The Butler (or Lee Daniels’ The Butler) comes out in a few weeks, so Lee Daniels, Oprah Winfrey and Forest Whitaker sat down with Parade Magazine to discuss the film – this issue will be out over the weekend, I guess. I keep seeing the ads for the film on TV, and I swear, each commercial gets worse and worse. I think this film is going to be a hot mess. I think that all of the people involved – poor Forest!! – thought they were making an important film about race and the civil rights movement and how the movement is seen through the lens of presidential power… but I still think the film is going to be a mess. I think Forest Whitaker is going to be the “magical” butler who comes in and teaches the powerful white folk about civil rights. And really… no. This is like a kindergarten-version of history. At best, this is going to be like “What if Forrest Gump was a black butler at the White House?” I bet that’s how they pitched it too. Here’s some stuff from the interview:
On why this film brought Oprah back to acting:
Oprah Winfrey: Lee was relentless. I remember being on my mountain in Maui, where I go to try to restore myself. And he called saying, “You need to get ready, because you are Gloria.” So I did it to have the opportunity to work with Lee. I also did it because Gloria represented to me every woman of that era who sacrificed herself … never bringing her own dreams to fruition because family took precedence over everything. It’s a story many have not seen with black people in these roles, because usually we’re one extreme or another. But to see that we are people who love our children, who have the same aspirations as everybody else—I just love that.On using the N-word:
Lee Daniels: It’s a word I used quite a bit, until Oprah sat me down and talked to me about its power.
Winfrey: You cannot be my friend and use that word around me. It shows my age, but I feel strongly about it. … I always think of the millions of people who heard that as their last word as they were hanging from a tree.
Forest Whitaker: I don’t use the word. Never did.On whether young people today know enough about the civil rights movement:
Winfrey: They don’t know diddly-squat. Diddly-squat!
Daniels: I showed the film to my relatives … because I figured they’re the harshest of audiences. And my 30-year-old nephew said to me, ‘Did some of this stuff really happen?’ And I was very upset by that.On their experiences of racism, and the valuation of life:
Whitaker: I’ve had many incidents in my life of racism. I’ve been thrown on the ground. I’ve been frisked. I’ve been arrested so many times I couldn’t tell you. I have no need to talk about it.
Daniels: It’s a given. I can’t even get a taxi [in New York]. I send my [white] assistant out to get a taxi because I can’t.
Whitaker: The movie deals with the valuation of life, too. Like, whose life is valuable? Is it okay to take life? In terms of today, [the film] Fruitvale Station [of which Whitaker is a producer] is playing, about the shooting of Oscar Grant in the Oakland BART station, which just happened in 2009.
Winfrey: And the shooting of Trayvon Martin.
Whitaker: If you can’t accept that these things are going on, you’re living an illusion. So the question at this point is more of, how can we move the needle forward? Can we speak up? I think this film helps that in some way.
Winfrey: Yeah. But do we live in a land where Martin Luther King’s dream has been ultimately fulfilled? No. Has part of the dream been fulfilled?
Daniels: Yes.
Winfrey: [nods] Are more people judged by the content of their character than by the color of their skin? Yes. Is everybody judged by the content of their character? Absolutely not.On who they think needs to see this movie:
Winfrey: America.
Daniels: That’s good. And kids need to see this movie. I’m fighting to get a PG-13 rating.
Winfrey: This is your answer: People need to see this movie.
Well, the only positive thing that I got out of this is that Forest Whitaker was a producer on Fruitvale Station. So at least he’s part of one powerful film about race this year. All apologies to Oprah – who I’m actually starting to feel genuine pity for – but if you’re trying to tell a story about how powerful a script is, don’t begin that story with “I remember being on my mountain in Maui, where I go to try to restore myself.” OPRAH!!! That pretty much sums it up, right? MY MOUNTAIN IN MAUI. WHERE I GO TO RESTORE MYSELF.
As for the n-word debate about who can use it and why and how… I don’t care. I know that’s the controversial soundbyte that media outlets will use, but is it wrong of me not to care? I don’t use the n-word. I don’t want to use it. But I have music on my iPod with some lyrics that drop some n-bombs (Jay-Z & Kanye, mostly), and I don’t care. To me, the whole “but black people can say the n-word, why can’t I?!?” debate is just as stupid as the “but black people kill each other, therefore Zimmerman is not guilty!!!” debate.
Here’s one of the trailers:
Photos courtesy of Parade, Fame/Flynet.
Nobody should say it. It’s too emotionally charged. Miss O has a powerful point. That’s probably the last ugly word some poor men heard before they were hung from a tree.
But, I’m there with you on the mountain in Maui. Maybe Gwyneth was there????
I’m not a big fan of the word but I am around people who uses it quite often but without malice. It’s just the way they talk. At times I do say to them if someone of another race called you that word, you wouldn’t like it but for you it’s part of your everyday vocalbulary. Some would agree that I’m right while others say that word only has power if you let it.
That being said years ago on The Oprah Winfrey Show along with her friend Gale Oprah confessed that she did use the N Word. They both admitted that it wasn’t the right language to use but she did say she used it when talking with friends.
You mean you’re around black people who use the word towards each other?
..because I have no opinion about that. I would lose my shit if I heard a white person using that word though.
I work as an administration assistant for a residential treatment facility for troubled teens. Though I do not work directly with the youths I am constantly around them and they tend to use that word a lot. The population is mainly African American/Hispanics Boys and Girls with a few Caucasians. I will admitt that I do have a small amount of African American friends and AA co-workers that use the word in their everyday life and treats it with no more importance than a hello. Am I still friends with these people, yes I am, have I ever called them on it before as well as some family members; yes I have. I know that they are not using the word in malice but I also know that doesn’t make it right. But you can try to educate people until you’re blue in the face and it still will not change their minds. They find absolutely nothing wrong with that word until someone other than a Black/Hispanic person uses it.
I have friends of various races, my best friend is Chinese and her son is my Godson. I will be heading to Boston next week to see my friend who is Italian, then to New Hampshire to stay with another friend of mine who is straight up Republican. I said that to say this, Sometimes I think how would I feel if I ever heard one of them using the N-Word, would it make me uncomfortable even if I knew there was no bad intentions behind it. I once dated a soap opera actor who was White and he used the word with his Black and White friends and vice versa. I made it clear to him that he was never to think it’s ok to say that to me.
I myself refrain from using it but I would be telling a bold face lie if I said I have never used that word in my lifetime. It’s an ugly term but the truth of the matter is I don’t think we are ever going to see an end to that word. How can we when almost every rap song is using it. All races listen to hip hop and sing or rap along with the lyrics; do we think that everytime a rapper says N_ _ _ _ that the person who is singing along with it bleeps it out. Where do we go from here?
BTW I’ll be checking for you once I hit Boston. :).
Get a blog v4 -_-
Original Kitten- Do you know how much I like you? You’re great!
V4real- I’m like you, I don’t use that word, and I don’t let any of my friends call me that, but I do know people who use it in reference to themselves and other black people. I’d rather never hear the word in any form again, and don’t like it, but I understand why other black people use it amongst themselves, and why they don’t feel comfortable with white people using it towards them. There are articles written about this phenomenon and how it helps to take the sting out of hurtful words that have historically been used to discriminate against marginalized people. Disenfranchised groups have a history of reclaiming words that have been used to denigrate them. It’s like gay people using the word queer. Or Jewish women reclaiming the term JAP.
