Yesterday, Bedhead covered Jennifer Lawrence’s new interview with Glamour Mag. Many of you thought Jennifer was obliquely referencing Kristen Stewart when Lawrence said, “I love my job. I can’t stand it when actors complain.” While she totally could have been directing it at Kristen, I tended to believe it was a more general statement about Jennifer appreciating her career, and never wanting to bad-mouth the industry. But! That doesn’t change the fact that Hunger Games comes out soon, and a lot of people will be comparing Hunger Games to the Twilight franchise. So are the stars of both franchises prepared for a throw down? Apparently. According to OK! Magazine (via HL), all of the stars of both franchises are in an epic bitchfight. Sure.
It’s no secret that Twilight and The Hunger Games are being pitted against each other, but now an ugly competition is brewing between the young stars, OK! mag reports.
A source says that Oscar-nominated star Jennifer Lawrence, 21, isn’t impressed with Kristen Stewart. Not only did she supposedly call the 21-year-old Twilight star “snooty,” but she’s also dissed her for not thoroughly doing her homework for her role as Bella.
“When I heard Kristen Stewart say, ‘I only read the first [Twilight book],’ I was like, ‘Oh, man,’” said Jennifer, according to sources. She apparently added: “I was like, for [The Hunger Games] book lovers I should probably read the books.”
“It’s like part of Jennifer really wants to overthrow Kristen as Hollywood’s young darling, and she’s more motivated now that their feud is pretty much out in the open,” Jennifer’s pal tells the mag.
So how does K-Stew feel about J-Law? Apparently, she’s not impressed with Jen, either — starting with her mug!
K-Stew has called J-Law “plain,” admits one of K-Stew’s buds. “Jennifer isn’t innocent, but it hurt when she found out what Kristen said,” the pal says.
“The whole industry is saying Jennifer is the next Kristen and Kristen doesn’t like that, but Jennifer doesn’t like it either; she wants to be her own person,” her friend added.
As for Robert Pattinson, 25, and Liam Hemsworth, 22, — well, they’re hatin’ on each other, too!
“I’ve never met Pattinson,” Liamsworth said, while adding he doesn’t really care for the Brit’s advice. “What do you say to someone? ‘Your life’s gonna change.’ Okay. Thanks. Cool.”
But a source says that the testosterone tantrums between the two dudes is worse behind closed doors.
“Liam feels like Rob should move over and make room for him,” said an insider, “but Rob feels Liam is just this silly, brawny ‘himbo.’ And Liam thinks all Rob can do is portray a sickly looking vampire and that there’s more room in Hollywood for the handsome hunk type.”
[From Hollywood Life]
LMAO. Just… awesome. And let’s be real – it’s all girly high school drama, isn’t it? These people are all in their 20s, and they’re all behaving (allegedly) like 14-year-old Mean Girls. As for the crux of all of arguments – I don’t think it should be a contest between these people, really. Liam Hemsworth IS a beefcake. He attracts girls in a completely different kind of way than Robert Pattinson. Sparkles is the glittery poet who will write a song for you. Liam Hemsworth is the beefcake who will lay some serious pipe, you know? Ask Miley. As for Kristen and Jennifer – I find Jennifer to be incredibly beautiful, with a to-die-for figure. And Jennifer has an Oscar nomination. Kristen has… um… well, she’s a very pretty girl when she stands up straight and you can catch her in between eye-rolls and lip-bites. Kristen’s talent, though, is… negligible, in my opinion. Who will still be working in a decade? Probably all of these people – but my guess is that Jennifer will be the one with the Oscar.
Photos courtesy of WENN.
Knowing nothing about either books or movies I have no idea what the link is between them other than having a lot of young “stars” in them? Someone explain how they’re alike or how they encroach an each other?
They are nothing at all alike, minus the fact they both involve teenagers. The Hunger Games is a story about dystopian America where kids between the ages of 12 and 18 are annual pitted against each other in a fight to the death by the government. The books follow Katniss Everdeen in her struggles to overthrow the Capital. Twilight is a book about an “outsider” who falls in love with a sparkly vampire and has his baby.
If they’re that different, why do the stars seems so threatened by eachother? Having nothing in common, they shouldn’t even be marketing towards the same fan base, so I still don’t understand. Unless the people marketing it are like “It’s starring young people, we’ll go after the twilight crowd because they’re young people and they like seeing other young people.”
