I am half-Indian and half-white, which ends up confusing a lot of people. I’ve had teachers swear up and down that I must be Greek. I’ve had Mexican-Americans come up to me and assume that I speak Spanish because of the way I look. I get random people guessing that I’m Italian, Middle-Eastern, Native American and more. A hairstylist recently looked at me and asked, “Are you Muslim?” (as if “Muslim” is a race). All of which to say… I feel like I fundamentally understand Meghan Markle in certain aspects. I’m sure that as someone who is half-white and half-black, as someone who “presents” as a somewhat elusive ethnicity, she’s probably had to deal with racial microaggressions and weird racial assumptions all her life. Meghan talks about that and more in the April issue of Allure.
If you don’t already know Meghan Markle from her role on Suits, you definitely know her because of her recent romance with Prince Harry. And their fondness for each other isn’t the only thing they have in common. Like her royal beau, she too has a face of freckles — and she’s opening up about her appreciation for them, along with her skin tone, in Allure‘s April issue.
“I have the most vivid memories of being seven years old and my mom picking me up from my grandmother’s house,” Markle tells Allure. “There were the three of us, a family tree in an ombré of mocha next to the caramel complexion of my mom and light-skinned, freckled me,”
But the actress shares that it wasn’t until later in life that she began to examine her identity based on her skin’s color — and to this day, she’s constantly being questioned about her heritage.
“I remember the sense of belonging, having nothing to do with the color of my skin. It was only outside the comforts of home that the world began to challenge those ideals. I took an African-American studies class at Northwestern where we explored colorism; it was the first time I could put a name to feeling too light in the black community, too mixed in the white community. For castings, I was labeled ‘ethnically ambiguous.’ Was I Latina? Sephardic? ‘Exotic Caucasian’?”
Which is why today, Markle celebrates not only her skin tone, but her freckles as well — a trait that she says she tries not to cover up. “Add the freckles to the mix and it created quite the conundrum. To this day, my pet peeve is when my skin tone is changed and my freckles are airbrushed out of a photo shoot.”
So for all of her ‘freckle-faced friends’ (we assume that includes Harry), she has a few words of wisdom: “I will share with you something my dad told me when I was younger: ‘A face without freckles is a night without stars.’”
I have freckles too, which confuses people. It happens when I get any kind of sun on my face, I’ll get a smattering of freckles on my nose and cheeks. I love when that happens. But yes, I feel Meghan on the racially/ethnically ambiguous thing. Like, just looking at her, I would think that she was a mix of more than black and white. You know what I think is cool? That we’ll get to have these kinds of conversations around a royal bride, potentially. If Meghan and Harry do get engaged and do marry, Meghan will have a platform to discuss these kinds of racial issues. That’s exciting to me, because I never thought a Windsor prince would ever end up married to anyone other than an aristocratic-looking blonde, you know?
Photos courtesy of WENN.
*staying out of this post TAHDAY… Lord knows some of you have the ability to show understanding to a POC akin to ya’lls fave twitter f*ckboy Reading letters this will prolly be discussed with the nuance of a sledgehammer hitting a table but with 67% more dog whistles*
I love how you write QQ!
Me, too! I always enjoy your comments, QQ. After reading yesterday’s “discussion” on colorism, I’m gonna leave this one alone, too. People will say anything to rationalize their negative energy towards MM, and I rather focus on the positive.
I’m with you, QQ
*Milly rocks out of this post*
Hardest milly rock of 2017
Same. I’m out.
Wait! What did I miss yesterday??
I thought I was all caught up w/r/t the Royal posts but apparently not!
Me too. Laters.
😭😭 And you better not come back!! You already know sis
Co-signed. And it’s Day 2 of my period. I don’t have it in me for Satan and his jokes today.
*sees myself out of this post*
” it’s Day 2 of my period. I don’t have it in me for Satan and his jokes today.”
God, I want this on a T Shirt. Or even better, a big black door sign.
*Period Twinsies*
Omg second day as well… freaky celebitchy…
Btw i do not understand why is bad to be blonde. This is the second time i feel like i am second rate citizen as a naturally blonde woman. As for Markle, as long as she does something i don’t mind her. If HM turn into KW the monarchy may just as well dissapear
Me too! Wtf? Spooky!
@milla No disrespect to you at all – I am mixed (mother is white and blonde, father black) and I grew up all my life with a desire to look like my mother and to be seen as beautiful in that way. The intent of this article (and what I read Kaiser to mean) is not that there is anything wrong with being blonde but moreso to say that there are so many other qualities that make us beautiful and she expected Harry to choose a blonde because the was his MO up until recently.
I identify with MM so much because like her, I am ambiguous looking and have been mistaken for Spanish, Indian (mixed with white according to many), and a variety of other assumptions. I’ve never felt as though I have a community that is mine and so to see her “be seen” and be thought of as beautiful and worthy of a prince, it just makes me feel like I can be seen too. It’s so refreshing to hear someone talk about experiences that I can actually relate to – right down to my freckles which I absolutely love. So, to say that she’s beautiful or that it’s refreshing to see that he’s with someone else other than a blonde is not to say that being blonde is any less beautiful (2nd class etc.) but more than anything to indicate that it’s an unexpected and lovely thing to witness especially within the royal family.
Yup. This brown girl is out as well.
I came back and peeked (in the early afternoon) and the general thread was not bad, but actually positive. The trolls (Kitty, Sarah) haven’t shown up so this is where I exit (again).
So after being here for over a year, and having a different opinion which I respectfully explained, I am now a troll, publicly labeled on a public website. Ok. Not much critical thinking going on here, I can see.
No one cares how long you claim to have been here, you’re being called out because you’ve been posting comments that are at best problematic and tone-deaf in discussion about racism and race issues, especially in your responses to non-white posters.
You don’t seem to have anything to say in response to criticism (of yourself and others, which is weird to start white knighting for random posters) apart from “I’ve been here ages” and “you’re mean bullies!!!” which is hardly raising the level of discourse.
QQ
You are fantastic!!
Being a beige woman of mixed ethnicities, i can relate to what she is saying.
Us beige folk we need to just be allowed to be, beige. I don’t subscribe to either of my ethnic backgrounds, because while they genetically make me, culturally, I am just a plain old small town Canadian that had to deal with weird racist s&^t that I didn’t understand because well no one could figure me out.
Either this has been my two cents, and like the rest of ya’ll I am staying away from here 🙂
Understandable. I do love this woman though.
QQ, I’m late to the party but I still wanted to say hello!
She is so beautiful. Sounds like a cool girl too!
I agree. I’ll admit I had never heard of her before her relationship with PH started being covered on here, but I find her very likable. She seems intelligent, informed, caring, down-to-earth, and yes, also beautiful. I can see why Harry is with her. I’m not a royal watcher, but I’m rooting for them.
I completely agree. I’ve watched a couple of her interviews and she is so articulate and confident and a great public speaker. For all the non-Americans here, Northwestern is no joke. You don’t get into that school unless you have brains. And when you hear her in interviews with no teleprompter you really see that.
I almost don’t want her to join the RF because I’m afraid of them hindering her. I think she has the capacity and, more important, the will to drive change and that’s exciting. I’m just nervous the grey men in Kensington aren’t going to let her in fear of overshadowing Kate and Will.
I’m so on board with this American princess.
Hi Jeanne, I agree and really hope that the Harry will stick up for her regarding the men in grey. Also, my fingers are crossed that they don’t decide that the Duchess of Cambridge should be the one to show her the royal ropes, that would be a disaster.
Jeanne, the only reason we are hearing of her now is because she’s dating a member of the RF otherwise we wouldn’t even know she existed. This is all media hype. If they split she will go off into oblivion again.
@Maggie please speak for yourself. I heard of her as did the viewers of her cable show and readers of magazines that focus on WOC etc. YES. She has a larger platform now that she is dating Harry but it’s NOT media hype. She is the author of her achievements no matter how much that galls you and they were hers long before Harry and will still belong to her after him should they split.
I think she’d be fantastic in the Royal Family for many reasons but mostly because she has a work ethic and a social conscience. It’s a bonus that she’s gorgeous, seems very nice and she and Harry make a super hot couple.
