I’m enjoying the new Vanity Fair, under the stewardship of Radhika Jones, mostly because I was sick to death of all of the ghoulish Kennedy covers and Marilyn Monroe covers. Plus, VF had a nasty habit of elevating mediocrity, but only if that mediocrity was “sexy” and blonde. Someone like Michael B. Jordan should have had the cover of Vanity Fair YEARS ago. He should have had it for Fruitvale Station, or Creed, or even Black Panther. But we’re getting it now, and how! This VF piece is super-long and detailed, all about Michael’s family and how his dad was super militant in Black Power movements and such. There’s also a lot of detail about how Michael operates within Hollywood, and how he’s setting himself up to be the next Denzel, the next Will Smith, the next Leo DiCaprio. You can read the full piece here. Some highlights:
He wants to have a career like Leonardo DiCaprio or Matt Damon: “I’m first and foremost a black man, for sure, but what I’m trying to do, and what I’m trying to represent and build, is universal. We live in the times where everything is based around race. And for me, it’s like, I get it, I understand. It just makes everything so loaded. When the way to do it is to Trojan-horse it, so then people look up, and say, ‘Oh wow, what happened? I didn’t even realize that.’ ”
When he first came to LA: “I remember when I first came to L.A., and me and my mom, we went to all these agencies trying to get representation and they passed on me—WME passed on me, CAA passed on me, Gersh, all these guys f–king passed on me,” says Jordan. He says it gave him a “healthy chip” on his shoulder.
Growing up in Newark: “You get inspired, the possibilities, the dreams, what opportunities are over there. It gives you this hunger to get across the water, across the bridge, across the tunnel, to the other place.”
Black mythology: “We don’t have any mythology, black mythology, or folklore. Creating our own mythology is very important because it helps dream. You help people dream.”
He sees himself & his peers as generational heirs to Will Smith and Denzel Washington. “They broke down those barriers for us. Now it’s time for us to take what they did and take it to the next level.”
Business goals: “I want to create projects for Brad Pitt, but at the same time I want to be able to create a movie for Will Smith, or Denzel, or Lupita, or Tessa. It’s gonna be eclectic. It’s gonna be animation. It’s gonna be non-scripted. It’s gonna be digital. It’s gonna be film, television. It’s gonna be video games.”
He goes on at length about how he’s not “comfortable” in the industry and he’s still searching, still setting goals, still reaching and hustling. I get that – he’s been like that for years now, always working, always putting together deals and projects and more. And you know what? He’ll get there. After Fruitvale Station, I knew that he would eventually be one of the biggest stars in the world. It was a career-defining performance, and he has all the pieces to be the biggest star of his generation. Now, we’ll see if Hollywood recognizes that.
Photos courtesy of WENN, cover courtesy of VF.
I kind of feel like he should qualify that with “African-American folklore and/or mythology” (assuming that’s what he meant) because Africa itself has a vast array of folklore and mythology. Some of which made it’s way to “the new world” in the form of voodoo rituals and beliefs.
+1
That’s the problem he’s talking about, I think. Black people were taken from their continent and brought to the US where they became just slaves, with no culture or roots they could cultivate. You have Irish-Americans, Italian-Americans, Americans whose families came from the Nordic countries… all those communities that have a mutual history and traditions. Then you have African Americans, who can only really trace their roots back to the slave ancestors who were brought from another continent and stripped of their rights and identities. (Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think most black Americans can easily access information about the actual country of origin of their ancestors)
I feel like maybe the context of the comment would be important, because yes, I thought the same thing. And what does he mean about mythology and dreaming?
I just started watching the Wire (over ten years late to the party on that one), and had no idea he was in it! Such a baby back then! He is very attractive
TEN years late to the party? More like almost twenty lol. Show started in 2002.
He was also really good in Friday Night Lights. He joined the cast in later seasons, but they are all well worth a watch. The show was amazing
I came here to say the same. Is he talking about African American? Because Africa has a ton of it. So Black folklore exists.
Edit: Africa has myths and legends. African religious are full of Deities: Ogun, Oshun, Yemanja…
After being in Black Panther he would be stupid to say that there is no Black Folklore. I understood it as “there is no Black Folklore represented in mainstream culture”.
