Cher: ‘The Democrats f–ked up so bad in their message’ & they were too old

70th annual Cannes Film Festival - 'Nelyubov' - Premiere

Cher covers the latest issue of Billboard. You know why? Because she’s receiving the Icon Award at the Billboard Music Awards. What’s surprising about that is that it’s taken this long for her to receive it, right? She sat down for a pretty amazing and “over it” interview. She even says, flat-out, “Icon is a stupid word.” You can read the Billboard piece here – she comments about her music and film history but it’s nothing new, really. Most Cher fans know her history like the back of their hands. Here are some highlights:

She wanted to be a rock star in the 1970s: In the ’70s, her Hollywood friends — Geffen, Warren Beatty, Jack Nicholson, Joni Mitchell — were making great art; Cher felt ashamed of her songs. She wanted to sound like Bob Seger, Bruce Springsteen, Mitchell or, especially, the Eagles. Anything but Cher. “I’m not a Cher fan,” says Cher. “I just don’t think my aesthetic taste lies in her direction.”

She lives with her son in Malibu: She lives in a Malibu mansion with her son, Elijah Allman, 40, a musician and painter (“He’s talented, but he won’t buckle down,” she frets). Chaz completed sex reassignment surgery in 2009. “My relationship with my kids is great right now,” she says with a big smile. “Let’s freeze this moment, because God knows what’ll happen tomorrow.” She’s single, and has been “for a while. I loved all the men I was with, but I seem to have a two-and-a-half-year sell-by date.” She explains this with a quip: “My mom once said, ‘You should marry yourself a rich man.’ I went, ‘Mom, I am a rich man!’”

She has to fight the urge to tweet about politics 24/7: “Since Trump was elected, I have to hide my telephone, because I’m so outraged. Twitter is like a drug. It creeps into your life, and you have to say, ‘Time to put a stop to this. I’m a grown-up.’ [But] The president is cheating and getting away with it, and using the White House to make money, and he’s going to take health care away from people, and people are going die. It’s outrageous. You feel like you’re screaming ‘Fire!’ and no one’s listening.”

On the Democrats: “The Democrats f–ked up so bad in their message, and how old [the leadership] is. You’ve got to pray that old people die before young people can get involved with the party. I told Hillary [Clinton] she should have a group of millennials give their ideas about government.”

[From Billboard]

While I agree that it wasn’t a great image to have Bernie Sanders – who is 75 – and Hillary Clinton (69 years old) as the standard-bearers for the Democratic Party in 2016. I do think a lot of younger people tuned out because Bernie was like everybody’s crotchety old grandpa and Hillary was like everybody’s mom who just learned to text. Then again, people actually voted for a 70-year-old orange man who sounds like every racist old coot in every mob movie, so maybe it’s not about age? And I think a political campaign infused by millennials’ ideas sounds horrible.

Film Premiere The Promise

Cover courtesy of Billboard, additional photos courtesy of WENN.

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105 Responses to “Cher: ‘The Democrats f–ked up so bad in their message’ & they were too old”

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  1. Rapunzel says:

    What was wrong with the Democratic message? Hillary’s message was always “I’m a hard working, experienced politician with ideas available for you to see and you should vote for me over the orange idiot with no experience, no plans and Russian ties”. That sounds like a fine message to me, considering the Republican message was “No puppet no puppet your the puppet” “grab em by the pus-y” and “what a nasty woman”

    • Shauna says:

      “What was wrong with the Democratic message?”

      Hillary Clinton managed to lose 30 states to a walking dumpster fire. I think it’s fair to say there was something wrong with the Democrats’ messaging.

      • Nastygirl85 says:

        The issue was that misogyny permeates our society. A woman wasn’t going to get the votes from people who doubt a woman’s ability to lead a country. And also backlash from having 8 years of a black president and our country making progress (though slow) on social issues; the “Make America Great Again” was in response to that.

        It wasn’t so much as a “message” issue as it was some of the items that I’ve listed above.

      • third ginger says:

        Nastygirl85, thanks for the comment. A recent study found that in the key states that HRC lost, the much publicized “economic insecurity” was not the issue. Instead, it was so-called “cultural insecurity”

      • cr says:

        I don’t think the Dems ran a great campaign. But this was also a perfect storm of misogyny, and all those isms, and inattentiveness. I had people on my FB complaining about Dems and minimum wage. Me: have you read their platform? Them: No.
        And yes, the Russians did influence it with fake news. It wasn’t the sole reason, but neither was the Dem’s ‘message’.

      • robyn says:

        I disagree with all my heart. Democrats had a great message but no one was paying attention because too much media attention was on stolen emails and off-the-wall comments day in and day out from BS artist and p*ssygrabber Trump. Add to that many Americans just preferred an asshole and male chauvinist pig to an experienced woman who reminded them of their strict teacher or mother-in-law who might take away their guns. Trump also came across as the last stand for the poor suffering white man. Hillary wasn’t a “great” campaigner but she really did tell the truth and had the perfect qualifications to fix health care and everything else.