In “The Hunger Games” Katniss is fierce! She’s a fighter, not a lame girl with a vampire boyfriend, waiting for him to fix things. And Jennifer is ten times better than Kristen!
Well, I must say that The Hunger Games series is way better than Twilight, though I haven’t had the guts to read this sparkly vampire-like thing in it’s entirety. And being a good books fan, I’d like them to be where they are. There’s no need to make movies out of them, with stupid “it” actors that won’t be remembered 10/20 years from now. I won’t be seeing it anyway, because I have a good memory of the book on my mind, I don’t want someone to f this up.
Well, exactly – Katniss would take 2 seconds to figure out Edward was stalking her, then cut his icy cold balls off with a Swiss Army Knife whilst staking him in the heart. Or at least apply for a restraining order!
The Hunger Games may turn out to be a steaming pile of excrement, but since it doesn’t romanticise an abusive relationship or feature Awkward McLipbitey it still hands Twilight its pale, twinkly ass.
Now this I love for many reasons! I loathe that average, smug Stewart. I get not feeding into the machine but for being a literal celebration of mediocrity she should be more gracious.
My husband was key personnel on Ginger Games, totally changed our lives in a lot of ways so I’m really excited to see it, more than any other film he has done. I forced myself to read the books s to support his career and I couldn’t put then down. They are not Tolstoy but its a premise not seen before. From all the work my husband did i.can totally say this film will be incredible. Nothing was done halfway, he had 80 hour workweeks. Thank god that Twilight is not going to be shoved down our throats anymore.
….but its a premise not seen before….
Hate to break it to you, but the Hunger Games concept is a rip off, of BATTLE REQUIEM/BATTLE ROYALE films[novels by Koushun Takami released 1999] released in Japan and world wide 2001/2003.
DVDs and books are widely available.
I think Battle Royale is more about losing Innocence. Since they were kids having to kill a bunch of their friends. The kids in the Hunger Games don’t really know the people they have to kill, and they are being trained for it. Same concept as far as kids being pited against eachother to the death, but the moral of the stories are different I think.
@BNF – i beg to differ. The kids in BR don’t know each other. The difference is that they all go to the same school, but they are the delinquents and the govt sends them off to an island rather than an arena to kill each other. The protagonist is male, he decides to work with and hopefully survive the games with a kid in the group he has a crush on.
And in part 2: the ‘winner’ hunts down the organisers of the games whilst also being declared an enemy of the state.
Changing the setting and adding more characters does not change the fact that the story and themes are the same.
eg Cinderella vs Pretty Woman – same story and themes just dressed up differently.
I haven’t read Battle Royal, but if it’s as compelling as the first book in the Hunger Games trilogy was, I’ll be glad to. There’s room enough for all! (And thanks for reminding me that I must get to the library and find it.)
Why won’t the comparisons to Battle Royale ever end? Nothing is 100% original. However, THG is still very different. One example is that in THG the kids use very old fashioned weapons or hand to hand combat and it’s a dystopic America but also kind of old timey but futuristic at the same time.
In Battle Royale they use guns and just more machinery and it takes place in Japan! (right?)
Suzanne Collins who wrote THG was a military brat. She lived in military bases all over the world and her Dad would drill her with Military history and the importance of peace. THG ultimately is a story about war and how it’s bad…Battle Royale is just a weird violent society and there isn’t a moral or lesson or deeper meaning.
That’s the best I can explain it. I feel like people are spamming blogs and boards with mentions of Battle Royale and Running Man to get their royalty checks and interest!
In every Hunger Games post, a Battle Royale fan has to pop up and claim its a ripoff. Its as annoying as the Brange triangle. Tales of fight to the death matches are as old as the Gladiator Games themselves; the only thing THG & BR have in common are that the participants are teens. Other than that, the individual character’s motivations, the government’s motivations, and the themes in total are different. THG is overall a more lean i characters (to the story’s benefit), yet broader in terms of theme, but to each their own. Im just sick of hearing it.
@THGfan and jesstar – Thank you so much for that link which is so misguided and clearly written by someone who doesn’t understand literature and how literature is translated to screen because it is clearly comparing BR FILMS to HG BOOKS, you both should be ashamed for a) taking that as the guide to BR books/HG books and b)showing YOUR ignorance of literature by deliberately NOT understanding that my comments are about the origininality of the story and themes rather than if the story and themes have been well executed.
