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I so enjoy The Cut’s How I Get it Done series, which has details from celebrities and high achieving people on how they structure their day and set and meet goals. It’s fascinating to read about their diets, sleep schedules and life philosophy. I was so glad to see their latest interview, with Melinda Gates. She runs the largest private foundation in the world, The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation. Melinda is currently promoting her new book The Moment of Lift: How Empowering Women Changes the World. I’ve covered a couple of other interviews with her so far and I have to say I enjoy her so much. This was a great look into her schedule and how she gets things done. She likes making handwritten to-do lists (me too!), she and Bill are competitive at home with games, and she also talks about the unpaid labor that women do, and how so much of the household work and even petcare falls on us.
Her morning routine
I’m a morning person. I like to get up around 6:30 a.m., and I spend that first hour in “quiet time.” I do meditation, some stretching, yoga, and I always do some kind of spiritual reading.On keeping calendars for everyone’s schedule
As a working mom with three busy children, married to a working dad, I’ve learned that calendars are important. I have one that tracks my schedule, the kids’ schedule, and Bill’s schedule, all in one place. In meetings, I tend to take handwritten notes. I also keep lots of little to-do lists.On how she and Bill stay caught up on shows together
Recently we watched all three seasons of Victoria on PBS, and had to hurry the last day and binge-watch the last three episodes before I left for the book tour, because we don’t watch without each other. If we’re in separate locales, we’ll agree to both watch the same episode at the same time so we’re caught up with each other. My aspirational time to go to bed is 9:30 p.m. Realistically, it’s between 10 and 10:30 p.m. I go on about a dozen [work trips every year] — give or take — and if I’ve been on an international trip, I’m literally in bed by 9:30 p.m.On women’s unpaid labor
Part of why I write about unpaid labor, even in my own marriage, is because it’s the story of women’s lives — the amount of unpaid labor we all do, all over the world. I believe that in healthy marriages you have ask for what you need. Recently, we were together as a family, all five of us. We have one dog. I wasn’t dying to get a dog, because I know for many of my friends, the work of a dog falls to the mom of the family. But Bill and I both agreed that it would be a good idea to get a dog for the kids. When we were on a holiday together with the dog, I realized after two days that I had been doing a lot of caregiving for this dog. It was a pretty high-maintenance dog. After two days, I finally said to Bill: “Hey, we got this family dog for the kids, but it’s taking a lot of my time.” He said, “You’re right. I’m on duty today.” That night, the dog happened to have a gut episode — all over the room. The five of us were watching a movie together and we stopped the movie, turned on the lights, and I started to take care of it. Bill stopped me and said, “Melinda, we said I’m on duty today.” So I put my feet up and read the New York Times and Bill and the kids took care of it.That’s an example of naming what you need and the other person stepping up. We get so used to doing things, as women, and we have to make sure we switch up the distribution of labor. That’s true all over the world.
The only part of this interview that I object to is where she says she’s a morning person because she wakes up at 6:30. Get up at least an hour earlier if you want to be considered a morning person. I wake up at 5am almost every day and 6 when I sleep in. I could relate to much of what she said about emotional labor and women’s work. Also I love that story about Bill Gates cleaning up their dog’s puke. The dude is a multi-billionaire and he is cleaning up dog puke voluntarily. Also, isn’t that couples goals when you’re so dedicated to watching a show together that you promise to watch it at the same time, even when you’re apart? As for keeping track of everyone’s schedules, I wonder if she uses Google Calendar and just won’t admit it.
How cute are they?
If you have a daughter to you’re less likely to end up forgotten in a nursing home when you’re old. Men aren’t groomed to be caretakers the way women are.
Correct and very good choice that we females are “groomed” to be caretakers.
So true. I see this with my mom. Her parents (in their late 90s) refuse to be put in a home even though they need constant care and just expect my mom to take care of them 24/7, even though they have a son. He barely lifts a finger and my mom has had to basically move into their home to take care of them and all they do is expect more and more from her and nothing from him. She has been so groomed to believe this is what she “needs” to do, it’s heartbreaking, and infuriating to watch.
