If youâve not heard about the protests that are happening at Mauna Kea, Hawaiiâs tallest mountain, The New York Times has a helpful overview of the situation: The summit of the dormant volcano, located on the Big Island, is the location of several telescopes because it provides near-perfect views of the night sky, thanks to clear air and little light pollution, at 13,796 feet above sea level. The mountain, which Native Hawaiians call Mauna O Wakea, is the location of several sites that are sacred or otherwise important in Native Hawaiian culture. The summit is believed to be where Wakea, the sky god, and Papa Hanau Moku, the earth goddess, met, leading to the creation of the islands.
For a bit more than a week now, protesters have been blocking the route to the summit in protest of the construction of yet another telescope, the Thirty Meter Telescope, which has been designed by universities and research institutes in Canada, China, India, Japan, and the United States. The telescope would be able to take images that are 12 times of the resolution of the images taken by the Hubble Space Telescope. The protesters feel that the construction of the telescope would continue to desecrate the mountain, and donât believe promises that it would be the last one built. On Wednesday, they were joined by Dwayne Johnson:
Dwayne âThe Rockâ Johnson joined native Hawaiians for a peaceful protest against a $1.4 billion telescope project at the top of volcano Mauna Kea Wednesday, according to reports.
âWhat I realized today ⌠itâs bigger than the telescope,â Johnson told reporters during the protest, which is in its 10th day. âItâs humanity. Itâs the culture. Itâs our people, Polynesian people, who are willing to die here to protect this land,â The Huffington Post reported.
âThis very sacred land that they believe in so powerfully,â he added.
Johnson was born in California but attended high school in Honolulu.
Construction on the Thirty Meter Telescope was scheduled to start on July 15 â the day the protests began. Demonstrators blocked the road and chained themselves to a gate at the construction site. On Wednesday, protesters chanted and danced the hula.
This is incredibly upsetting and frustrating. I can appreciate wanting to find the perfect site for a telescope that has the capability to take even better pictures of space than the Hubble Telescope, but putting it on sacred land doesnât seem like the answer. Good for The Rock for participating in the protests. The New York Times mentions that news of the protestersâ work is spreading and so is leading to protests elsewhere, including on the mainland; I only heard about this for the first time a few days ago, though construction was given the green light in late June. Maybe a lot of press will work in the protestersâ favor. Unfortunately, given how little concern the current state and federal governments are showing for land in this country, I donât see the protesters achieving their aim of getting the construction site moved elsewhere. If Iâm wrong, Iâll be grateful.
Unpopular opinion here…I’d like to see better advancement of science. Could there be some kind of agreement between the sacredness of the location and science?
There are other mountains in other areas that could do the same work. This isn’t the only clear area in the world.
Shouldn’t we have the scientific community working on climate change?
good point, I hadn’t thought of that
Sara – I think there’s more than one type of scientist
The land is not going to become unsacred just because scientists have an interest in it. I am all for the advancement of science, but there might not be a compromise before. This land has been taken advantage of before, they have been told “no more telescopes” before, only to see new telescopes go up. I believe this telescope will eventually be built, but I hope the scientific community agrees it will be the last one in this location and they find somewhere else to build observatories. Also, the various universities/foundations using it should be giving back to the local indigenous community, investing in schools and STEM programs and also conservation efforts.
I agree with you.
I understand the importance of the land to them, but space exploration has been a catalyst for invention, discovery ,and advancement here on earth.
Yeah, this isn’t the environmental issue like standing rock or constant musical reservation boarders based on what mood people are in.
We need to move forward right now, not later. I was talking to a friend recently about how scientific research progress has slowed to a crawl particularly on both medical and environmental science. Most green energy technologies like solar and wind and dead tech at this point that are bulky, expensive to maintain and install. We need progress, we need research and we really do need this telescope to further research into the universe.
I might just be getting bitter, but I’m over any religion based argument. I hear sacred and I don’t particularly care. I understand there are cultural overlaps with a lot of religion, and indigenous cultures are important to respect and preserve. I am just sick and tired of religious roadblocks to progress. I’m tired of religion in general, all of them. The biggest problem with humans is our proclivity to worship the irrational blindly to our own often bloody detriment.