      • LadyT says:

        Nasty- so is the answer to that to not have a female nominee next time if the level of misogyny makes winning impossible? Makes me want to vomit.

      • Otaku Fairy says:

        “…And also backlash from having 8 years of a black president and our country making progress (though slow) on social issues; the “Make America Great Again” was in response to that.” This. That was a big part of it.
        @LadyT: What you said makes me wonder what would have happened if it had been a republican woman vs. a democrat woman.

      • SoonerOrLaterWeAllSleepAlone says:

        The only thing wrong with the Democratic message? The Russian message permeated the national enquirer readers with fake news. Oh and the hacking of the DNC – taking emails out of context to look nasty towards the millennials grandpops Bernie. Add a big dose of misogyny, a dash of xenophobia along with a twist of ignorance and Mercans voted in the orange slushy.

      • sondag says:

        Hillary is an amazing woman who has dedicated her entire adult life to serving the Country in various roles and all she gets is grief for it and a 30 yr GOP smear campaign of mostly lies on her that have been told so long, that people believe them,

        Donald was older than Hillary and he ran on racism, basically, I don’t care how much people try to sugar coat, Trumps words, He sold racism.

        Hillary was right when she said Putin wanted a puppet, in Trump. I think Trump cheated to win certain states with the help of Russia and it will come out in the end.

        When all is said and done, I think it will be shown that Hillary was cheated out of votes by Russian fiddling in the election.

        Part of the problem for Hillary was that she had Bernie demonizing her with GOP false talking points, he was no better to her than Trump, , to the point where when Bernie finally came around, his voters were still believeing all the GOP old smear lies, Bernie told on her. and Trump was now using Bernie’s word….on Hillary and Russia fiddling in the election to the point where we don’t even know yet..

        I don’t ever want to see Bernie Sanders in the democratic party again, he’s a divider and a user. imo

        I’d like to see the young Joseph Kennedy, Kamilla Harris , Corey Booker , and others possible consider running.

    • Jeesie says:

      Well that’s exactly it. The message was ‘I’m better than that guy’. While clearly true, it’s not exactly a rousing call to action. ‘Vote for me because the other options are god-awful’ isn’t exactly a ‘Yes We Can’.

      Trump got himself so much free press and pulled so much focus. What was needed was something/someone that could cut through that and make an impact independent of him. But that didn’t happen. The Democrats campaign became about NOT electing him. Telling people what they shouldn’t do isn’t effective messaging. You need to get them pumped up for what they should do.

    • KWM says:

      I feel there was a few things, and it lies with the party on a whole. Say what you will about the Republicans, but they have marketing down. They say tax cut means more money in your pocket! Dems rebutt with Rich get Richer! The rebuttable needs to be Tax Cuts = Bad Roads, no parks, no free birth control. 20 year old, 30 year olds, heck I turn 45 in 2 months and honestly I do not give a shit about Social Security and Medicare. I care about roads that aren’t going to break my axle. Sidewalks my daughter can play on, after school programs.
      Don’t get me wrong SS and medicare are very important, but if at 45 years old they still seem like a lifetime away, no candidate is going to inspire and fire up the 20 year olds with that. They need to counteract every thing Rebulicans say with this cut means this, cut to X means that lake you all love going to will be poluted, cut to this means that free birth control you have been enjoying gone.

      The message of Tax cuts means the rich get richer is tired and an old message. The marketing needs to be this is what we can do to help you. And not that it needs to be dumbed down but no one is going to sit an read through a candidates 23 page tax plan. It needs to be easy to understand, concise and speak to the consumers short attentions spans.

      And I have no idea if this even makes sense, this ramble brought to you caffeine free…..

      • LAK says:

        Understood perfectly and agree 100%.

      • cr says:

        “but they have marketing down.”
        The Republicans are overall much better at appealing to emotions, I think. The Dems can with individual candidates, but not as whole. Bill Clinton was a wonk, but he was also perceived to be a change agent and he is/was an extraordinary gifted campaigner/politicians. Obama is also a wonk, but also perceived to be a change agent and charismatic. Hillary is a wonk, She’s not the most gifted campaigner, nor was she seen as a change agent. And even a lot of supporters were willing to believe the worst about her.
        I’d love for voters to vote with both intellect and emotion, but most go with emotion. And those ‘undecideds’ were swayed to ignore the worst of Trump (which was most of it) and believe the worst of Hillary because the Republicans appealed to emotion and the Dems did not do that well.

      • Original T.C. says:

        Most Republicans are businessMEN, they can sell you the shirt of your back. They hire commercial advertising firms and label experts to make sh*t sound like roses. Instead of the estate tax it’s the “death tax”. Instead of tax break for the wealthy it’s job growth. Democrats like to be honest and wonky. Due to poor education and short attention spans that style no longer works on most Americans unless you have a charismatic candidate people rather watch than reality TV.