Well, hell. I have four boys. Guess I’m screwed.
Depends on who raised them. My mother in law lived with my husband when we dated and lives with us now. If you raise men to give a sh*t they will give a sh*t.
I think, keyword is groomed.
You can teach anyone anything… or rather, to believe anything.
I think this depends on one’s culture and family – in many cultures it is considered the oldest son’s responsibility to care for the parents, at least financially – I suppose his wife would be expected to do the ‘soft’ care?
My point is, far too often we consider American norms, global norms, and that’s just not true. My older brother moved states, leaving his cushy job in San Francisco, to be closer to my aging parents, whereas I live in a different continent. Shrug.
My grandfather took care of my great grand mother for several years, at a certain point she moved in with my grandparents and when her constitution worsened so much he had to bring her into a nursing home, he visited her every day for several Hours. She didn‘t like my grandmother, he really did the entire work.
My (female) friend’s mother is in a nursing home and she does a lot more for her than her brothers do – the staff has told her that whenever someone has boy and girl children, it’s always the daughters that are their primary contacts, not the sons.
My husband and his brothers are dealing with some issues with their mom and if they had a sister, I guarantee they’d all have ceded everything to her… they keep fighting amongst each other.
Men’s brains aren’t that much different than female brains. Men can learn to cook, clean, and take care of living things the same way women learn to. Most men that don’t do any of those things were raised in a home where either the mother or the sisters did everything. That has to change ! Also, there are single dads out there raising their kids…doing their daughter’s hair, cleaning, cooking, etc. It isn’t impossible.
I hate to admit this, but my children turned out so gendered I can’t believe it. I had two boys and I was determined to raise them neutrally, expose them to a variety of toys and activities, and teach them to be decent human beings. It has turned out to be a lot harder than I anticipated. Then I had a daughter, and she is simply more interested in being connected and useful in our family. So either I wasn’t strong enough to battle culture or gender is slightly more biological than we like to believe right now.
Not that boys shouldn’t be taught to be caring, respectful human beings, as they certainly can and should be expected to behave that way. But it’s been a hell of a lot easier going with my daughter.
Obviously, individuals are individual and YMMV.
My MIL often said something like this. And when she had dementia from Parkinson’s and died at 62, it was my brother in law who stepped up and provided the care- not her daughter (my sister in law). Families vary.
I have 3 boys, no daughters. I hope someone will smother me with a pillow in my sleep before I have to go to a nursing home.
I am hoping to die before I have to go into a nursing home. My m-i-l is in one and this is not where I want to spend my last days.
My dad communicates way more with his parents who live across the world in France than his own brother who lives in the same freaking town. My dad’s brother in law (married to my dad’s sister who also lives in the same town as my grandparents) is the one that does everything for my grandparents. My uncle doesn’t work, is wealthy, lives in a huge house full of useless knick-knacks, and can’t be bothered to check in on his 80+ parents. My grandfather can’t walk unassisted, my grandmother has feet issues. Yet their own son who lives barely 10 minutes away has to be guilted into helping out even one iota. If my dad lived in France, you can bet he would be involved and checking in on them all the time. My dad goes to France twice a year to see his parents. It may not sound like much but my dad has ALWAYS made it a priority to check in with his parents since he left France back in 1980. Ironic that the son who moved halfway across the world to the US has a better relationship than the son nearby. (With my American grandparents my mom was given power of attorney even though she had 3 other siblings so she was more involved just because of that. My mom has two brothers but one lived further away and the other did visit but he has always been very aloof and passive in general so he didn’t do as much just by nature.)
My French grandfather was an only child so he had no choice but to take care of his mom. He visited my great-grandmother at her nursing home several times a week until she passed.
I love the sass about Melinda not being a morning person because she gets up at 6:30, lol. I’m not a morning person but I am inclined to agree.