*Yemoja not Yemanja
@Ifeoma: apologies, but this is how it is written in my language and if you google using Portuguese spelling, you can still find the same information.
I also thought, ugh this is problematically phrased.
However, I understand what he’s saying: we have our own European or American myths represented by mainstream culture from the Brothers Grimm to the Mayflower pioneers. Whereas from Jamaica to Nigeria, to Ghana etc there is no concrete knowledge of Folklore in mainstream culture.
And he’s right. Apart from very clichéd notions of voodoo, what do we know other than what we (I am talking as a white person) appropriated such as Jazz music or dance moves?
I agree. I’m brazilian and here those rituals and beliefs are practiced. There was a mixture between the catholic church and african rituals too.
@T: Catholicism originally borrowed rather heavily from Pagan rituals. I suppose it’s easier to convert people when half of what they already believe has been incorporated into the new beliefs.
First thought in my head. There are plenty of African folklore. May be what he should’ve said was that there aren’t enough folklore’s that are represented.
@ Snowslow: You are incorrect. There is more African and West-Indian fokelore (ie:The Lion King) than you can shake a stick at. I was raised on Anansi the spider and Miss Lou (who is well known in Jamaica and used to come to my house because my family knew her) enshrined it on the island sooo yes, a boy needs to be specific.
Ok. I can quote some other Folklore that somehow made it through on my side of the pond but it’s minimal compared to what is out there even of Indian and Chinese folklore for instance. What I mean is that I know American Folklore like Halloween etc. but do not know – and I am sure my French and Portuguese friends don’t either despite coming from old coloniser nations – Anansi and Miss Lou that I just googled and am glad to know now.
Or is everyone here trying to tell me that there is no racism and that black folk tales and roots are deeply respected and showcased in American and European culture?
@SnowSlow:
I don’t know that it’s so much a question of racism as it is “written history and or lack of it”.
The tales, the myths, the heroes and villains in China and India are all the subject of written history/folklore/myths and have been for centuries. And not coincidentally, India and China have huge populations who can afford to go to the movies.
Africa (most of it) transmitted those things orally until fairly recently. Which, as oral tradition relies heavily on music, probably explains the enormous impact that Africa (and all of it’s lost sons and daughters) have had on music. Jazz, blues, R&B, Rock and Roll, Gospel, Zouk, everything Latin American etc.
I think that the Movers and Shakers in HW are lazy. I also think that China and India are much bigger markets for their films than Africa is.
um, sorry for nitpicking, but the Lion King is not originated off of an African myth. It is based off a Japanese Manga “Kimba the White Lion” with origins starting in 1950. Not African. Disney modified the story and emphasized the African visuals/music as part of the US’s infant globalization awareness in the 1990’s. I would not call Disneyfication of a Japanese mid-century fiction “African folklore”.
@Felicia
There is a African folklore written, recounted. I was also listening to a researcher on the BBC the other day about an archive she is digging into with a lot of texts about African myths. The myth of the prevalence of oral history seems to be a simplification and condescending position (not accusing you of it but Academia) as far as I’m told. In French school we read Camara Laye, Leopold Sedar Senghor etc. Bc, like OriginalLala says below, folklore is a constant creation, not an ancient set of stories. And we are incredibly unaware of it in mainstream culture.
@SlowSnow: The myths and the folklore exist. As far as I’m aware, the vast majority of the tribes in West Africa did not have a written form of their language until a relatively recent historical time period which came after colonization. I could be wrong about that.
To the person nitpicking about The Lion king being a Japanese cartoon, please follow link:
https://www.facebook.com/612475849/posts/10155799512880850/
He shouldn’t qualify with that statement because that too would be wrong. See: John Henry, Stagolee, and John the Conqueror. And Toni Morrison has referenced the Tar Baby tale and flying tales from African-American folklore. There are many more.
African Americans do have a culture, and it includes lots of folklore. It’s tragic that he’s so removed from this history that he doesn’t know this and that people generally think we don’t have a culture. I say this because having folklore is a hallmark of cultures.
