Taylor Swift on Scooter & Kanye: ‘Trash takes itself out every single time’

Taylor Swift knew it was a big deal to be named Time Magazine’s Person of the Year for 2023. She understood the significance and she delivered one of the better interviews I’ve ever read from her. She does not come across as a girl-woman gossiping cryptically about who did what. She names names, calls people trash and creates a heroine’s narrative for herself. She also talks about Travis Kelce and some of the “fun” stuff – her tour, her tour film, how much she loves Beyonce. I thought this line from Time was important: “She’s the last monoculture left in our stratified world.” It’s probably true. Some highlights from Taylor’s Time POTY cover interview:

The breakthrough moment: “I’ve been raised up and down the flagpole of public opinion so many times in the last 20 years. I’ve been given a tiara, then had it taken away. It feels like the breakthrough moment of my career, happening at 33. And for the first time in my life, I was mentally tough enough to take what comes with that.”

Recovering from her Eras shows: “I do not leave my bed except to get food and take it back to my bed and eat it there. It’s a dream scenario. I can barely speak because I’ve been singing for three shows straight. Every time I take a step my feet go crunch, crunch, crunch from dancing in heels. I know I’m going on that stage whether I’m sick, injured, heartbroken, uncomfortable, or stressed. That’s part of my identity as a human being now. If someone buys a ticket to my show, I’m going to play it unless we have some sort of force majeure.”

Her success this year happened because of all of the bad sh-t: “It’s not lost on me that the two great catalysts for this happening were two horrendous things that happened to me. The first was getting canceled within an inch of my life and sanity. The second was having my life’s work taken away from me by someone who hates me.”

1989 was her “imperial phase”: She didn’t realize it would also give her much farther to fall. Public sentiment turned—sniping about everything from her perceived overexposure to conspiracy theories about her politics. “I had all the hyenas climb on and take their shots.”

The Canceling, aka the Kanye-Kim issue in 2016: She felt it was “a career death. Make no mistake—my career was taken away from me. You have a fully manufactured frame job, in an illegally recorded phone call, which Kim Kardashian edited and then put out to say to everyone that I was a liar. That took me down psychologically to a place I’ve never been before. I moved to a foreign country. I didn’t leave a rental house for a year. I was afraid to get on phone calls. I pushed away most people in my life because I didn’t trust anyone anymore. I went down really, really hard.”

On Scooter Braun: “With the Scooter thing, my masters were being sold to someone who actively wanted them for nefarious reasons, in my opinion.” Swift rallied her fans against the deal, but still felt powerless. “I was so knocked on my ass by the sale of my music, and to whom it was sold. I was like, ‘Oh, they got me beat now. This is it. I don’t know what to do.’”

The Taylor’s Version albums: “I’d run into Kelly Clarkson and she would go, ‘Just redo it.’ My dad kept saying it to me too. I’d look at them and go, ‘How can I possibly do that?’ Nobody wants to redo their homework if on the way to school, the wind blows your book report away.” She began rerecording subtly different versions of her old albums, tagging them “(Taylor’s Version)” and adding unreleased tracks to redirect listenership to them. She frames the strategy as a coping mechanism. “It’s all in how you deal with loss. I respond to extreme pain with defiance.”

Kanye’s been canceled now & Scooter is losing clients: “Nothing is permanent. So I’m very careful to be grateful every second that I get to be doing this at this level, because I’ve had it taken away from me before. There is one thing I’ve learned: My response to anything that happens, good or bad, is to keep making things. Keep making art. But I’ve also learned there’s no point in actively trying to quote unquote defeat your enemies. Trash takes itself out every single time.”

Going to Chiefs games: “I’m just there to support Travis. I have no awareness of if I’m being shown too much and pissing off a few dads, Brads, and Chads. Football is awesome, it turns out. I’ve been missing out my whole life.”

When she & Travis Kelce started: “This all started when Travis very adorably put me on blast on his podcast, which I thought was metal as hell. We started hanging out right after that. So we actually had a significant amount of time that no one knew, which I’m grateful for, because we got to get to know each other. By the time I went to that first game, we were a couple. I think some people think that they saw our first date at that game? We would never be psychotic enough to hard launch a first date. When you say a relationship is public, that means I’m going to see him do what he loves, we’re showing up for each other, other people are there and we don’t care. The opposite of that is you have to go to an extreme amount of effort to make sure no one knows that you’re seeing someone. And we’re just proud of each other.”

She knows her life can be chaotic, but whatever: “Over the years, I’ve learned I don’t have the time or bandwidth to get pressed about things that don’t matter. Yes, if I go out to dinner, there’s going to be a whole chaotic situation outside the restaurant. But I still want to go to dinner with my friends. Life is short. Have adventures. Me locking myself away in my house for a lot of years—I’ll never get that time back. I’m more trusting now than I was six years ago.”

[From Time]

I don’t want Tree Paine on my ass, but Taylor is addicted to trying to rewrite what happened between herself, Kanye and Kim and that’s all I’ll say. Now, Taylor has every right to gloat and “trash takes itself out every single time” is one of the most terrifically bitchy lines to use in this situation. Although… while Kanye has effectively taken himself out like the Nazi trash he is, Kim is actually thriving. Scooter is still a mega-successful music industry professional as well, although it’s clear that he’s not going to be a hands-on manager anymore.

As for the rest of it – I’m glad she clarified that she and Travis were spending time together long before she turned up at her first Chiefs game. I’m also glad that her mindset is “I’m going to live my life and do what I want to do, chaos be damned.” The self-aware queen has turned into the IDGAF queen.

Covers courtesy of Time Magazine.

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143 Responses to “Taylor Swift on Scooter & Kanye: ‘Trash takes itself out every single time’”

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  1. Brassy Rebel says:

    She’s almost unrecognizable in these photos. That explains why when I briefly saw them on television yesterday announcing the POTY, I said, “Who the hell is that?” She’s all glammed up like a classic movie star. Love it!

    • Mimi says:

      She has really grown into her face. She looks great.