It’s really not my place to tell people whether or not to reclaim terms that have been used against them as a pejorative. Nor is it my place to even use an epithet that has been reclaimed by a group because as a person who is not personally effected by the term it will almost, always come off discriminatory and hurtful.
I totally agree.. Jay-Z, Kanye — even Gwyneth — using that word illustrates such an ignorance I can’t even begin to articulate. I hate that part of society sees using it is a badge of “friendship.” It makes no sense, it’s a terrible word.
I remember Forest Whitaker getting frisked by an overzealous deli employee here in NYC and it making the news—they apologized, but the store hada reputation of selectively choosing people to harass about shoplifting, It’s not a myth about profiling, and Forest was so low key about the whole thing. THe whole thing was pathetic.
Ultimately this word has power because of the hate behind it and what that hate has lead to. Truly the word should not be used unless it’s to describe the Webster dictionary definition. And that’s not a good thin) even if it is true to original definition.
Having met racists in the southern states I know it still exists. Having met my friend in college Toot I know African men still call each other that word as a term of endearment. The whole thing breaks down to me not having personal reason to use that word in any hateful or endearing way. I have other words for that. If a song like stated above has it it might be mentioned if i’m alone on my treadmill. That’s it. Oprah makes a good point. And knowing how terrible it was for her growing up out of respect I would nver sing those songs around here… If we ran together.
I agree, no one should use the n-word. Not rappers, black, white, or any other color folks, no one. It is an ugly word with an ugly history. Period. That said, Oprah? Really? Thought we were past the days of her in our collective face, telling us what to do, how to feel, etc. I wish O would take her self-righteous, narcissistic, blowhard butt back off the main stage. No one of my generation cares about her.
Keira
Are you 20 something? If so we could be in the same generation and many of us do care about Oprah. Not her TV show or network, but her life story is still relevant. Do not dismiss an entire generation because of your personal opinion. She still has many relevant points of view on racism, rape, abortion, and how to persevere against decades of adversity. She has survived all of these things. If nothing else applies she is to be admired for her work ethic.
I agree 100% with Florc.
Oprah may get a little self-righteous sometimes, but I wouldn’t call her a narcissist.
If if is TRULY that offensive, no one would say it. It’s impossible to take someone seriously who has a “do as I say, not as I do” mentality. Sooooo many blacks call each other that word, which I personally don’t even find offensive because it’s JUST A WORD, and it gives it such a taboo power that is just ridiculous. The more excitable people get about it, the more strength to hurt it has. If everyone displayed more tolerance and ignored the things in life that CANNOT hurt you unless you allow them to, we would all be better off.
Um, its not your place to tell black people how to feel about the N-word. Ever. I don’t have the energy to even get into how offensive, insensitive, and ignorant your comment is, but if you get nothing else, understand that. Stay in your lane. Kay?
Oh and this is how you are derailing today:
*But If It’s Okay For Marginalized People To Use Those Words, Why Can’t I?
*You’re Just Oversensitive
*You’re Taking Things Too Personally
http://www.derailingfordummies.com/
I’m a very proud black woman. I hate the word–I hate black, white, hispanic, WHOEVER using it. I don’t want to hear it in “friendly” terms let alone with tones of hatred. And, in all honesty, I believe that ignorant people call us the N WORD because more times than not in our society, that is what WE call OURSELVES. And, for the record…we don’t call each other that “amongst ourselves”. We use it “amongst everyone else” in malls, schools, restaurants. And guess what? Children of all other races hear it and it becomes a part of “pop culture”. And then a hispanic kid calls a black kid a N and gets his butt whooped or worse. And people sing the word in songs that are POPULAR and what do people do with songs? They SING them! So only some people can sing these songs and others can’t? How is that normal? I’m sick of it!
@simndy: that is ridiculously stupid. Never ever repeat that sentiment again and I just hope that you have the good grace to be embarrassed that was even published on the web
Thank you, Mia. It’s so annoying when people try to tell other people to let hateful slurs go, and use the ‘It only bothers you if you let it’ card. The truth is, people have valid reason to be offended by slurs and to express their offense. And not all black people use the N word. Many of them don’t have a tolerance for it no matter who uses it. Just because some do, doesn’t make it ok.
How are people who use that word supposed to be taken seriously? I doubt Oprah uses it and it’s certainly not acceptable to just blurt out in normal conversation, but there are DEFINITELY demographics that use it extensively, and it makes zero sense for them to call anyone out on their behaviour when they do the same thing. I’m sorry everyone seems so touchy to what I said but I’ve been called that word myself in a vindictive fashion and it looks like I’m in the minority of people who don’t let insults bother me, and don’t allow myself to be hurt by people and their pointless slurs because it just shows their education and maturity (or lack thereof).
Since it has been glamorized by a huge section of mainstream music and media, kids today think it means nothing to throw around, and nothing’s going to change until that does.
How are people who use that word supposed to be taken seriously? I doubt Oprah uses it and it’s certainly not acceptable to just blurt out in normal conversation, but there are DEFINITELY demographics that use it extensively, and it makes zero sense for them to call anyone out on their behaviour when they do the same thing. I’m sorry everyone seems so touchy to what I said but I’ve been called that word myself in a vindictive fashion and it looks like I’m in the minority of people who don’t let insults bother me, and don’t allow myself to be hurt by people and their pointless slurs because it just shows their education and maturity (or lack thereof).
Since it has been glamorized by a huge section of mainstream music and media, kids today think it means nothing to throw around, and nothing’s going to change until that does.
She’s rich enough to own a mountain. Why shouldn’t she say that? She started from nothing. Go on Oprah. Cannot wait to see this movie.
I agree…she earned it through her hard work so shout it from your mountaintop O!
If it were Simon Cowell talking about his mountain i suspect we wouldn’t be up in arms.
We all want to do well financially but then we vilify other people for enjoying their wealth….wouldn’t we do the same if we got there too?
This!!
She is an inspiration to Black woman everywhere. If she wants to mention her mountain in Maui she has every right too.
She does not sound pretentious like Paltrow.
She came from nothing and good for her for owning her own mountain.
she is an inspiration to women of all colours and nationalities
Because its pretentious.
I am in awe of the empire she built and the success she’s had – that’s great. But saying stuff about “her mountain” where she “restores herself” sounds pretentious and silly, especially in this context. If it were a conversation about spirituality, relaxation, meditation – maybe. About getting a film role that leads to a discussion of race? No.
Yep. I loved watching Oprah from the time I was in middle school and learned so many life gems from her show, the number one being: “If someone tells you who they are, believe them.” I love that woman! I called her “The Goddess” and turned my friends onto her too, a bunch of 12 year olds watching Oprah, lol. I wish I had gotten to see her show before it was cancelled.
^This^
Oprah is a successful, intelligent & accomplished businesswoman & philanthropist, as well as a decent actress (anyone remember her in The Color Purple from the early 80s?)
I just don’t get the hate and constant disregard.
Me either. Maybe it has something to do with people being quick to negatively judge ambitious, confident, successful women? I don’t know. Maybe I’ll have to look through the Oprah thread to see why people have a problem with her. To me she’s inspirational.