I agree that there is actual African mythology and folklore (and folklore among other black populations, like Afro-Caribbean). But I would also take issue with his idea that there is no African-American mythology and folklore – there is a ton of it, if he cares to explore it.
This is unfair. Do you not see that you are proving his point? He shouldn’t have to look around for this stuff having grown up in America. I grew up in an extremely literate home and at the age of 13 I couldn’t have told you one single African based or African-American folk tale. I knew who Bre’er Rabbit was and that was it. But I knew a shit ton of stories from Hans Christian Anderson to Beowolf to Bullfinch’s Greek Mythology to the Bible like the back of my hand. Why is that? Why can’t we talk about that?
Black mythology and African mythology are completely separate things, because Black and African are completely separate.
+1 (from the perspective of an african woman)
I’d like to think he meant “in Hollywood.” In that sense, he’s got a point. I would love to see more African and African-American mythology present in the stories we see on TV and in film.
totally. recommended reading: “African-American Folktales: Stories from Black Traditions in the New World”
its brilliant and barely scratches the surface
Well, so many African American citizens have been cut off from their heritage and its rich cultures all across Africa, so I see what he means.
Yes, agreed. I’d recommend Yaa Gyasi’s “Homegoing,” and anything by Nnendi Okorafor. There are other amazing African & African-American writers who incorporate African myth and folklore, but those are the two that jumped to mind immediately.
Keep it moving and watch your back, Michael.
So inaccurate. Many people in the African diaspora have been cut off from our cultures. Even so, Anansi and Brer Fox still exist, and so much more.
Anansi, which was brought west by African slaves, is still a prevalent folklore in Jamaica till this day.
I will always love Anansi-dispite my arachnophobia. 🙂
Anansi is less prevalent but is still known in Barbados. There are also tales of Ossi Moore, the Heart Man, Steel Donkey, Sam Lord (pirate), Chase Vault stories etc.
I know for a fact that the Caribbean from Bahamas all the way down to Guyana have folklore and stories for days.
I’m an academic folklorist (MA and PhD) and what he is saying is patently false as is evidenced by the numerous folklorists who have been studying, analyzing and publishing on African American folklore touching on genres such as vernacular song, material culture and ritual.
He is also displaying a lack of understand of what mythology and folklore is. Folklore is vernacular, expressive culture – everyone (EVERYONE) has folklore in their lives whether they know it or not. I could go on about this because it’s an issue academic folklorists always grapple with (no, folklore is not “just old wives tales”, and yes folklore exists in urban areas). I’ll stop now!
I find it really interesting that we forget that we have our own folklore, always. We are passeist, thinking folklore is something we somehow “stopped producing”.
But don’t you think he is saying that Black folklore historically did not make it into our cultural narrative? As an academic would you not agree with that statement?
that part I agree with – I am more arguing with his claim that folklore doesnt exist. It always has and always will as long as people interact with other people and form communities.
We are constantly creating, re-creating and passing on folklore. Through peer groups or through generations.
Yes @OriginalLala! That’s a great message because it makes us value what we have around us and how we talk, sing, bake etc. I often think that the things we see in historic collections are equivalent to the ones we use at home now. There is a great collection in Oxford of a man – I forget the name – who has vitrines and vitrines of things, from pre-historic stones to light a fire, to contemporary cigarette lighters in chronological order.
I agree, though I do think his comment is fair is that you have to have the background to know that. We don’t really teach it in primary schools, and you only encounter it through specialization in college. The black cultural conscience is relegated to a minority status and more or less absent from the mainstream American narrative.
Thank you for this. I grew up reading African American folklore in children’s book! I think mine was The People Could Fly.
That cover shot is AMAZING.
I know, right? VF has been knocking it out of the park with their covers lately. Not that it would be too difficult with such a handsome, charismatic subject as MBJ!
I think this is the first comment not pointing out the fact that hes so wrong about folklore….
In 2018 you cannot comment about something on the internet without having a PhD in the subject.
Did he grow up in America? If so, I’m not surprised hes ignorant on his own culture considering how they are treated there…
I don’t know anything about folklore but I know a kickass photo when I see one!
hahaha thanks for the laugh and keeping it real on this Thursday afternoon, Alix!
