a civilized society and I honestly don’t know how to compromise with that.

      • Little Darling says:

        I’ve heard ONLY things about what Hillary did in response to why vote for Trump, OR the other ambiguous “we need change.” I honestly have yet to hear ONE concise explanation for why they voted that way that makes any sort of sense on ANY issue. I simply haven’t found it yet. It’s all broad strokes….mumble mumble make america great again, mumble mumble, BENGHAZI, mumble mumble locker room talk is normal, mumble mumble EMAILS.

        timbuktu – I couldn’t agree more.

      • Lambda says:

        Timbuktu, your post made me laugh so hard! Recite Neruda or croak!

        And now I’m reminded of something I read on the cauldron of mental illness that Breibart is: why do we need higher ed? Better people to have decent jobs, like in construction and such. If we need doctors and engineers, we’ll import a few from India.I kid you not.

      • Esmom says:

        Lambda, I mentioned Sarah Palin above but I blame her for helping in this inexplicable contempt for higher ed. And who can forget Rick Santorum so vehemently mocking Obama for saying wanted to make college affordable and attainable for all. He called him a snob in the most hateful, scornful way, this guy with a bachelors and a JD. Unreal.

      • Lightpurple says:

        @Timbukto, that makes me laugh actually. Does he not realize that we coastal elites live on, hum, the coast? Where there is an ocean? And the ocean has fish and stuff? I can go catch my own lobster. How much does he pay for one? From May to Thanksgiving, I buy pretty much all my produce from local farmer’s markets near my office. I’m the only one on my street who doesn’t have a vegetable garden although I have enough space for one if I need it. My neighbor uses my fence to grow vines and tells me I can keep whatever is on my side: zucchini, pumpkin, melons, several types of squash, grapes, peas, and beans. Another neighbor gives me eggplants, carrots, arugula, spinach, tomatoes. I do grow berries, plums, pears, herbs. Another neighbor keeps bees and chickens and shares. There are numerous local dairies and farmstand within an hours drive. I don’t think we’ll starve right away. And they need our money. Those big red states get higher percentages FFP, for which the money comes from the blue states.

    • Embee says:

      I’ve been looking for a place to post this question and your comment is it! Both my parents and my boyfriend voted for Trump. None of them admitted it to me for a month because I am so vehemently anti-Trump.

      My parents own independent pharmacies and have suffered greatly at the hands of the insurance companies since ACA. I try to tell them it’s the insurance companies, but their reality is that it happened as a result of the ACA. They are highly educated and have 40 years business ownership experience. They are not rubes.

      My boyfriend owns healthclubs, and employs hundreds of people in part-time positions doing things like wiping down equipment, re-racking weights, folding towels, etc.. He claims he would be put out of business by a minimum wage of $15/hr and having to provide healthcare for all those employees (I’ve explained he only has to do it for full-time employees, not all the kids but he correctly fears the expansion of required coverage). He is college educated, an immigrant and extremely savvy and socially liberal.

      They voted for Trump because they feel their livelihoods are at stake, and he was on the Republican ticket. I share this not to defend them, but to provide two concrete examples of what Bourdain and Stewart and Springsteen and others have brought up: it’s not just inbred racists voting for Trump.

      What about these people? What can we say to the small-to mid-sized business owner who feels they fall through the cracks?

      • Timbuktu says:

        Only that there are, alas, no guarantees in this world, as Trump himself filed for several bankruptcies, so he is clearly not error-proof?

        I also think that people like your parents and your boyfriend don’t really need much convincing, certainly not at this point. If Trump DOES go through for them – then we can’t really fault them for voting for their best self-interest. If he doesn’t, they will probably learn from their mistake. There’s the possibility that they do well all on their own, but credit Trump with it, that’s the only time you should perhaps step in and point out that their hard work, not Trump’s leadership, that helped them.

        Honestly, it’s the people who would never change their minds that scare me. Like my elder relative, who always votes against Democrats because of abortion issues. I think even if it was revealed beyond doubt that Trump forced a girlfriend have an abortion, she wouldn’t change her vote.

      • Who ARE These People? says:

        Your pharmacist parents would do better with a national pharmacare plan, not dealing with all the different insurance carriers, and even better with fighting the big fight against inflated drug prices. Your boyfriend has to deal with the reality of employing hundreds of young, part-time workers without exploiting them. He would do better fighting for a single-payer health insurance system because it would remove the small-business burden of providing health insurance at any level. It should be divorced from employment. He would even do better keeping the ACA because it keeps these young people *on their parents’ plans* till they are 26.

        People are easily walked away from the big picture and fed misplaced priorities.

        Every few days there is more statistical evidence that Trump voters were swayed more by racism and sexism than by economic hardship.

      • Timbuktu says:

        I can live to 100 years and I am sure I would never understand America’s refusal to have healthcare for all. Talking about the ultimate vote against self-interest.

      • Lingling says:

        I actually just had to lay off 10 people because the minimum wage in the state I live went up on Jan 1st after the November election. I had no time to adjust, and I did vote against the measure. Not because I I don’t care about a living wage, but because I took a massive hit with the ACA. I couldn’t support both. In a year when it raises again to the final level I’ll have to lay off people again.

        Still didn’t, vote for trump, but there are 10 people who may feel betrayed and desperate.

      • Embee says:

        WATP, I appreciate your commenting.

        Independent pharmacies have taken huge hits from governmental insurers, most recently when our state decided they didn’t want to deal with the small pharmacies and attempted to cut them out entirely. They understandably have no faith that more government in their business is a good thing.

        As for “exploiting” young workers, I can assure you that they aren’t. They are happy, getting experience/resume building, earning spending and have access to the best workout facilities in our area. And language such as “exploit” makes the point of Bourdain and others.

        Lingling that’s awful and I am so sorry. It cannot be the intended outcome of this type of legislation.

      • Lingling says:

        @embee

        The thing is if it was just the ACA or a less drastic minimum wage hike *we went from $8- $12* then we could have taken it, but even Walmart in my state let people go who weren’t seasonal because both at once is unreasonable. I had to cut what my husband and I make to accommodate the ACA, which I was okay with. The benefits to the rest of the country outweighed my wants.

        However when it came to minimum wage I just wasn’t going to sink the ship so I could pay a 16 year old to sweep hair and wash towels. I’m in a rock and a hard place but all of the blame on the ACA is misplaced. I understand pharmacies are a different game, but for most small to medium sized businesses job loss has a lot more to do with wage hikes for jobs that aren’t worth that much. Unfortunately, the jobs I cut were the most unskilled and probably the most in need. It crushed me when a young girl I let go said she was looking forward to a significant raise she didn’t think she would get fired. It hurt, but let go of 10 to save 90.

        Everything is a mess right now and a lot of times the people proposing laws have never owned or run a business. They don’t realize that too much too quick will crush people.

      • K says:

        @Lingling

        I have heard the ACA is actually helping some small business because they are letting their employees pick from the market and they pay subsidies but I don’t know if that is because they have smaller work forces then you do.