    • Kitten says:

      The pic of her with Benjamin Button is incredible but why not one of her two Folds? What happened to cat seniority? Offended on behalf of the Scottish Fold community!

      • Christine says:

        He is the unicorn of cats, the other two wouldn’t go for this in a million years. Like proper cats, LOL!

      • equality says:

        Maybe they didn’t care for a photoshoot and declined to cooperate?

      • NotClaudia says:

        Meredith would kill her if she tried to wrap her around her neck. Olivia too, probably.

      • urbanelf says:

        She has mentioned before that Benjamin LOVES the camera, whereas the other two… not so much. I think Meredith is the one that loathes the lens.

      • Christine says:

        As a Taylor Swift cat expert, of approximately 2 months, Meredith is the recluse of the 3!

        I can’t believe I know anything about Taylor, much less her cats, but I’m not mad about it. It turns out she is a lot of fun, who knew?

    • Lux says:

      @Brassy Rebel, Proof that the bangs can go. Really. This should be her new look, unless she’s trying to relive her twee “22s.”

  2. DaniLou32 says:

    I’m a big fan of Taylor’s music. I can take or leave her as a person depending what version of herself she’s presenting at any given time, but I am so over her talking about the Kim and Kanye thing. I really don’t think that it bothered her that much at the time. She rewrote it to suit her reputation aesthetic.

    • Bros says:

      Omg I can’t even with this hologram of talent. She is so far up her own ass and 100 full of lines her publicist spoon feeds her. Last monoculture in our stratified world, please, no way she came up with that, it’s above her paygrade, it came directly from headquarters.
      So she had to rerecord her music subtly differently. BFD, she will now make millions off the new versions. And the kim and kanye thing she had coming! I don’t feel bad for her at all and her recluse year is OTT. Her reimagined self as a victim overcoming so much adversity is ridiculous to me. She’s factory issued from top to bottom.

      • AnneL says:

        I don’t think she was the one who said the “last monoculture” thing. Wasn’t that the writer of the article?

        It’s not a lie that she kind of hid out and lay REALLY low for a long time, though. And that pre-dated the pandemic.

      • Elsa says:

        Why do you think she couldn’t come up with that word? She has a way with words and is a prolific writer.

      • Maida says:

        She’s not the one who said she was the “last monoculture in our stratified world” — that was the Time writer. I don’t cosign her view of the whole Kanye/Kim thing entirely, but I can also believe that it really did a number on her.

      • Sherry says:

        You are absolutely bang-on with your comments. I don’t know why so many people feel the need to defend her.

      • Kitten says:

        “It’s not lost on me that the two great catalysts for this happening were two horrendous things that happened to me. The first was getting canceled within an inch of my life and sanity.”

        Was this comment referring to Matty or the Kanye scandal? It seems like the author is attributing her quote to this past year so I assume Matty, but I don’t love the fact that she didn’t really address the valid criticisms.

      • equality says:

        I think she is over-dramatizing a bit. There were unpleasant things that happened to her. Saying “horrendous” is a bit much. There are people who go through much, much worse things.

      • Macky says:

        @bros she made me feel bad for the record exec guy. Taylor and her father set him up. Taylor father personally knew about the sale. They vilified that man for a narrative. Taylor team had the options to buy her old masters. Taylor has never signed a bad contact. It’s just messed up how they used those people to connect her to industry people.

    • Josephine says:

      I’m not a fan at all. But they did her dirty, and Kim gets away with being a nasty person all the time so I don’t mind her being called out. And I don’t think TS said enough to unleash her swifties on Kim.

  3. girl_ninja says:

    There is still a level of brattiness that she has that I cannot abide by. When she called out Netflix for a joke about her dating life made on the Ginny & Georgia series, she caused a lot of trouble for Antonia Gentry. Her rabid fans attacked her with racist, vile and all around disgusting . She talks about how Kim Kardashian’s call out “took me down psychologically to a place I’ve never been before.”

    Does she think that Antonia (who doesn’t have nearly the level of protection that Swift does) faired well during those disgusting attacks? She can really be selfish and sloppy. Lest we forget she dated a whole racist misogynists’. There is a lot to admire about Taylor. I don’t have to list them, but she really needs to work on that part of her character.

    • sevenblue says:

      That’s the hypocrisy I cannot accept. Her fans attack even Olivia Rodrigo, who didn’t even do anything to her, minding her own business. They just send hate to her way anytime they get bored. Olivia also talked about how much online hatred affected her mental health. She just does nothing while her fans attack anyone Taylor doesn’t seem to like.

      • Lux says:

        The OR thing really made me lose respect for her (along with the Mealy rollout). When Elvis Costello is happy to let someone live for evoking his songs, TS has to demand 50% songwriting credit for her and Jack. And get the Paramore chick in on the action. All while she herself has “borrowed” from Lana Del Rey, Hosier (“Don’t Blame Me” is basically the dollar tree “Take Me to Church”), Lorde and a host of other musicians. She’s as money-hungry as they come, despite being 0.000001% wealthy. Even her fans are getting tired of the vinyl money-grabs.

        That said, I do admire her for being cross-generational and enduring in her work. Whether or not we admit it, there is some nostalgia to her music, largely because it was simply unavoidable. She’s literally the most shrewd musician of her era.

    • sunny says:

      This! I quite like her as an artist but as a person she can be petty, rude, and selfish. The fact that she publicly dated a racist paired with how she has weaponized her white womanhood in the past is not great. She can also be smart and thoughtful, incredibly hard working, and amazing to her fans. It really is a mixed bag.

      In terms of working on her character, I don’t know how many people in her life are truly honest with her at this level of fame and success.

      • Brassy Rebel says:

        Working on her character now that she’s achieved this level of success and fame is not very likely, unfortunately. I think her character is baked in by now. And what you see is pretty much what you get going forward for good or for ill.

      • Beach Dreams says:

        Yup. If she’s still incapable of doing some genuine self-reflection at this point, she probably never will be. The inherent privilege she has as a white woman who was at least *very* well-off from birth + the level of fame she’s achieved and maintained from a young age…she’ll never feel the need to do or be better because she easily gets validation and excuses for whatever she says and does.