I agree, 6:30 is not “morning person”. Many people with regular jobs are up or even out of the house by then. I get up at 4:55AM every day, which allows me an hour of personal time before my husband and toddler get up. My husband likes to brag that he is a morning person who gets up at 5AM and it makes me roll my eyes so hard. M-F I go to check on him at 5:50 and at least 9 times out of ten he is asleep. Weekends he sleeps until at LEAST 6:30, usually close to 7, and occasionally even as late as 8. Then he complains that he doesn’t get any “quiet time” (i.e. time before our toddler wakes up). I’m like, “you could have 1-2 hours of that time every day of the week if you actually got up at 5AM like you claim you do!” I’ve told him the “secret” is to be strict about bedtimes but he’s always wanting to stay up late to watch a movie. I’ve decided at this point I don’t even want him getting up at 5 because on the few occasions he does he always wants to talk to me or ask me to help him with something and 5-6AM IS MY ALONE TIME.
I get what she is saying but it still ticks me off to ask my husband to do things because that is just one more thing for me to manage. I want it to be as automatic for him as it is for me, and I dislike settling for this standard of “he is super helpful when I ask”. First world problems, I know.
LOL Google calendar would be amazing but I suspect they’d have their own special program for calendaring not available to us plebs? But maybe I’m just overestimating because they are so mega rich.
I agree with this SO HARD. Like, why do you have to be told to feed the dogs and give them medication and walk them? Why do you have to be asked to do the dishes and help folding laundry?
I love my husband but between him, talking to my mom about my dad, and talking to my sister in law about my brother I’m basically convinced most men are absolutely useless.
Yep. My husband cuts an orange with a butter knife.
I wonder if I were mega-rich if I would still use my handwritten giant desk calendar? I think I still would.
Totally agree on the having to ask is one more task to manage.
But baring that perfect world of not having to ask, #relationship goals is having a partner that follows through after being asked without additional reminders.
God, yes, the emotional labor involved even in noticing a problem and enlisting help can be too much, just one more damn thing.
I’ve been married to my husband for 17 years now, and now that we’re having all these conversations in public, I’ve started to notice more of his “oh, I’ll help if you tell me what to do” attitude and it’s really pissing me off. He’s 47 and I think he should have brains enough to figure out what needs to be done around the house/kids without me holding his hand and pointing. It’s amazing what kind of uselessness men have been allowed to get away with.
I always felt like a strong woman who doesn’t take crap from men, but they appear to have unlimited amounts of crap that they will just pile on us until we can’t move, and then they’ll whine about how they don’t feel appreciated.
Sorry, I’m going off my antidepressants right now and am an irritable disaster today.
YES to all of this regarding how we women carry the mental weight of everything. I have had multiple discussions with my smart, woke husband about this, because he is guilty of some of these “tell me how to help” as well. His answer – and i grudgingly acknowledge that there is truth to it – is that since I enjoy cooking / I’m the better cook, for example, he won’t start dinner, say, unless I ask him to. Because that’s “my” area. OTOH, I won’t run out to trim the grass ever, I don’t care how bloody high it gets. That’s his.
The way we resolve this is that we talk. If I feel that an expectation is unfairly placed on me to always deal with something “because women’s work” or some other crap, I speak up, we discuss, and find a resolution we both agree with.
My husband called me this morning while I was rushing in to work (after working a 16 hour day the day before) to tell me he was going home because his office’s servers were down. He asked “Is there anything around the house I can do?” So I had to THINK for him what needs to be done around the house. Like, bro, STAND IN YOUR OWN HOUSE AND LOOK AROUND.
Preach! I live this every day and it pisses me off. Super helpful mate..when asked, but I am tired of doing all the thinking!
This thread is giving me LIFE!! I need some t shirts:
“It’s amazing what kind of uselessness men have been allowed to get away with.”
“I’m basically convinced most men are absolutely useless.”
“bro, STAND IN YOUR OWN HOUSE AND LOOK AROUND.”
I love my husband, but every time he says, “You should have just asked me to do it!” as a defense for his incompetence, I want to stick a fork in his eye.
Yes!!! A thousand times! “Bro, stand in your own house and look around!!” Make it! I’ll buy it!!!