He’s so overrated and he looks like steve harvey.
What?! Do they look alike to you because they both have a moustache? He’s not the best actor ever, but he’s talented and gorgeous too
Disagree on both counts.
I remember him from Friday Night Lights, and he had such star power even back then.
He had charisma and star power as a teen on All My Children. I’m not at all surprised that he’s risen so high. I hope he and Coogler have the same artistic relationship as Cukor/Hepburn, Ford/Wayne, Scorcese/DeNiro, etc. had.
Those are fighting words. Put them up.
Michael B. Jordan is amazing at his craft. There are so many other actors who are overrated (Robert Downey, for example) who have had great success based on hype more than substances.
His performance in Fruitvale Station was passed over for an Oscar nomination and that’s one of the greatest oversights in Oscar history. His portrayal of Oscar Grant was heartbreaking and real. The scene on the platform cut me to the core.
No black folklore?? lol. How hot he’s gotten in the past couple years made me forget that he’s kinda dumb.
I remember him as an adolescent actor on “The Wire”. He had some gravitas even then.
I don’t know about this interview, he comes across as very actor-y to me, like not the smartest. He did 73 questions for Vogue and struck me the same way in that. I do like his work, and he’s from NJ so I have to love him anyway.
PS I recycled my last Vanity Fair about ten minutes after I got it because the font in the articles now is so small and pale, I couldn’t read a single word. Read online instead, which is sad.
Well he IS an actor, so it yes he will come across as one. That doesn’t make him unintelligent.
I get what he’s saying in terms of the mainstream identity, but there was absolutely African American folklore. Some of it was mythology transplanted through the slave trade from its African origins, but some of it originated here. Where he’s correct, however, is that there is no “mythological consciousness” available for black youth to look up to. You have to actively seek out that mythology, and not everybody has the education or resources to do that. It’s been more or less dismissed from the dominant, white Western cultural landscape.
Edit: Some of you really need to be careful about the “dumb” statements here. Lacking the education to articulate something eloquently does not necessarily mean they aren’t making a valid point about black identity in the white mainstream.
Exactly. It’s elitist with a hint of white privilege thrown in to call this man dumb.
I mean, I have two Bachelors degrees, one of which is in English, and I can *maybe* name two or three African/African American mythology figures off the top of my head. I can actually tell you more about Asian traditions because I’ve read more about it. It’s difficult to even find it in academic dialogue unless you are highly specialized in folklore and mythology. How can the average kid expect to know anything?
That’s CLEARLY what he’s saying. Of course it exists. But is it taught? No. It’s given the same treatment as Black History in schools. Barely spoken about, hardly a part of the curriculum. Everything we are taught has European roots.
I honestly didn’t learn about it to any significant extent until I pursued a BA in English – and I had an active interest in mythology as a kid. I have most of Campbell’s books on my shelf. You will find minuscule amounts of African theology in there. We touched on it in my mythology course – but even that was dominated by Western mythology! So it’s absolutely not well known, and it is absolutely prioritized beneath Western traditions. Hell, I knew more about *Asian* mythology than I did African American, and that’s just ridiculous. That’s a huge part of our history, and a lot of it is because we want to erase the blemish of slavery from our records altogether. Teaching slave mythology means admitting America was a slave country.
I get what everyone is saying about black folklore. But walk up to any Aftican American child now and ask them to name something. They can’t. Because it isnt taught to black kids like white and European mythology is taught to us from the time we are small children. It is not info that is readily available within the mainstream. So while he was incorrect in saying it doesnt exist he is absolutely right in the thought that it is not something most black kids grow up with any knowledge of.
+1
Thank you for this comment!
Exactly. It isn’t taught to black kids or any other ethnicity.
Question from a non-american:
Is the folklore taught in homes?
I understand that it definitely isn’t shown in mainstream media but that can’t be blamed fully. I’m a West Indian and a lot of the folklore I know was taught to me by my grand parents and that is largely what has kept it going (less now).