      • Ameerah M says:

        Exactly this.

  4. sevenblue says:

    She said Reputation album is “a goth-punk moment of female rage at being gaslit by an entire social structure”. It is like written by AI or she is talking about a different album. It is a love album, she said that at the time and the songs are the proof. I am guessing she doesn’t want people to think about how much she loved Joe, so she is also rewriting her own album’s theme.

    • Andy says:

      I think she is talking about the Reputation-Era-part during her Eras-tour concerts – not the album. But yeah also during the concert it’s not really goth punk music wise (maybe aesthetic wise though).

      • Arizona says:

        which honestly…. it’s not. she plays three Joe love songs and one Kanye song in that section, so it basically is just sick snakes and strobe lights lol. there’s not a whole lot of rage happening. certainly nothing goth or punk.

    • Macky says:

      I thought all of her relationships was fake but the way this all went down says to me she really loved or atleast thought she could build a life with joe a. She is totally rewriting history.

      I know think she cheated on him. And that she didn’t see the breakup coming.

      Which… I guess, means she was really obsessed with harry styles.

  5. Rani says:

    She’s just a spoiled brat. She can try to rewrite that Kim and Kanye biz all she wants, but she just can’t stand that someone caught her in BS and publicly called her out on it. End of story.

    • Lolo86lf says:

      I bet Tay Tay enjoyed watching Kanye and Kim’s marriage fall apart and how Kanye bullied Kim the same way he bullied her in 2016.

    • swiftcreekrising says:

      I’m not at all a Swifty, but the unedited video does give some context that definitely shifts the shade to Kanye and Kim. There really was no permission given to refer to her as a b*tch. There are a lot of things to find questionable about TS, but that one wasn’t really it. The racist boyfriends and problematic friends, the supposed lack of awareness that she was being used as a WS dreamgirl, the late and performative Q+ allyship – that’s on her.

      • Ref says:

        Sure, he shouldn’t have called her a b*tch. I don’t think anyone is defending Kanye, he’s disgusting. But the new version of the phone call doesn’t really completely excuse Taylor. Her first response in the original feud was that Kanye never called her to ask permission for the song, he just wanted her to promote it. That was a lie. Then she had her Grammy speech where she puts him on blast for taking credit for her fame when on the phone call she said that’s his truth, and that she’s on his side and that everybody will be shocked on the red carpet that she already spoke to him. THEN, her apparent concern was only the word b*tch. Taylor did lie. No one looked good after that call.

  6. Willa says:

    Idk. White, bratty. That’s what I got from that. Sue me.

    • Brassy Rebel says:

      😂 You’re not wrong!

    • swiftcreekrising says:

      Brats don’t become successful..?

      Emma Roberts? Bhad Bhabie? Lea Michele? Tim Allen? Shia? Charlie Sheen? None of these people’s names ring a bell?

    • Originalleigh says:

      @LOLO86LF – I’m not commenting on Taylor but there are and always have been plenty of successful “brats.” Do you really think all successful entertainers are mature and grounded? If so, you clearly haven’t been paying attention.

    • C says:

      Uh I would argue the entertainment and music industries have the highest ratio of successful brats versus probably any other industry or job on earth, lol.

    • Slush says:

      I think theres a big difference between someone who’s a bit up their own a** (which you can easily argue Taylor is) and someone who treats the people they work with like garbage (a la Emma Roberts, Lea Michele, Tim Allen).

      It’s fairly well known that Taylor treats her team, down to the truck drivers on her tours, very well.

    • Slush says:

      @swiftcreek – I think its unfair to bundle Taylor with the likes of Emma, Lea, Tim.

      She may be up her own a**, but she is well known for treating her whole team, down the truck drivers on her tour, very well.

    • swiftcreekrising says:

      I wasn’t agreeing or saying that TS is a brat, I was responding specifically to the comment that “brats don’t become successful” by listing a few very well known “brats”.

  7. SAS says:

    I eye rolled through a lot of it. Ironically, Kim could understandably write a “I would like to be removed from the narrative” statement at this point lol.

    And the digs at her ex just had me thinking, girl, get therapy. The fact she still wants to win this breakup so badly, 2 boyfriends later and 9 months since Joe basically dropped off the planet without saying a word about her is so telling.

    As for her saying Reputation was a “goth-punk moment of female rage” girl, BE SERIOUS! It’s an album full of gorgeous love songs! Just drop it already so the absurd rewrite of history can be behind us and you can write your damn Travis album.

    • Beach Dreams says:

      Yeah, all these pointed little comments and actions from her and her friends from last weekend to now re: Joe are a little much. Personally, I wonder if she’s even fully over him, because it doesn’t seem like it.

    • FeedMeChips says:

      This entire interview was extremely cringe worthy to me.

    • Snideysense says:

      It’s funny; I didnt read any comments as digs at her ex. I read it as more her acknowledging the reality of the fact that she and her current boyfriend both have jobs that require public performances on a regular basis (in Travis’s case, weekly), and they’re both getting a lot of attention just by showing up to see each other do those jobs. But they’re not going to stop showing up for each other just because they’re getting attention for doing it. I didn’t read a dig in that at all- she was answering a question from the interviewer.

      • Arizona says:

        the point about how you have to go out of your way to hide a relationship and that it’s just her and Travis being proud of each other was one hundred percent a dig.

      • Snideysense says:

        @Arizona, I still don’t read it that way. Travis has a much more visible job, at least in the US, than Joe ever did. He’s literally on TV playing a game every single week. If she weren’t supporting him, it would be far more evident than just not going to a film premiere here or there or not doing a pap stroll. She would have had to make a concerted effort to just not be at his games. She’s chosen not to do that. Not every decision in one relationship is a direct dig at a previous relationship. I think people are maybe looking for insults where there aren’t any.

    • NotClaudia says:

      All of this! I don’t think she’s over Joe…

  8. Amy T says:

    I love that she’s wearing her cat.