Love her. Using her platform for good, she’s accomplished, and well spoken and giving . She’s what a princess should be.
I never thought Harry would end up with someone this interesting either.i thought he’d go the same route his brother did
I’m surprised by this match up too, not just because she is American and Woc, but she seems so culturally different than the BRF. I never would have pegged Harry to connect with a women of colour who has a willingness to talk openly about gender and racial discrimination.
Here I come to show off. I am not surprised of this from one Dianas boys. I mean I have been very puzzled over the years that they were seemingly walking the beaten path just because their mother, the most famous woman in the world, very publicly dated a man of South East Asian extraction and then one with African roots, both muslim men. I figured since their mum smashed convention, and as exposed as they are with all their traveling, at least one will look not just beyond social station but race or religion.
I had read somewhere that the love of Diana’s life was a Pakistani doctor. As I am South Asian, I’m going to get pedantic (apologies) and point out that she was involved with a South Asian which is different from someone of South East Asian origin.
While it’s true that the boys were exposed to interracial and intercultural dating through Diana’s relationships, I suspect the men she dated were probably from elite backgrounds and not necessarily politicized around issues of discrimination in the way that Meghan seems to be. To me, this is significantly different and kind of interesting. Your point stands in that Diana probably normalized interracial dating for the boys.
Sanders: in past decade, particularly in America, Asian has become the preferred terminology for all Asians whether they are South Asians, South East Asians or from the Far East.
Until then, Diana’s BF was described either as Asian or Pakistani because Asian didn’t include the Far East and Pakistani was more specific.
I still have moment of confusion when someone from the Far East is described as Asian, but the other word (the O word) that was the norm is apparently rude and or perjorative so we can’t use that anymore.
Personally, i try to call them by their nationality so i don’t offend with the wrong word.
I think as well, in the UK, the use of Asian to mean South Asian and the use of nationality to refer to other people of the various Asian ethnicities mostly comes from the size of the various populations here – that is, the former is large, the latter is very small.
Lak, I think we are similar in that we like to be precise about people’s ethnic or national origin. I remember you corrected me in another thread about South Africa vs Botswana, which I appreciated.
I grew up in Canada where we refer to anyone from Pakistan, India, Sri Lanka, Nepal, Afghanistan, Bangladesh, as South Asians. South East Asian would refer to Vietnam, Cambodia, Thailand and other countries in that region but not China.
Since I’ve been In the US, I don’t bother using South Asian because people look at me blankly. I’ve noticed Americans use Asian to refer to South Asia, South East Asia, Japan, Korea etc. I don’t think it makes sense to lump these groups together when you are trying to describe patterns of behaviour and demographics, like voting or income.
I like to use nationality to refer to people too. I think it demonstrates respect. The term South Asian is useful when talking about solidarity among brown folks living in the west. We have similar colonial histories, religions and culture ( compared to south east asia) and we can all be roundly dismissed as pakis! It’s a term I’ve used in activist and academic contexts.
Despite the reputation the media insisted on giving him, Harry’s long term girlfriends are intelligent, articulate, independent, and not at all Hooray Henrietta nor are they vacous party women.
Laura, Chelsy, Cressida and now MM. All have degrees and training in their chosen fields, non has a MRS degree.
If he ends up with a vacous Hooray Henrietta, THAT will be a surprise.
I’m not a big royal follower, so this was all news to me. I always thought Chelsea Davy was a bit of a Hooray Henrietta (yes to this as a moniker), but that was based on not much of anything.
I’m glad to hear he’s not so shallow, he’s come off so much better than Wills lately even at a glance.
Detritus: i think people often forget that Chelsey was 17/18yrs old, and a first year uni student when she started dating him.
She went on to acquire 2 degrees in serious disciplines, Economics and Law.
The media extended the ‘party prince’ image to her because she wss dating the ‘party prince’ even though she didn’t go out as much as Kate and was in university most of their relationship.
News editors have since admitted that for both of them, pictures would be taken of one outing, and ran multiple times over several weeks to support the narrative of ‘party prince’ for Harry and Chelsy.
Meanwhile, at one point in time, Kate was going out 4 nights a week, with proven different outfits in the pictures from the different nights, yet was dubbed the boring, non-party girl!!!
WELL Said LAK.
All of Harry’s longterm girlfriends were are educated, going for their own goals, none were chasing being MRS. I liked that about Chelsy, Cressida, Meghan.
I never understand the hate any of them get or got. All three were going to University or had gone to University, completed and were pursuing their goals when they dated Harry or as Meghan is dating Harry. I always disrespected Kate because she STOPPED her own life, own career goals, if she ever had any once she met and started dating William.
“‘ethnically ambiguous”
What a horrible phrase. Casting notes really are the PITS, aren’t they? What with Kal Penn and others posting examples lately, I’m really coming to realise that the entertainment industry is like some seventh circle of hell.
It seems like a cesspool to me. For some reason or another, the entertainment industry has created an environment that brings out the worst in human behaviour. It’s sad because it is an industry that has a huge cultural impact.
I would never want anyone I love pursing a career in hollywood, particularly children.
Right? It just seems like the absolute worst of everything. And then you see the award show speeches where the successful tell the other successful that it’s the purest and best of us all distilled. I beg to differ.
So well said. I was in the biz for a hot minute and it is completely dehumanizing. I struggle in the corporate world (or maybe, don’t) because sometimes people are totally shitty to me and my barometer for acceptable is so skewed.
It is. It really is. They make pretty pretty pictures (mostly) but I admit I would be too much a coward to try and hold my own behind the scenes. And totally agree with you about the awards shows.
Sixer! You know the casting notes for Hollywood ain’t got nothing on the casting notes for royal duchesses.
Hopefully she’s readied to jump from one cesspool to another.
Bloody hell. Now you put it like that…
… poor, poor woman. She seems so nice. First casting notes, now the judgement of the aristos (or perhaps more accurately, the aristo-adjacent) and the Daily Fail.
I gotsta say, I’m rooting for her.
I’ve actually used the phrase “ethnically ambiguous” to refer to myself. I’d never even considered that people would label other people that way. I just couldn’t think of a better phrase to describe my experience.
I’m Native American and white mixed, but the genes just came out in a way that people seem to look at me and see their own ethnicity. I’ve been asked if I’m Russian, Vietnamese, Hispanic, Japanese, the list goes on. Sometimes I wish that my appearance was more definitively Native American, but for the most part it hasn’t bothered me. But, I say that knowing I’m fortunate and many other people have different experiences.
Now that I’m aware that people use “ethnically ambiguous” as a label for “othering” I think I need to find another way to describe my experience.
I honestly meant just in terms of casting notes it’s a horrible phrase. I wouldn’t have recoiled if I’d heard it coming from you or anyone else with mixed heritage, you know? Sorry if I was at all tactless.
I have used it a few times too. Also a Native mix, Metis here. I get Italian, Spanish, Mexican, Egyptian, etc. Basically anything but what I am. I knew it was a term used for casting, they use it in the modelling world as well. It’s never bothered me as, honestly, I am kind of ethnically ambiguous looking. I can pass for a lot of other races, and when I tell anyone outside of Canada what I really am, they have no idea what it even means.
Most of the people I know who are offended by Hollywood, are usually offended by the fact that most of the Natives you see aren’t actually Natives.
Hollywood casting notes on scripts can be horrifying to read. I remember reading one audition list of a friend and I asked her, Are THEY allowed to say that, refer to you like that when you are told to go audition for something.
Her note was black woman, angry ….innercity hardened,….then a note on side said ghetto life.
I was like that’s horrid, Can they say that to people. It was full of horrid stereotypes, just horrid.
My friend once told me ,once a casting director told her, HE only called in mixed black girls because the studios or projects don’t hire any of the full African American girls he sends. I was like WTF!!!! That’s so racist.
He said to Hollywood when many tv projects will say they want a black women in role, it usually means half black , half white, but they won’t say it out right.
I know she’s from Canada so maybe that is why she feels that way but as a black person from the States there are plenty of black people with two black parents that look like her or are lighter in the black community that aren’t treated this way.
Yes there is colorism in the black community and yes sometimes dark skin people get upset at the fact that within the community lighter skin black people (especially women) are treated as the superior black people because of their closer proximity to whiteness due to the internalized racism that was brainwashed into us by white people.