    • wolfpup says:

      Men do not admire women. My sons are so glad that they were born male, rather than as female. If I were to reincarnate, I would try being selfish, with a wifey at home, taking care of all my needs and DNA, while I showed myself a winner.

      Figure that out – and perhaps we will find gender equality. Men do not admire a strong female because as leaders, we threaten their priesthood, which is an ancient idea, 1000’s and 1000’s of years old, so perhaps we can understand the kickback, while never giving up our happiness to a male-centric universe. It’s the truth of Us.

      Seriously, my sons want to take home a very sexy female, never commit to her, merely giving her a good life because of the money they can earn.

      I divorced both of their dads. I have a degree in Women’s Studies, and they call me a feminist – not what they need to be okay. They think, that being a female sexpot is the most desirable thing for a woman in a society focused on a man’s needs.

      The men who could fix this state of affairs are absent. Men are subject to great fears of being rejected by females.

      Whatever – may the Force bless Us – that is, the force, of all the goodness we can create.

      • LT says:

        Your sons don’t speak for all men – not by a long shot. I have two adolescent boys who could not be more different – they are gentlemen who respect girls and have only known women to work and earn as much if not more than the men in their lives. They have grown up around women doctors, lawyers, teachers, and yes even ministers, and they take gender equality for granted.

      • Melior says:

        This is so disheartening! How are we ever to get rid of gender bias when the young men are re-conditioned to think like that? Haven’t you been able to influence your sons more about treating women as equals? I think a possible explanation is that today’s consumerism based on sexiness as a market value is taking women back and re-centering society on men’s needs.

      • Moonman says:

        “I divorced both of their dad and have a degree in Women’s studies”
        I see what you did here 😉

    • Daisy says:

      Maybe Clinton should have dumped her nasty husband before embarking on a fight for the White House.

    • SoonerOrLaterWeAllSleepAlone says:

      God forbid anything is old progressive or iconic (=Cher)

    • sondag says:

      I think so many people in America didn’t bother to vote because the Country is becoming complacent. A lot of people I spoke with during the primary simply did not care, weren’t paying attention

    • sondag says:

      History will show that Hillary was cheated imo, the Russian interference details grow clearer every day.

      ,,,,,,…… hopefully, people will get off their butts and register to vote in Primaries in 2020 and also vote in midterms 2018.

      I;m looking at some of the charismatic new Democrats on the stage maybe a Corey Booker, , Kamiila Harris, Joe Kennedy, Christine Gellibrand, etc….

  2. littlemissnaughty says:

    CHER! Oh my god thank you for giving us a Cher post. I love her. “Mom, I am a rich man!” YES YOU ARE!

    As for the Democrats comment … eh. She’s not saying it’s their fault, she’s just pointing out what she thinks was an issue.

    • ichsi says:

      I freaking love that quote!

    • EM says:

      100% agree with her about Democrats & Twitter. Wasn’t too involved before since I’m a former GOP but listening to some new blood like Joe Kennedy III, Ted Lieu and a slew of others. They should have been in leadership and maybe even considered for VP. Lost opportunities without a doubt BUT what got is Trump was (1) apathy (2) let’s burn the country down & start over votes (3) blind hatred & racism (4) Russia + (5) Dem candidate & lost opportunities.

  3. alfaQ says:

    That throwback photo of her is stunning.

  4. Jezi says:

    Hillary spent her life in politics and had the experience. What experience would a millennial have? Hillary knew what the country needed and was willing to fight for it. It’s not the democrats who fucked up it’s the stupid people in this country who followed Trump like a friggin cult leader. It was people’s inability to research and decipher real information from fake news. It was the stupidity of Americans who instead of doing the responsible thing voted with their “conscience”. Whatever the hell that even means. Now look at where we are. The democrats didn’t fuck up because the message was there, they just refused to listen.

    • Tate says:

      Thank you. Plus are we still pretending this was a normal election?!?! We now know that our election was interfered with by a foreign government.

      • sondag says:

        Jezi you are exactly correct.
        and the Bernie Bro’s and some of the millennials will never admit they cut off their nose to spite their face out of a temper tantrum.
        No one gives ANYONE a political party, you have to VOTE, you have to fight for it, you have to register. I think they thought their voices counted more than actual votes.
        94percent of AA women voted for Hillary. POC voted for Hillary in greater numbers, it’s a big factor in why Bernie lost the Primary by 4million. Bernie or His message simply did not appeal to the majority of people who voted in the Democratic primaries.
        The millennials now will have a Supreme Court for the next thirty years who will take away every social , liberal or progressive gain made in the last 40yrs if they can get away with it. The current millennials will be 50 yrs old by the time the damage of Trump is done. …but hey good luck trying to tell them that!

    • pf says:

      This isn’t about Millennials running things. Cher specifically said ” a group of millennials give their IDEAS about government.”

      That’s not a bad thing. Not enough politicians, with the exception of Bernie and Elizabeth Warren, are talking about the issues that Millennials have to deal with on a daily basis – trillion dollar student loan debt, being overeducated and underemployed, not being able to afford to buy a house etc.