        As for the minimum wage I think it needs to be raised but I think the conversation we are having about it is a bit wonky. There is literally no excuse for a company the size of Wall Mart or McDonalds not to offer $15 minimum wage and benefits to their employees and not passing it on to consumers this is about the top people making as much as possible. And while I don’t begrudge the top company runners their salaries they worked hard and earned them I do think they can cut into their billion dollar profits for the betterment of society (not to mention spending would go up & they’d make more.)

        With that said I also know that small businesses that don’t make millions or billions of dollars a year paying people $15 an hour and benefits is hard. I think all companies should be required to provide benefits it is for the greater good of our health and country that people are insured. However, I do think with the minimum wage there is room to make an argument that it is not standard so small businesses such as a local hair shop aren’t required to pay $15 an hour but $8 and it should be based on your overall company earnings.

        The problem is that we are no longer having nuanced and detailed discussions about concerns and issues that both sides of the argument have. It is just hard and fast this is the only way. Like Obama said you need to be willing to compromise to get the greater overall goal accomplished. God I am going to miss Obama.

      • Lingling says:

        @k

        I live in AZ the aca really isn’t an example here it’s a mess for reasons that have nothing to do with the actual law. The financial burden it put on my business was the equivalent of paying everyone about $1.65 more per hour. Not that much. We had to adjust our prices are matter of cents and pay ourselves slightly less. It in no way was going to sink us.

        Minimum wage hike of $4 is another thing. I had to eliminate all of my zero skill positions. Those are the jobs that are most needed by the people who have them because they are very often not able or qualified to do more. They are however jobs that I will never see as worth $12 an hour. Instead I distributed the responsibility amongst other workers. So yeah, they make more now but the work load increased because I’m not paying $12 and health insurance to someone doing menial tasks.

        There needs to be provisions for workers under 18 and also zero skill jobs. We have grocery stores with no baggers now you just do it yourself because they don’t want to pay someone $12 per hour to bag groceries and that really hurts the disabled community too. A living wage is fine, I get it, but they need to distinguish between jobs that will bring you a living wage and jobs that are zero skill and should just be extra pocket money.

        I’d love to go back to employing high school and college kids, but it’s not an option.

        The ACA is amazing, people demanding $12- $15 an hour to sweep hair, collect carts or hand out dry cleaning need to realize those aren’t jobs you can support a family with. Times are tough, but jobs are just getting scarcer by forcing unreasonable pay rates. Health care is a human right, $12 an hour to run the register at Walgreens is not.

    • Megan says:

      Ever heard the term”Yellow Dog Democrat”? It is used to describe people so loyal to the party they will vote for any Democratic candidate, even if the candidate is a yellow dog.

      I guess we can start using the term “Trump Dog Republican” to explain why seemingly decent people voted for Trump.

      I once had the pleasure of hearing Molly Ivins run down a list of all of the despicble Democratic candidates she had supported over the years. As someone who voted for Bob Casey, twice, I can relate.

      • lightpurple says:

        I miss Molly. What she would do with this mess! And how Trump would be exploding all over Twitter as a result.

    • Annie B says:

      Literally the only thing I have heard from Trump supporters I know is, Hillary is un-trustworthy (and a bitch) as evidenced by the email server and Benghazi, she should be in jail. She is in the pockets of “the elite” like Goldman Sachs, she wouldn’t even release her speeches! Trump says he will make America great again and will create jobs, he got voted in fair and square, everyone has to give him a chance.

      And I bang my head against a wall.

  9. pzc says:

    He looks like he’s made of leather.

  10. Trixie says:

    When one’s opinion is “deny other people their basic human rights based on one uncontrollable metric”, then no they don’t deserve to have their views legitimized.

    • rahrahrooey says:

      THANK YOU!!!! The ones making the excuses for them are usually the ones with nothing to lose.

  11. Adrien says:

    Ok, what is going on with his skin color? Is he finally getting some karma after being so mean to Guy Feiri? Did he get the George Hamilton special at the tanning salon?

  12. Locke Lamora says:

    I love Bourdain. Parts Uknown is amazing. And he’s nowhere near as smug as Maher, and he’s usually very respectful towards the people he’s talking to, which Maher isn’t. Also, I dont remember Bourdain being sexist.

    I don’t know if I agree with him about Trump supporters. Besides, didn’t rich east and west coast people also play a huge part in electing him?
    I do agree with him about liberals ( and I am very left liberal) preaching to the converted and being self-conglaturatory.

    • Kitten says:

      I agree with all your points. I just watched the Parts Unknown: Iran episode last night. Fascinating stuff.

      I will forever unapologetically love Bourdain but I’ve reached my breaking point as far as “understanding the other side”. How about the other side attempts to understand US?

      • original kay says:

        Exactly. How about they let go of their need for ALL of absolutely everything and not seek to actively suppress the rights of others, those rights they already have, just because they don’t agree?

        FFS

        Also, credit me with some f*cking intelligence. I DO understand what “the other side” is going through and I still DO NOT agree with the way they are dealing with it.

        So F off to anyone who tries to tell me to “understand” them.

      • Little Darling says:

        I see it as this: BOTH republicans and democrats have plenty of wealthy, educated elitists. But only ONE party (as I see it) is committed to real, tangible social change. And it is NOT the group who wanted to gut the ethic commitee from day one, and it certainly isn’t with the leader that is representing said party.

        Sure Trumps message hit the desolate, but I do think they’re in for a RUDE awakening when they realize their savior is the one on the Titanic jumping on the rescue boats first and taking all the damn life vests with him.

        Kitten: I couldn’t even reply on the Bruce Springsteen thread, as much as I love him and am the ultimate Jersey Girl, but it just made me sad. I will never agree to the other side. I can’t, wont, will not, cannot, unwillingly will not EVER. Implicit connection is just as damaging as real damage.

    • Dani says:

      Maher is the worst. Every time he’s on my TV – my husband hate watches him – I want to bash it with a chair. He’s so smug and sexist and thinks he’s above everyone. He had Ann Coulter on before the election and yes while she’s a vapid brainless Republican, his treatment of her was so degrading and disgusting, he should be ashamed.

  13. Aang says:

    🙄 I lived in an area of God, guns, and ‘merica. Yes the people there will help you push your car out of a snow bank, or bring you a casserole when someone dies. That doesn’t mean they aren’t racist rubes who think that other people (blacks) are poor because they are of bad character, and they themselves are struggling because the government favors minorities. They believe the only thing standing between themselves and success is affirmative action and undocumented immigrants. They believe that women are lesser, should not govern their own bodies, and owe their husbands obedience. Rich white men need to stop telling us to sympathize with “the poor downtrodden white rural people”. They’d rather loose health care, see schools stripped of funding, live next to industrial waste, and watch social security die, than admit a black man or a woman can offer anything of value, than loose what little privilege they still cling to. I’m not smug, I’m infuriated at their ignorance and selfishness.

    • Kitten says:

      Your point is an excellent one that always gets lost in these binary arguments.
      People can be good and kind to their white neighbors but that doesn’t mean that they can’t be racist towards a black stranger, for instance.
      They can even be very kind to their black neighbor, but still vote for someone like Trump.