She is an American filming a TV show in Toronto.
Thanks. I thought she was Canadian.
I don’t think she is from Canada. I think the show “Suits” in filmed here but she is American, as far as I know.
Also considering how hard it is to get roles for obviously black looking actresses I am wondering why she complaining about looking racially ambiguous when in the racist industry like HW that is actually an advantage to her. I could understand if they were denying her racial mix, but that doesn’t seem to be the case. It looks like they are saying she can fit all these roles because of her ambiguity.
I think the issue she has is that they erase apart of who she is .
She talks about how everyone seems to think she’s every race but black.
In Hollywood I’m sure ambiguous can be used for or against, or as a reason to hire or not hire. Hollywood does whatever it takes to make money. Ethics, awareness, and thoughtfulness not required.
I don’t remember if Jennifer Lopez talked about this or not. For a while, it looked like the strategy (the studio’s or hers?) was to cast her as “not Latina”. In at least two of her movies, her character was Italian (Wedding Planner, Out of Sight). In some others, her character was never given a last name (Paulina in Shall We Dance?, Charlie in Monster in Law).
I do think she has had her struggles like Wentworth Miller, but I kind of wondered if she had a better shot with Harry precisely because she is light-skinned. Would the royal family accept her if she was Lupita Nyong’o (just as beautiful and sophisticated, but darker-skinned)? I don’t think she has evaded racism, but I do think her lighter skin does in some ways make her more palatable to a public not used to change in the royal family.
In some ways I think her ethnically ambiguous looking features are a bit of an advantage when getting into the royal family, even if it is a hindrance in Hollywood.
perplexed, I don’t see the BRF as being the ultra conservative royal family. Given what other wingnuts are out there, they’re middle of the road. Lady Davina is married to Gary Lewis, Lady Gabriella Windsor was with Aatish Taseer (British of Indian and Pakistani descent) for several years.
Two of the most hyper-conservative royal-or-former-royal families are the Habsburgs and Liechtenstein. Members have married African-American (Countess Lei von Habsburg), Sudanese (Countess Mary Nyanut Ring Machar von Habsburg), and Afro-Panamanian (Princess Angela of Liechtenstein) women.
Even if the royal family isn’t ultra-conservative, I do think the media can be quite racist. And while, as I said, I don’t think Meghan has evaded racism (not in her personal life, I’m sure, and not in the media), I do think her skin tone could be advantageous in currying favour with some of the public who might otherwise be stuck in a different time. In terms of dealing with the public, I do think her lighter skin tone is certainly an advantage.
Despite the fact she is light-skinned, and could probably pass for white, the media hasn’t let her forget her bi-racial background. I don’t know if that’s because of the blue-blood thing in Britain or what it is, but recently I don’t think her ethnic identity has been erased (even if that has occurred in the past).
Maybe I sound like I’m contradicting myself, but there are instances where I can see her light-skin being a huge advantage, and other times, where I don’t think she’d be allowed to forget (not that I think she’d want to) the other half of her identity if she were to marry into the royal family. I think I put in multiple thoughts in at once, and maybe none of them make sense.
I hope she would never want to forget half of her identity, no matter whom she marries.
I don’t think she should have to forget the other half of her identity either. But someone upthread mentioned that other people have erased part of her identity by identifying with her every other ethnic group but black. If she were to marry into the royal family, I don’t think that would happen any longer, judging by the tone of the coverage about her.
At the same time, I think her skin tone helps in making her more acceptable to the public, who can still be quite racist, even if it so happens that the royal family might not be. Some parts of society are forward-thinking, but there are still factions of the public , like, er, Donald Trump, who aren’t.
Jinni: I don’t think she is “complaining” about the racial ambiguity, as much as she is speaking up about the treatment by people who are unsure of someone else’s ethnicity and they “feel” it is their duty to inquire by uncomfortable questioning of a child: what is your race, where were you born. Having to “explain” to ignorant people, I am American too. I am Puerto Rican and Asian, with an Asian surname, but have a medium/light complexion. Childhood was often spent with people always playing the racial ethnicity what are you game and where were you born. The game of strangers is you couldn’t have been born in Seattle, because you are too exotic looking. You must be from? New York? France? Portugal? Are you Eurasian? I thought I was fitting in, but too exotic for whites and skin not brown enough to fit in with other ethnicities, except at home, with my own mixed brown family or if I caught enough sun, then I wouldn’t be questioned. Spent a lot of childhood with suntan lotion to fit in with the brown side of my heritage. What Meghan is stating is what happens to many of us of mixed race.
I’m also confused that she is complaining about being racially ambiguous… I mean, that has to be an advantage in Hollywood? It means she can get cast in many different roles. Unless she explicitly wants to play white-black, in which case it’s something she should articulate to an agent or casting director.
She DOES look ambiguous – you can’t expect people to know right off the bat what your ethnicity is. People guess mine wrong all the time – so what?
Speaking as someone involved in casting on a regular basis: being lighter skinned would definitely open up more roles than darker skinned black women (literally last week a major CD sent out a a breakdown for an Indian character and emphasised twice that they didn’t need the actor to actually be Indian, which I cringed at). But the standard is often white blonde skinny boobs. It can be so relentless sometimes. Light skinned or no she would still be considered the “ethnic” option to many and unfortunately I’ve heard “but we’ve already cast one ethnic!” more times than I’m comfortable with (which would ideally be none).
She works in Toronto but she is American.
She is American from LA, not Canadian. She has written about her experience growing up in Los Angeles, California multiple times.
She’s from L.A. And not Compton-as someone on here wrote-but from the San Fernando Valley.
Her mom lives in Creenshaw
Beautiful and smart. Think I have me a little girl crush.
I have one too!
When i first heard about Kate years ago I was young and bought into the whole princess thing but now I appreciate Meghan for all the opposite reasons. I love that she’s an ambitious, independent, hard-working woman.
Same! I’m excited she has a platform to talk about what’s important to her. I’m excited to see (if/when) she becomes a royal, what she does with it as far as speaking on issues and charities.
cough cough, interested to see the drama between Kate and her. I hope Kate feels shamed for doing nothing.
Me too!! She is poised, articulate and passionate about helping others plus on the shallow side I like her sense of fashion. I really hope that the BRF doesn’t try to make her conform too much to their protocols but allow her to be the inspiring woman that she is.
I think she’s gorgeous
I had never heard of her until she got with Harry. If I never read anything about her, I’d never think she was 1/2 black, and I have a few friends who are. Really pretty, smart girl
At first look, I’d say she’s caucasian, probably from Spanish heritage. She’s pretty. I hate the skin tone chat in general. Every colour is beautiful.
She reminds me of Maya Rudolph. A lot of people didn’t know she was Black/mixed race. Her mothere was the singer Minnie Riperton who had that hit song Loving You is easy cause you’re beautiful.
I would think Megan was of Spanish heritage as well. They never addressed her race on the show until about a couple of seasons ago when her dad who was Black showed up.
I didn’t know that about Maya Rudolph! I loved Minnie Rippeton, she died too soon. Breast cancer, if I remember correctly. Had to have been hard on Maya.
Ugh. MM is so stinking pretty it’s not fair lmao
Really? To me she’s obviously black. Not being rude but I grew up in a diverse area with artists and can usually tell what a person is because people of certain ethnicities generally have similar features. Not always but it’s more often so than not.
She looks nothing like a spaniard from Spain but she could be a Hispanic from quite a few countries or even pass as Brazilian. I assume she’s had a nose job (it just looks fake to me, I may be wrong but she’s got that weird tip that a lot of nose jobs have) which could confuse the issue though. But that may be her actual nose. I know less than nothing about her and what I do know is underwhelming.
I guess I say this as an awful white privilege haver but I certainly wouldn’t want to date someone that harped on about race and came off as perpetually aggrieved. Seems like it would get old fast. Maybe the progressive points outweigh the annoyance though, for some people.
What do you mean obviously black? So you subscribe to the one drop rule? So ridiculous and sad that in the 21st century we still need to debate this.
“progressive points” lol you just couldn’t help yourself, could you. You were almost successful at hiding it…aaalmost.