      There are 90 million Millennials in the U.S. They are the future. Hearing their ideas for government would have been great for Hillary’s campaign. If they heard their voice, like they did with Bernie, then they probably would have turned out in greater numbers at the polls.

      • Jezi says:

        That wasn’t a why they didn’t turn out. Hillary took on 2/3 of Bernie’s progressive platform after he lost the primary to her. She also worked with him on free tuition for families making under $125,000 a year and loan forgiveness programs. She had all of this up on her website. After she won the primary the Bernie Bros or Bernie Busters refused to let go of the “primary was rigged” narrative that the Russians fed to them. This is why she lost. If Bernie had won the primaries people would’ve showed up for him yes because although I didn’t want him to win I would’ve done the right thing and voted for him over the Orange dick face. As well as other democrats who would’ve done the responsible thing for our country instead of throwing a temper tantrum and now have given us a dictator from hell.

      • pf says:

        Yes, I know she was forced into taking Bernie’s progressive platform. But why did she not try to sell it more? Probably because she is a bad campaigner. I mean, you have to admit that. Unlike Elizabeth Warren or Obama, HRC just doesn’t get people passionate about these issues. And way to generalize. She didn’t lose because of the Bernie Bros. she lost because the voting rights act was gutted. 14 states had new voting restrictions for the first time in 50 years, majority were swing states. I mean, look at Wisconsin. 27,000 votes separated HRC and Trump. Fewer polling places, strict forms of voter ID and residency requirements, people being turned away at the polls, limited voting hours, etc.

        Stop blaming Bernie Bros when you know the real culprit is the GOP. They knew exactly what they were doing and that’s why HRC lost every swing state Obama won just 4 years before.

      • cr says:

        “Millennials have to deal with on a daily basis – trillion dollar student loan debt, being overeducated and underemployed, not being able to afford to buy a house etc.”
        That’s not just Millennials.
        But I got the impression from the more reluctant Millennials that even when it was pointed out to them what was in the Dem party platform they didn’t believe or thought it wasn’t serious. There’s a certain point where that responsibility lies with the voter, not the party.

      • wolfpup says:

        Beloved’s to me – – – remember to share your point of view, for the ones who do not have the education to see the destruction of their rights, healthcare, education, and food itself,; and the giving of our country’s wealth and hard work to the rich, and honestly, how do we teach these people logic – plain and simple? Why is everything contained in a Bible – that is simply not relevant in a current society?

        I spent 30 years of my life studying Buddha-shaman, Mohammed-shaman, Jesus-shaman and Moses-shaman, as well as the Masters of the Far East – my favorite, LaoTsu, and the I Ching. I even lived there. I did not neglect witches. I am atheist now. I advocate in love, as a true scientist, with Neil di Grassi, as a tutor. Our world, our Universe is simply marvelous – full of the awe that feeds our souls and cause us to choose life. (once a witch, always, a witch – and apparently damned by Christian theology – but you are not even allowed to ask the questions).

    • The Original Mia says:

      Exactly! You said everything I wanted to say.

    • sondag says:

      Thank you Jezi. I’m so tired of people putting down Hillary who has served this Country her entire adult life in various roles or office.

      The problem was the people who didn’t vote, or were too lazy to get off their butts and vote, or who threw their votes to some third party candidate who had no chance in hell in winning,

      Also the media browbeat Hillary to death, she barely got a word out without the news media screaming Emails everyday. It ended up being four emails, in the end and nothing was found. Hillary got bashed on every front…..from the Media, from Bernie or Busters, from Russian fake news, Putin , GOP smear lies, Comey…it’s a wonder she even won the people’s votes in the end, the popular vote.

  5. Nicole says:

    I mean she isn’t wrong. Sanders is already pissing off everyone I know by saying he MIGHT run again. Dude you are old and not a champion of minorities or women who make up the core of the left base. So no.
    The Dems need fresh blood and quick. The good thing about the resistance (no not the one Bernie THINKS he leads) is more men, women and minorities are running for everything from the bottom up. That’s what we need. And by fresh blood I mean someone who isn’t nearing 80 in age. Fresh blood for the POTUS is someone in their 40s. Ie Obama was a young POTUS
    There’s no accounting for why people voted for the old cheeto aside from racism. So Cher isn’t wrong

    • QueenB says:

      How isnt Sanders championing women and minorities? Look at his track record.

      • Aiobhan Targaryen says:

        Bernie is not the white savior that a lot of his supporters want to claim he is. He is all about economic inequality but when it comes to racial inequality (women and men of color getting arrested and convicted at higher rates than white, women and men of color getting killed by the police at a larger rate than whites, mandatory minimum sentences negatively affect people of color at large rates than whites, etc.) he could not make a substantive response. He even said he was uncomfortable talking about race and only talked about social justice issues when forced to do so. He acknowledges the reality of racism, but mostly describes society’s problems in terms of class and income. His mindset is that of the old school white male perspective on what’s important to white males and never takes into account that others feel differently and should be respected for those differences.