I can’t relate to Oprah “I own my own mountain” Winfrey. Not at all. I admire her altruism and her work ethic, but she stopped being relatable a looooong time ago.
Oprah is more than twice my age and I have the same feelings as her about ANYONE using the n-word. Racial slurs are so unnecessary and some people argue that it’s the power and the meaning behind the word that matters. I disagree…I think it’s about the origin. To each his own. Ugh I don’t even think I want to watch the trailer if its as messy as you say it is.
MY.
MAUI.
MOUNTAIN.
O is steady lettin’ folks know the ‘gangsta’ of it all! 😆
I often don’t agree with Oprah, but she is right about this. People who use racial slurs don’t need to be around me.
They don’t need to be around anywhere.
+1 to you both. No one should have to hear or be around that kind of hateful language
Oh boy, to say something so right and powerful and then ruin it by referring to your mountain. That frustration, in a nutshell, is is why I haven’t been able to watch her show for years.
Had she just said “a” mountain, and “when I was on vacation” it would have been significantly less obnoxious.
Any sentence that contains “my mountain” or “my island” is a bit too rich for my taste and leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Not content with bragging like mere mortals, Oprah is name dropping a mountain!
No one cares when Johnny Depp name drops his Island.
at least she earned her money by helping others. Mostly insecure middle to upper middle class stay at home wives/moms, but still. She built a school for girls in Africa and has donated a lot to charities.
To be clear, I don’t like Depp either. I was thinking of him when I included “my island” in my post.
Such a woman of the common folk.
I am sick and tired of these films!! And I am black.
It’s either slave movies, some sort of blind side type movie, or we’re the help.
Why, in 2013, can’t black people be shown as people of this century. Why always the negative, downtrodden, sad, throwback to slave days!? It’s the only way a black actor/actress gets work these days it seems.
I don’t pay to see these movies and instead choose to support independent films where black people are not miserable and/or helpless.
‘Awkward black girl’s only chance to a TV series was if she changed the main character, awkward black girl, to a white woman. This is what they told her.
It’s really sad how they c*ckblock you and it comes from BOTH sides, both male and female.
@A: ITA. I really like black cinema for the very reasons you cite above. I prefer films to have nuanced characterizations and show people going about the business of living, and I don’t like tokenism or any other form of stereotyping. “Something New” is one of my favorites, along with “The Best Man”.
I remember this soap opera on ABC that at one time had a lot of storylines going on at one time with their black characters. And it wasn’t just light-skinned blacks on the show, as sometmes you will see. The lead male, playing a powerful man in the town, was very dark-skinned and the bad guy at times, the charmer, the good guy at times. The woman who plays the forensic medical examiner on SVU had a role on the show too. Maybe she was an attorney. There was interracial dating in one storyline, but race was never a part of the show. It was just interesting characters who just happened to be black on the show and it was so refreshing to see. Maybe it was As The World Turns. I’m not sure of the name of the show. But why isn’t this seen more often?
The Young and the Restless at one time had that also, a larger black cast, but that dwindled down.
TV nowadays is getting Whiter and Whiter!
As a Young and the Restless fan, I have to say that they still have the same number of black actors on as before, I would say even a few more than they usually do. Lily Winters, Neil Winters, Devon and his girlfriend, Lesley, Tyler, Sargeant, and Sargeant’s nephew (never remember his name). And Lily is married to a white man, Cane Ashby. I love how the show never once brought up the fact that two people with different colour of skin were marrying one another. It was written in a way that it just seemed natural and real. I wish more shows would do the same.
Oops, apologies for the double post.
Wholeheartedly agree me dear.
I mean, this movie looks good and all but can civil rights, slavery/period piece movies please stop being the only Oscar worthy movies for blacks, say be the only movies where there is a large, realistic abundance of African/African-American/mixed race actors and by that I mean non-stereotypical, “caricature”? Part of me feels better knowing Steve McQueen is behind this, but it’s sad when the last couple of major film roles for black actors (with major award consideration) have been for playing servants, slaves, civil rights and urban or whatever that means (waving at Spike Lee).
I’m definitely going to see this movie because McQueen doesn’t shy away from a subject so I expect it to be brutal, especially based on Solomon Northup real story. BUUUUT what gets me peeved is Hollyweird and other awards BS thinking that Black people can only perform their best and deserve noms when playing as slaves, servants, bad guys etc. and can’t be praised for playing a bipolar I mean WTF???
rant over.
“I think Forest Whitaker is going to be the “magical” butler who comes in and teaches the powerful white folk about civil rights.”
Yup. Won’t be seeing this. I will see Fruitvale Station on Saturday though-mainly to see Michael B Jordan’s performance.
The Blindside was the biggest pile of sanctimonious shit I’ve ever seen. I cringed throughout that movie. I also felt the same way about The Help and Crash.
I think Crash was on the right track with trying to tackle the topic of insidious racism, I just thought the way Haggis (*coughs* creator of ‘Walker, Texas Ranger’ *coughs*) handled it was awful. The film was full of one-dimensional stereotypes without providing anything even remotely thought-provoking IMO.
EDIT: Elodie-this is Lee Daniels’s movie, “Twelve Years a Slave” is McQueen’s film 😉 I’ll probably see “Twelve Years a Slave” because of McQueen and the cast.
Thanks for the correction dear, but in fact I got it mixed and my mind only went all Twelve Years A Slave, that’s how much non-existent The Butler means to me…
The Blindside was awful, bloddy white savior woman, oh okay… Oscar joke!
And when Crash won the best film that year over Brokeback Mountain…I…never mind!
The Help, regardless of Viola and Octavia performances I hated it with a passion OMG!
Totally. I saw that Kaiser mentioned The Butler in another post, but that was the first I heard of it as well. This leads me to believe that Kaiser is correct in thinking this film is likely a mess.
ITA on all counts. Brokeback is still one of my all-time favorite movies. It was, in my mind, a perfect film.
I met Michael Oher at an autograph signing/ fan meet and greet, and he said that he hated how the Blind Side made him look like he was dumb and didn’t know how to play football well. The story was still really inspirational and his “adoptive” family are great people, but yeah Hollywood totally whitewashed it.
“ITA on all counts. Brokeback is still one of my all-time favorite movies. It was, in my mind, a perfect film.”
Me too. Smelling his shirt broke my heart into a million pieces. I thought Crash was cliche, predictable, and heavy handed.
@A I’m somewhat in agreement with you. I understand the importance of doing these types of films because it does give the viewers a look as how life used to be for African Americans. On the other hand I get sick of Blacks being portrayed in Hollywood as gangstas, thugs, drug dealers, maids and slaves. Also I grew tired of movies such as The Blind Side where it seems as if only the White person can save the poor Black child. Even though that was a great movie based on a true story there have been many African Americas that have done great things to help underprivilege Black kids. We don’t get a lot of those films. I too understand your frustration of the Black girl being the sidekick to the White lead female in the movies.
Crazy as Halle Berry maybe I was glad that she was able to branch out and be the leading lady to White men and her skin color wasn’t the issue. Swordfish, James Bond, The Rich Man’s Wife, Catwoman, Perfect Stranger were just some of the movies where she was just the beautiful woman, not the beautiful Black woman.