Please, i bet you will argue that because ROMEO AND JULIET is shakespearean, it differs from WEST SIDE STORY which is set in modern 1950-60s. And to say that a story is different just because it is set in America vs the other set in Japan really shows how shallow you are.
I happen to think that HG is very well written, and should not be compared in any way to the Twilight books. HOwever, HG BOOKS and BR Books are so close that it is hard to believe Suzanne Collins denials that she was unaware of the similarities. Especially since those books were so popular in Japan when they were released in 1999 that they have also spawned a Manga Series.
Based on your ignorance, i am going to put up a page and link it to any further comment you have to make because this is not the forum to argue the plagiarism.
@THGfans ;- the only intelligent thing you’ve written is the fact that there are no original stories which is true and i am only ragging on THG for presenting as though they are original and especially because there is clear evidence that THG are heavily plagiarised
@LAK: Actually, the BR they are not “delinquents” they are an actual class of students who thought they were going on a school trip.
Where HG & BR have in common is that the government uses the events to repress their people.
@Roma- I am using the term ‘delinquents’ in the sense that the kids in are the bad kids in school. The books make it very clear that the bad kids are randomly chosen from different schools at a time to go on that special field trip.
WAIT WAIT!! please don’t start yet, I have to go get my popcorn!!! The Twi-Hards vs the Hardly Hungries.
This is going to be EPIC.
You nailed it!
I think the Twi-Hards are in school right now, getting Google alerts for “Twi-Hard”, and will be hitting this site viciously after 3:30 pm EST… Oh boy, I can’t wait…
This misconception that all twilight fans are teens just refuses to die. Teens are notoriously fickle, and have grown up and out of Twilight. Most Twi fans that are still around are older. It is such an easy cop-out to call all Twi fans stupid teens, when that isn’t really the truth. Teens now are probably more HG fans, because it has become a sport to hate on Twilight
OMG a Twi-Mom!!!
Pass the M&Ms please.
Wow you sound like a mean-spirited person. Enjoy the hating, it will come back to you many times over. It is possible to make your point without being insulting.
I just don’t get it with that Liam character. I mean, good for Miley for getting exactly what she wants, but all I see with that guy is icky beefy fratboy common dude. Eh,different tastes, I guess.
She should’ve gone for big brother, Chris.
@normades, well…she’s his wife so I can see how they might procreate.
@jayne: yeah and they got married like 4 months after meeting. This gal keeps on trading up. She goes from yucky French comic Michael Youn, to Oscar winning Adrien Brody and now 7 years her junior hot as hell Hemsworth. I meant WTF as is “How does she do it”???
I don’t actively crush on Liam, but if I had to choose between him and Sparkles, I’d choose the hunky beefcake… mostly because I just don’t get Pattinson’s appeal at all. In character, the vampire guy has a bit of a dark broody thing going on, but as a person, Pattinson is a big dopey-looking snore for me.
I am with you Jeneral!
I used to think the same thing about Liam, but now I just think he’s smokin’ hot. And I don’t think he’s as dumb as he looks. His bro is having a baby with Elsa Pataky (WTF?)
Opposite for me. I think Pattinson is really charming and funny, while Edward’s just dull.
Wow – this sounds like even more BS than that Pitt/Jolie article!
I’ve read some of those quotes before in other interviews and can tell you they are taken out of context. It makes for a funny story though. And as @Nomades said on the other thread… It’s the Mouth Breathers vs. the Nose Breathers (classic!)
Either way, they are all now part of the same studio (with Lionsgate purchasing Summit) so they’ll be feeding off of each other whether they like it or not. In fact, the HG folks may have to owe the Twilight people a little something because the premiere of the first trailer for the last Twilight installment will be shown exclusively in the Hunger Games theaters. This is Lionsgate’s insurance that they can get the Twilight crowd. I imagine that in return, the trailer for the next installment of the HG movies Mockingjay will be shown exclusively in the Twilight Breaking Dawn 2 theaters come November to try to finish with as large an audience as possible.
I dont believe a word of either one of these stories either. They really need to find better writers at that rag!
I agree. The tabloids all literally make things up out of nothing. I don’t believe any of this.