    • Who ARE These People? says:

      LBJ said something about how if you let poor whites feel they’re still one step ahead of poor blacks, you can feed them any kind of s–t.

    • Timbuktu says:

      I’d take it even 1 step further: I think those same people can actually like or maybe even love a handful of personal Black friends, while still thinking that Blacks as a group are “bad”. I’m seen this often and a black friend just shared a story about how a wealthy college friend (my friend went to Brown, so we’re talking very wealthy) invited her to spend Christmas with her family at their winter cabin or something, and during dinner, Dad said many openly racist things. My at that time still teenage friend didn’t even know what to do: here she was, a guest in this posh house, very remote, with people twice her age looking straight at her and bashing her race. When the Dad finally noticed her reaction, he said “well, clearly, that doesn’t apply to you, you’re one of the good ones”.

      • Little Darling says:

        I got this many times when I was growing up, as a Puerto Rican growing up in one the the most affluent mostly all white neighborhoods in the east coast. My high school was in the top ten public schools in the nation, elite of the elite. They would say things like, oh the spics, or whatever, and then turn to me and say, oh we don’t mean YOU of course, you’re as good as white, and we’d laugh because I WAS as good as white. Living on white privlige. (only men said those things, never the women, ironically.)

        Only in my mid 20′s did I start to realize the discrimination I was subject to, and the lack of discrimination I was subject to, because of my white skin and my apparent heritage that belies that whiteness.

      • GMonkey says:

        Can you imagine how he would have reacted if she had disparaged white people and then condescendingly said, “not you, you’re one of the good ones?” Bigoted wealthy white people think that not burning crosses, using the N word, or flying a confederate flag=not racist.

    • isabelle says:

      So sick of “those poor downtrodden working class people” being the excuse for electing a charlatan petty arsehat like Donald. Give me a break. Do they think that will play on peoples sympathy and we are gullible enough to fall for it? Its Trump voters trying to justify voting for a bigoted P8ssy grabbing authoritative Russian loving fool.

  14. grabbyhands says:

    Well, I will agree that Bill Maher is king of the smug a**holes. I hate that guy. And he’s a sexist douchebag.

    As a lefty, I DO think we carry a lot of blame for what happened in November and we can be very smug and dismissive.We didn’t plan. Man y were lazy and uninvolved because they didn’t get the outcome they wanted in the primaries. We acted like spoiled children. However, I am really over being asked to understand and bow to people who absolutely refuse to engage in a normal conversation and that can’t be bothered to express their dissatisfaction with anything but foaming at the mouth Fox News talking points.

    A guy posted this list on FB the other days about how “we” created this and among his reasons-

    When we tried to take away free speech-I’ve lost count of how many times I’ve tried to explain that people being pissed and disagreeing with you and saying mean things when you say something they don’t like isn’t having your free speech taken away. When people do that AND throw you in jail, then your free speech right is being violated.
    When we took away everyone’s guns-honestly, now you’re just making shit up as this literally never happened.
    When we emasculated men- GROW UP. I’m sorry we’re not living in the fifties anymore and the age of the white man being able to do whatever the hell he wanted without question is coming to and end. Did you know that women actually don’t think it’s cool when they get beat up and can’t have their abuser prosecuted? That they actually like having jobs and being able to speak their minds and be respected JUST LIKE WHITE GUYS? Crazy, huh?
    When we called them racist and xenophobic-I’m speechless. Your Orange Fuhrer advocated for a registry list for Muslims and is being lauded by the KKK and Neo Nazis. People at his rallies were throwing up Nazi salutes left and right and he said nothing.

    And that is a fraction of it. Why should I try and pander to someone who thinks this way? Nothing I say or do is going to change a mind like that. And I don’t know how to get through to people that live in regions where they patently refuse to accept that they are in industries that are dying and never coming back-like say, coal.

    • Timbuktu says:

      Forget even for a minute normal conversation! I tried to ask people to articulate why they are voting for Trump (rather than against Hillary) twice, and ACA (so, against Obama, really) and “Trump is for the military” were the only “answers” I got.

      • JulP says:

        @Timbuktu, I can’t even…. I mean, did those people pay attention AT ALL? Trump insulted McCain for being a POW, insulted a Gold Star family, and now wants to privatize the VA. Perhaps he cares about the “military,” insofar as it can be used as an instrument to further corporate interests around the world, but he doesn’t give a shit about veterans.

        Yesterday Jezebel posted a bunch of emails from Trump supporters explaining why they voted Trump, and my head nearly exploded after reading them all. The emails basically revealed what we already know: people who voted for Trump are either 1) astoundingly stupid/ignorant; 2) selfish; and/or 3) racist/homophobic/misogynistic. As other posters have said, there’s really no way to reason with people like that. These people don’t believe in facts or logic; we can’t come to their side and try to understand, because there just isn’t anything *to* understand.

  15. lightpurple says:

    Ohio, Michigan, Wisconsin, and Pennsylvania are not flyover states. Just had to smugly point that out.

  16. MunichGirl says:

    Trump should thank Putin and his hacker minions, that’s why he won.

    • CItyHeat says:

      I hate that we learn truth from hacking (believed to be by Russians) that is selectively released with a clear intentional agenda to influence. Be clear on that and reread it before the next sentence…..

      But no one has denied the truth or veracity of the hacked emails. They were real. Their contents unedited. And further I highly doubt that anyone’s vote was influenced as a result of learning the content of those emails. Does anyone actually know someone who said “I was going to vote Hillary…but day-um…..those DNC emails…….gotta go Trump now…”. Yeah right. 👀

      But again……….I hate that we learn truth from hacking (believed to be Russians) that is selectively released with a clear intentional agenda to inflict.

      I just doubt those emails actually changed votes. And if they did ..it was the proverbial straw on top of other issues for the voter.

      • BnA fn says:

        The email hacking should be have been done equally to the Dems and Reps, put it out there and let the voters see how seedy both sides. After the voters read both sides hacked and leaked mails then we could make a true comparison of who is the bigger scum, Hillary or Trump. Imo, I would bet my last dollar Trump the pu$$y grabber would be the bigger scum of the two.

      • jetlagged says:

        But that’s just it isn’t it? The hacking wasn’t done to both sides – or if it was the hackers made a decision to NOT release the Trump/Republican side of things. That right there tells me the hacking was done as part of a larger agenda.

        Voters may not have made their final decision based on what the hack found – but it certainly allowed Trump to squirm out of a few tough spots because the media focused on the info from the hacks rather than his latest disaster. Every time he said or did something especially heinous, a new distraction would miraculously get released and the press would focus on the new shiny thing for a few news cycles.

      • Lightpurple says:

        I know quite a few Trump voters, who claim to be independent, who most certainly do cite the emails as their reason for voting Trump.

      • CItyHeat says:

        For the record…..my “selectively released” reference was indeed that it was one sided. So that tells us one of 2 things : Either it was definitely done to ATTEMPT to influence the results……or the cyber security of the Republican Party is better than the dems.🤔

        I doubt anyone truly changed their vote over the freaking podesta emails except maybe a small number of those special Bernie or bust snowflakes who went with stein over HRC, Again it was the proverbial straw for them if they did on top of other issues.