I do enjoy films such as Jumping The Broom, Think Like A Man, The Best Man, Death At a Funeral, This Christmas, Soul Foud, Waiting To Exhale and even WHy Did I get Married because it shows successful African Americans having everyday issues that any race could have or relate to. Hell I even enjoyed Pam Grier movies because it showed a Black woman who was in control and didn’t take smack from no one.
BTW, The Best Man 2 is set to come out next year, I can’t wait to see the reuion.
OMG, I can’t wait to see “The Best Man 2”, the trailers look hilarious. What I would really like to see though is another incarnation of “Love Jones”. Whether it’s a sequel or something in that vein. I just loved seeing a bunch of intelligent, artistic, creative, and educated black people. It was such gorgeous movie and so realistic about the nature of love and relationships.
Halle has crossed the color barriers. Shes doing roles that could have been written for a white woman (a much younger white actress at that. Thank God shes not doing mother/wife roles). Go Halle!
No one here has seen the Butler so honestly the cynicism is misplaced. In qny case, too many people, black and white, have no idea where we have come from. How do you know where you are going if you dont know where you have come from? I’m sure Morris Chestnut and co will keep making BET movies about regulatr shizz. Lee Daniels and co need to keep telling the history of our pain.
Hmmm… while I can see where you are coming from, I still think these stories deserve to be told. I think we need more varied black movies that are Oscar worthy, not less movies about slavery, or civil rights. There are a dearth of films featuring black people in any capacity and about slavery from the point of view of black people, so when I see good films with black people that aren’t one dimensional characters, I’m happy. I’m still waiting to see the Danny Glover film about Toussaint L’Ouveture (which has been permenantly stalled due to the film not having a white hero ::Eyeroll::) who was the leader of the successful Haitian revolt that led to Haiti being the first free black republic in the Western Hemisphere and the Louisiana Purchase that doubled the size of the United States.
But I love “Awkward Black Girl”!!! I turned my friends onto that series and it was like watching ourselves: a bunch of awkward black girls, lol. If you love that show, you need to check out “The Unwritten Rules” series on youtube. It’s about this black girl dealing with micro aggressions and akwardness in her all white workplace. Good lord, it’s funny! And way too true to life, lol.
Hilarious – thanks for pointing those out!
I strongly agree. And the producers and studios always defend themselves by saying that they have to create what will work at the box office. But that is a lousy excuse. Spring and summer is when the studios make their money, winter is when they put out lower budget, heavier themed quality Oscar bait films.
Besides, producers should place talented minority talent into roles organic to their skill level and the dramatic mandates of the character.that is why Thandie Newton was the Tom Cruise love interest in MI2 . So someone like Omar Eppes or Taye Diggs could have easily been cast in ‘The Hangover’ or ‘x-Men’ you add diversity, reward talent regardless of race and put out films that reflect the realistic black experience and tastes.
I both agree and disagree. I think these films are very important in that they bring a new younger audience the context of these issues. But I would also like to see variety amongst people of color in these films as well.
I agree with Oprah, but the question is, does she apply this philosophy in a vague, general sort of way, or will she call out rappers, actress – Goop, Jayz, Nelly – there are many others – who were guests on her show and use the word without restraint. You see, it’s one thing not to say it during a private conversation, but to use it in song lyrics, or in front of an audience full of impressionable young people – that has much more of an impact. If you want to render a word unusable, it has to apply to everyone, all the time – otherwise you’re only censoring a certain portion of the population – in this case, people who already know better, and don’t need to be told.
Yeah, I’m not sure if she is splitting hairs. Although, there is a difference in meaning, colloquially on the word, when the suffix is -gah versus -ger, and spoken by the rap black sub-culture, one could argue. However, I thought this might have been a subversive way of addressing Paula Deen, who was supposedly all buddy-buddy with Oprah. Like they can be friends still because she never uttered that word around Oprah?
There was that whole thing with Ludacris a few years back where she didn’t want him on her show or something because of not only the fact that he’s a rapper (and according to her that’s one of the things that’s bringing down Blacks in America) but also the language he uses in the rap including the n-word. I don’t think that’s really gonna stop her though from cozying up to Jay-Z if she had the chance though.
Not only the N word. It was also the heavy use of misogynistic lyrics she was opposed to, rap’s attitude towards women.
She is splitting hairs. She did an hour long special with 50 Cents and after the interview she admitted that she liked him.
@epiphany
Winfrey: You cannot be my friend and use that word around me.
Those people who you mentioned are not her friends but merely celebrities she interviews for ratings and entertainment. She didn’t say you couldn’t be on my show if you used that word; she said you couldn’t be my friend.
As I stated on another OP’s post Winfrey admitted she used the word in everyday conversation with her friends years ago. So I hope she’s not pretending that she has never used the word herself, unless she has forgotten about that confession she made with her friend Gale.
Yes, that’s my point. Do you really think anyone is sitting around, having a private talk with O, and suddenly blurts out – n—–? It’s meaningless to object to it on that level. If she really found it offensive, she would call out the folks in show biz that she knows- whether they’re personal friends or not – and tell THEM how offensive they are. If someone has to use that word – or any other offensive words mentioned in these comments – to make a point in a song lyric, sorry, but he/she needs to expand their education and their vocabulary.
Put it this way: I’m not ok with men using the term “bitch” towards women, as a way to put them “in their place” but I’m not gonna get on Britney Spears, Xtina, Foxy Brown, Lil Kim, Nicki Minaj, and the list goes on….. for using the word “bitch” in their songs and yes, I’m still gonna read Bitch Magazine.
I guess I’m alone here but I think music is art and I think freedom of expression has to be allowed to exist within that realm, offensive or not offensive (which is entirely subjective anyway). Of course some will be offended, but easy enough to not listen to it.
Once we start censoring artists, then as a society, I think we lose something vital. Comedians, painters, musicians, filmmakers, etc shouldn’t have to feel like certain words are “off-limits”, that’s up to the child’s parents to teach them right/wrong.
As I’ve said many times around here, my brother and I both grew up listening to heavy metal music which largely objectified women. My brother and I are both feminists, because we were raised by feminist parents. The music we listened to didn’t suddenly transform us into misogynistic assholes because they objectified women.
@TOK you make a valid point. I am so forgiving of female artist when they use the word bitch. I also think music is a form of art and not to be taken literally. On the other hand I see myself allowing the double standard because a female can use the word bitch with the same malice as a male can and how can I say that is ok. I jumped on the defense of Robin Thicke’s song because women were saying but they are calling women bitches but bitch in the song was not used in a derogatory way.
I also used to listen to a lot of metal. I loved the underground stuff from Suicidal Tendencies, Type O Negative and I’m still a fan of Disturb. Metal objectifies women just as much as Hip Hop does and you’re right in saying that it’s just art but how far should they push that art.
Let’s imagine a country artist singing a song about being a Cracker. They would most likely be in hot water if they did that because of where that word derived from. Most of us know that a cracker was the man with the whip who beat the slaves. They called him the cracker because of the sound the whip would make; hence the saying crack the whip. Cracker later became a derogatory term for White people. Sherman Hemsley even used that word on his television show for laughs.
I just think some people need to know when and where to draw the line. Most of us don’t take lyrics to a song in a literal way just like we know after going to see an action film we are not going to go out and shoot and blow up the town like we’re in a Bruce Willis movie.