Its a hard call because of the indignity indigenous people deal with regularly, but at some point we need to become science and fact focused and leave behind our chains of worship holding us in this constant stunted waring place.
Lol
This isn’t ‘just’ religion. This place, this land, is central to the people. The people are the people because of this place.
I agree. I think the telescope is quite important. Being an atheist might make it easy for me? I donât think religious importance should take precedence over science, ever. However, Iâm glad theyâre protesting. They are the indigenous people of those islands and the US has just inserted themselves like they do. The Hawaiian people have every right to protest. And I hope they win, but not because the land is sacred.
Yeah @anflex at this point if its a religious argument its an irrelevant argument that shouldn’t even bother being acknowledged. I’m all for them protesting I’m just not going to cape for religious based causes.
I’d say replace one of the current sites on the mountain not build a new one. If the others are so out of date why keep them? The issue seems to be that the scientists keep saying one more but it’s never just one. I think that would be a good compromise for both parties.
The different telescopes there do different things (not all are taking these types of images) and are fully subscribed, in constant use.
There’s an alternate site already chosen in the Canary Islands. They can go there. And I believe they will, because the only reason they didn’t start construction last year was because of the Hawaiian protests. They are strong. They will prevail.
I’m on their side. Hasn’t Hawa’ii been colonised enough? The indigenous people have had so much stolen from them already, let them have their sacred mountain. Would people allow a telescope to be build on Mount Rushmore, for example (I’m just spitballing here). Leave them alone.
Ironically, Mount Rushmore is also desecrating a sacred mountain.
You’re right that there are other mountains, but Mount Rushmore is sacred to the Lakota Sioux and has a history of being stolen and re-stolen from the tribe by the US government.
@Algernon and MrsBanjo, I stand corrected! That’s even more reason to leave the other mountains alone.
Excellent example, Duchess, just for reasons other than intended.
I appreciate people and cultures but I donât respect (any) religions. Word âsacredâ implies itâs considered to be special by a particular religion. And yes, science IS more important than madeup story created by someone 1000 years ago (i feel the same way about Catholic churches, for example). Now can the find another spot? Absolutely, Iâd hate the beautiful nature of Hawaii to be disrupted by construction
There’s a terrible history of colonialism at the root of this. Yes, they’re protesting partly because the land is sacred to them, but that land was stolen from them in the first place. “Because science” is not a reason to continue taking those lands.
That’s really at the core of this. The Hawaiians are still angry about the overthrow of their queen & in the last several decades have been reclaiming and strengthening their culture. They’ve had enough of the colonizers.
I work for the company that is putting up that telescope and while itâs frustrating, the work generated from it is incredibly important. For example, one project will measures solar flares which will help calculate when atmospheric conditions on earth flare and could lead to early detection of such things as tsunamis – allowing people time to escape. It is a sacred site, but the work is to protect future generations of humans. Itâs not just to look at some stars.
Is there absolutely no other place it could be built? Anywhere in the world? If not, then what is this company going to do to compromise with native Hawaiians? Will they make any kind of conservation effort on the mountain? Support STEM programs in the indigenous community? Will they do anything to be good neighbors and respectful of the land they are *borrowing*? Science is important but scientists don’t live in a vacuum. They have been bad neighbors to date, perhaps while building this telescope they can ask how they can better coexist with the indigenous community in Hawaii, of whom they are *guests.*
Honestly, no. There are 7 locations in the world where telescopes of this magnitude can be paced to do this type of work. The work is so advanced that it requires all 7 telescopes to work together and the requires use of a supercomputer over years, sometimes decades, to perform research. There is some brilliant, Nobel prize winning research coming out of research from telescopes at these locations.
I read in the local papers they’ve got an alternate site in the Canary Islands.
@ Jessica
Then I repeat, what will the scientific community do to honor the land they are occupying? If they cannot go anywhere else, then how will they work with native Hawaiians to be mindful neighbors? There is an attitude toward indigenous land that if white people want it, they should get it, no questions asked. The native Hawaiians are asking to be respected as the custodians of this land. I don’t care how important the science is, and I *love* science, because there has to be a way to accomplish the science and also be mindful that this land is not theirs and they owe something to this community for using it. Europeans have used advancement and “for the good of all” for centuries to justify colonisation, let’s try to leave that in the past and find ways to move forward together.