I totally agree. Love how they make it seem like Rob was giving advice to Liam, when the quote was taken from an interview Liam gave and had nothing to do with Rob Pattinson. As a matter of fact that interview is right here on this site.
Anyway, the tabs love a good bitch-fight. (As do I) esp. between women so I’ve been expecting this. What I do believe is that the comparisons might irritate some of the stars, once HG officially comes out, much like the comparisons between Twilight and True Blood led to some bitchy quotes from Stephen Moyer but for now I’ll say this is just OK manufacturing drama where there is none.
I have read the books of both franchises and have seen all the Twilight movies to date. They ooze cheesey but are thoughtless entertainment. The acting isn’t great and they seem mediocore.
I do not think this is going to be the case for The Hunger Games. I think this is going to be a well-made, well-acted film.
I don’t really like comparing the two but yes, it is going to happen. I have nothing against any of the actors in the movies they all do what they do and probably better than I ever could but I do think that the actors in The Hunger Games are going to be much, much better.
Sorry Kristen and sorry Rob. The truth hurts 🙂
I read the Twilight book and enjoyed them-but the movies…OMG they are awful! I almost got my ass kicked in the theater by the Twihards for laughing so loud.
The Hunger Games books are on their way and I can’t wait to read them! I know I will like them-and I HOPE they made this right!
the first hunger games book is good. Totally a young adult book=kid book, but enjoyable. Really easy to read you’ll finish it in a couple hours, it’s good. The 2nd book isn’t as good and I stopped reading it after a few chapters and have not picked it up since. Never even thought about buying the 3rd book.
As for the movies? The plots are totally different, but Hunger Games will have actual actors and not pretty people reciting stupid dialogue and looking equally dumb doing so. Ass Greene that was towards your crappy acting in everything you do!
Aww Kim once you get to the Quarter Quell the second book reeeally picks up. It ended up being as good if not better than the first. The third kind of sucked though.
I’m almost done the 2nd book and I think its fantastic. I’ve read it in just few days so maybe that’s the reason – I haven’t allowed myself to stop (except when I’m at work or driving, of course!).
I can’t wait to see what happens and start the next one. By this time next week I’ll be all done 🙂
Suzanne collins can write and create dimensional characters, that’s the biiigggg difference
Agreed. Katniss has MUCH more to deal with than just losing her boyfriend. Bella is weak and self harming. Katniss is much more deep and complex. I’ve read all the books of both franchises, and I much preferred The Hunger Games.
When kristen signed on for twilight she had no idea the movie would be life changing. Jennifer has already said she would hate to be as famous as Kristin Stewart…its not as if Kristen ASKED for like Jennifer clearly signing onto a movie that she KNOWS will be a huge hit. Ugh…TEAM STEWART!
Agree. Also, Jennifer auditioned for the role of Bella and lost it to Kristen. I havent seen any of Jennifers movies but I was not impressed with her acting in the trailor, plus she doesnt look very hungry to me. As for Liam, I saw him in The Last Song and thought he sucked and hes not that good looking. I like his brother better. I doubt their is any fued going on between them. Rob and Kristen arent famewhores so Im sure they would gladly step aside and have Jen and Liam take the spotlight.
She doesn’t look hungry? Actual hunger has very little to do with the hunger games competition. It that a veiled attempt to call her fat? Rude, much? And to say Kristen didn’t know how her life was going to change merely exposes the fact that she didn’t read the books and know about the OBVIOUS hype. If she had-I don’t know-opened her eyes, she would have known exactly what she was getting into. And yeah, it’s a real shame Jennifer wasn’t picked to play Bella and instead had to settle for a role that earned her an Oscar nomination and industry respect. I’m sure she’s crying herself to sleep at night.
I knew you Kristen fangirls would show up with the typical drivel. If you wanted to be objective you could watch “Winter’s Bone”. She was nominated for an Academy Award and is a promising young actress.
I think Kristen and Rob would GLADLY give up the spotlight, this alleged feud is ridiculous.
And as much as I suspect this HG will be a success, I find Jennifer Lawrence to be very smug, and not very likable.
I can’t understand why the potential success of HG is some sort of diss on Twilight.
I don’t think anyone was calling jennifer fat…but in the books its CLEAR the characters are incredibly skinny and she is not. Obviously Linney YOU do – otherwise why even think that? Ugh.