Better luck next time 😉
My husband is light-skinned, with one of his parents white and the other black. His identity is complicated, and he’s had it questioned all of his life. Some of my friends didn’t figure out at first that he was mixed race, they thought he was from the Mediterranean.
She’s smart, articulate as hell, and beautiful. The more we get to hear her voice the more I love her.
I really like her, she’s smart and thoughtful as well as being very beautiful. And I want her to marry Harry, but for our sake. For her own sake, I’d think very carefully about it. I really want to protect her from the racists and xenophobes who will tear her to pieces in the press. I fear that with an engagement, the hounds will be unleashed.
This exactly how I feel.
She shouldn’t marry Harry because she’d be a great symbol and learning experience for him, the BRF, and the public.
If she decides to marry him for her own reasons, ready the Flying Elvi.
Kaiser, I honestly think olive to medium brown skin confuses some people – I’ve heard my fair share of guess-the-ethnicity from people while abroad and this is despite my having no white ancestry and looking what I thought was fairly unambiguously brown.
I give people a pass if location/context could lead them to make assumptions (like the four-year-old who asked me if I was Mexican….. which gave me a start until I realised the kid was from a US city with a lot of Spanish speakers. Or the ladies who asked me in Arabic for directions to Shepherd’s Bush market, because the area has a fair few Middle Eastern immigrants).
But it’s not nice when people ask and then act displeased by the answer, like am I supposed to be sorry my ancestry isn’t the ‘right kind’ of exotic for you?
It totally does confuse people! I am the same description, yet I am white (mostly eastern European, Russian, Italian). In the summer, people speak to me in Spanish. I guess my eyes are unusually angled, so some people have asked if I’m Asian. My sister and I get asked constantly “What are you?” The question is so offensive and one of the reasons is yeah, they never seem pleased with the answer.
I am half Lebanese but I have very blue eyes. I live in an area with a lot of North African immigrants and am constantly asked if I am Moroccan.
I’m white and obviously ethnically Anglo Saxon but I have had Argentines and Chilean people speak Spanish to me because they thought I was one of them. I have also had Croats and a Georgian think I was Croat and Georgian. No idea why, except maybe because I knew a lot about their countries and they didn’t think an American would know?
About a decade ago, Chronicle Books (San Francisco) published a beautiful book of portraits, Part Asian, 100% Hapa by Kip Fulbeck. They published a second book with the artist, Mixed Portraits of Multiracial Kids. I keep wishing they’d publish more in that series, which opened some eyes about what X ethnicity “looks like”. (ended up posting in wrong place).
I am Native American and Irish, most of my family is olive to dark caramel with dark hair and dark eyes. When I came along with blonde curls and actually translucent skin (I look like a map, which I have come in my 37 years to kind of think of as cool) my family was like WTF?! My mother wept when I was born – for real, my grandfather told me and I thought it was a joke until my mom was like, “I was scared, I didn’t know what was wrong with your skin.” My grandmother tried “fixing” it for me by rubbing me in vegetable oil and sending me out into the sun. (terrible idea – as I burn on the most overcast of days while I sit in the shade. Within the confines of my family I was confused and HATED my skin tone. I didn’t care so much what other people thought, but I wanted to feel like I belonged at home.
My sister on the other hand is black haired, almost black eyed and an even dark caramel, she has been assumed to be mixed African American, completely Italian, Greek, Middle Eastern and a slew of other things, her husband has a traditionally Latino last name and now everyone assumes she is Latino. It didn’t bother her so much, but it did bother us that no one believed we were sisters and she didn’t like that they never really believed she was telling the “truth.”
When my daughter was born, she was so beautiful and she had these big dark eyes and tons of dark curls – EVERYONE asked “She’s mixed?” or gave a guess what she was mixed with – it was strange, like a game that people thought it was perfectly okay to play with a stranger. If we went anywhere with my sister they assumed she was her mother… Okay, I dealt with it my whole life and I wasn’t surprised. But, when she was like three she was crying about hating her skin tone and I was like, “You are so beautifully golden brown, baby!” She looked at me and said, “But nobody thinks I am yours.”
Just one family and three different stories of how people can affect our own feelings of ourselves based on how they react to the coloration of our skin.
Thank you for your story, Mrs. Lucky. Interesting & enlightening.
@ teacakes
Sorry, i think a lot of people don’t realize it is rude to ask what are you? I guess that’s stupid, but i asked my now husband that. His mother is Native American and African American. His father Caucasian and Japanese. So my husband is a pretty caramel color and his skin tone looks mixed or Latino. But when you look at his face, he has slanted eyes, wider nose and high cheekbones. I never realized how much we identify people by their race and maybe thats why we ask.
I never ask about someone’s race but I have often wondered. I didn’t want to “categorize”, I was just curious sometimes, I admit, because of someone’s unusual beauty.
People ask “where you are from” from accents too. I got that one in South Carolina (two white ladies) and even Birmingham, Alabama (black male). Apparently, I have a strong southern accent which I don’t necessarily hear although I can hear it from other people.
Being mixed race myself I really don’t get why it’s offensive to ask someone that. Ok , I understand phrasing it as ‘what are you’ is rude because that is a demeaning way to put it, but being curious about someones ancestry is surely not rude? It’s an interesting thing and something to be proud of.
Why is it rude? I love to talk to people about where they’re from and nobody has ever been offended. But those people are usually first generation immigrants and love to talk about their home countries and culture. It helps because I usually know a little something about those places and am genuinely interested to learn more. Everyone goes on about how great multiculturalism is, and how we can learn from each other, but how is that possible if everyone gets all indignant about discussing it? Do we really want to live in perpetual offendedness? Maybe it’s better to be afraid of talking to each other?
@Tulip @Snowflake @Eye rolling – I should clarify, I don’t mind the question itself – like I said, it’s natural to be curious and I don’t begrudge people that.
What I DO mind is when people act disappointed by the answer (because it affects them exactly how?) or start throwing ethnic stereotypes at me.
I have to admit, I have asked people what their ancestry was. I didn’t know I was being rude, and nobody has ever answered abruptly or dismissively- it’s actually been a conversation starter. But, I’ve only ever asked people I thought were attractive/beautiful so, maybe they picked up on that.
@Snap – I don’t mind being asked, I’m visibly foreign in a fair few places I go to and curiosity is natural as long as whoever is doing the asking isn’t being a jerk about it (I even stated how they were).
On some level, it’s interesting to me because there’s no genetic linkage between my people and indigenous South Americans, yet I get taken for one quite a bit. It’s one of those themoreyouknow.gif things.
I love her, and I think she and Harry will really run the cambridges off the map popularity wise.
My only concern with her, I think a previous poster said it too, is for that family to drain the fire out of her. Look what they did to Diana, and even Waity was FAR more fiery and colorful (and smiled real smiles, seemed to have a little personality) prior to the marriage. Please Meghan be the exception not the rule!
If she figured out the rules of the game, and never acted like it was The Meghan Show, she’d be fine. She could follow the lead of Sophie Wessex, who after her initial blip, has fit in fine and maintained her personality. Camilla still has her fun personality, and once people set aside their Diana obsession, they realize she’s an engaging person to have around. She makes Charles appear more human (in good ways).
We are more interested in the women then the men, so the women gather more attention. Some who naturally outshine their husbands (like Maxima and Mary), end up having to dial it back some for the job. But both of those ladies still have plenty of personality and engagement in what they do.
What was Sophie’s initial blip?
@ Nikki she was still running her own firm and got scammed by a Uk tabloid who sent a fake sheik to set her up.
One big thing in her favour is that she is older and hopefully wiser than Diana and Kate (when she met William) and has been out in the big wide world a bit.
I think (hope) that things are different now-plus she’d have Harry’s support. I’m all in for them-so I’ll just show myself out to continue planning my middle of the night wedding viewing menu.
One thing for sure. Their children will be beautiful.
well though she’s mixed she’s not quite passable like for instance other biracial (black and white) actresses such as Jennifer Beals, Troian Bellisario, rebecca hall who all live life as white women.