No. Because most African American have no knowledge of it. We are cut off from a lot of our own history and mythology. And unless you are an Academic or purposely seek it out it’s not easy to come by. If nothing is learned or taught from generation to generation then who is around to do the teaching and pass the knowledge down??
It was in mine. My first experience of it was a book of stories for children called “The People Could Fly”
It was in mine. I’m first generation American, though, and my parents read me the folktales from the European country of their birth. I then became interested in Greek mythology, which I read on my own and then again in high school English.
I do remember tiny bits and pieces of African or African American folklore from my grade school readers, like the Tar Baby story, but nothing comprehensive. I feel like I didn’t start learning more about African American folklore, primarily via Toni Morrison, until college as an English major.
There is an immense amount of difference in family tradition versus mainstream media reach. The average child in America learned Western folk tales and mythology through movies or referenced in passing in history classes. The focus is on Western and American history – and even that’s highly restricted because don’t cover Native American history as extensively as they should. African American history is treated even worse. Even when they’re honest about slavery, that’s frequently the only definition African Americans are given – an identity defined by oppression. Their traditional myths, religion, rituals, beliefs – all of it – was stripped away when they lost their homes and then were subjected to colonial Christiandom. I would be very careful in suggesting a stolen people should hold any responsibility to maintaining their cultural traditions enslaved in a foreign land, where families were frequently ripped apart through sale and trade.
In high school, most of us read Odysseus or possibly Oedipus Rex or any of the other great Greek classics in high school. I highly doubt any of us read the Mwindo epic or learned about Anansi. You might know Mulan or Arabian Nights from Disney but lack any familiarity with the original stories and their cultural meaning. Our non-Occidental mythology is filtered through a very Westerns lens and frequently sanitized of its intent. You may get people who have had the rare opportunity to be introduced to it through good, inclusive schooling, family references, or personal interest, but it’s the exception and not the rule. If it was, Black Panther wouldn’t have been such a BFD. It wouldn’t have felt like such a cultural milestone for so many.
Sigh……..
Seriously…all I got regarding this interview is a…
Sigh….
You want to be like DiCaprio or Pitt…to move beyond the RACE thang…
DiCaprio/Pitt are able to DO WHAT THEY DO…because at they are the DEFAULT! The majority of their roles could have been played by an actor…of ANY RACE…but that would NEVER be entertained…because…the Power Structure already established….THE DEFAULT!
Sigh….
Honestly, that statement probably made me the saddest out of everything else in the interview. It just emphasizes how restricted minority identity is that race is something they feel they have to move beyond. It isn’t something you should have to move beyond. it’s something that should just be, but it’s not. Because black people aren’t allowed to not be black.
Oddly, I like Michael B. Jordan as an actor (his performances in Fruitvale Station and Black Panther were outstanding, IMO he made his role in Black Panther the most memorable in the movie), but I don’t find him “hot” the same way Denzel Washington, for example, has always been hot.
He lacks something that Denzel Washington has in spades – charisma and a strong, overwhelming presence – which makes him good-looking, but not particularly sexy, IMO.
When I first saw Denzel in 1981…in “Carbon Copy” and right after that, he got the role in “St. Elsewhere”…CAN THAT BE PUT ON HULU/AMAZON/NETFLIX/SOMETHING PLEASE!!!…even in his 20s…the same age that Michael B. is now…Denzel had…GRAVITAS!!!! He had emotional/psychological…WEIGHT! The complexity that he has manipulated to work for him so magnificently on the screen now…it was like a RAGING UNCHECKED FIRE then…
For me, that’s not Michael B…which is why I will ALWAYS look at him as someone I would love to cook a meal for…and have a talk with him…about some of the talks he’s had with journalists…but sexually…he’s neutered for me…
And there is NOTHING wrong with that! LOL!!!!
Good news Lala, St Elswhere is currently on Hulu. I saw it there last night. Here’s a link
https://www.hulu.com/series/st-elsewhere-3422d26c-5b6c-4a09-aa73-7f3ffdf24740
Tanesha86: THANK YOU DARLING!!!!!!!!!!
I was reluctant to comment on this and throwing my 2 cents in without reading the full interview and here’s what I got from it regarding folklore.