        He basically wants non-white voters to re-align our priorities so that they fit right along with his and his white supporters. We are just supposed to put aside our non-whiteness (as if we could or should actually do something like that) and just work together to get rid of economic inequality. That somehow this will fix all the other problems. You cannot get rid of economic inequality without talking about race and unconscious bias in this country. He still cannot or won’t tie policy, economics, and race together. He wants people of color to stop playing identity politics but has no problem going after the white working class who are doing the same damn thing. He is not really about systemic change for everybody. Bernie is, in the most annoying white liberal way possible, propping up white supremacy.

      • sanders says:

        I encourage you to see the documentary “Thirteen” and then I’d love to have a discussion about Bill and Hillary’s record on serving the black community.

      • Aiobhan Targaryen says:

        Bernie voted for the crime bill as he was in the senate at the time the bill came up. All three have blood on their hands.

      • Megan2 says:

        I don’t think anyone who supports a pro-life candidate can be described as a “champion of women”. For him to say that we need to start accepting people who may have “slight differences of opinions” or we risk alienating people is a load of crap. I didn’t hear any of that conciliatory tone when he lost the primary, from him OR his Bernie-Bro supporters. It was all about how Hillary hadn’t compromised ENOUGH on the economic issues because that was super important to all of the lower income Bernie supporters. Well guess what… aside from the social aspect of it, a woman’s ability to plan her family and access reproductive health care and choose whether or not to have a child IS A F*CKING ECONOMIC ISSUE AS WELL. But sure… Bernie, Mr. Champion For Women, is willing to compromise on that.

        I’m SO sick of the narrative that Bernie could have won. Maybe he could have. But the thing is, he didn’t win, he’s not perfect, and people need to stop acting like he was some paragon of virtuous perfection who could have solved all of these issues. The misogyny in that message makes me physically ill.

      • sanders says:

        If you want to promote Hillary as better than Bernie, please don’t use feminism as a reason, or at the very least, qualify her feminism as only applying to women in the US. Her record as secretary of state harmed women and children in countries outside the US. Google hillary and Honduras. If we are holding Bernie to such high standards, let’s apply the same to Hillary, or do only American women’s rights matter?

    • Decca says:

      You may not like Bernie Sanders, clearly, but to say he is not a champion of women or minorities is untrue. He’s been fighting the good fight for decades, it may not be how you would do it or how you to want it done, but why the vitriol?

      • How has Bernie supported black and minority issues? Details please? Congressional Black caucus said he’s never approached them. NEVER.
        While I like Cher, what she says is ridiculous. A) HRC won the popular vote. B) millennials are just as inexperienced as 45. My 21 year old knows what affects him, but not much else. HRC has worked for the entire populace for decades.
        Let’s get it straight He won because of white privilege, the media not doing their job, racism, sexism and ignorance

      • crazydaisy says:

        Gloria Steinem named Bernie Sanders an “honorary woman” on more than one occasion. Below are 19 examples of Bernie’s lifelong record of supporting civil rights and standing for minority issues. It may have seemed Hillary had a better chance of winning in the general, but in hindsight, I think not. Especially since Bernie had so much millennial support. I think that’s what Cher is talking about.

      • Still waiting…Please tell me how Bernie has supported minority issues. There is a reason minorities voted overwhelmingly for HRC. Bill and Hillary KNOW how to speak to the issues that matter to minorities. Bernie speaks to the ultra white liberals who feel their own “all knowingness ” trumps others’ experience. Sorry he is out of touch, like some of his followers. I remember a young white guy saying to me if only blacks would THINK about their own needs rather than knee jerk support of HRC they would support BS. Huh? Yes, white liberals and young people went for BS. Why? Because he brought back romantic dreams of hippy days. End

      • pf says:

        Cher did not say anything ridiculous. She did not say Millennials would be running the government. She specifically said a “group of millennials give their IDEAS about government.” Sorry but only Bernie and Elizabeth Warren were talking about Millennial issues, like student loan debt, underemployment, etc.

        And give me a break that Bernie only speaks to ultra white liberals. You could say the exact same thing about Hillary. Bernie is not indifferent to racial justice or civil rights issues. Besides being there right at the beginning and being arrested for desegregation in 1962, he was also ahead of his time calling for equal rights for LGBT back in the 1970s. He also opposed the welfare reform bill championed by Bill Clinton that negatively impacted minorities and the poor besides the fact he condemned police violence and has supported Black Lives Matter since the very beginning.

        Black Americans’ support of HRC was a paradox – they supported her because she’s “familiar” and they believed she had a better chance of defeating the evil. Republicans but her husband was ultimately responsible for the New Jim Crow (the largest increase of federal and state prison inmates in American history, the majority of who are black). The Clintons might be able “to speak” to the community like you said, but what they have to offer them is absolutely nothing. Just broken promises and lies.

      • sanders says:

        yetanotherjudy, People have been kind enough to paste links that answer your question. How much more spoon feeding do you require?