Honestly, the society we live in tries to force you to claim one or the other, due to the one-drop rule surviving all this time. I agree with Jinni…. colorism is rampant, but you can still navigate thru, and the black community is largerly more accepting of the various complexions due to racially mixing and such…. they would be like o she black just lightskinned… so yea idk
Hallie Steinfeld is another with mixed race actress who is assumed to be white. She’s white, Filipino and Black.
Interesting. I did assume she was Caucasian. Also, I find her facial features particularly her eyes very attractive.
I think she is light enough to be play European roles but I assume Hollywood categorizes people more easily.
I had no idea Rebecca Hall was half-black.
Rebecca Hall is not half Black. She does have “distant Black ancestry” from a Grandparent. I think her Mother literally had a drop of Blackness. See the Guardian interview below.
As a Black woman I wish people would celebrate the Black women around them instead of trying to latch on to everyone with 1.0% Blackness. Like the Blake Lively’s with a drop of Native American blood and no involvement in Native culture. I mean most African-Americans have a drop of Caucasian blood but they aren’t going around claiming to be White or half White.
——
Does Hall identify herself as black? She bursts out laughing, and when she does her features scrunch into a lovely, messy abstract. “Heeeheee. It is quite funny. No, you could not get more white and middle class and English than me.”
https://www.theguardian.com/film/2010/jun/12/rebecca-hall-interview
One of my cast went to school with Rebecca and she’s right, you can’t get more white and (upper) middle class than her family.
Incidentally Peter Davison (5th Doctor from Doctor Who and father of Georgia Moffett) has a black grandparent. Anyone familiar with them would perhaps be surprised, as they’re both fairly Aryan-looking, blue-eyed blondes. Peter has either a sister or aunt (can’t remember off the top of my head) who looks non-white. They look completely different. Genetics are just so unpredictable.
Not quite passable? I do hate that phrase.
The more I learn about her, the more impressed I am. She would do an incredible job as a member of the brf, if they allow her. I think she would really use the position well to further causes she believes in. If Waity has any sense, she must be quaking in her suade pumps because the negative press they’re getting now will be nothing to what it us when Meghan starts working and really shows how little and badly Kate does in her role.
Better not to label people because we’re all diverse looking. You can’t say “oh she looks spanish!” because MY GOD not all spaniards look like her. Not all latinas look like her. The number of times my ethnicity and nationality have been questioned! And this has not only happened in the US but also in Europe and other latin american countries. So sorry not to fit your latin stereotype but that doesn’t make me less latin than you.
And Kaiser I need to get your recipe for self control because that “are you Muslim” question is so ignorant I wouldn’t know how to answer that politely.
Just say “Why do you ask, are you?”
Sorry, I don’t have a shred of sympathy for anyone who chooses to walk, eyes wide open, into the snake pit that is Hollywood. If Sparkle is looking for Kumbaya in Tinseltown, she’s stupid. That would be the true fairy tale, not hooking up with a Prince. Hollywood is rife with racists. My Chinese daughter has grown up hearing, “I’ll bet you’re really smart.” Or “Do you play the violin?” And, when she was small, people bending over and in a very loud, sing-songy voice, “Do youuuuuu speak Ennnglish?” Ignorance and stereotypes cut across all racial and cultural lines.
Seriously, that’s your takeout from this? “No one should ever complain about racism because the choose to work in an industry where racism is rampant?” By that rule no one would be allowed to speak against racism ever, unless they live and work in sir magical racism-free place.
No, I published before I typed the latter part of my comment. Calm down.
How rude of you.
The touch screen on the phone is not always my friend 😩
Wait-because there is racism EVERYwhere she shouldn’t complain because she wanted to be an actress? What?
I don’t have a shred of sympathy for ANY person of ANY race that bitches for ANY reason about how hard it is to make it in the cesspool of Hollywood. H-O-L-L-Y-W-O-O-D. Clear enough for you?
@Donna-there’s racism everywhere: in schools, in every workplace-if you don’t shine a light on it, it’s never going to get better. There’s always been a culture of the casting couch in Hollywood too-by your argument no one should complain about that either? Lots of pedophiles in Hollywood too-victims shouldn’t mention that either? Women get paid less-that’s a known fact-but don’t complain?
@HappyMom – Regarding Hollywood, exactly. Racism, drug abuse, rape has been rampant there for years. I’m cynical, no one there wants to address the issue unless it affects them personally. And those with clout either look the other way or applaud abusers such as Polanski and Allen. I’m also casting a jaundiced eye at Sparkle bringing the issue of race up now that she’s pretty much bagged her prince. Actors and actresses have the time, the money, and the media at the ready. They have had years to work to break down the walls regarding racism, but haven’t. They have had years to address pay inequality publicly, but haven’t, until very recently. Meryl Streep was more than happy to applaud Roman Polanski and speak out against Trump, but she’s never called out the racism in Hollywood.
I don’t agree at all.
I’ve worked in the industry my entire life (former child actor now working behind the scenes with my own production company). Albeit mostly in Britain rather than LA but I’ve made projects in the US and American co-productions. I’ve dedicated the last ten years to fighting for equality and diversity and especially better disability accessibility and representation in the industry, and also have fought for protection for women who are sexually harassed. I have been involved in this not only on the creative level (in terms of actually making diverse work) but legally via working with Equity.
Do you consider that “bitching”? I sure don’t. And most of these issues don’t affect me personally since I’m no longer an actress and my career would certainly be a lot more commercially viable if I wasn’t constantly doing stuff like insisting on only making films with female leads.
And I’m sorry but Hollywood is not a “cesspool” that’s just silly generalisations. Not to be a dick but if someone doesn’t work in the industry they really have no idea what it’s like.
“Bitching about how hard it is to make it” =/= complaining about racism.
NO ONE should ever feel censored into staying silent about racism. That’s insane levels of victim blaming.
And bringing rape up, are you saying if a woman who happens to be an actress is raped, she shouldn’t go to the police just because some other women who also happen to be actresses supported a man who is a rapist once? What if an actress is raped by their plumber or car mechanic and not by someone in the industry, are they allowed to go to the police then? It seems like you’re saying being an actress means accepting any level of abuse, because actors are so fundamentally dirty they don’t deserve basic human rights.
Unfortunately looking the other way happens in all walks of life. I’ve personally had experience of women ‘standing by’ or supporting men who were convicted of rape or even child sexual offenses and they all did normal jobs in offices or shops.
@Donna just FYI, the person you are calling Sparkle did not just bring this up now she has bagged her prince, it is an old story dug up by the media. Meghan has said nothing much for months except the girls and periods stuff.
I am curious what industry is NOT “rife with racists”?
Also you have no problem reading gossip about these people who work in the cesspool.
Lol, this is the only site I visit for anything celebrity-related. The perspective of the people who comment are far more interesting than any of the celebs.
Why do you call her Sparkle? It comes across as aggressive, like you personally dislike her…do you?
@NN – Read through the past posts here. Shes been referred to as “Sparkle” by many who have posted, for the past few weeks. One of the commentators joked “Meghan Markle Princess Sparkle” and the name stuck. Feel free to review and call others out, too.
I am guilty on starting the Meghan Markle, Princess Sparkle moniker. I wasn’t trying to be offensive at all. When she was originally reported on I misread her name as Meghan Sparkle, so my mind went to if they marry she’s Princess Sparkle. Although, obviously, not really. I just thought, and think it is an affectionate/cute nickname. I mean her personality does sparkle!
You’re an angry, mean person. Such vitriol for someone you don’t know because she complained about racism.
You do not like my opinion, which I have every right to express, even if it differs from yours.
No one said you didn’t have that right.
Disagreement with you is not persecution of you.
I am glad she’s talking about this. She’s had a front row seat so we should listen. It’s important.
Honestly, that rather dim prince with the fast fading looks is lucky she loves him. I wish we were discussing her in terms of running for office here in the US, where we could use her perspective, rather than potentially marrying into the BRF and taking up a second tier, rapidly descending into third tier, royal position.
It must be wonderful to be beautiful and highly intelligent. I wouldn’t know, do tell me.
Look at this wtty and incisive comment. Is that you, Harry? Lol, there are plenty of Internet commenters who find you hot, so go bask in their regard and don’t concern your brilliant little head with those who find you less than appealing.
You first comment was just shallow, your second – 🙄
Shallow? She was talking about how she wishes we were talking about her work not who she’s marrying! Not shallow at all.