Look how many times Little Women has been re-made. I mean, A Star is Born is now being released for the 500th time. Yet only this year are you getting a hit at other stories, like Black Panther. They’re not a part of mainstream conversation. That’s what he’s talking about. Bringing the tales he’s heard about from his parents to the mainstream and weaving it into conversations like you would about other characters in history.
And I get that. There are so many tales from my childhood that you don’t hear about in everyday conversation about animals and our people that mainstream society doesn’t know. I’m still waiting for our Native American hero to come along and bust all of these stories out since they are at the core of the North American story. sigh.
I know I will catch it for this, but – I don’t get his appeal at all.
Nah. He’s just showing his ignorance on the topic of Black or African folklore. There’s soooo much of it! He probably hasn’t been exposed to much or any of it but that’s really his fault.
I agree, Patty.
He has all the access to information he could want. He’s not taking advantage of it.
People should relax. We all know what he meant. He is not a problematic guy and we should give him the benefit of the doubt.
Just came here to say I love him and I love what Radhika has done with VF. It was sooo white before, and the obsession with the Kennedys and Monroe even just a year or two ago was truly bizarre.
Let’s all pounce on how he should have phrased his statement. That way we don’t have to deal with the essential truth of it.
I’m actually more dismayed by the number of comments that seem to indicate that if you weren’t taught it at school, it’s not something to go looking for yourself because you have a curious mind and that what you were taught is where it ends.
99% of the things we will learn in life are things we didn’t learn in school.
That’s a strawman’s argument if there ever was one. Ignorance is not the same as intellectual apathy, and lack of resources is a very real issue in many parts of the country. Teaching people how to research, how to study, how to learn and to value learning is a very real part of education outside of what you learn in books.
Beyond that, plenty of Western mythology is referenced or utilized in schooling because we consider it culturally relevant. The lack of minority-driven cultural narratives is not a mistake, it’s intentional. They are the Other. You maintain the sense of Other by refusing them access to the mainstream.
@Veronica: My comment was meant as a generalized observation and not an argument (strawman or otherwise) specifically regarding ignorance about this particular topic.
There are far more history subjects that don’t get taught in school than those that do. And even those that do are generally “one side of the story” only. It’s very much like always watching the news on the same channel. You only get the information they want to spoonfeed you and if you stop there, that’s the sum total of what you’re going to know on the subject. Which was the point of my comment.
all of you people commenting on how much or how known any type of African stories are, ARE REALLY AND TRULY EXERCISING WHITE PRIVILEGED TO THE F–KIN FULLEST
let me tell you what it is like t realize as a grown educated black adult raised in America how it feels to know that America traced the records of race horse better than they did slavery
how dare anyone question how or why those original African stories were lost or mutilated just as my people were dragged across he Atlantic
we have not way of knowing where our tribes really are or our ancetral roots, this is such a hole in all blacks
sites like ancestry are a rip off and only show west Africa,nothing specific, we backs should get this info for free from southern Americans that may have family members that owned slaves generations ago
we were dragged here and made Christians, sold on JEZUS,of course we dont know our own folklore
To be honest, there is very little European/white mythology, besides Greek and Roman mythology and Gods. Hans Christian Anderson and the rest were writers of folk fiction. I think the two are separate. Mythology is tied to the religion you follow and Africans were pagan (hate that word), muslim, christian, so each might have a different mythology.
I’m sure there are a lot of African folk stories, but how will those be relevant to African Americans? I’m not that familiar with it, but I’m sure there must be African american stories based down from one generation to the other.. I suspect, it’s never been written down and published..
I knew he’d be a star when he was in All My Children.
Not a fan of MBJ at all; he seems egotistical and I’m really not interested in his persona.
Just throwing in another quote from the article:
“During the filming last March, Jordan and Caple often talked about black historical figures whose stories might make a great movie or TV series, like Fred Hampton, the Black Panther who was murdered in his apartment in 1969, or Mansa Musa, a Malian historical figure of the 14th century known to many African-Americans but virtually unknown to white people.”
That’s what he’s talking about when he wants to create black mythology.
I guess he’s never read a novel by Toni Morrison. More’s the pity.