  9. Amy Bee says:

    Her career wasn’t taken away from here. If it was she wouldn’t be where she is now. I don’t know there’s something about the way she expresses herself that rubs me the wrong way.

    • VilleRose says:

      Well, she felt like her career was taken away, that nobody ever wanted to hear from her again. Taylor is (or used to be anyways) deeply insecure, she wanted to be liked and sought validation from being liked. She became very overexposed during the 1989 era, Girl Squad, Calvin Harris, Tom Hiddleton, Taymerica July 4th party. She posted a lot of personal pics on her IG back then, now it is much more music/career focused. People were sick and tired of her playbook, which was to play the victim in every single breakup she had and blame the ex-boyfriend and then write songs about the breakup. It became a very predictable pattern and came across as very juvenile too. And so when the whole Kanye/Famous song scandal happened, people were only too happy to pile on and tell her she was a snake. She became very hated when she was used to being America’s sweetheart. I think it was a reality check that nothing lasts forever and that she knows that public opinion can turn on a dime.

      • Lux says:

        Plus the fact that “Lover” wasn’t the most well-received, for her standards. And then the pandemic hit. It’s not nearly as dramatic as she made it out to be, but I can see her being concerned about never being on top again.

  10. Meg says:

    I love the whole piece! The “are you not entertained” part killed me. I feel like it’s the most she’s ever let people into her production of celebrity self. Super fascinating! Sam Lansky is a great writer. Also, I’m so impressed Benjamin the cat let her pose like that with him. My cat would kill me.

    • Andy says:

      Yeah. I liked the piece as well. Especially the *Trash takes itself out every single time*-part, which I think is also her calling Kim trash. Reminds me of Long Story Short. “You nemesis will defeat themselves before you get the chance to swing”.

  11. Newt says:

    I wish she’d move on from the Kanye and Kim thing too. I think the truth is somewhere in the middle and her hands are probably not entirely clean either. But…it’s obvious the situation did a number on her psychologically. I remember she just vanished from public view. She was just GONE. Which was the best reaction/thing to do. And I wish she’d just not talk about it anymore. Move on. You’re HUGELY successful. GLOBALLY. Let that shit that happened what….7-8 years ago go girl. You’re at the top of the mountain!

    • Andy says:

      It might be part of her reminding people (also her Gen Z fans who were very young 7 years ago) about the months before Reputation album was released – so that people get into the mood for Reputation TV.

    • SAS says:

      Yes, it clearly messed her up at the time but this many years later when we’ve all globally gone through so much worse and all parties are squabbling billionaires at this point, it’s an insane issue to plead sympathy over now. Weird that she went in so hard over it, kind of embarrassingly tone deaf.

  12. AnneL says:

    I never followed the whole thing with her and Kimye when it happened, so I’m not getting into that aside from observing that yes, Kanye really is a jackass. And if she says she felt knock-out after that period in her life and was in a bad place? I believe her. It makes sense. I’m glad she’s feeling more like herself again.

    Love the cat picture! She has three cats and I think Benjamin is the only one who would let her wear him like that. Gorgeous kitty.

    I like hearing about her process for preparing for the tour. She really is a hard worker and does her best to give her fans a great show. For all that we see Taylor holding cocktails and wine in some of her public outings while on break, I can see her abstaining while actually rehearsing and touring. I also loves that she admits dancing isn’t her strong suit. It’s not, but that’s OK.

    The “Dads, Brads and Chads” line is funny. There are definitely a lot of butthurt bros complaining about her being shown at games, or even about that fact that Kelce is dating her at all. Haters gonna hate.

    • Meg says:

      I LOVED the “dads, brads, and chads” line. While I’m not convinced she’s right that football is entertaining, I loved that whole section of the article.

      • AnneL says:

        I don’t find football all that entertaining either. But I guess when you go to the games and someone you care about is actually playing, it’s easier to get in the spirit of it. I learned to appreciate baseball a lot more after my son played in an intense local little league for five years.

      • Lucy says:

        That is a great line. I’ve been able to enjoy football this year for the first time in a long time. Coach Prime and his first few games made college football fun for me again, and listening to the Kelce brothers podcast (started to see what the hype about the podcast was, now listen every week) has made me actually enjoy watching games again. The fact that I’m a lifelong cowboys fan who’s now sort of rooting for the eagles tells you how charming they are.

      • Brassy Rebel says:

        If she cares about TK, she should be urging him to get out while he still has functioning brain cells. It may be entertaining, but it’s also very bad for one’s general well being.

    • VoominVava says:

      I don’t know if you ever saw the Kanye music video he made to go with that song, but it was disgusting. He had a fake realistic Taylor robot thing in it completely naked .. he had Trump and a few other people too, but it was so gross and misogynistic and almost like revenge porn-ish. I was firmly on Taylor’s side after that, I can’t imagine how that felt.

      • AnneL says:

        I only found out about the naked Taylor mannequin today. Apparently he did something similar with Rihanna? That is truly disgusting and I can’t blame anyone, not even someone as famous as either Taylor or Rihanna, if they were shaken by it. Just the fact that he did that makes me inclined to fault him in the entire situation.

        People call out Taylor for her white privilege, which is fair. But I don’t think she abused it to nearly the extent that Kanye has abused his male privilege. I’m not a big fan of Kim K but I don’t get what she ever saw in him or why she thought he was worthy of her.

  13. Valentina says:

    This is her first major interview in years, so it’s natural to mention some topics that happened in the past. It’s not like Taylor was bringing up Braun and West all the time, she wasn’t.

    • AnneL says:

      True. I mean, she herself admits that she holds grudges. She has a long memory and it serves her well in writing new music. She still feels how she feels about it, but as you said, she doesn’t go around talking about it all the time. Like you said, this was a major interview. It’s not unlikely that he asked her about it.

    • Betsy says:

      Agreed. I think a lot of people, many who profess to be “over” her or who claim not to like her at all, spend so much time thinking about her and situations and talking about her and obsessing over her and they then attribute all that psychic energy spent to her.