I don’t know maybe the N word is the new Bitch.
“I think music is art and I think freedom of expression has to be allowed to exist within that realm, offensive or not offensive (which is entirely subjective anyway).”
Totally agree. Has anyone seen the episode of Louie about the n-word? Brilliant!
@TheOriginalKitten: Even though I don’t think ANYONE should use the N-word, I have to agree with this part of your comment:
“Once we start censoring artists, then as a society, I think we lose something vital.”
Which is part of the reason why I support a singer’s right to sing about sex and even drugs.
As for use of the word ‘bitch’, I think context is everything. When a woman or all women are dismissively referred to as bitches in a casual, trivializing way, (like a woman is just ‘some bitch’ or some insignificant thing) THAT’S offensive. You can always tell when a woman is being called a bitch in a misogynistic way.
However, I’ve never been offended by someone being called a bitch for mean girl behavior, or calling such behavior bitchy, and I use the word myself. To me calling some mean snob or bully a bitch is the equivalent of calling a guy who’s being mean or a jerk an asshole. And I refer to people of either sex who engage in slut-shaming as ‘Puritan Bitches’. When I was a kid, I used to use the word bitch indiscriminately- any boy or any girl who was being mean would be called one. (I got in trouble MANY times as a child for calling people that 😀
She’s right.
I agree.. I don’t care either. Her mountain in Maui? Go play with your OWN network, you have nothing in common with the rest of us. Trying to be relevant again, not happening.
Yep, she lost me with her mountain in Maui. Next!
On another note, Forest Whitaker is great.
Loved him in Ghost Dog and Bird.
Has he been bad in anything?
@Kiddo:
He was in Species!
Presumably because the producers were holding his family.
Ha! That’s funny.
I also forgive him for BloodSport with Jean-Claude VanDamm. He played the goofest federal agent I have ever seen.
Did you ever see his season of the Shield? He was amazing.
I adore Forest Whitaker, so will support the movie, even if average reviews.
I don’t even use the word and I don’t see Oprah in my list of contacts.
I think the effectiveness of fighting racism through movies has plateaued. Anyone who’s still sick enough to think racism is OK after everything that has been said and written about it needs court ordered psychiatric treatment.
“Anyone who’s still sick enough to think racism is OK after everything that has been said and written about it needs court ordered psychiatric treatment.”
There are still a lot of people who think racism is ok. A LOT. But you’re right that a movie is unlikely to change their minds.
There seems to be a resurgence, (or is it simply the internet shining a light on it? Holy crap some of the comments) brought on by certain talking head opinions on networks which shall remain unnamed, following the election of a black president.
“I mean, let’s face it, we didn’t have slavery in this country for over 100 years because it was a bad thing. Quite the opposite: slavery built the South. I’m not saying we should bring it back; I’m just saying it had its merits. For one thing, the streets were safer after dark.”—Rush Limbaugh
This is just ONE of many racist quotes from this turd.
your right racism does still exist in this country. For all races, lets be honest. You have white people who are still racist, you have black people calling for the death of white people (black panthers), you have Hispanics racist, etc. It all needs to end on every level.
Saying you disagree with Obama is not racist. the over use of the race card in the last few years is obnoxious. I have never fully agreed with any president, EVER, saying I disagree with O is no fricking different.
that quote by Rush Limbaugh has been proven untrue. But it is still repeated even though it is a lie. Kind of like saying Palin saying she can see Russie from her porch. She never said that, Tina Fey did.
The reason I will not go see this movie, is that history will be skewed once again by Hollywood, if they ever got any historical movie right I would fall over.
@Sarah, No one said anything about disagreeing with Obama. It’s the type of language that is often used that has nothing to do with policy and only to do with race and/or negative stereotyping that you can read online, that is offensive. I disagree with a lot of his policies, especially the NSA. But you can’t read comments about him and be ignorant of what the undercurrent is with a lot of those people; it’s very obvious.
@Sarah-no one was talking about Obama. At all.
The Limbaugh quote may not have been proven but it has NEVER been disproven either.
Here are some things that he said that ARE proven:
http://newsone.com/16051/top-10-racist-limbaugh-quotes/
…which is why I wouldn’t be surprised if he actually DID say the aforementioned quote.
yes Kitten, it HAS been disproven. Multiple times.
I never said any of you said O, I am just saying what I hear online in forums, on news shows, etc. Anytime anybody disagrees with O you are immediately branded a racist. According to Matthews on MSNBC, if you say he golfs to much, your a racist. it is ridiculous. or the names that Lemon was called the other day for his views on the AA culture, on twitter people were calling him an Uncle Tom, and Uncle Remus. that is not okay.
@Sarah “Anytime anybody disagrees with O you are immediately branded a racist.”
Nope you’re just branded a Republican. 🙂
Sorry sometimes I like to throw humor into things.
@Sarah: Even if that one quote was false, Rush Limbaugh has already proven himself to be racist, a vile misogynist, and a rape apologist. There is no redeeming that swine.
V4Real
it always kills me that Repubs are called the racist part. Lincoln, a republican, freed the slaves. It was in large part due to Repubs that Blacks got the right to vote, and they fought for women to get the right to vote. Repubs were by and large against Jim Crow laws. It was because of repubs that Civil rights were passed.
Dems are the part of the slaveholders, the party that started the KKK, the party that passed Jim Crow and the party that kept putting civil rights on the back burner, because according to JFK, he didnt want to irritate his base. And LBJ was a huge racist whose famous comment about putting n***** on welfare will keep them voting democrat for the next 200 years.
The republican party of today isn’t exactly the republican party of a century ago. The same goes for the democrat party. Not all republicans are racist. Not even most. But most segregationists (yes, segregationists are still around. I’ve actually gotten into ‘discussions’ with some of these pigs) identify themselves as conservative and/or republican, so that’s probably the reason why when some people think ‘republican’ and ‘conservative’, they also think racist. People also think sexist and homophobic when they hear those words, even though logically they must know that not every conservative or republican is those things.
I agree. But why do some black singers use the N-word constantly in their songs? Is that not offensive. It is to me. It seems almost double-standard. Do what I say, not what I do.
Because there’s money to be made in reinforcing black stereo types. As long as the likes of Kanye get to crap in gold toilets they don’t care if they’re contributing to the hardships faced by ordinary black people.
It’s not really a double standard. It’s an insider dialogue. If someone has called you a name, and it’s use and intent is pejorative, if you use that word amongst others like yourself, as a way of connecting the history, but diffusing its power, it removes the negative on some level. People who do not have ancestry with the loaded nature of the word don’t share the experience of oppression that the word conjured. I’m not advocating use of the word, just simply attempting to explain that context makes a difference.
Understand. But doesn’t it perpetuate the problem, and use of the word by using it so casually in songs? Especially since those songs contain references to gang violence, killings, etc… just saying.
I really can’t answer that question. Chicken or egg. Is it covered in songs because lack of opportunity makes the gang experience commonplace in certain environments, thus the artist describes that existence, or does writing about it glamorize it? Maybe a bit of both?
Perfectly explained, kiddo.