    • Cleo says:

      Thank you, @ QueenB and Decca!

      I see this type of remark a lot (bashing Sanders with willful ignorance and disregard for facts, because I guess that’s the world we live in) and it really gets irritating after a while.

      • It’s perfectly okay to support Sanders with your own facts. I’ll wait.

      • crazydaisy says:

        @Erin Lee Daniels – I posted some in comment above. ^

      • Aiobhan Targaryen says:

        That list is an exaggeration of the highest order. So basically he gave a lot of in-person support, some worthwhile fundraising, and some speeches. Oh and he got arrested. Let’s not forget that Bernie got arrested!!!!

        There is nothing powerful or extraordinary about that list at all.

      • sondag says:

        Jezi you are spot on correct.

        Bernie imo was nothing more than a con man in some ways. He became a Democrat to get wider fame, he tried to Primary Obama also. Bernie made money off of the Primary, has a new third home, while his wife is being investigated by the FBI for frauding a College. He also never appealed to the Democratic base of POC that is why he lost by 4million votes. So he is now going for Trump white voters who imo will never vote for him.

        TO QUOTE the poster above in thee thread………”Bernie is not about systemic change for everyone. Bernie is, in the most annoying white liberal way possible, propping up white supremacy”

        Fk Bernie.

      • Jezi says:

        For me Bernie sold pipe dreams to young people. Hillary was realistic. With a congress that is majority republicans she knew damn well that none of what Bernie wanted would be easy to achieve. So of course people listened to his free healthcare, free education, free everything. It just isn’t going to happen but with her it would’ve come pretty damn close. This election was everything about racism and misogyny in my eyes.

      • Kaiser says:

        I agree, Jezi. Hillary was the pragmatist.

      • Jezi says:

        She was! If anyone looks back at her history she was able to get things done by compromising. When she couldn’t get Universal Healthcare she fought for Child Health Plus. She knew how to work with Republicans and that’s what made her so scary to them.

      • vaultdweller101 says:

        Bernie was selling people a beautifully wrapped dream lie. Hillary was about what realistically could have been achieved.

      • wolfpup says:

        Hillary was not pretty. She was a hard worker for women’s rights. However, the women in our country care most for the rights of men, the biblical rights they have learned from childhood. Hillary was a dose of the future. Women try to form themselves into the opinions of men and then get pissed-off because the men are not trustworthy for the bargain given.

      • Orange'n'Lime says:

        To be honest “pragmatic” and “realistic” are often used to basically say something’s inevitable, and if a politician is telling you something’s inevitable, they’re not doing their job. Obviously your policies should be workable but inevitability is too often used as an excuse to get voters to put up or shut up.

        Hilllary is a career politician. Read Shattered (on the ’16 campaign) and she runs it like a machine, like an athlete training to win, instead of someone serving the public. American politics is crazy intense and that culture of serving the public is often lost in the focus on competition and winning.

      • Jezi says:

        Are you kidding me? Hillary has spent her life serving the people. She started her career getting equal education for kids with disabilities by going undercover. What she’s done for women and for people of color in this country should not be ignored. She is a politician and she knows what it takes to get things done. She doesn’t say I’m going to get you this and that without also saying it’s going to be a fight though. So don’t tell me she’s not served the people because that’s false.

  6. Decca says:

    God almighty do I love Cher! I agree with Cher that Cher’s aesthetic taste lies in a different direction, but Cher is AMAZING. I cannot stop using her name, CHER! What a name, what a lady!

  7. QueenB says:

    Sure politics is basically only old people and younger people should have more say. But! Its not enough to really base a campaign on.
    Im pretty sure more millennials like Lena Dunham would have alienated more older voters from Clinton than they would have brought in younger voters.

    Also when those old people die the younger people are already the (new) old people.

    • wolfpup says:

      Is this an issue between the young and old? Might it be an issue of noticing performance, and character?

      Might it be an issue of a reality tv star influencing? Perhaps we are simply going to become a society of commercials, without substance. The US is damned if we do not teach the young in their schools. This Us, created by the thoughts of our founding fathers, is a grand experiment. If we do not teach our young their privileged spot, then it will be lost.

      Perhaps, you can take a nap while it is happening to you and the children you say that you care about.

      There have been many civilizations that people are happy living within. Do you notice archeology and that life is good, here and now? Are you so ready to let all the goodness of our ancestor’s dreams and beliefs slip away, into another night?

      It was good for me – thanks and greatest blessing to the ancestors for creating such a perfect life of me.

  8. Sara says:

    Wow Kim looks amazing in that pic

  9. third ginger says:

    Aren’t there a couple of generations in between baby boomers [mine and HRC’s] and millennials [my daughter’s]?

    However, Democrats need new and younger leadership badly. I would welcome it.

    Maybe Cher, an icon to be sure, was just using the term “millennials” in a more general way.

    • Alyce says:

      I think it goes boomers, gen x, millennials, and now i-gen ( that is people born 2000 onward).