I was complimenting Markle, but you seem rather overly bothered by my referring to Harry as dim and losing his looks, mild comments on a snark site.
But I am sure Harry appreciates the defense.
@ bluehare – I wasn’t referring to Megan as shallow but the post about Harry being dim and losing his hair.
As a “racially ambiguous” person you know what I hate the most?
People pestering me if I am SURE I am what I am. I’m sorry I don’t fit your stereotyped notions of my ethnicity.
I went on a date with a black guy who told me he didn’t date black women (first red flag). And when I told him what I was, he asked me if I was sure and he began to list all the other things I looked like. Also he blew up my phone like 50 times asking why when I dumped him after the first date. Ugh it’s made me take a break from dating.
Oh my goodness. That was a close wasn’t it? Bless your heart.
Oh GOD. That makes my skin crawl. I’m so sorry. Any guy, no matter the color, who blows up a girl’s phone when she clearly isn’t interested makes me sick to my stomach. But the fact that he was clearly a self-hating colorist who obviously offended you and couldn’t understand why? Come on dude. Glad you avoided that one.
Yeah my sister and I get “are you sure you aren’t Chinese?” Fuck you, I’m sorry I answered your offensive question in the first place.
Use a burner phone until you’re sure.
OMG what is wrong with some people? So glad you saw the million red flags and got out.
Wow, that’s just so wrong. You have more patience and manners than me! I would have asked for the check and walked out as soon as he said he doesn’t date Black women. But to take it up a notch and tell *you* that you are another race than the one you stated is asking for soup to be dumped on his head. LOL. So condescending and a total douchebag!
Imagine the mind games we would have played on you to feel insecure because of HIS racial issues. Good for you on moving on.
Yeah, no. Not today. My sinuses are clogged and my throat is swollen. No patience for some of these comments.
Rooting for you, Meghan.
Oh no, feel better Mia! It went through my family and has lodged itself in my husband’s lungs. Even our house guest from Belgium arrived with it, having caught it from his 4 year-old son before leaving home.
She is lovely and beautiful. End of story. If she has ever been marginalized because of her skin color, than curse the perpetrators. Why are people so intent on looking at people and determining their pedigree? I love my melting pot country and hate those who like to forget that their ancestors likely came from somewhere else too.
Wonder how light she felt amongst the royals! Dont worry Meghan your angst with your dark side will pale in comparision when u dealing with a blue side@ blue line!
On the tv show Suits, I could tell she’s half-white, half-black, but I’m not sure if that’s because of the lighting. She also has a bit of a resemblance to Stacy Dash, so maybe that’ helped me out in figuring out her ethnicity.
I guess my first thought was that she’s really pretty.
I had no idea she was biracial until Bunk from The Wire showed up as her father.
I like that she hasn’t put her life on hold while she dates a prince. Chelsy moved to the UK to study law in part so that she could continue the relationship. Cressida turned down auditions and settled for an admin job while she dated Harry. Kate… well, we all know what Kate didn’t do for 5 or 6 years. Markle hasn’t even stopped speaking out about controversial topics. I like that, and I think it speaks to the strength of their relationship and of Harry — that he doesn’t feel intimidated by her. William would. He’s the one who will cause trouble for MM if she joins the family.
I wondered if William would feel jealous that Harry got an interesting lady while he’s stuck with a really boring one. I know that’s what he wanted, but still…
William badly wanted Isabella Amaryllis Charlotte Anstruther-Gough-Calthorpe (God what a mouthful) she could have been the future Queen by just clicking her fingers but she was having nothing of it and accepted Branson Jnr instead. I felt really sorry for William he probably felt she ticked all the boxes and would have helped his popularity as the superficial world would have gone crazy for her simply because as real blonde beauty she fits the princess stereotype .
This is such a misconception.
Diana, Fergie, Sophie continued to live their lives, working etc until the engagement announcement. In the case of Sophie, she kept her job for two years post wedding as well as carrying out her royal duties. Only scandal (one and only) forced her to quit her job.
Chelsy has two degrees. Economics and law. One completed in SA and the other in UK. She went straight into Lawyer training and working.
Cressida also has 2 degrees followed by the path all actresses take…..jobs that pay the bills whilst you audition.
All the European Princesses were working right upto their engagements.
They all acted like people who happen to be dating a prince, NOT living for their Prince.
The point being that ONLY Kate chose to interupt her life, atrophy herself in order to land her skittish prince.
She’s not the blueprint of Prince hunting. She’s the anomaly.
I know about all that, but Diana and Fergie had fairly low-key jobs and didn’t interact with the public as part of their jobs. D, F, and Sophie all worked pre-internet also, which makes a difference. And I suspect that neither Charles nor Andrew, while they likely respected them for working, had a lot of respect for their jobs.
Chelsy was so young when she and Harry met, most of their relationship took place while she was in school. She didn’t put her life on hold, because it hadn’t yet begun. She has a reputation for intelligence, but the rumor was that she only went to Leeds to study law at Harry’s urging. She hasn’t worked much as a lawyer since; perhaps her heart wasn’t in it.
Cressida (or someone speaking for her) pointed out that she couldn’t go on auditions while she dated Harry and that she had already turned down several opportunities. But again, she was young and those opportunities may well have been a lot more about who she was dating than who she was.
Rumors of MM dropping out of Suits (after the last season — imagine) play into the public perception that royal girlfriends should be seen but not heard. I guess I’m just pleasantly surprised to see that she hasn’t felt or succumbed to any pressure to not speak her mind.
1. I’m not sure how much more public interaction you would have preferred their jobs to be if nursery school assistant, cleaner, nannying ( Diana), and PA in a PR firm, chalet girl, Publishing assistant, art gallery assistant ( Fergie) are not public facing enough for you. Sophie started out as secretary, PA and event organising and PR-ing.
2. Fergie and Sophie had a good decade of working jobs, even if those jobs weren’t high end, before marrying their princes.
3. Diana managed to squeeze in a few jobs in the little time she had living as an independent adult.
4. The internet has only impacted the Royals (and establishment)’s ability to lie to us, but in terms of knowing or finding out information about royals, they’ve always been an open book. Every detail of their lives is in history books, in gossip media, in museums, in public places.
5. That public perseption you are talking about is the Kate effect. Until her ran as a GF, there was no public expectation that a royal girlfriend couldn’t work. Her PR kept insisting that she was waiting to be a royal to work, that being a royal girlfriend made it impossible to work etc and all of that was untrue. ONLY Kate has followed this route and because she was so insistent on this point, the public has come to think it must be true, but it’s not. Exihibit: all the other women involved with princes, pre and post internet.
6. Cressida said being Harry’s GF made it difficult for her to work, but she was in several plays, a tv show and 2 films during that period as well as that teaching job she had. Perhaps it brought out creeps who wanted to meet her for obvious reasons, but she never stepped back.
I like MM don’t get me wrong but she’s definitely changing things. She had her PR put out that she’s retiring from acting. I highly doubt she’d do that if they weren’t on the road to an engagement.
Chelsy attended a British boarding school, so she more or less grew up in the UK and socially she moves in British upper class circles, so she never moved to the UK to be with Harry.
You know that time when William was still dating Katie Middleton and everyone everywhere were lauding her as Diana’s second coming, the best princess who’s ever princessed. And how disappointed we all are afterward?
You cannot look at Kate nowadays without seeing a woman who has her inner light completely shut down, like a robot with good hair.
This is a hard pill of reality, but there’s a possibility that Meghan may be ground down to that too. Royal Families everywhere seems to have the ability to curtail one’s achievements and reduce them to smithereens, with only a few exceptions and only because the Head of the Family are actively helping and giving positive encouragement to the married-in.
Not seeing it with dear ol Lizzie Two.
What inner light did Kate ever have? Her entire life revolved around locking down William. She did nothing apart from that.
She looked much much more relaxed and happy, as well as genuine when she was in her university days, and younger. Even her first honeymoon year she looked better and more glowing. Her first Canadian tour was a marked success if you compare it with her second Canadian tour.
Then slowly the toll weighed on her. And she got swallowed up by both the Royal Family and (admittedly) her mother’s ambitions.
She probably looked younger in her university days because she actually was younger.