        And light purple…..they were going to vote for him anyway. Exit polling shows that most 3rd party voters would have voted Trump if they had no 3rd party options, so it’s reasonable to assume some bought into the social pressure of “you must choose HRC or DT YOU MUST. YOU MUST”. And so they went with Trump. God knows this website was ate up with that YOU MUST CHOOSE ONE OF THE 2 pressure pre election.

        The Email hack didn’t influence the election results really. But yes — it’s crazy stuff and I don’t like it 1 bit. But I don’t accept blaming the election results on the Russians. It sure made them happy though.

        Blaming Alleged russia one sided hacks is just asinine, Hillary lost the election because she was a flawed candidate (as is DT), who ran An even more flawed campaign than Trump. He got the needed votes in the needed places. She didn’t. Period.

        The reasons have been dissected, some damn distasteful and some so disappointing, But quit blaming voters for choosing wrong, Russians for jacking with us, and everything but the fact.

        She lost, he won.

      • GMonkey says:

        @CityHeat: The US Intelligence agencies said that there was hacking into the RNC as well, just that none of it was released, which is even more damning. I think that’s why DT is being soooooooo stubborn and refusing to say anything negative about Putin. I think that’s the motivation behind Rex Tillerson, too. I bet that a falso move on the part of DT will bring forth so much crap, including what are probably absolutely horrific details in his tax returns.

        I’m convinced that DT didn’t actually hope to win the Electoral College. I think that he thought that he’d win the popular vote, Hillary would win the Presidency and he would just bitch and complain and make more of a name for himself and sell more books and hats and junk. Possibly set the stage for an Ivanka run in 8 years. His team were professionals (and jerks) but they weren’t about to let their reputations go in the crapper so they used their strategies to help him win.

        It seemed like he and Melania never even discussed living arrangements in the event of a win. Security for Trump Tower wasn’t on the radar, nor were cabinet appointments. He didn’t think to make considerations to disentangle himself from his businesses. The expression of a man in way too deep and seriously overwhelmed was impossible to ignore when he met with Obama immediately after the election. Same with when he sat with Paul Ryan at the first meeting. I work in medical and that was the same facial expressions on my classmates faces (and probably mine) when we first had to perform barium enemas on patients.

  17. Keaton says:

    I agree with Bourdain that alot of liberals are smug and contemptuous and many red state people are pissed off about it. Hell that may have played a significant part in Trump’s win but it’s such a piss poor reason to vote for him. Trump supporters just have to own up to the fact they voted for an ignorant authoritarian demagogue kleptocrat that peddles in racism and Islamphobia. The most benign thing I can say about them is that they clearly do not CARE about racism, Islamaphobia, etc at least not as much as they care about abortion, the economy (god knows why they think Trump will be good in this area), gun rights, or their hurt little feelings etc. I’m sorry I’m still so pissed that this man won. I’ve never been one to run down or country and say I’m ashamed of it. But when he won that’s one of the first things I thought “I’m so ashamed of my country right now.”

  18. Citresse says:

    Creme brulee anyone?

  19. Eric says:

    I’ve never seen Bourdain on Maher’s show, but if he had a bad experience on it then that’s no excuse to rail on Maher. My guess is that Maher ridiculed Bourdain in such a way that Bourdain didn’t realize until 30 minutes after the show ended.
    That’s Bill for you: he’s very very bright and, as much as like Bourdain, he got outsmarted by Maher. What really stings Bourdain is that they are birds of a feather (east coast arrogants) and this happened.

    • Locke Lamora says:

      Is he, though? Very very bright? I used to watch his show and he didn’t strike me as that smart. Smart yes, in that typical middle class educated sort of way, but not mind blowingly intelligent. And his stance on vaccination makes me question his intelligence. His humour isn’t exactly high brow either.

    • Lambda says:

      Maher is quite the douche bag.

    • GMonkey says:

      I’d be really surprised if Bourdain cowered in the face of Maher. Maher is quick with a comeback, he’d probably have done well as a sleazy attorney, but I don’t think that he’s a deep thinker. Bourdain strikes me as a deep thinker and I agree with him on a lot, but I also think that he can be such a snob.

      While Food Network is not my favorite channel and a lot of the hosts are…eh…But, we cannot ignore the fact that it has elevated home cooking. It has helped people discover ways to prepare vegetables and to express creativity and do things as a family.

  20. Embee says:

    Trump has definitely shown he doesn’t give a damn about being PC! The man who was running for president of America should not have been using filthy, sexist, racist words and phrases as he was. I’m ashamed he is the president of my country!

  21. Patricia says:

    There’s no excuse for these people. And they have voted against their own best interest yet again. If they are struggling so badly maybe they should educate themselves about the fact that the Democratic Party is the only party interested in preserving and expanding social programs to help them.
    Nope. The appeal of white supremacy was strong enough that they would rather vote for that.
    Is it smug that I think social programs are important (even though I’m at a place in my own life where I don’t need them)? Is it smug that I think government should stay out of uteruses and people’s love lives, and that all people should be respected? Is it smug that global warming scares me and i want the government to make ANY effort to address it? Ugh I could go on. But if all that makes me smug then I guess I’m smug!

    • Abbess Tansy says:

      Kitten, you are my hero.

      • Little Darling says:

        Slow clap for that. I put my writing guns down, realizing I was late to the party and Kitten just did the most AMAZING KEG STAND of a reply. I’ll just hang with my red solo cup on the side and let her finish this dance off.

  22. Jake says:

    Either way, the next four years are going to be interesting.

  23. robyn says:

    These “hard done by” white voters for Trump are in their own “bubble”. Why don’t they wake up and smell the coffee and see how the world is changing.

    Nope … people who voted for p*ssygrabbing conman Tump have no excuses. Liberals had good ideas for the lower/middle class and I wish they articulated them better instead of now considering going more to the left. For example, just now I’m hearing about the dangers of coal mining and the cancer coal miners endure and how getting rid of Obama Care will affect them. Why wasn’t this more thoroughly discussed during the election? I do think people can be convinced if media and politicians did a better job of giving context to the issues. But on the other hand, voters are lazy and want sound bites and emotional outrage so maybe more information would not have helped.

    Anyway, it all came down to Comey, the NRA, the KKK and Russia (big time) to push corrupt Trump over the margins.

    • BnA fn says:

      Hillary tried to adress the coal mine workers.
      They did not want to hear that they would have to be retrained for other more safe jobs. She explained the dangers of mining coal in this day and age. They went with DT who told them that he would bring back those jobs. Those jobs are never coming back. The coal cause lung cancer ect.

      • Patricia says:

        Yes I was so frustrated with this. Not only does coal cause lung cancer, but much of the work has been replaced by machinery. Trump promised them we would go back in time and do the impossible .
        Hillary explicitly said she wanted the ex coal workers to be on the front line for new green energy jobs.