@kiddo Nice explanation. I sort of said something like that upthread. I have freinds that said that word only has power if you let it and when they are using it they are using it as a term of endearment. I often hear greetings that goes like this.. what’s up my N_ _ _ A, to these people it’s like saying what’s up bro or the more recent one what’s up my dude.
WORD UP Kiddo!
For me it depends on how you were raised. I am African American and my parents never allowed the “N” word to be said in the house period. Therefore, I don’t have friends who say it either. I also don’t like hearing it in rap songs and I’m 31 years old.
I was raised in the deep South and obviously grew up around that word. As a child always found it offensive, therefore have never allowed that word or any other offensive slang to be used in our house or around our children. As a Southerner I am very aware of the history and the suffrage of black Americans. I am proud to say that as a child my great grandparents took in a black child (against an entire community that persecuted them for it) and raised that child, educated him in their home until he was an adult.
That’s why i come to this site for this interesting discussion; I agree with dorothy that it’s a double standard, but the constant use of the n word, along with hos, bitches, etc. really shows a lack of linguistic creativity and intelligence – aren’t these “artists” supposed to be creative, not repetitive?
Art does not have to be complicated or particularly derived from any advanced education. Forms, structures, colors and subject can be repeated. You see this is in the visual arts all the time.
The medium is the message. This is key here.
But she IS friends with all the rappers that use the word regularly
Agree! My point exactly.
But she did not say you can’t use that word and be her friend. She said you can’t be my friend and use that word around me.
I think the “use that word around me” part is a BIG part of her statement and to ignore it changes the meaning of what she said.
Well the times they have changed since Ophra and friends were using that word between themselves. I am sure she has grown along with her bank account.
Just a piece of trivia: I think the Butler is based on a true story. http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1665973/news
It is, based on the life story of Eugene Allen. I think there was a book written about him in recent years, I vaguely recall the author being on the Daily Show but I haven’t found it yet. His story sounds very interesting. I hope the film does him justice, but who knows.
oh, she lost me at my mountain in maui.
On the n-word matter… my 9 year old was writing out lyrics to memorize the song, a Nicki Minaj song, and then singing it to me. I nearly fell off the ladder when the n-word flowed from her lips and she was totally oblivious. As she should be but I had to explain to her why she can’t use that word, but even I was at pains to explain how then it was in a song but she can’t say it.
That’s why it’s important to include Black history in schools.
I agree with this. There’s so much that kids do not know. I figured I knew quite a bit, but learning in college (and we only spent maybe two weeks on it too in a class that met once a week for 3 hours) I realized how ignorant I really was. Those 6 hours I learned more about the Civil Rights movement then I had in my entire high school, middle school, and elementary school career.
That sort of directed study helped a lot in understanding the events. I don’t think spending a few weeks reading a fictionalized account of Emmett Till’s death by a white man is in any way an appropriate way to “celebrate” black history month. It really is something that should be fully integrated into our curriculum.
It’s an important conversation to have though. If Nicki Minaj is the one that prompts you to have it with your child, then more power to her.
I had asimilar experience the other day — my 5 year olds (twins) came home saying ‘boo, Redskins’ an equally racist word. It took me a minute to realize they were talking about the football team and had no idea of the word’s history, but I had to explain we don’t use that word in our house — but hard to explain why it is a bad word when an NFL team uses it as a team name! (Note, I live in NM, where there is a large population of Native people, but this word should be problematic everywhere).
I agree it’s an important conversation to have but it never occurred to me to have it. Maybe because I didn’t grow up here and it wasn’t part of my culture. Even on the other side of the world we were aware of the word and the basic history but I guess I have to be more cognisant.
Really!?!?! I saw the trailer last night on Hulu and I thought it looked really good.
Agree about the non-use of the N word. It’s like nails on a chalkboard. I doubt I will see this unless there happens to be nothing else on, but I do love Forrest and want to see Fruitvale.
As far as Daniels….Is he honestly saying that a black man cannot get a cab in NYC? Or that he can only get one if his white assistant hails it? I don’t believe this. Maybe he had a few bad expeiences a few decades ago, but now???
Yes still now in NYC. I’ve gotten shade there but its still my fave city?!!
Sad but true.
Over 80% of NYC cab drivers are foreign born, so yeah…I could see that happening.
I lived in Asia and Africa for several years, and people from overseas tend to be pretty open about their racism – plus the tend to be clueless about American history.
For example, when I lived in Thailand in the late 90’s, the NBA had just started broadcasting basketball games there and it was very popular. At that time, several (!) Thai people made comments to me along the lines of, “Wow, Black people in the United States are doing really well. They are all playing at sports and succeeding and making tons of money.” Seriously: they thought all Black people in America were really rich because of the NBA stars they were seeing on TV.
Where do you even begin?
Yes, Chicagogurl, it’s completely true. Black people, especially black men definitely have a hard time getting cabs to stop for them. This is definitely a thing, along with cab drivers refusing to go to Brooklyn. I love NYC, but like any city, it’s still got major problems. :-/
If you say the “n-word” at your job, you’ll be fired.
Is there any sexist word that will result in the same ending for you? If somebody calls you a bitch, you may fill for harassment or something but nobody will get fired.
I have seen people fired for the use of the b word. So it does happen.
Is this just saying the word or calling a co-worker the b-word to their face/ in an arguement?
Really? Just using that one word and that one word alone? For example, saying it casually once in the break room. “God, the packaging on this frozen lunch is a total bitch. I can’t get it open, and I’m hungry!” Like that?
Because at my job, use of the n-word in the manner I just described is grounds for termination.
I never really felt strongly about the b-word, as long as it’s not being used in the way I discussed in a comment higher up.
However, I do feel strongly about other sexist words like slut, whore, skank, ho, trash, white trash (to me that word is both sexist and racist), and tramp. There’s no excuse for that. I might give a 13-year-old a pass for that kind of thing, because it’s easy for a naïve little tween to be duped by our whole, “a woman’s sexual modesty determines her worth, moral character, intellect, and security” culture. But grown women and grown men should know better.
And I agree that sexism is just as serious as racism and homophobia. Too bad it’s not taken just as seriously.
Had anybody else started with “I was on my mountain” I would have scoffed. But this is Oprah, and she is my Queen, so it’s all okay.
Re the film. It looks okay. I know what the blogger means re it looking kindergarten history. But I would argue that hopefully it’s simplicity will be easier to digest to those who actually need to digest the information it is sharing. And those who know the history and fancy something deeper can go watch 12 Years A Slave.
Oprah is doing great things on her mountain. She plans on selling her foods eventually, and in typical O fashion her name is plastered on everything. However, she is currently giving away loads and loads of organic food stuffs. I’ll praise that!
I am sick of hearing about the ‘N’ word.
Also, people these days give words a lot of power. Don’t give the word power, and it won’t be as harmful anymore.
Words have always had power, hence The pen is mightier than the sword quote. Words can uplift or they can alternatively downgrade.
Yea, that’ll work. Just don’t give it power. ::Eyeroll::
I love that movie the Secret Life of Bees, and this time it was the black woman saving the white child, not vice versa. And Queen Latifa played an independent black woman making her own destiny back during a time period that’s not often portrayed.
Dakota Fanning and Queen Latifa really had great chemistry in the movie.
“Are more people judged by the content of their character than by the color of their skin? Yes. Is everybody judged by the content of their character? Absolutely not.”