      I don’t like the Kardashians. So my strategy is to not ever click on articles about them, or spend a lot of time talking and thinking about them, imagining what they’d be saying, etc. They don’t need my energy.

      • Lilly (with the double-L) says:

        Yes, I don’t click on any of the K’s and I’m sure she was asked. There’s dislike for many I like, unapologetically like (e.g. JLo). But, I get why often others don’t feel the same and people aren’t the same, thankfully. I think we’re in a tabloid-y upswing and mindset, though. Things become so one way and there’s either love or hate. Of course, some never likes are justifiable and I can hold a grudge. But, I love Taylor at this point. Mainly because when I was talked into taking baby girl girl to her movie, she said because Taylor advocates for LGBTQ+ people and voting (she’s 8) and I appreciate this.

      • AnneL says:

        I have nothing against them but I don’t understand why people find them so compelling. My sister, who basically doesn’t own a TV and is not into pop culture in the slightest, falls asleep watching them on her laptop. I discovered that this summer when she was visiting and I woke up at 3 AM to muffled female voices arguing on the floor above me, lol. I told her she is never allowed to tease me for being a Game Of Thrones fan again.

      • Justwastingtime says:

        My 15 yo has been a hard core fan for 1/2 of her life without any aiding or abetting from her mom. I thought she was a good role model, but I never got into her music till folklore and evermore were released. Then we lucked out in getting tickets for eras tour and my daughter asked me to listen to the entire set list so I would enjoy the concert more. It was a revelation to listen to her evolution as an artist. And, I haven’t seen a concert that good since Prince (my forever top concert-going experience and an artist I have seen multiple times) .

    • Arizona says:

      she did a Rolling Stone cover when Lover was released where she went into depth about the Kanye call and Scooter, and then she rehashed both of those things again in the Miss Americana doc.

      at this point it’s been eight years and I wish she’d stop talking about it because there’s always been some … issues with her version of things.

      I love her but it’s frustrating. I’m guessing she talked about it a lot because the re release of rep is coming up.

  14. Beach Dreams says:

    If Swifties wonder why people outside of their fan base don’t buy into their Pollyannish image of Taylor, this interview is one good source. She’ll never change, for better or for worse. Reading her comments on feminism gave me strong ‘gaslight, gatekeep, girlboss’ vibes, which isn’t new for her.

  15. DeltaJuliet says:

    She’s got to be close to the point of oversaturation at this point right? My god she’s EVERYWHERE.

    • AnneL says:

      She’ll be going back on tour early next year and will be in Asia, Europe and Australia. So you won’t be hearing much about her then.

    • VilleRose says:

      She’s everywhere but this is what she used to be like pre-Joe Alwyn. People seem to forget that.

  16. Kathryn says:

    I like a lot of Taylor’s music, but my head spins when I think of all the identities and personas she has tried on and then often discarded – country darling, pop princess, indie angsty, etc. Not feeling this WAG phase at all, although Travis seems like a good person.

    • AnneL says:

      I think she kind of addresses that in the article, though. That female artists have to keep re-inventing themselves to stay relevant. She couldn’t stay the country ingenue, because the labels were already out there looking for next one by the time she was in her early 20s. If she stayed Pop, she was just a bubblegum princess. So she did Folklore which was a bit more Indie, etc.

      She has a point. I don’t think Taylor’s actual persona has changed that much, especially when you consider that she’s been in the business since she was about 17. Everyone changes and evolves from that age to 33. She changes her music to stay relevant and move forward, and changes her style a bit to go with it. But that’s part of the game she’s playing and trying to win.

  17. Daisy says:

    She’s still on the “I got cancelled” thing. Girl… you weren’t. Rich white people don’t get cancelled for petty celebrity stuff like that (and even actual crimes, let’s be honest). People were mean on the internet but she still sold albums like crazy. It’s the thing that annoys me about her. She’s always trying to make it seem like she’s an underdog, someone who has been wronged by everyone or something like that.

    • Justjj says:

      That’s what I was wondering. “Cancelled” where?? There was literally nothing ever “taken away” from her. She has been a hit machine for almost two decades now, she’s just hitting her stride but she was definitely never cancelled and buried or whatever she’s saying. Also, the ‘Look what you made me do’ video with the jewels in the bathtub and the finger gun I thought showed her level of petty… I mean, that was pretty low after Kim K’s trauma. I hate the Kardashian/Jenner empire and I think they’re all insufferable but she was really nasty about them for years, besides just bringing it up-which I agree is a little obsessive at this point.

    • Snideysense says:

      The interviewer actually addresses that in the article, I think in a pretty deft way. He notes that the album was #1, etc. and by all measures she never lost her ability as a performer to top the charts. But, the reality is that she *felt* canceled, and people have a right to their feelings. Particularly women, whose feelings and personal interpretations of their experiences are often invalidated (and we’re seeing a lot of that in the comments here, actually!).

      • C says:

        She can feel how she feels about her emotional experience but the facts about her numbers and chart performance are not subjective. Disagreeing with the way she represents that, for PR purposes, is not invalidating her feelings.

    • sevenblue says:

      She is using the wrong term in 2023. She got bullied, mostly online. It probably hurt so bad especially for a person who really cares about her public persona. Idk when I read “cancelled”, it reminds me of Janet Jackson. Now, she is an actual person who was cancelled. Not Taylor Swift or comedians still getting Netflix specials to talk about how they got cancelled.

  18. K.T says:

    People trying to rewrite history because they don’t like Taylor Swift. Kanye fans were hating on her and she had a lot of vitriol from many sides for a year. Sure she’s rich and privileged but she’s still and artist – finding a safe enough space for someone to create would have been really difficult. And she actually writes most of her music which is unheard of among most current artists productivity levels.
    I only now just listened to the full tape between Kanye & Taylor and it’s uncomfortable. Kanye was the full villain, monologising as an egoist, and he had the trashardians propping up his narcissism!

    • Ameerah M says:

      Both things can be true: Kanye can be awful and Taylor could be someone who enjoys always playing the victim and commodifying that.