        This kind of thing is what makes me thing a lot of reasoning for voting for Trump was just excuses to embrace the contemptible things he says. “But he says he will bring our coal jobs back!” Well that’s an obvious impossible
        lie, and Hillary has a real, practical plan to help you! If you still went and voted for Trump there’s something more going on (racism, mysogeny, white supremacy, islamophobia, take your pick).

      • Kitten says:

        Yes Trump will “bring back the coal jobs” and then deny these people their health insurance so that they all die of lung disease.

      • Esmom says:

        Kitten, they’ll die of lung disease even if they have health insurance because even with the best care, some strains of that black lung disease is incurable. Instead of pining for the bad old days in the coal mines, people need to, as pointed out above, not dismiss green energy and the jobs that come with it.

      • Adele Dazeem says:

        As a former coal country resident, this is the part that KILLS ME and while i love her, Hillary ROYALLY F–ED UP:

        Coal production in West Virginia is higher than it has ever been, even in the perceived peak of the 1950s. However, automation and changes in the mining process are what killed the jobs. Google mountain top removal, strip mining, automation etc if you are really interested. As with everything else, the rise of machines leads to job loss for humans. Bringing back mining jobs is akin to bringing back horse and buggy manufacturing.

        if Hillary would have explained this and used a metaphor better than mine(not buggy and horse hah)–she could have made her point more clearly. Instead, she went with the green energy conversation that Obama had (which is incredibly valid and worthwhile, but won’t get through to someone with an 8th grade education that is struggling to feed their family).

  24. Matador says:

    I like both Bourdain and Maher and think the point they are generally trying to make – poorly, compared with Jon Stewart – is that if you don’t truly understand the opposition, you can’t effectively strategize to win against them. And you do need some of their votes to win, as seen in the Rust Belt, which is where Hillary’s loss occurred by the slimmest of margins.

  25. Timbuktu says:

    I am seriously losing sight of what these people are talking about.
    Have they talked to some die-hard Republicans in red states? They are JUST as arrogant and dismissive and smug, except they also tend to be less educated, less well-traveled, living in less diverse communities, etc.
    Our differences are in our values, not in the way we express them – the expression is actually something that we’re quite similar on, we have 2 very angry sides shouting past each other and believing that we have all the answers. At least none of the liberals I know threaten to back their “solutions” with a gun or a million.
    Therefore, can we please STOP with “arrogant elites” crap? It doesn’t take an education or superior intellect to be arrogant, look at Will and Kate. Some of the most arrogant misogynists I met were dumb and uneducated, yet believed they were entitled to talk down to me because I was a woman. So, why do we equate arrogance with education or salary?

    Also, contrary to popular beliefs, liberals don’t live in a liberal bubble. I live in a very blue state, all of my immediate family voted for Hillary, but people in my extended family voted for Trump, some friends voted for Trump, and I lived as long in a red state as in a blue state. I have met TONS of Republicans in my day and am plenty aware that a lot of them are nice people in everyday life. However, their niceness does little to assuage the fears of my friend who never had continuous healthcare before ACA, so what does Bourdain recommend my friend does? Say “well, I may go untreated for years, but I must remember that nice people voted to rob me of my healthcare, so I must not resent them”?.

    • Esmom says:

      Timbuktu, I’m with you 100%, said something similar above. How this “liberals are smug and elitist” trope ever gained traction is beyond me. It’s so far removed from what I actually know to be true.

  26. z says:

    I’m digging your political takes and applaud you for calling out Jon Stewart and Bourdain. Is the left up its own ass? Yes. And I do hold them responsible for Trump, but not because of their contempt for the right… because they couldn’t get past their own selfishness to come out en masse for the OBVIOUS choice due to their own idiotic idealism.

    • Lynnie says:

      Third parties were super detrimental during this election I agree.

      • Lambda says:

        Third parties were NOT detrimental during the election. One can make a narrow case for it only in Michigan. Let’s not carry on with this myth (not that I don’t consider third voter parties weak minded). Voter inertia was deleterious, though.

      • CItyHeat says:

        WSJ did a decent data driven article that concluded as Lambda said. Third party voters didn’t cost Hillary the election….

        One can assume that if forced to vote for HRC or DT….most Johnson voters would have gone for DT and most Stein voters for HRC. Given the number of Johnson voters, the end result would have been a race where the popular vote was actually closer then.

        However almost 5 million voters — high numbers of milleniels and people of color –showed up for Obama but didn’t bother to vote at all.

  27. HatetheletterK says:

    Well written Kaiser.

  28. Shark Bait says:

    I live in Philly now, but believe me when I say the further west I go in PA, it’s like a different world. Lots of Trump signs to be found, Confederate flags, hateful and vile signs about Hillary. I have friends and family who live in rural PA. I hate the argument that they are the real, salt of the earth hard working Americans and I am some liberal elitist. My parents are financially stable and quite well off. They still voted for Trump. Almost all the Trump voters I know in rural, suburban PA aren’t facing rising insurance premiums or facing serious financial woes.
    I love Bruce Springsteen, so I didn’t jump in on that post, but I don’t think those hard working, salt of the earth red state voters exist anymore. Have you looked on social media?? Have you seen some of the vile, awful, hateful things these people post about President Obama? How are these people “real Americans” “real people” yet I am in some liberal bubble. Sure, when I go into rural parts of Pennsylvania or Maryland (Maryland may be a blue state- but go into Harford, Cecil or the eastern shore counties and you’d never know), Virginia etc and these people are very nice to me. But they see a white lady, usually with her children, and I have no reason to think they would act any other way to me. I don’t have LIBERAL or OBAMA VOTER/HILLARY VOTER tattooed on my forehead. Yet I still see the hateful, racist things these so called nice, rural people put on social media.
    To say just because I’m liberal and live in Philadelphia I don’t understand the rest of the country is disingenuous. I’m not smug because I live in an urban area and I am educated, I just feel that I am more in tune to the diversity of this country. I feel like if Trump was just about jobs and didn’t have hateful rhetoric, if the criticism of Obama wasn’t tinged with racism and utter hatred, if there wasn’t disgusting sexism mixed in with the criticism of Hillary I would be more willing to sit down and have a discussion with those voters. But the hateful rhetoric is what turns me off and causes me to become “smug.”

    • Timbuktu says:

      I couldn’t agree more, in fact, I wrote something very similar above you, and also in a political thread yesterday.

    • robyn says:

      Shark Bait, Thank you for sharing this. Interesting read from your perspective. I think you are exactly correct in your assessment!!!

    • Kitten says:

      Loved this comment, Shark Bait.

    • Little Darling says:

      Sharkbait – SPOT on hon. I too am a huge Bruce Springsteen fan but couldn’t endorse his statements nor believe in the validity of salt of the earth voters who really aren’t bad, they’re just working class. I will say that my brother in law lives in Colts Neck, where Bruce is from. He is a blue class worker, a hard worker, and central southern Jersey is FILLED with people like him, hard working mechanics etc. I don’t think my brother in law is a bad person, in fact he is one of the most amazing humans I know in terms of being a provider, and an all around “good guy” but he knows few black people, I’m fairly certain his father might have called a neighborhood “the dark side of town” because it was mostly brown people. They aren’t BAD per se, but they most certainly aren’t completely enlightened either. Simply not liberals. Kind yes, but nary a thought to LGBTQ, or those in the social system, or those on medicaid, even though my brother in law is VERY middle class. The issues don’t affect him, he wants more jobs in the rural parts of jersey and better health insurance.