      • third ginger says:

        Thanks. I sympathized in part with Cher’s comment, but I did not immediately jump from my age group to my child’s.

  10. Lucy says:

    She’s pretty damn awesome.

  11. Felicia says:

    Cher is right. What is important to my parents (in their 80’s) is not what is important to me (50’s) and what is important to my kids (20’s) is also different. Our perpectives on the future (and the length of what that will be) is completely different and the issues as to a (parental) 10 year future, a (me) 40 year future and a (my kids) 70 year future are not at all the same.

    • wolfpup says:

      Actually, we all want peace, and the right to pursue our dreams! Age is not a divider – because I am young and beautiful, and my dreams are the dreams of the planet!

      Why don’t you concentrate on your mama’s dreams for you – she votes in your behalf!

  12. Cleo says:

    I disagree that Sanders’ age played a role in how millennials saw him, at least in a negative light. I’m a female college student and I, as well almost every person in my age group that I know, was way more excited about him than Hillary. That’s anecdotal, but I think that was probably the case for many college students.

    • Anilehcim says:

      I agree with you on Bernie Sanders. His age played no role in the millennial opinion of him. I’m a millennial and everyone I know was much more excited about him than about Hillary. I’ll say this much: Hillary probably would’ve stood a much better chance if Bernie Sanders didn’t appeal so broadly to young people and start up the whole “she’s corrupt, she’s a crook, she’s a Wall St puppet” and all that. I know a few people who voted for Trump because Bernie Sanders didn’t get the nod and they were so disgusted by the DNC and they were deeply impacted by what Sanders said about Clinton. This is one of the biggest issues in our political system though… the mud slinging. We have 2 candidates who are playing basically for the same team (for lack of a better way to put it) and they bash each other so much and then they turn around and tell you “oh wait nevermind about what I said… go and vote for that person).

    • Otaku Fairy says:

      I don’t think age was really a factor either.

  13. Merritt says:

    I think a lot of people have no idea what the definition of millennials actually is. Millennials are people born from the early 1980s -early 1990s. Often the older part of the group born in the early 1980s gets excluded from the coverage.

    And the reality the younger part of the group often doesn’t have good planning skills. For example, many who are uninsured failed to sign up for ACA, because they aren’t currently sick. Then they get injured in a vehicle collision and are stunned when they now have tens of thousands of dollars in debt.

    • wolfpup says:

      I am a mother to millennials. Three children born withing 4 years of one another – now 34, 36, and 38, and then I have another child, born 10 years after that rush. Mother’s do not have their own life – it is focused on the children and their happiness. – at least for me, in my day and age. But the children, the millennials, are the ones that I have studied and cared so much for their happiness and well-being, that includes all of you. I loved my children, more than life-Itself, though they will never understand me, or why I live my life singularly, why I choose to be divorced, nor why I do not look to any man for peace.

      To the future!!! Whatever we determine as God, may we bless and bless One Another.

  14. AC says:

    “And I think a political campaign infused by millennials’ ideas sounds horrible.”

    Horrible? Did you miss 2008?

  15. Franny says:

    Is it really the message, though? I get the impression that DNC has been overrun by communications majors from Ivy League schools who are too focused on spinning a message. Their strategy seems to be to sit back and let the GOP step in it, while going on an outrage tour about everything.

  16. robyn says:

    Sexism played a role in how messages were disseminated. Bernie and Trump could yell but not Hillary. I guess she was supposed to sound like Ivanka with a sock in her mouth. And does anyone remember when Hillary had pneumonia and didn’t tell the press for a day and fainted at a 911 memorial service. The press went wild … you would have thought she murdered somebody while the whole time slippery Trump lied lied lied lied lied about pretty much everything.

    • wolfpup says:

      Do you think that our little girls do not notice? Are men truly better than women? They ask themselves this question and then try in proper time and circumstance to evolve. It takes great bravery to challenge men’s ideology.

  17. PoliteTia says:

    This coming from a women who held concerts in ‘Sun City’ when South Africa was oppressing and imprisoning their own people or color and admitted to smoking marijuana while, then pregnant, with the 40 year old man child that still lives with her.
    I doubt she has to fight the urge to tweet about politics

  18. Joannie says:

    I agree with her about your politicians being too old. Trump is 70. And he’s an elitist. How does he relate to the average citizen? As much as I like the idea of HIlary winning the election I think she was too old as well. Plus she’s had some serious health issues. In Canada both Harper and Trudeau both in their early forties when they won the election. Young enough to be open minded and put out some fresh ideas.
    Gov’ts get old and tired!

  19. Jenny says:

    a) They didn’t focus enough on working class issues, and actually let Trump get away with portraying himself as some kind of working class hero. He’s from the party who oppose universal healthcare and a decent living wage, wtf?

    b) They failed to understand how big the drug issue is, and that they’re on the wrong side, especially with Obama pardoning all those drug criminals in the lead-up to the election. Dumb move, as was apologising for the “superpredator” comment. The only apology should have been in the other direction, that it shifts the blame entirely onto the supply side and absolves the demand side of any. They took the side of the abusers at the expense of their victims. A little ironic given how many of Trump’s supporters are drug addled.