That’s pretty rich for Oprah to say, because she’s one of the figureheads of black culture, which is as racist as white culture – more so, when one takes into account the multitudes of white liberals dumping buckets of white guilt over their heads. Saying so doesn’t toe the party line, however, which is that blacks are always suffering and are never racist.
This party line is full of irony, as King’s message was not to group people by skin colour, but to try one’s best to judge others on an individual basis. I don’t see this happening in a culture that views all blacks as victims, and all whites as privileged a-holes.
When you refer to black culture are you referring to Miles Davis, Jimi Hendrix and Billie Holiday and when you refer to white culture are you referring to Shakespeare, Mozart and Newton? Culture is such a broad, indeterminate term that encompasses everything from the Large Hadron Collider to the Jersey SHow; or are using these terms as unspecified code words and shorthand?
I read it as a person writing a comment gets all cues about black culture from Oprah, commenter doesn’t like Oprah, thinks Oprah is racist, feels put upon for some reason about guilt, therefore all black people are racists, more so than whites. MLK was tossed in for some effect, I’m not sure what.
“multitudes of white liberals dumping white guilt” – I realize this is a convenient myth, but, no. People who use the phrase “white guilt” have no idea of history.
If you did have any idea of what we perpetrated on a rainbow of minorities, here and abroad, you should feel some degree of sober awareness. These things aren’t in the distant past. The book “Lies My Teacher Told Me” is a good starting point.
You wrote, “because she’s one of the figureheads of black culture, which is as racist as white culture – more so, when one takes into account the multitudes of white liberals dumping buckets of white guilt over their heads.”
1st- So you are saying black culture is more racist because white liberals are encouraging white guilt? Why is black culture responsible for what you think white liberals are doing?
2nd – As a white American, I know that there are many inequalities that exist in our society. I know that despite an equal 13% rate of drug use in the black and white communities, black Americans are charged with drug offenses at a significantly higher rate than whites. I know that if I am charged with a crime my journey through the justice system will be different than a black American. I will likely face a jury that will include members of my race. It is more likely that I will not be convicted, and if I am convicted I will get a shorter sentence than a black American would for the same crime. There are many studies and statistics that have shown these inequalities still exist.
Perhaps it shouldn’t be called “white guilt” but rather “acknowledgement of inequality”.
I have a theory that most people who make these comments are either a) not very educated about civil rights/apartheid (yes I included aprhetid because up till the 90s America supported apartheid South Africa) or obviously haven’t met any of the older generation who have been through segregation.
It’s only been 60 years since segregation. That to you might seem in the distant past but the older generation do pass on that consciousness to the younger generation and thus arguably are still traumatised. Just because segregation ended 5 decades ago does not mean the effects of it has ended conciously, socially, mentally, and emotionally. Black culture, consciousness and the like are forms of empowerment and liberation so to say from previous oppression. I highly encourage you read some of Steve biko’s work to understand the importance of such things (even so Biko is South African, I think a lot of his work applies to African-Americans).
You know, as I sit in my Sentra, where I go to relax and refresh my mind, body and spirit, I recall a time when she did have a show are rappers using the n word, yet she indeed cozies up to Jay Z and he uses the word all the time in his music. My spirit is telling me that if you have his music on your iPod while vacationing on your mountian, you can’t say you can’t be friends with a person who saids it around you. That would be bullshit.
Agree with you totally.
No One should use that word, white, black or purple. It astounds me that anyone would even have to lay down that boundary.
Nobody should ever use it.
Ummm, last time I, a black person, was called a n*g(ger) by a white person, the meaning of that word was still the same. Sorry to burst your ridiculous and willfully ignorant bubble. Blah, blah, blah indeed.
My personal stance on n*gga is the same as Oprah’s, I don’t use that word nor do I allow my friends to use it towards me. But I understand why other black people use it, which is the same reason why people of any marginalized group reclaim pejorative words. Its to take the sting and the power out of the word AMONGST THEMSELVES. I think it’s really rude and insensitive to tell marginalized people how to react to racism by telling them what words they can reclaim or what things they can get offended about. It’s just not your place. And I really don’t see why other (white) people want to use that word, knowing that it has never been used against them, so that there is nothing for them to reclaim and repurpose. Futhermore, if you say the word, 9 times out of 10 it’s bound to come off hurtful and discriminatory and you’re going to have to explain and rationalize using it. Is that worth it? There are multitudes of words in the english language. If I as a black person, don’t need to use that word, white people surely don’t need to be using it either, and most definitely not in reference to me.
I’m going to go out on a limb and guess that 90% of white people don’t use the word and have no desire to do so. And I’ll climb out further on that limb and say that the ones who don’t understand why they can’t use it, too, have strong childish, entitled, and racist streaks. Normal white people have neither want nor need of the use of that word, which I find objectionable in all uses.
And while I find it objectionable, no matter the context, I don’t support banning its use in music. And I certainly don’t think it’s appropriate to tell someone how to react to a situation, but its constant use in music hasn’t seemed to lessen the sting of the word so much as it has given the word a new legitimacy.
Go up to a Jew and say something really derogatory and then come back and tell us what happened. And then go up to a black person and do the same. I dare you.
Blah blah blah? C’mon.
No one is banning words, everyone is free to say the stupidest things that their hearts desire. Being able to say things doesn’t mean that it is inconsequential, however.
And just because you can say something doesn’t mean you should. What happened to being polite and thinking about others?
I agree. People sometimes mistake “free speech” as being “free from consequences”.
As a white european woman growing up, we knew it was derogatory and were taught to never, ever use that word. And I never have.
‘Winfrey: You cannot be my friend and use that word around me.’
Here’s something I’d have liked the interviewer to ask her.
I’m sure Hollywood is full of folk who only tell her what she wants to hear.
So, what if you don’t use the word around Oprah, but use it elsewhere? Would they still be a friend?
It’s just that she associates with the likes of Cruise and Travolta who are members of a racist cult, sorry, ‘church’. I wonder what her answer would be?
purpleunicorn–
I have NEVER, EVER heard of anywhere in the entire world where thin people are advised to stay out of the public b/c it makes fat people feel bad about themselves!! (Where exactly do you live, that this happens?) As far as being unable to say “low fat milk” w/out someone causing an uproar about the word “fat” being used there—sorry, never heard of that place, either–ever. Where I live (on earth)such happenings are about as common as seeing purple unicorns.
Honestly, kidding aside, in your zeal about word over-sensitivity, you have not only really overreached reality completely, you have also entirely missed the point of the discussion. Certain words can, and DO, hurt people, especially those that are spoken with the intention to cause pain to certain groups. And no, it is not ridiculous to be aware of such words, and do avoid them.
We all know that discrimination still exists in many forms. I agree with Oprah about the power of language. A lot of people do use hateful words so casually. You can debate about whether it makes people numb, etc til the day is long. I know one film won’t solve the issue of racism or even sexism etc. all I know is that I don’t like being pandered to and that’s starting to sound like what this film is about. Is it easier for Oprah to pontificate from her mountain? Probably but she is still a good example of someone who had defied the odds.
I don’t care for Oprah, but she has a point.
The N word is meant to be insulting, just like when you call someone an idiot or a moron is meant to be insulting.