    • K says:

      To your last point exactly. If this was one of the followings

      Hillary vs Marco
      Hillary vs Mitt
      Hillary vs Jeb
      Hillary vs. McCain
      Hillary vs. Grahm

      We wouldn’t be having this reaction because it would have been policy debates, both candidates would have had some level of experience and qualification. But the campaign wouldn’t have been a hateful, fearmongering racist blight on our society. It would just be people in Ohio thought Jeb’s ideas were better.

      I also want to say I am sick of this attitude that because I live in New York City, have diverse friends and a college degree that I am somehow an elitist. Or that all people who live in NYC, LA, San Fran are. Sorry that isn’t true the people in Inglewood aren’t part of the elite society they are the hard working salt of the earth Americans who are just trying to make a better life for their family. Heck some people from Hollywood Hills aren’t running in the elite crowd. Same with NYC their are all walks of life living here some extremely rich and connected and some working class.

      So I get it the people of Iowa don’t like being lumped in together or looked down on, well guess what I don’t like being attacked for going to school, caring about diversity, and the environment and neither do the people of California.

  29. hmmm says:

    The man bought the propaganda, thinks in memes and stereotypes. Put a parrot up there and you get the same result. Best to shut up and not show yourself for a fool.

  30. Samantha says:

    I think this is thread just proves the point of Boudain.
    Is anyone aware that some of the same people who voted for Obama (twice) then voted for Trump? I think it’s pretty obvious what they have in common, they both promise change and seemed to be not part of the status quo. So of course it’s easy to label every single person who voted for Trump as a racist, it’s harder to really try to understand why or to look from their perspective, especially when you’re looking down on them. I say this as a woman who grew up on the south side of Chicago. In communities not unlike the very ones assigned to some Trump supporters (desperate, poor, scared, ignorant, clinging to religion) As a little girl, I remember people (mostly white) in our community giving us food, gifts, scholarships to catholic school, free camps and so many other things, including hope. What I’m trying to say is that I’m glad that not everyone gave up on our community and wrote us off as deplorables.

    • robyn says:

      I don’t think voting for Obama meant people were not racist. Obama was sort of homogenized and mixed-race. People did not feel threatened by him. There is a guilt absolving syndrome that goes on. You vote for someone you fear or who is marginalized, giving yourself an emotional pass. Now you can say: See I’m not racist; I’m not sexist. But then it doesn’t happen again for another hundred years.

      • neil says:

        robyn
        The thing about Obama I think you are overlooking is that an overwhelming amount of people voted for him because his colour AND his youth AND his vision AND THE PERCEPTION of him being new and DIFFERENT… made many of us think it was going to be a new era. Why do you think the mantra of, HOPE was so powerful? It wasn’t because we were trying to assuage our white guilt; it was because EVERYTHING about him was THOUGHT to be new, fresh, different; a new page for a new century. I think people here don’t realize how disappointing so many people are of him. Obama, at the end of the day was yet again just another neo-liberal working for the establishment giving the rest of us just enough incremental change to keep us from getting too worked up while everything wrong about the country continued like a cancer to grow stronger and grow more entrenched. Why do you think Bernie was so popular? “Identity politics” just isn’t going to cut it anymore. Obama’s race; the “identity politics” ended up feeling like a betrayal and a marketing scheme. Want to know why Hilary lost and why us progressives didn’t support her….. DURING THE PRIMARY…..? She was a mediocre and baggage-laden candidate put forth by an out of touch and tone deaf party, supported by a ratings driven and incompetent mainstream media; it’s as simple as that.

      • K says:

        @neil

        I disagree with everything you said almost and that is fine. Obama brought a lot of change and did amazing things for this country, but and I know this is shocking to a lot of people his is President not a King or dictator for all of his ideas to work he needed the Senate and Congress. And with some of his plans he needed Governors. However, we can agree to disagree on Obama.

        That being said he and the democratic party DID NOT play identity politics, he spoke to everyone!!! And why that is now being vilified because Hillary wasn’t believed is insane to me. It was good he reached out to women, Asians, African Americans, white men (they ignored him but he reached out), Hispanics and the LGBTQ because guess what all these people are REAL AMERICANS they are as much Americans and as the white guy in Wyoming and they deserve to spoken to and heard. Their voices are as important as anyone else.

        Sorry but the identity politics is bull and offensive.

      • robyn says:

        Neil, There’s no denying that Obama is charismatic and projected hope and that helped him get elected. But that did not help him with the GOP which thwarted many of the wonderful things he wanted to do. They cast suspicion on him to knock him down … was he a Muslim … was he even born in America. It was easy to do when racism lurks in the background.

        Trump would have pummeled Bernie to the ground. A crazy old man who wanted to give everything away for free to deadbeats, he would say. Hillary understood that progress is incremental and if she had had the support of America, she had the smarts and patience to see it through. For various reason some voters refused to trust her even though Trump boldfaced lied to their faces. Media kept harping on her mistakes … even when she was sick and didn’t mention it right away, it meant she couldn’t be trusted. Stupid things like that were highlighted while Trump continued on his corrupt way into the highest office.

  31. Samantha says:

    I would like to make one more statement. For all the eloquent words here, there is little empathy. Most people have acknowledged that these people (Trump supporters) are desperate yet will not give them benefit of a doubt whatsoever.

    If a starving woman steals a loaf of bread to feed her family, does that make her a thief? It’s not a trick question, the answer is yes. She stole, therefore she is a thief. But if we never look at the WHY, what does that make us?

    It makes us the very people that Mr. Boudain is describing.

    • Jade says:

      Samantha, I feel it is ok to analyse the why. That’s what we do in history lessons anyway. It’s just that all of us don’t have to agree on whether it’s the correct decision to vote for Trump / Hillary or steal.

    • lobbit says:

      I simply cannot empathize with any view that contradicts what I believe to be essential human rights: health care and marriage and gender equality, to name a few. How could I? How can feel badly who feel threatened by my reproductive rights?

    • hmmm says:

      False equivalence. A thief isn’t going to make millions suffer and destroy the world. No sympathy for Trumpistas, those special snowflakes. No empathy either. I give it to those who don’t glorify a fascist and bully. I’m not stupid.

      Let’s talk about how much empathy Trumpistas had for those millions who were not like them when they voted. Yeah, I thought so. Gad, they are such endless whiners even when they won. Jesus.

    • cynic says:

      If a starving woman steals a loaf of bread, but then spits on us and calls us libtards when we try to help (because we are also trying to help the dispicable “others”), are we elitist for giving up on that woman? Why should we keep trying? Why are we the ones that have to compromise our values?