  20. AsIf says:

    I think that the democrats were “too old” is complete nonsense. Bernie attracted a lot – mostly – young people, he was the champion of the millennials

    • Vail says:

      Hahahhahahahaha no! But he fooled a lot of you. I take my hat off to the 70-something who made you heart him!

  21. Grandmasutra says:

    Let’s not forget Hillary switched up her message really quick when Bernie was getting all the attention. Hillary was a lifetime politician and let’s now pretend all those closed door wall street speeches weren’t cozying up. She wanted big money and she got it not that it helped her.

  22. EM says:

    It wasn’t the Democrats’ message that was the problem, it was the nominee. Hillary was always the wrong choice. She had far too much baggage and skeletons in her closet.

    • Vail says:

      2016 was, among other s@#$ty things, The Year Of No Good Choice. The way people suddenly adore Hillary now? EM is correct, she had to much baggage, and much of it was, at best, immoral. I still feel like we are all stuck in the most bizarre TV show or Movie or whatever and will wake up with an actual functioning adult in the White House. (especially if you know who is really going to kick the poor, the elderly and the sick in the butt as much as has been reported. My parents and sibling will be hurting so much, which means that an incredibly tragic amount of people will be hurting worse. This really is the time for The People, but changing your FB profile pic and wearing a lame “Feminist AF” shirt is so, so embarrassing and has helped exactly zero people. Well, the people who hate real feminists are happy since they are handed so much ammo so often.
      I really hope we aren’t ending like Rome. I always thought we would, but that annoying voice in the back of my mind kept being hopeful. I think I’ll just brace for impact.

  23. NEO says:

    LOVE her

    • Vail says:

      Sweetie, that is not a whole sentence. You love her or you would like us to love her?

  24. Andrea says:

    I am a female New Yorker living in canada. I have a loud booming voice and speak my mind. Some of my “friends” have told me to quiet down when I am out to eat at a busy restaurant etc. I refuse. This is me. I don’t care if some stranger overhears my conversation—they will probably never see me again! I refuse to be quiet about politics either and am very vocal about it. Sadly, most women I know feel it is fruitless and best to “marry up” to help themselves and their position. My father, as he has aged, as resorted to telling me to not curse so much, act like a “proper lady”, he dislikes my vocalness about politics and thinks the reason I am 36 and unmarried is because I am too much. I ignore all of that also. I am who I am take it or leave me. I have been told btw to enter into politics by many people, but since we have such backwater attitudes towards women still, I am leery to do so. We collectively need to make it be okay for women to have a voice and until we do, it will always be an old boys club.

    • Vail says:

      Andrea, being loud doesn’t make you right. It makes you tuned out. You should see how people cringe over That Girl – the one so desperate to show I KNOW EVERYTHING AND MUST TELL EVERYONE – in public. No one wants to be yelled at, especially over dinner. If your real friends are trying to help you by asking you to turn it down a notch? They are real friends.

      The quiet ones, the ladies and gents who listen and don’t do live re-enactments of Jersey Shore? They are the ones who have real knowledge. Why? Because they are listening.

      99% of what you wrote belongs in your diary, and no. I will never make it OK for you to yell at people, present no facts, and whine about whatever “it” is that is a boys’ club. Respect is earned. Look at the world and see who is respected – they are not the ones who paste memes into thoughtful debate or faux-quote Marilyn Monroe. STUDY. Read several newspapers. Don’t get your “news” from social media. (You might want to let people know where you will be loudly dining though, so they can miss you. That you can do on “FB”) Women should have friends – no “squads” or any of that crap. I would rather sit and listen at the Algonquin on a loop than read this silly cry for help. You have a brain – use it! You do not need to build a power base on a Blog! Be real, be present, and listen. You might be surprised, other people may see things from a different perspective and you can learn and grow.

  25. Vail says:

    Are any of you aware that the big hypocrite Cher showed up at Hillary’s “Victory/Bursting Through the Glass Ceiling” party, looked around, looked confused, and then left?

    And pandering to Millennials, grief. Did any of you even bother to vote? Or were you saving your energy for sit-ins? No one even remembers the “Occup

    This woman pretended to have an incurable illness (who does that?), thinks a 40 year old living with his Mommy (who hopefully invested her money well, when she still was paid to do… whatever she does, I just can’t take her seriously as a singer still) and is posing with one of the most pathetic humans on the entire PLANET in the photo above. Why does it matter what she says about anything? She is so extremely out of touch, uninteresting and worse, uninterested. Well, she does like Millennials!

    I guess if you like Kimmy & Co, the fact that they copied Cher’s 1970s wacky knee-length hair matters? I just don’t understand any of these people. There are no women in entertainment to look up to or even like these days, and the great men are, as I suppose Cher would say, “old”

    Bored now.