I don’t remember her ever being particularly vivacious or anything. She always seemed kind of blah. She probably did look happier at one time, but even her happier self seemed kind of blah. Pippa is more vivacious than Kate, and her vivacious self is also kind of blah. The Middletons in general are kind of blah. Nothing wrong with that necessarily, and not everybody has to set the world on fire, but they’ve never really been fascinating.
She’s smart and beautiful. Harry seems happy to be with her. Nothing else to it.
I get that too. She could completely pass as white but she could also pass as many other things. I have about the same complexion as Megan and have had people question my heritage. It doesn’t bother me and I really don’t think it’s anything to feel offended by. It would be lovely if we could all just accept each other for what we are rather than having to fit into a box. Saying that, I did have one guy insist I was Portuguese. I kept telling him I wasn’t but he wouldn’t take no for an answer. They guy didn’t even know me! Why did he think he knew where I was from better than I did?!
Yeah that is weird. I don’t mind people asking asking where I’m from, or what my roots are, but insisting that they know better is hella strange.
Anyway, your heritage is also your culture and your history, it can say alot about who you are, so of course we will ask each other where we come from. That’s how services like Ancestry etc exist!
As a Black woman I have to side-eye what Meghan Markle is describing here as colourism. But continue…
@ Shelley Lol! I’m with you. I understood the historical textbook definition of colourism to be quite different. Is she misremembering what was taught in her African American Studies class or is it her African American Studies professor who is to blame?
I really hope it is her having misunderstood what she was taught. Unfortunately, anyone who is hearing about colourism for the first time while reading this article will have this understanding of it. 🙁
Yeah, I don’t doubt that she can feel in between two worlds (I’m black and know my biracial husband talks about how some black people don’t feel he is black enough), but regarding colorism, she is benefitting from colorism. Women who look like her are the ideal compared to dark skinned women. Of course, she certainly has her own issues to face as a light skinned person, whether it is considered “colorism” or not.
Having said that, I’m definitely not discounting racism that she encounters in and out of Hollywood. She’s intelligent and lovely and seems a great catch for Harry.
Actually the precept that she benefits from her complexion is not true. In HW there is such thing as being too light. She isn’t dark enough to be cast as black nor white enough to be cast as white so while she may get more auditions, that doesn’t nec lead to roles. Let’s stop trying to generalize when she has been very specific about how colorism has impacted her…despite impacting darker blacks more. It’s not a contest.
@can’trecall she didn’t limit her comments to her experiences in Hollywood. Never said it was a contest at all. I specifically responded to a comment about “colorism,” which, if you look at the academic work done on it, specifically is about discrimination against darker skin in favor of lighter skin. I was merely agreeing that it might not be the correct term here, but yes, she absolutely faces discrimination. I even said she faces issues being a light skinned person, whether you consider it colorism or not. Feel free to read my comment again.
@Can’tRecall, I see what you’re saying to an extent, but she has also made herself look whiter. She’d look a lot less ambiguous, for example, if she stopped straightening her hair. She lost a notable amount of weight and may have had some cosmetic work done as well. She has made herself look as much like the skinny white Hollywood ideal as possible. While she’s light, she’s not that light. She looks much more obviously black to me than, say, Mariah Carey, Rashida Jones or Maya Rudolph. She looks about the same complexion as Lisa Bonet. The fact is, Hollywood has embraced scores of light-skinned women — from Lena Horne to Zoe Kravitz. Casting notices specifically request light-skinned/mixed women. I’m not saying that Markle hasn’t struggled in Hollywood but her framing of colorism here misses the mark
I would…but I think we are putting the tumblr trolls on ignore today so…play on trolls play on.
I’m glad she is speaking on this issue.I recently watched a documentary called Light Girls.I learned alot we often discuss the dificulties over being dark skinned in the black community and ignore the issues light skinned women deal with.
Genetics are weird and all sorts of surprises can arise, it’s super interesting but incredibly invasive for people who can “pass” for multiple ethnicities/races. Even fraternal twins with a black and white parent can end up with two completely different skin colors. I read about a biracial couple in England that had two sets of fraternal twin girls 7 years apart. Both sets of twins were biracial–one dark, one light!
I recently came across a black American vlogger on Youtube living in South Korea even lighter than Meghan (Megan Bowen). I didn’t even realize she was black at first, I assumed she was maybe part Asian, especially with her current short hair and I think she wears maybe colored contact lenses. It wasn’t until I read the comments on her videos that I realized people were fighting over her race and appearance in the comments, accusing her of bleaching her skin, of trying to look more Asian etc. One of her latest videos was an ancestry DNA test which proved she was indeed mostly of African American descent with some random European and Native American ancestry thrown in. Even this vlogger’s own dad admitted he got a paternity test when she was born because he had a hard time accepting he had fathered such a light skinned child and that she was 100% his daughter,, that he was convinced the mother had cheated on him with a white guy. Goes to show that most people want a black and white answer (pun intended) to what race or ethnicity you belong. But there’s just a lot of shades of gray and genetics never play by the rules.
Yep. I got an Ancestry test run to see my origins and I’m 70% African, with my mom being about Oprah’s complexion and my dad looking ambiguously [dark] Mediterranean. I was born pale with red hair and green eyes. My hair has gotten blonder as I’ve aged. I look enough like both parents that it’s obvious I’m not adopted but no one in my large family had my coloring so I’m from a way back when recessive genes mix. Genetics definitely don’t play by the rules.
As a side note, I know some have bad/irritating experiences about their nationality cause they look ethnically ambiguous. Mine is related to hair color. I constantly get strangers asking me if my hair color is real/natural. I still tense up about it as it’s so intrusive to roll up on someone you don’t know and ask them that.
What do you mean ‘African’? You do realise that ‘Africa’ has a multitude of ethinicities that range from pale skin to blue black skin. Blue and green eyes as well as black or brown or hazel eyes.
Every part of Africa has so many different ethnicities that calling yourself *African* is meaningless in the context you describe.
@LAK Sub-Saharan African. I’m well aware of Africa being made many countries and ethnicities. As I had 11 different countries listed, none known for endemic pale skin Africans that aren’t albinos, I was too lazy to write them all out. That said, I think you knew exactly what I meant though… but thanks for trying to nitpick my comment.
”Markle tells Allure. “There were the three of us, a family tree in an ombré of mocha next to the caramel complexion of my mom and light-skinned, freckled me.”
Oh my, so beautifully expressed! Seriously! This is someone who loves, understands and appreciates the power of words. And wastes none of them.
The fact that Harry is serious (and he does seem so serious) about this gorgeous, engaged, articulate woman, is encouraging. He, on his own, is lovely (hard-working , engaged, aware of his obligations etc) but she elevates him, make no mistake about that.
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Being Hispanic I know Latinos come in every shade of white to the darkest shade of brown & I also know that some people who don’t exactly know what you are, white euro or African American tend to make comments in Spanish about them & get busted bc uh oh, this person is from Argentina or Cuba, etc. People should be more aware that a person’s skin color can’t define what YOU think they are as they can be greatly mixed as well. I have redheads in my family who are pale white & freckled but that doesn’t mean theyre Irish…a rainbow of people & I love it
She is so, so cool. Love her. ❤️
I am a dark-skinned, monoracial, black girl.
I have had to catfish most of my life to even establish friendships with people and it has nothing to do with who I am as a person but all to do with the way I look. From a young age, I had discovered that I would not be subject to the same sorts of bullying if I looked like my light-skinned (brown skinned for me is light) sister/cousin(s) with “pretty-coolie” hair. Looking black was never something considered special, and I’m only 24. No, it has nothing to do with the things my family would say, but a collection of evidence based on being highly observant and sensitive from a young age. I observed that the words “cute and pretty, skinny and model like” were attributed to my classmates, my sister, other kids my age, and my cousins.
Everyone knew me as my momma’s big baby.
I was always shy and well-mannered, but rigid with social settings because I was always picked on for being big. Because I was bigger, people assumed I’d be the playground bully when it was the opposite. All I wanted was to play with the other kids and do dance classes like the other girls. The teachers would say how talented I was. I had just started gymnastics but they say potential in me and wanted me to move to an intermediate level after my first class. I was bigger, but limber and malleable.