      • AnneL says:

        To be fair, there’s a difference between commodifying the victim thing and enjoying it. I doubt she enjoyed having her heart broken by Jake Gyllenhaal, or being mistreated by Kanye like that. But it happened and she had to deal with the emotional fallout. Mostly, she deals with it by writing songs about it. And other people find things to relate to in her songs, which is one reason she’s so popular.

      • K.T says:

        Sure, except there’s two very different levels with Kanye being just the worst level of misogynistic evil troll at that time and Taylor being a lower level of situational narcissist.

        Also, ‘playing the victim’ is a term that is so thrown at women & non-white people – I think Taylor is thin skinned and revengeful but in most of the cases that people say now… we’ll, I find the call out of Kimye & Scooter Braun is deserved.

      • Ameerah M says:

        I’m Black hun. And a woman. And Taylor’s special brand of white female victimhood is especially obvious to me for those very reasons.

  19. Twin Falls says:

    “It is literally impossible to be a woman. Like, we have to always be extraordinary, but somehow we’re always doing it wrong.”

    • Mabs A'Mabbin says:

      It’s revolting how women treat each other in light of the horrors women face already.

    • Slush says:

      so much this. Some of these comments are absolutely wild to me.

      • VoominVava says:

        Me too. I am surprised at the vitriol towards her. I’ve been reading about her article and tour on Lainey’s new blog The squawk and the commenters there are so respectful. I don’t think Taylor is perfect by any means but I respect her talent and I try to remember she’s a human being in a fishbowl. If we have respect for Meghan for going through what she did, and being constantly scrutinized maybe we can find some of that understanding for Taylor and other women in these situations. (and I know there was a race element to the Meghan hate, but the misogyny is what I’m referring to here.)

  20. Ciotog says:

    If she never hard launches a first date that means she and Matty were a thing for much longer too.

    • SH says:

      No, it doesn’t mean that because Taylor and Matty’s first date occured all the way back in 2014 when they had a brief fling. As people often choose to do she rebounded with someone she previously dated, a known quantity, after getting out of a long relationship. Matty had the feature of having complained about being emasculated by her frame back then after their fling ended so he lost all right to complain about her fame if he was pursuing her again. She didn’t alter her life at all for him and as soon as he had to go back on tour it was over.

  21. QuiteContrary says:

    As a champion grudge-holder, I can relate to her talking about her old grudges LOL.

  22. Silent Star says:

    Knowing that this article is a huge opportunity for her PR, I would definitely take parts of it with a grain of salt, but her clear description of what happened with Kim and the allegedly doctored recording makes me think that part is true, because if it’s a lie it would be libel, and I doubt Taylor, her handlers or the magazine would put her in such an openly libelous situation.

  23. Eowyn says:

    The pinnacle of white mediocrity. Middling talent, can barely hold a note. Incapable of writing about anything beyond her own experience. This is what gets raised to superstar status. I miss people writing about things beyond themselves, and writing about themselves with some maturity, wit, and insight. The most shallow 80’s pop was more interesting due to the humour and implied wink. She’s tedious.

    • Justwastingtime says:

      She is way beyond the point of just writing about her own experiences … check out her pandemic era albums. If you are going to criticize, please be accurate.

      • Slush says:

        THIS. It is so wild to me when people call her untalented or insult her writing skills. You certainly dont have to like her music, but it always annoys me how people are so willing to call people (mostly women artists) untalented.

        It reminds me of every white man I know who says Beyonce is untalented. No, she’s very talented artist, you just dont like her work (or in Tays case, you may not like her as a person) and that’s totally valid – but theres a huge difference between those two things

      • VoominVava says:

        It’s so funny when people think a few radio hits are all that an artist is. I have been a lifelong Sinead O’Connor fan and her songs that no one knows are my favourite ones.. Listen to a full album before making judgement.. whether the lyrics or genre speak to you, if you step back maybe you can at least appreciate the talent.

    • CaptainCrunch says:

      white mediocrity Indeed. At this point, this has traveled into Cult of Personality territory.

      • Becks1 says:

        I always like to come into the Taylor posts because the cult of personality cracks me up. I love when someone suggests she’s not the greatest songwriter who ever lived (see above comments.)

        I think shes a great businesswoman and obviously a good entertainer. Greatest songwriter ever? No.

        (also, I laugh every time someone mentions her 3 hour concerts. Bruce Springsteen would like a word – without costume changes, and with 40 years on her.)

      • VoominVava says:

        Have you written a song? As a songwriter myself, I wonder how easy people (that don’t do it) think it is. She has a natural ability and her own style.. she won me over with Midnights. Fantastic album.

      • Justjj says:

        You don’t have to like her but she is undeniably talented and has a prodigious understanding of music.

  24. VilleRose says:

    I’ve always enjoyed Taylor’s songs, though I’ve always been very wary of Taylor’s persona. She strikes me as someone who is amazing to have in your life if you’re on her good side. But if you cross her or if you do anything she perceives as a slight (she’s very sensitive and thin skinned, that much is obvious), she will be a Mean Girl and bring that drama into her songs and never let it go.

    I think we are all a bit tired of revisiting the Kim Kardashian/Kanye/Famous era but it was deeply traumatizing to Taylor and I think it was the first time her public image took a huge fall the way it did (her music did just fine). It was clearly a turning point and left a deep psychological impact which is why she revisits it so often in interviews and wrote a bunch of songs to process it. I would like to stop hearing about it so often, given Taylor has had so many successes since and Kanye pretty much made himself a has been with his ridiculous antics. I am not a Kim fan either and Kim never did apologize for what she did or receive similar backlash, even when people found out the video had been deeply edited. I think it deeply irks Taylor that Kim walked away from that scandal basically without any blame.

  25. Diamond Rottweiler says:

    This 33 yr old woman is paid obscene amounts of money to channel the inner life of the most EXTRA girl in your sophomore class, the one who’s read waaaaay too much Plath (speaking as the girl who also read waaaay too much Plath lol). I don’t see much motivation for that to change for her. People seem to like the formula. Though I do wonder how this ages. But yeah, mature self awareness isn’t part of the marketing plan.