I loved the Hunger Games books and enjoyed the Twilight movies…I like both actresses and its juvenile to make this into some sort of competition. But I do NOT buy for one minute from the author to Jennifer to Liam to ANYONE that they are not eagerly looking for fame and success. Just like every other actor out there. If they truly did not care about fame or money they would do off broadway.
pretty sure any movie or book would be better than the twi-crap.
Hemsworth seduces you with his eyes, yum
I’d rather his brother seduces me with his “Hammer”.
LOL! And seconded! 😀
I can’t deal with Kristen’s attitude. I think she thinks she coming off “edgy” and to me she looks like a brat. Rolling eyes, slumping and lack of excitement in any of the press tours.
I read the Twilight books when I was in the hospital for 2 weeks so I had a lot of time to think about characters-and she did not even come close to how I pictured Bella. I thought the whole “older than her years that was the mom to her mom” character protrayal in the book was key to that character-and they just slide right over that in the movies. No depth/feeling like you can relate to why she does what she does.
…and right now Ashley Greene is fighting Lenny Kravitz. Because we all know who the real stars are. Snort.
Honestly though, having read both series, I clearly preferred Hunger Games. Katniss is such a better character than Bella. And I love the writing of Peeta- even though he’s the sort of perfect guy, he has flaws and depth. The writing really isn’t comparable.
I am 50 years old and have seen 2 of the twilight movies. I thought it might somehow be important to at least know what the hell they were about since the series was supposed to be so iconic (among tweens anyway). Mindless fun entertainment with some muscled-up guys (the wolves)but K-Stew is a wash-out in it. Very bland acting, a very weak character to begin with. I spent the whole time wondering why BElla didn’t just go get a life. I hated the thought that some young girls might be modeling themselves after her do-nothing portrayal of a young woman. I would like to go see Hunger Games when it comes out.
I hate the comparison being made between these two. They’re nothing alike! There really isn’t even that great of a love story so I don’t get it.
I really don’t believe this.
ohh you people are so annoying with the hate to Kristen, news flash, nobody though twilight was going to be huge, JEN and the rest of the cast know
what’s going to happen, so stop trying to act like they don’t want to be famous, that’s why they keep mentioning Kristen and the twi cast?? ohh and Jen didn’t WIN thre oscar, stop trying to pretend that this girl is the best out there
She is a fine young actress who already has an academy award nomination under her belt. It really is silly to compare the two.
“Twilight” was a hugely anticipated film series.
But…Jennifer Lawrence WAS nominated (just like a lot of other talented people..they are being recognized) Jennifer has the industry respect that’s for sure. Anyway, I think everyone has realized by now that the article written in OK!Magazine—you know, that bastion of quality journalism (btw, are these the same wing-nuts that are hacking into peoples phones and e-mails?) is pure and unadulterated horse shit.
yeha she was nominated, but it doesn’t mena she is without a doubt better than anyone, how many actors have been nominted without really deserving it?? both girls have critical acclaim, is just the Kristen haters can’t seem to get that. I really don’ get the hate she gets, she is not a famewho.., she is not Lindsay, she is quiet, and shy, you don’t like her movies, fine don’t watch, she gets hate for no reason
Kristen has made a lot of offensive comments. She’s whined about fame, but then gone ahead and signed on for another franchise and an ad campaign. She gives the same performance over and over again. If you like her, fine. But others are hardly hating on her “for no reason”.
Yeah, how horrible of Kristen to not like the paps following her everywhere she goes. What a terrible person she is. *rollseyes*
LOVE the hunger games…jennifer is perfect for the role…no contest she is beautiful and seriously talented…and she SMILES! Kristen always looks like she just sucked a lemon
Im sure the tabloids are creating the majority of this drama but Jennifer is way more talented, classy and grascious than Kristin. Not to mention WAYYYY better looking. She will go alot farther and have a longer career because she is thankful and doesnt complain about being famous like Kristen does. Kristen won the jackpot when she got Twilight because she isnt a great actress. Her 15 mins are up.
Never seen a Twilight movie nor will I. Kristen cant act and is painful to watch & the story line is boring to me. Hunger Games I cant wait to see!
Jennifer also has Nicholas Hoult. And I think he is like a young Cumberbatch.
Oh GOD … this story is too ridiculous to comment on, and yet here I am, commenting on it.