  32. neil says:

    I agree with him 85%, but we not only do have to move past the typical political correctness of the left, we have to get smart and see the TYPICAL AND ABUNDANT political correctness of the right. The Right plays on our desire to own the “high ground” and while we wag our fingers at them they are happy to kick us between the legs. Not a Hillary fan but she was right about one thing, although half the Trump voters may have been frustrated, misguided and angry the other half WERE everything we accuse them of being. There have been questioner polls taken about beliefs and opinions of the electorate and a disturbingly majority of Trump supporters really are as vile as we could imagine. Excrement stinks and THAT is being politically correct to say it doesn’t.

  33. evilqueen says:

    You know the whole Political Correctness theory belongs to Bill Mahr right? The guy he (Anthony Bordain) hates? That is actually a monologue that he does theorizing that PCism helped elect Trump.

  34. Sandy says:

    Yeah, we’ve been coddling the Southern racists since the 1950s (even before that). Gotten nowhere with that! But let’s be oh-so-tolerant of the poor white Trump voter for what? Another sixty, seventy years? Nah!

  35. wolfie says:

    I live in Louisiana surrounded by the kind of people he describes. At work, my boss and a coworker were talking yesterday, and applauding the demise of the ACA. I came close to being fired as I almost lost the battle of biting my tongue. They of course are full time and have always had insurance. Their insurance has always been high cost. That is the company’s fault, not the ACA. I, being part time, working 2 jobs, got covered under the ACA. Our wonderful new governor expanded Medicaid last year, so I am going to hurry and get my glasses while I can. I was diagnosed with glaucoma last year and I don’t know how I will afford the medicine or pressure checks in a couple of months. I have ZERO sympathy for Trumpettes. If they can’t even think for themselves, instead of joining the parade of lemmings, so be it. But they dragged the rest of us working poor, the ones that actually studied the issues, down with them.

  36. lobbit says:

    LOL if you visit conservative websites, you’ll find that right wingers are quite smug and HUGELY contemptuous of left leaning folks like me.

    • Neelyo says:

      Bingo! And i don’t think i’ve ever heard anyone tell them that they need to empathize with the other side. That’s only for the left.

      • lobbit says:

        Nope! When Conservatives lost the White House in 2008, there were no calls to “empathize” with the left. On the contrary, they doubled down on right wing values with the whole Tea Party movement, and then took over the Republican Party. And now they’ve got Congress AND the White House in their corner.

        Meanwhile, I’m being told to go soft on intolerance – to try and “understand” why the right wants to deny people healthcare, reproductive rights, and a living wage. Ugh, it’s infuriating.

  37. Hannah says:

    It’s pathetic how white old men like him and Stewart go out of their way to excuse racism and bigotry and in a way end up presenting white men as the put up on group. It’s just another example of white male privilege.

  38. Jess says:

    I’m sick of tired of people acting like Dems are out of touch snobs and red state people are real people. I used to live in Texas and now live in Wisconsin (didn’t realize it was turning into Texas) and there are tons of smug, contemptuous Republicans in both states. Both rich Republicans who smugly make jokes about their “toxic male masculinity” and assure me that there’s no sexism or racism, along with the more redneck folks (like people in my family) who act like they’re the only true patriots, true Americans, etc. And don’t even get me started on that portion of religious people who are so smugly sure they’re superior (not all religious people are like this -but some sure are). I agree that people can disagree and both should listen to each other, but when Bourdain says stuff like this he’s buying into the idea that Trump voters are somehow the “real Americans” that we should all care about. Beyond the racism and sexism inherent in that idea, it’s also just absurd on its face. More people voted for Hillary than Trump and by definition we’re all real Americans and we all have legitimate concerns.

    • hogtowngooner says:

      Reminds me of Jon Stewart way back 2008:
      “She said that small towns, that’s the part of the country she really likes going to because that’s the pro-America part of the country. You know, I just want to say to her, just very quickly: f*ck you.”

  39. KatyD says:

    I’m in Europe visiting family and I went to visit Dachau concentration camp today. The parallels between 1930s Germany and the US is scary. Our tour guide talked about why people voted for Hitler and the reasons were the same: economic collapse, no jobs, and no future. She said many people did not believe Hitler’s rants and threats. They thought he did it “for show.” They did not believe that anything terrible would happen to them, even many Jews, as they thought Germany was an advanced and “civilized country.” She said, “Everyone was mistaken. Hitler showed his true colors and many didn’t believe it until it was too late.” It was an eerie thing to hear. Then, she wondered if people are capable of learning or do people keep making the same mistakes over and over and over? It’s sad. In exchange for economic well being, people threw away their morality. Nothing good can come out of voting very bad people in charge.

  40. Bohemian Martini says:

    I agree with what he’s saying. The Democratic party that I grew up with doesn’t exist anymore. The only proof I needed was seeing my staunch, always vote the straight Democratic ticket father of 70 years old vote for Trump.

  41. Ash says:

    no trump won due to russian hacking (bestfrannns right), wiki-B*TAZZ leaks, comey-lame-comey and a vitriolic whitelash….. dont make it calculus, Bourdain…and I see the liberal strategy, legitimize these losers’ feelings and alt-beliefs…but no, thyre just a bunch of dumb-azz idiots hopped on the “whites-shall rise again” (1950′s style, nice) wanting to undo everything that helped them from obama….with the russian unifying in their complete disrespect of the white house and the obamas’ (almost in a racism fashion complete with obama monkey analogies and trump a civilized white man narrative)

    democrats liberals…. you hit it grass roots…. be progressive, be radical, be for forward change….fill your party leadership and front runner teams with uncle bidens, obamas, bernies, eliz warrens, mark warner, tim mckaines, corey bookers, etc. etc. But dont dare for a second think, these idiots who voted for trump are legitimately logical thinkers…. they are deplorable, who rode on a wave of some of the nastiest ish i’ve ever seen or heard of in the modern century from the leader of the free world.

  42. JK3 says:

    Idk. I’d describe most “#JillnotHill” “Both Sides” Jill Stein voters and Democrat leaning non-voters as smug and contemptuous liberals.

  43. Franny says:

    Both sides are in bubbles that regurgitate partisan talking points.

    One of the big differences with those bubbles, however, is that the bubble/rhetoric on the right promotes an angle that is homophobic, racist, and misogynistic.

    I’m supposed to cower to this mentality?!? I live in red country middle America, and I’m wondering when they will take even one step towards understanding the bs that they force on minorities.

  44. isabelle says:

    When liberals speak their mind, use vitriolic language, have ideology, are bold & loud its called smugness. When Conservative do it its called Patriotism, free speech, real America.

  45. Guesto says:

    For me, he is telling so much truth about the reality of the ‘liberal’ America that blindly and complacently enabled the terrible Trump to rise.

    I’m a fan.

  46. Franny says:

    What about the conservative elites on the right? They never make decisions that are in the interest of the poor or working class, no matter what color they are. They get to hide behind a fake persona with the agenda “God, gays, and guns.” It’s a total act.

    Plus they have smugly and glibly turned to race-baiting to get votes and hide their elitist money grabbing interests.

    They spent 8 years shamelessly spreading the rumor that Obama is not an American. Many people in red states bought it because they wanted to. This is what they want to hear. It has nothing to do with liberal shaming.