  26. Eowyn says:

    I’ll be beyond thrilled if people move on from stan culture and multiple aspects of the industry find themselves stalled out with few ideas on moving forward. Maybe then artists will find ways to make inroads and gain recognition for their diverse and unique talents once again.

  27. bettyrose says:

    Daily Kos posted an article that basically said the far-right now considers Swift the leftist antichrist and she’s gonna open nationwide drive thru abortion clinics or something. IDK man, she’s growing on me.

    • Mabs A'Mabbin says:

      I know right?

    • AnneL says:

      A few also accused her of literally summoning demons during one of the songs from “Folklore” on the eras tour. Something about the orbs? She’s been called a literal witch plenty of times. They say it like it’s a bad thing!

  28. kindkaren says:

    As a child of mental & physical abuse, I understand what she’s doing standing up to her perceived opponents and coming out fighting. It’s a survival skill if you feel you’re going to be brought down, and at her age/stage an imperative in that industry. I can’t fault her, I did the same thing in my much smaller way/world. Eventually, I got to a place where I found kindness to be the best revenge. But she’s up against a machine of unimaginable forces. Tough and talented young woman, I’m impressed.

  29. CaptainCrunch says:

    “Trash takes themselves out every single time.”

    I wish her yodeling voice, white tears, shitty whining pop tart music and sycophanic fans would “take themselves out.” I’ve never seen such an overhyped garbage musician in all my life. Even Bieber Fever crazies aren’t as bad.

  30. JaneS says:

    I really enjoy the fact that Taylor fights back when men try to use her for their gain!
    She is talented, hard working.

    If she is now a Billionaire, that puts her in the Sir Paul McCartney level of music financial success. She must be the only female in the top 5 earners.
    Wealthier than Eric Clapton, Jimmy Page, David Gilmore, Pete Townsend, Phil Collins, Peter Gabriel etc, etc. I am telling my age with this, 62.

    More power to her. The womens lib movement of the ’70’s salutes Taylor Swift, IMO.

  31. Dee says:

    So many hating on her! That’s what successful women face! She took on the music industry, fought back against a successful artist who was awful to her. Kim Kardashian recorded her phone call without her knowledge. Taylor objected to the part about calling her a bitch. As every woman has the right to do. She takes care of her people and supports the local food banks. It’s awesome that Time chose a successful young woman as their Person of the Year.

  32. Gem says:

    Love her, hate her….she is at the top of the world at the moment. I liked this interview….of course, in her narrative she is the battle hardened heroine that slayed the dragons to win her kingdom back. Its exactly how I’d brag too if I had her level of fame, success and worldwide clout. I like how this was bitchy, harsh, unapologetic interview. She is not perfect but I prefer this over the sweet as honey persona she had in her early career. I hope she and Travis make it all the way. They suit each other well.

    • kirk says:

      Never paid much attention to TS in her earlier ‘eras’. But started listening to folklore? evermore? (forgot which) in the background while working at home in pandemic. She’s prolific, and she spreads the wealth! The most interesting thing in the article was how she prep’d for the current tour 6-months in advance by singing the entire set list daily while running or walking on a treadmill. Wow!

  33. JaneS says:

    Taylor Swift is now a billionaire.
    IMO, that also makes her similar to every male billionaire. Problematic, complex, sharp at business and SHE is a business now.

    The old line of a tough business man “being a tough man” vs. being a tough female in business “being a bitch” strikes hard here for me.

    In a contest of who has actual talent Taylor vs. Kim, we all know Taylor is the winner.
    Kims’ talent is PMK exploiting the entire family, including gkids, in every way possible to make $$.

  34. Elo says:

    It is absolutely insane to read the vitriol here against her. I wouldn’t consider her mediocre in the slightest. What she has been able to accomplish with her re-releases and tour is not mediocrity.
    You might not like her music but objectively it isn’t bad. She writes her own song, plays guitar, sings, performs.
    Not liking her as a person doesn’t mean she’s mediocre either. She is a savvy business woman who has established and maintained a career for over two decades, that’s not exactly mediocre.
    Geeze if Taylor Swift is mediocre what am I?
    This comment section is gross.

    • Snideysense says:

      I agree. The comments in general on this site have become pretty gross in general lately. A lot of knee-jerk misogyny and nasty hot takes. The posts on Taylor over the last few days have been pretty eye-opening to read — the vitriol is nuts. Between this and the near-constant focus on the BRF, I kind of feel like this site has lost a lot of what used to make it a genuinely entertaining, thought provoking place to be.

      • M says:

        Amen re: the comments on this story, and any Swift-related items. It’s disgusting.

      • sparrow says:

        I know nothing about her but I love her song No Body No Crime, which is on my bike playlist, and August. My problem is, I feel unless I research all there is to know about someone, particularly an American celebrity, I am out of my depth and get jumped on! I remember this site from years ago. There was lots more general celebrity stuff. I still like it here but I am very protective of what I say and there are posts I don’t open because I know my opinions would be chased off the page! In a way, the only pages I feel comfortable on are the BRF pages because, as a Brit, I feel I know it. Kate Middleton brings the worst out of me. There aren’t many sites out there that are nice about Meghan.

    • Christy says:

      Agree. The hatred in the comments on here is something else.

    • Slush says:

      Hard agree

    • Lux says:

      I would never call her mediocre. She would never be where she is if she was (at most, mediocre musicians get as high as Brittany before age cuts them off and they have nothing left to offer). I begrudgingly enjoy a lot of her softer, more folksy songs and see her enduring place in music and pop culture as a testament to her talent and appeal.

      That said, there are many valid criticisms of her and I’ve made a few myself. She can be tone-deaf (Matt Healy?), privileged, and vindictive. She can also be money-grubbing while being incredibly generous at the same time. While there are definitely out of line comments here, I don’t think most people’s dislike of her is completely baseless.