In what way is this company compensating the native community? Are they making paid internships and mentorships for young people there? Are they creating grants and scholarships for local students to be able to go to elite universities so that they might return and work as scientists there?
What is being done to educate the current scientists about the communities where they feel entitled to work? Are the scientists learning anything about the people and their history? What are they doing in order to make connections with the local communities so that the local people feel respected, heard, and included?
I have a lot of questions, as you can see.
We do have a partnership with the University of Hawaii. Many of the PdD students work at this site and on research resulting from vast information collected from the telescopes (7 places around the world) which work together to produce brilliant research – Nobel prize winning research.
Also, the telescopes do not require onsite operation. Most are run remotely via computers.
How many of those PhD students are native? Any? No one is objecting to the science, it’s the stampeding over an indigenous community people are sick of.
For those interested, the following website should be visited to grasp some of the research being conducted with said telescope and the magnitude of the research being done. https://www2.hao.ucar.edu.
You know, Jessica, somehow the fact that those telescopes don’t require onsite operation makes everything worse. Desecrate the mountain & then leave?
@Jessica, I have a niece who is an astrophysicist and works on black holes using telescopes. (Don’t ask me anything else, I’m a retired history teacher and science was never my strong suit.) However, I can see both sides.
Yes, we need a telescope for this research, but it needs to go somewhere else. The Hawaiian people have had their land and culture taken from them at so many points, and I understand why they’re protesting. As another poster said, put it in the Canary Islands. I am not religious at all, but we have to respect the indigenous people of Hawaii. I’ve been seeing the video from Jason Momoa’s Instagram for weeks. I’m happy The Rock is now involved. The scientific community is not going to win on this, and it’s horrible publicity for the governor of Hawaii.
I hope the telescope gets built but somewhere else.
You answered my first set of questions but not the second:
What is being done to educate the current scientists about the communities where they feel entitled to work? Are the scientists learning [about the local communities’ needs, too?]”
(The second set of questions apparently got truncated, I know not why. But now you have the full piece).
Also, how many of the PhD students are locals?
Jessica, why don’t they place the telescope on Mt. Haleakala on Maui? There is already an Observatory Complex set up there, without further disturbing new locations.
Kitt Peak National Observatory, outside of Tucson, was built on sacred Native American land. A compromise was reached with the tribe that allows universities to do their important scientific work with the telescopes, on a limited area of mountain land, and also provides some financial benefit to the tribe. I wonder if a similar compromise is possible.
Iâve got to say, this reflexive pro science at the expense of everything else take leaves a bad taste in my mouth..yes, religion is almost always dogmatic crap, but people are allowed to have beliefs and things they hold sacred and quite frankly you donât get to dismiss it or deem it unworthy, especially if it doesnât infringe in your beliefs or freedom. As another commenter said, Hawaii has a long and ugly history with colonialism, and this attitude of steamrolling over people and their long held beliefs (especially when they are regarded as hokey, weird or other) just reeks of imperialistic bull. I am all for scientific discovery and exploration, but not at the expense of our humanity, and especially as there are two other backup choices which are almost as ideal.
Yes totally agree with you ! Some of these comments are gross. Hmmm let’s think of a popular Christian/Catholic location to tear apart and make a telescope or some other “scientific” thing…see how fast people protest !
Yeah, maybe just tear down the rest of Notre Dame after the fire & put some big ‘science thing’ there. How does that sound to everyone?
@me thatâs literally what I said, I WOULDNâT mind Catholic churches to be teared down for the sake of science. I would only feel sorry about the loss of architecture, though. Catholic church literally committed 10000000 crimes over the course of history and continues to do so. Now arguments about colonialism convinced me much more to root for Hawaiians and support the protest. (Again, not cause itâs âsacredâ, religions are bs, I stand by it)
@ BeanieBean
I’m still in awe at the amount of money donated to the Notre Dame when it burned…just amazed how quickly money was sent to Paris…in the billions. But yeah who cares about any other religion/belief, not important because science comes first (but only when it’s about non-Christian/Catholic beliefs)!
Thank you Nikki, I completely agree with you