As for the film? Well, might be interesting, she’s an ok actress, I liked her in the Color Purple. “ok” because I prefer the one that played Shug Avery.
EDIT: and yea, just realized she was actually nominated for an Oscar for that role. And while the Oscars are highly political sometimes (Hellooooo GOOP – UGH) she wouldn’t be a contender if she sucked, since bias is/was alive and well in the Academy’s old guard. They might be more careful about it now but we all know the deal.
i am a white woman, a white muslim, i dont live in my homecountry and in this country (in Europe) where i live, racists have also names for foreigners like me. but, i never heard foreigners call each other nasty words which the racist use for us. so my question is, i dont live in the usa so i dont know, why does afroamericans call themselfs the n-word, the word racists gave them? i cant imagine that i would do that to others who are from my homecountry or any other country. but maybe its not the same. Does chines people call their people hey yellow whats up? or Indians hey brownie or how did the brits called the indians when they were in India? i dont get it, maybe im naive or dont have a clue. Racism is a huge virus!
I don’t know about Chinese or Indians, but I can give you several other examples of “reclaimed” words.
The following were once highly insulting but have now become acceptable and are commonly used by those who were originally the target of the slur: gay, butch, Mormon, Witch (as in Wiccan religion), redneck, Tory/Whig, suffragette, tree-hugger, Wog (in Australia only – it’s still an insult in the UK where it refers to a totally different ethnic group), Paddy, Gaijin, nerd/geek and tranny.
Perhaps it’s got something to do with power: if a group is heavily affected by racism/sexism/whatever-ism they don’t want to be further marginalised by slurs, but once they start approaching equal rights then it’s just a label, not an insult?
I admit, I haven’t read any of the comments so this may have already been said before. If you want the word to go away, you have to stop saying it. I hate when women call each other bitches. But worse yet, when a woman calls another woman the c-word. That is not empowerment. That is taking the worst descriptor of a woman and using it. So I love what Oprah said. I agree completely. You can’t have your cake and eat it too. Language is not exclusive. We don’t get to say some people can say a word and others can’t.
“For example, you can’t say “I bought low-fat milk” because someone will get their panties in a wad.”
Were you being serious when you wrote that?
That’s well said of O, “It shows my age, and I do not like that word”. I was ignorant to the unspeakable challenges of the black american until late in life. I am ashamed of my ignorance and lack of education. But now that I’m becoming a smarter person, I cannot tolerate that word.
I’m going to repeat what she said, there needs to be a continuing revival of information. I cannot believe that man has to hire his white assistant to get a cab. See? I am in the process of learning still and almost 50.
People, especially tweens or teens, use this word ALOT. It’s disturbing. I’ve yelled at them(we’re close it’s fine) for using the word and then had serious talks with them. Like actively discussing why they use it and why I think it’s not okay. They’re surrounded by it with their peers and it’s just the trendy thing to do. For them it’s slang. They always tell me “Well I don’t use it in front of black people.” THAT’S NOT THE POINT! I believe the ones I know will grow out of it (well hopefully, I’d like to think they’re smart), but they have grown so cautious around me not saying it. I would tell their parents, but most of them have parents that are immigrants who don’t understand the severity of the word. They just say don’t use it and they think it’s finished. It is a problem.
And Oprah is so freaking right. Kids these days don’t know anything about the Civil Rights movement. I am one of those. It’s really sad. It’s something that’s completely glossed over during all our history courses (well mine) and I think it deserves it’s own class.
I remember I took an AP US History class in high school and I honestly can’t tell you what I learned about the civil rights movement in that class. You would think it was vital to the standing and building of our country. Instead we learned about World War II for weeks on end and Germany and Britain and how we “won” the war and my god the time we spent on the American Revolution. It’s like I’ve been studying the revolution since I was born. It wasn’t until college where I learned more in depth on the Civil War. I took a whole rights class where I learned so much into detail about the Civil Rights movement.
The state of public education and it’s emphasis on these things is horrific. Black history month is such a joke during high school and middle school (at least it was in mine, that’s for sure). There’s just not appropriate attention given to it at all. No integration with the curriculum, nothing. Kids nod at these things and say uh huh it was all bad but they have such a superficial understanding of it. It’s such a backhanded way of acknowledging the past and acting like we care.
Bijee, you are amazing. I hope there are more like you. Keep on keeping on.
But isint Oprah friends with Jay-Z? Or no…? :-/
I think Black people using the N word is kind of like reclaiming the word “bitch” or “hoe” which many women use to describe themselves and their friends in an affectionate away. I may be totally off base but that’s what it comes across to me. To be clear, I do not use bitch (or any other pejorative words that are meant to insult women) to describe myself or my friends because I find them demeaning. So it only makes sense not to the N word either or any other word that is meant to belittle or degrade any sort of people.
I don’t know, to me it’s like saying the f word to a gay person. That has just as much as an impact in my opinion as the N word (and yes I’m aware that the F word also is slang for cigarette in the UK so it may not carry as much meaning over there).
To me, the whole “but black people can say the n-word, why can’t I?!?” debate is just as stupid as the “but black people kill each other, therefore Zimmerman is not guilty!!!” debate.
THATS WHY THIS IS MY FAVORITE SITE KAISER BEDHEAD AND CELEBITCHY love yal
i might go in on yal sometimes but when it comes down to it….i love when yal get it right on critical things!!!!! 😀
#RIGHTOn
Nigga, please.
(I’m sorry, I HAD to do it…because no one else did.)
But seriously, love Oprah and agree with her sentiments. It’s a destructive word.
Wait! Is that Vanessa Redgrave? Oh man! Why must she be in a hot mess of a movie?
I’m sorry. My eyes rolled so far up at “my mountain in Maui” that I couldn’t read the rest of the story.
Tell us again how difficult your life is, Oprah. Good Lord.
The n word has a long history of being used to degrade and dehumanise. It’s linked with the systematic denial of human rights to people based on their skin colour.
And I don’t think comparing it to misogynist slurs exactly strengthens your point, either. Hate speech is vile when aimed at a persecuted group – beyond the pale – and it isn’t the victims who are being pathetic and disgusting for minding.
No view on black people using the term, because that’s none of my beeswax.
White people who do it, though, are foul. It’s throwing centuries of systematic and murderous oppression in someone’s face, and implicitly expressing approval of that oppression. I can’t see how that is anything but disgusting.
No matter how much people want to wish this word away. It will never stop existing. It’s used in day to day language.
I was all prepared to hate Lee Daniels The Butler because I am not a fan of Lee Daniels and I am sick to death of these magical black savoir or even worse magical white savior movies. But I recently found out that Danny Strong wrote the screenplay and I like his work. I might have to sneak into a show…..
This debate has been really amazing, it’s why Celebitchy is my favorite place.
But my 2 cents: Oprah was just trying like crazy to promote this movie and chose to use an inflammatory topic to get more press. No different than Jennifer Aniston wearing a dress that shows her “maybe/maybe not” baby bump to promote her new movie.
And I am returning to my couch to paint my toenails and restore my spirit. Gosh, that is so going to be my new phrase.
I don’t use that word either. I won’t not be friends with someone who uses it, but I am clear that they don’t use it around me.
And I’m Irish-white as they come. It’s just an ugly word used to hurt.