    I live in a red state and have friends and family who voted for trump. Some did because they are right wing elitists who only care about their tax breaks and nothing else. Others might not believe all of the race-baiting bs that the right is willing to spew, but they are also so disinterested and ignorant of the threat of violence under trump (i.e. The rise of the KKK) that they feel entitled to sweep it under the rug and claim victimhood if a liberal criticizes their point of view.

    Too bad for them. I don’t think anyone who cares is willing to stay silent anymore.

  47. Stef says:

    I 100% agree with Bourdain. i think he said it perfectly.

  48. Dinah says:

    Smug and contemptuous is Trump’s Strumpet. The Nude Commie Atheistic Slovene believes her skanky self doesn’t stink. I hear she literally reeks of gut-churning body odor. She is less than dirt and no better than any American. I hope she’s reminded of it daily.

  49. dorothy says:

    when’s last time this guys cooked anything

  50. Jen says:

    So because some liberals are smug poor white people just had to vote for an openly racist candidate? Lol! Love how he doesn’t even mentioned the hacking or comey, like it’s all the smug liberals fault😂

  51. Irma says:

    British comedian news guy Jonathan Pie said essentially the same thing, only in a funnier way.
    Also, 8 states that voted Obama turned red, 4 of those states had voted Obama in both 2008 and 2012. Did they all become contemptuous? I’m a Californian and I’m fed up with the uber liberal PC and very patronizing culture that now legislates lives here. And I’m not conservative, never owned a gun, don’t go to church, etc. It’s time for some reflection, cooperation and balance, IMO.
    Cheers in the new year all!

  52. mark wilson says:

    Unfortunately everything he says is true.

  53. Pandy says:

    I still think:
    Hillary being a woman cost her the election
    People are STUPID
    Bourdain is looking a little cheetoh himself

  54. Veronica says:

    I think he has a fair point about how we treat the flyover states as, well, flyovers. There are places in the American South and West that have never recovered from Reconstruction even today and are struggling to get by. But that upswell of rage also stems from a fear of change and progression and shifting power dynamics, which is not on anybody else to fix for them.

  55. Patricia says:

    Did you just call me a jackass? Back off.

    And yes if the issue is that these people are struggling financially then the party best suited to help them is the Democratic Party.

  56. Kitten says:

    “YOU do not get to decide for others what THEIR best interests are.”

    ********************************************

    Yeah and YOU don’t get to tell gay people that they can’t get married.

    YOU don’t get to tell a transgendered person which bathroom they can use.

    YOU don’t get to tell women that they can’t have an abortion.

    YOU don’t get to tell black people that they can’t protest or that racism doesn’t exist.

    YOU don’t get to tell Muslims that they can’t wear a burqa or that Islamophobia isn’t real.

    YOU don’t get to tell immigrants that they don’t belong in this country when they’ve been working and contributing to American society for generations.

    YOU don’t get to tell atheists that they can’t teach evolution and that God belongs in the school system.

    YOU don’t get to tell the elderly, the sick, and those of us who have paid into social programs for half our lives that we don’t deserve to benefit from those programs.

    YOU don’t get to tell us that marijuana doesn’t deserve to be legalized for medical purposes as well as recreational.

    And YOU don’t get to deny us our basic rights because you only give a shit about yourself.

    PLEASE miss us with your hypocrisy. Your entire f*cking party seeks to tell others how to live their lives yet you come here lecturing us.

    And then you’ll tell us not to be angry or “mean”. Yeah boo-f*cking-hoo.

  57. robyn says:

    Kitten, Such clarity. You are my hero!!!

  58. IlsaLund says:

    If you live in an area where there is critical need for social services, health care and a social safety net AND you consistently vote for elected officials who are AGAINST those services and do nothing to help provide them for you, then yes, you vote against your own best interests.

  59. Sadezilla says:

    But Nat, don’t you think that in the case of people who are desperate for economic improvement, voting Republican, which as other posters have pointed out, is unlikely to enhance social programs that can help them (the ACA, progressive tax rates, etc.), is not in their best interests? I agree that for people who are solidly middle-class or above, voting for Trump is probably not against their best (economic) interests. But I don’t think that’s who Bourdain is talking about here – he’s talking about the working poor.

  60. Sadezilla says:

    Sigh. Nat, Kitten is attempting to point out your hypocrisy. Posters in this thread have attempted to address your point, which you are ignoring. I interpret this to mean you aren’t open to discourse.

  61. Kitten says:

    @Nat-I quite literally addressed your point.
    In fact, I actually copied and pasted the main point of your comment and responded to it directly. I could not have been more clear but of course you will respond in the obtuse manner so typical of the Right.

    And where is YOUR rebuttal to MY point? Oh yeah, YOU HAVE NONE.

  62. Who ARE These People? says:

    Oh Kitten, that was wonderful! Bet it felt good, too.

    Nat, not seeing the hypocrisy there … if the so-called white working class is desperate for jobs, it’s not hypocritical to point out that a Donald Trump administration of rich fat cats looking for tax cuts is not going to give them jobs. If the so-called white working class is desperate for affordable, guaranteed health insurance, it’s not hypocritical to point out that a Donald Trump administration of small-government ideologues is not going to give them that health insurance (and is going to try to take away what they have). A Donald Trump administration is not going to do anything about an opiate addiction crisis or expand the government services they need in their desperation. So yes, they voted against their own self-interest and it’s not hypocritical to point that out.

    Of course, if they want to lose their insurance coverage, stay unemployed, not have access to Medicaid and so on … that is totally their right to believe that is what is going to work for them.

    But generally speaking, having a job is better than not having a job, and being able to go to the doctor is better than not being able to go to the doctor.

    And it *is* hypocritical for Trump voters to say, “You can’t tell us what to do!” and then turn around and try to tell others what to do … which is all Kitten was (I think) pointing out.

  63. MellyMel says:

    “Little tip: YOU do not get to decide for others what THEIR best interests are.” I was going to respond, but Kitten said everything and more.

  64. suze says:

    What is the role of government if not to implement policies in the best interests of their citizens?

    Our government – like all governments – tells us what to do all the time. In many areas. No one agrees with every thing it does but we comply or protest or accept the consequences.

    This is is true of all citizens. Not just Republicans.

  65. Megan says:

    I’m a successful small business owner whose company is just the right size to pay the highest corporate tax rate in America. We pay a higher rate than Facebook, Apple, and Google combined. Republicans have proposed cutting our tax rate in half. That would mean tens off thousands of dollars in additional profits. Yet my two business partners and I not only voted a straight Democratic ticket, we all actively campaigned for Democrats. We cried in a group hug the day after the election.

    So, how do you explain why we voted against our economic interest?

  66. Lightpurple says:

    @Nat, and yet my entire life, I have been hearing the Republican Party lecture me about how I need to have family values while wasting my tax dollars on endless ridiculous investigations

    You don’t get to vote to deprive me of access to treatment for my cancer-related ailments without extremely negative feedback

  67. GoodNamesAllTaken says:

    Everything he said was absolutely correct.

  68. Sweetness says:

    “We cried in a group hug the day after the election.”

    That’s hilarious, Megan.