      • Bachy says:

        Taylor is not money-grubbing: she just wants the money she believes she has EARNED. She has learned to fight back when someone tries to rip her off or undermine her credibility as an artist or her dignity as a person.

        But she is not miserly: instead, she is very generous with her money.

    • Lili says:

      Hard agree. I don’t read BRF posts anymore because those comments are not healthy. As celebrities go, I truly believe TS is one with the fewest skeletons in her closet, who has faired unimaginably well through two decades of fame and all that comes with it, growing up in the spotlight and still managing to keep her head squarely on her shoulders. Who by all accounts seems to genuinely want to do well by others.

      And here petty commenters hidden behind anonymous user names scramble like crabs in a bucket to condemn everything about her success.

      I’m not even a Swiftie but I believe you can enjoy gossip without being nasty. If you’ve got nothing nice to say…

      • coriolis says:

        Agree on a lot of points made in the posts above. I usually read the site in the morning with my coffee and used to peruse the BRF posts, but I don’t anymore because the hundreds of negative comments across all the BRF stories were affecting my mental health for the day. I am glad to see this discussion of TS take the top post today.

    • Becks1 says:

      Look, I’m just going to say that insisting she cant be mediocre because she writes her own songs and plays guitar is not really the winning argument some seem to think it is.

      I can think her songwriting is perfectly mediocre while also acknowledging that she is NOT a mediocre businesswoman. And she certainly has learned how to maintain a……strong….fanbase.

      I think her strength is in her business acumen, not her songwriting abilities.

      • Vanessa says:

        But she has millions of fans who love her music and it resonates with them, she’s not selling all these tickets only because of her business sense. Honestly, calling TSwift “mediocre” is like saying the Beatles are “overrated”. How embarrassing.

    • Her Again says:

      Elo, you absolutely cannot say that Taylor Swift’s music “objectively isn’t bad”, because music, being a form of art, is ENTIRELY subjective. I personally can’t stand TS’s music. It literally hurts my ears.
      And I am NO fan of Kim Kardashian, but I am not sure that I believe that Kim & Kanye “framed” TS and “edited” their conversation. And I agree w/ Kaiser that TS needs to stop obsessing about it. No one cares anymore, except TS

  35. Quesadilla says:

    I think a lot of people need to look at the bigger picture. She was, what, 19 when Kanye interrupted her at an award show to proclaim that Beyoncé had the best video of all time. She forgives him and, allegedly, writes the song Innocent about him… which, I’m not gonna lie, I would be hard-pressed to do.
    Fast forward to the Kanye/Kim phone call where they edited things to make it look like Taylor agreed to something that she never did. And then Kanye has the audacity to put a naked wax version of her in his music video.
    I understand why she feels victimized, traumatized, bullied and harassed by Kanye. As far as I know, outside of speaking about the multiple situations, she has never once retaliated or done anything to him to warrant what he has done to her.

  36. AC says:

    I’m not a Mega TS fan. But I do like her music. She’s a very talented songwriter. I wished though some of her extreme fans weren’t petty or nasty which sometimes kills it. Esp since TS was also harassed and bullied when she first started, they should know better.
    However, I loved that her being Person of the Year triggered the MAGAs and even Musk… lolZ.. they literally cannot handle an intelligent and very successful woman who is one of the biggest influencers in the world. She has helped influenced many of Gen Zs women artists today(which IMO gives a good future for the US music industry). The Gen Z artists of today are more independent and has a better control in managing and making their own albums – from the song writing to producing their own songs, playing their own instruments, creating their own visuals, becoming their own entrepreneur, having their own voice etc without having to rely on someone like a Scooter Braun.
    Taylor is here to stay for a long time.

  37. bubblegum dreams says:

    Hmmm. So Chuckles didn’t get the Time Person of the Year Award huh? Must suck to be a BM journalist. A few weeks ago the were practically breathless at their own prediction that he will probably get it because QEII got it when she was crowned. Sucks to be you Chuckles.

  38. Arhus says:

    I really feel like she is making more out of the Kanye/Kim thing than it was. In no way was she cancelled or her career threatened.

  39. Magda says:

    So many comments and I haven’t seen a single one addressing the cover. What a horrible cover all around, no? Both of them, but especially the armpits one? Just… terrible. Who decided that was the best way to photograph a powerful/rich woman? And how many times are we going to have the discussion re: powerful men photographed in power suits, powerful women – half naked, before we do something about it? Not saying she needs to be in a suit, but this looks like a bra/swimsuit almost, way too exposed, why? Heck, even wearing what she’s wearing, it could be better with a different pose.

    And just wanted to say – hear, hear to all the comments and discussions above about what this site is becoming. The constant flood of black and white BRF stories needs to go. It’s killing the vibe. How many times can we rehash how much BRF sucks before we’re sick of it? Well, clearly, many of us are, and a lot of fun veterans left years ago. BRF stories are toxic, please, enough with them. Here and there, but not as a main attraction every day.

    • kirk says:

      If you read the actual article, there are several pix of her with more clothes coverage: corduroy jacket, denim shirt & turtleneck; dressy jacket with white shirt & vest; workout clothes on stage; sleeveless maxi dress. The pic chosen for the cover looks like her stage outfits – basically bathing suits.

  40. phlyfiremama says:

    I think she was better off just leaving this in the past. 🤷‍♂️

  41. Melissa says:

    UGH. Every time I feel a little bit of goodwill toward her she says a bunch of trash (ope!) like this. Kanye was/is awful but she was literally on stage getting an award and she almost lost her career after that? Please. She’s had some challenges but the way she lives like everything is an attack and she’s on the verge of LOSING IT ALL because people are mean to her is totally self-centered and out of touch with reality.

  42. Anonymous says:

    She should have better judgement of character at this point. I wouldn’t be hanging out with Phoebe Bridgers if I was her- seems like a shady narcissist if I ever saw one. She’ll throw her under the bus the minute she’s not benefiting from that friendship.

  43. Krista says:

    She publicly stated she never spoke with Kanye then got called out. Bye Taylor.