“When I heard Kristen Stewart say, ‘I only read the first [Twilight book],’ I was like, ‘Oh, man,’” said Jennifer, according to sources. She apparently added: “I was like, for [The Hunger Games] book lovers I should probably read the books.”
The second half of that blurb HAS to be complete B.S., because J-Law has said many many times before that she was ALREADY a huge HG fan long before she ever auditioned for the movie. So the second half of the quote would not make sense at all.
I have heard the first half of the quote before, where she called out Kristin for not having read all the Twilight books prior to auditioning. I thought the context I heard it in was actually regarding Jen being a fan of TWILIGHT, not referring to HG. That part I can’t recall though.
In any event, this story could not possibly sound more fake; I am seriously doubting that half these people have ever even met each other.
Smug or snotty movie stars turn me off more than anything…I don’t care what piece of work they’ve done, it’s who they are that also counts in the public eye. I respect actresses that are good, but humble, do not let fame go to their heads but who remain authenic and real. From what I’ve seen of Kristen, meh, maybe the Twilight films worked for her, but overall, I’m not so sure she is going to be a great actress in the long run. This remains to be seen. Although the same can be said for Jennifer.
Jennifer Lawrence is definitely more talented, but I actually think Kristen Stewart can be quite good in the right role. Into the Wild, Adventureland, The Runaways, Welcome to the Rileys…I liked her in those films; it’s just Twilight where she’s bad and that’s because the writing is so awful and the character so bland. I think she’ll be able to have a good career now that Twilight is over, or almost over.
I think its Jennifer who keeps shooting off her mouth on Kristen.Because she knows shes got nothing on her,she’ll never be as famous as her.Shes the one who likes to complain about people complaining about their fame,shes not that famous herself so i don’t know where she get the idea whats these people are complaining about.Kristen is already there, an A list actress,what is she B- the most.And shes too fat to play the role of Katnis,yes i said it ,shes fat,she can exercise all she like she’ll never gonna get rid of her fat.
And this is why no one likes Twilight fans.
That’s why we hate jealous hags like you too who follow and comments everything twilight and hates on Kristen.
Calling someone fat? I’d like to see your picture Twiggy. Dollar bet restaurants that serve buffet close down when they see you come up the walk.
P.S. – your goddess Kirsten looks like an unwashed crack addict at times
@say what you want :
I congratulate you for, at the very least, showing us what Twilight fans are made of. Please continue to enjoy your tween books and movies while the rest of us enjoy the grown up stuff. Ok, sweetie?
Kristen Stewart, A-list? Hahahahaha. Only if you’re 18 or younger.
Jennifer Lawrence, fat? Hahahahaha. Only if you’ve not yet gone through puberty.
Honestly, I think none of these actors has ever wasted a moment thinking about the others except when their opinion’s solicited in an interview. They’re all working, they’re all making tons of cash, and they’re completely different types. Sparkles and Brawny are not going to get asked to read for the same roles. K & J, well, one is famous and one can act.
See the video of Jennifer Lawrence dated today on huffingtonpost.com. Jennifer read the OK article and actually emailed Kristen to tell her the article was made up and Kristen replied in an email that she knows what it’s like to have stories “made up” about you. In their own words is better than speculation so check out the video disputing the OK article.
glad to see a cause really worth picking teams and fighting for after all these years of stupid *REAL* wars!
Jennifer >>> K-Stew. R-Pattz >>> Liam Hemsworth. Personally, I think Lawrence is more talented than Stewart, but I find Stewart more beautiful. R-Pattz is better looking and more talented than Hemsworth.
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The camp of Jennifer Lawrence is obviously using dirty trick in order to get noticed. People will watch HUNGER GAMES because of the story alone, obviously not because of Jennifer Lawrence. At first I watched TWILIGHT because of the story too, but after seeing the obviously adorable chemistry of ROBERT PATTINSON and KRISTEN STEWART, I fell in love with the couple too! That is why with or without TWILIGHT, Rob and Kristen still became very popular amongst the newest hollywood couple! And the fans continuously supported all their projects and movie assignments! I’m so disgusted with the dirty trick of using KRISTEN STEWART here! pathetic move!!!
IF, and I mean IF, this is true, I only have one thing to say…
Who the hell is Kristen Stewart to call ANYONE plain??