One day my uncle picked me up from school and they told him how good I was. On our way home, like any kid, I asked to stop at burger king. That’s what my mum did sometimes after dance. My uncle said, before we left the car, the following:
“Do you really think you should be eating that?” He acknowledged the confused look on my face.
“Didn’t you see the other girls? Don’t you want to look as nice and pretty as them?” They were all slim girls, light skinned, with my hair. My hair was permed and broken because of my moms decision to process it.
I cried the whole day after that.
I had light skinned friends in high school who were mixed and they never understood how much people preferred them. They were kind of blind to bias, as it always worked in their favor.
The one time I’ve had a guy like me, was at 19. I had tried to speak to him for almost a year as we had a lot in common. I figured it could be a plethora of things but mostly the way I look. I figured what would a guy my age find attractive, and I knew it wasn’t me due to the fact that no guys ever had liked me.
I made a fake page directly like mine, and had anyone that knew me saw it; they’d recognize how similar the person was to me/used my photography. The only thing I changed was my name and picture. I adapted the picture of a light-skinned girl, who looks much like Meghan, who also looked like all of the girls in my life who always were considered perfect.
He accepted me within four hours, and even incited conversation.
Spoke for months (3) before telling him the truth. This was 5 years ago.
I don’t feel badly for women like Meghan feeling “too light” because being too “light” in the black community, and all other(s) *as I’ve learned*, is right. Mixed or ambiguous/light-is black enough, while black from a distance is too black. This has nothing to do with antagonizing light or attractive women (obviously the two are not synonymous). However, it does have to do with the “woe is me, i always felt neglected, or too light and too black depending on who i was around,” trope. Welcome to the club. Want to know how that feels? Be a black girl who is monoracial, non-ambiguous and identifiably black. kinky-haired and all. This colorism debacle of light girls is very annoying and I don’t care about how divisive it seems. Yes, I am ugly, and yes I am dark-skinned; but the two are not mutually exclusive. This phenomena happens to beautiful girls with dark-skin too.
You will never know the pain we have to feel. You were the mocking tool(s) that people used to belittle us our whole lives, and internally, so many of you know it. You don’t take blame because obviously its not your fault, but you take advantage of that privilege but pretend to be victims. Some of the most malicious females I have ever met have been attractive, lighter skinned “woe is me” types.
I wish her luck of finding her identity. I wish black girls had it easy too .
@Chan-I’m so sorry that those have been your experiences. I wish you a future where you feel accepted and loved for who you are.
Reading your post immediately made me think of ‘Precious’ not bc you said youre a “big girl” as I obviously don’t know what big means to you, but bc in the movie, Previous always wished she was a lighter, if even white girl, with nice hair & thinner frame so she could “feel pretty” & more accepted to societys standards. It breaks my heart that the barriers between what is acceptable, what is considered beautiful, what is standard still is…black & white. Youre beautiful & I know that from just your words…..the racial stigma sadly still remains but you are beautiful
It sounds like you have had to deal with some real morons. I’m totally with you on the victim/privilege thing. We all have our issues but we shouldn’t down play others issues and I’ve been guilty of that before. There is this bizarre tendency to want to be the victim of something and the genuine issues like you’ve just raised get lost in the crowd.
I’m sorry you were made to feel inferior to others Chan but you can’t hide behind a fake persona and catfish people because then you’re using them and lying to them and hurting them when feelings get involved (3 months is a long time). You might not realize it but what you wrote made you sound like a victim justifying your actions. I think you need to accept yourself as you are so that others can accept you and love you too. There will come a time when your confidence and sense of self will attract the right type of partner. Best of luck to you
i am sorry to hear that. You sound like a perfectly lovely person and that is just, well I don’t know what to say other than it’s awful. I hope you have found some sort of inner peace. I hope you will accept this comment even though I can’t understand your specific struggles. However I think all women feel inadequate in some way regardless of color or hair or whatever. This isn’t to discount your experiences but to let you know we all understand the feeling even if the particulars are different. Hopefully you can understand that you are who you are and life is too short to try and meet society’s stupid and arbitrary expectations. It is a game nobody of any race or color or size or whatever, can ever hope to meet. And it is this way by design, because if you are happy with yourself you will not be a good little consumer and make the controllers rich. You are beautiful just as you are, but also beauty isn’t the be all and end all of life. I hope this makes sense and helps in some way. Best wishes to you and my heartfelt wishes and prayers for your inner peace and acceptance.
@Chan
Stop watching American movies. They will make you believe that the 10% of Black Women that look like Beyoncé or Rihanna represent 100% of how Black women look. There is an entire continent of Black women and 80-90% of them look just like you: Darker skin and more rounded and toned. TV, Movies and Music videos are not real life. Even your family is a small reflection of the Black world.
Go to YouTube and watch Nigerian movies, movies from Ghana etc. Full of beautiful Black women of monolithic Black parents. If you can afford to, travel outside of the US to majority Black countries and see the reality. Date outside of your race, you will be surprised st how many non-Black guys like Black women but are afraid to ask them out. Unfortunately many Black men in America have bought the cool-aid that it’s better to date white women or as close to White looking women as possible. They are ashamed of their own dark skin color.
@ Chan
I am really sorry you’ve had those experiences. Idk what you look like but please know not everyone values looks above everything else. All you can do is just be the best you can be and love yourself regardless of what you look like or how others treat you. You are a special person who is so much more than her looks. So please don’t value yourself by whether you are pretty or not. Many people who are plain find love. You will find the right person. There are men and people who are looking for more than just a Barbie doll. Looks are a shallow barometer to use to measure your worth. There is so much more to a person.
THIS! Well said Chan. I am sorry you have had to go through this.
Not to take away from racism that light skinned Black people/”racially ambiguous” people feel, but this is one perfect example of colourism. The preference for lighter skinned people is institutional, and ingrained in our societies as POC, and it historically stems from racism.
The problem with these conversations around colourism, is that everyone wants their struggle to appear to be the biggest one. Everyone has it hard, we get it, but some people like Chan (dark and not skinny) have it harder, and there are more far reaching consequences of being discriminated against.
I’m not mixed but I can so relate to this as a light skin black woman. I have auburn red hair and when I was little people used to accuse my mother of dyeing my hair. When I was a toddler woman once walked up to my mother and asked her if she was my nanny. Keep in mind that ny mother is not much darker than I am but a red haired baby apparently equaled a white baby.
That is so rude. What if you developed a complex and started thinking you were someone else’s child. IMO there is no reason to question a kid’s origins to their face. That’s child abuse!
I always automatically consider kids walking with an adult to be related unless corrected, for sure I would never go up to a perfect stranger and question them about their kid’s race or heritage. I mean that’s like going up to a couple and asking what type of sexual position they prefer. In other words none of your damn business!
Just for the record I think Meghan is lovely.
“I remember the sense of belonging, having nothing to do with the color of my skin.”
This is my fervent wish for humanity.
Race is convenient and inconvenient for society at different times. I was reminded of this yesterday as I spent the entire day in the new African American museum in Washington, DC. I am feeling WOKE AF to my Black-African heritage, the many shades we come in based on everywhere our ancestors were shipped around the world, and the MANY contributions we have given this world, which is not even taught in most schools.
@Kaiser – srry/not srry – NO. Being mixed-Indian is a very different than being mixed-Black in this racially-fractured American society. These life experiences do not equate. History and modern day society confirms this.
No one calls President Obama mixed race – we call him the First Black President. No one says Halle Berry was the first mixed-race female Oscar winner – we say she was the first Black Female to win an Oscar for Best Actress.
I am Nigerian-American – my Mom (born in Nigeria) has freckles, whiter skin than Meghan, green-eyes and a very broad nose. Her grandson has blue eyes, blond hair and his Grandma’s broad nose. People stare at him and then his sister who looks just like him, with brown hair/eyes).
PS: If Meghan left her natural curls out it would not even be a question (look at her teenage pictures). But to each his/her own on #BlackGirlMagic #HappytobeNappy
Not to discount what MM has gone through being light skinned, but doesn’t colorism only affect people with darker skin color? Like that’s the actual definition of colorism. Lighter skinned people don’t experience colorism, but they can experience prejudice…