Agree, 6:30 does not make you a morning person. My guess is they use an online Outlook shared calendar and either copy the appointments from their individual calendars or color categorize on the shared.
My husband is in charge of our dog. I take our kid to the doctor appointments so my husband takes the pup for vet and teeth cleaning appointments. I have one son and one on the way and my goal in life, besides teaching them consent, respect, etc, is to teach them to take care of the people in their lives. My SIL and I end up planning all the events for our husbands side of the family because their Dad is useless at this stuff and my MIL has health issues. No one ever made or bought my MIL a birthday cake until I became part of the family. After no one did anything to plan my MIL’s 70th Bday, I told my husband he and his brother need to step up and take care of this from now on and he agreed. My side is huge, I’m the oldest sibling with a bunch of brothers, so much of the planning falls to me. I’m no longer in charge of his family events anymore. It’s important my sons see their Dad care about their loved ones.
We have a dog who is currently going through some (not major but still need daily treatment and will last about a month) health issues and I have been the one dealing with the bulk of things. My husband helps with his medication and wound care, but I make sure we have a schedule, meds, dressing, follow up visits, supplies from Chewy, etc.
Managing that on top of work and home is mentally exhausting.
I like what she’s saying and what she does, but the reality is they have people in their house to take care of everything. My friend used to be his personal assistant at home (not the ones at work) and I can assure you they don’t worry about the little things like thank you notes and Christmas cards and feeding dogs. Having said that, she said they are wonderful people. His parents live (this was a while ago) on the property and he treats them like gold. Kids are reportedly well behaved and sweet.
My mom always took care of the dogs. Sometimes i think it must be nice to have a penis. It enables you to get away w so much stuff.
THIS!!!
Yeah plus you have the convenience of standing up to pee !😂
The work of EVERYTHING often falls to the woman of the family.
Except BBQing and taking out the trash. Big deal.
Taking out the trash is LITERALLY the one thing I don’t have to ask for to get done or provide input for on how or where or when it should be done.
From the big stuff like child care, to cleaning out the grody sink drainer, to changing toilet paper rolls. Sigh…Always remember a cartoon where the baby’s nighttime cries go right over the head of the sleeping dad straight into the mom’s ears!
THIS SO MUCH!I am a SAHM,and part of the reason is health related,but truthfully the other part is that I like a clean ,organized house,and I’ve tried going back to work three times since my daughter was born,and EVERY single time I’ve come home to laundry,house cleaning chores,bills/banking,scheduling appointments,helping with homework,and cooking and shopping.I admit I’m controlling and am a bit OCD with my house my way sort of attitude,but men just don’t get it.It is truly unfair to work and then come home to chores,and don’t even get me started on caring for the dogs whom I adore,but was not the one who wanted them,because of exactly this…Don’t get me wrong my husband and daughter are great,but house,shopping and pet care falls on most women IMHO,because it just does..
They seem like such nice people. It’s great to see her getting so much attention for her work too.
Uneven workloads make me crazy, and I’m not married/no kids! But I see it in marriages I know, and experience a little of it at work.
I hate the vomit story. It reminds me of men “babysitting” their own kids. Announcing that you’ll take care of the kids/dogs today just reinforces the idea that somehow you’re doing the woman a favor.
My husband and I just kind of naturally split work up based on what we like and what we’re good at. He’d never clean up the vomit, though, he’s a “see vomit, I vomit” guy and no one needs that.
Our dog died in September and I’m digging my heels in hard about not getting a new puppy for this very reason. Everyone thinks it will be so fun, but it will all fall on me, for sure.
My rule is I won’t potty train more than one living thing at a time. No new puppy if there is a kid in diapers under my roof.
My husband travels a lot for work. I’m the lone adult and things just have to get done. 99% of the time I don’t mind but, because I “work” for thank you’s and not $, I do get irritated when the rest of the family starts taking the things I do for granted.
In our house, we have a list of chores (which includes “contribute $x per month) that need to be done on a weekly/monthly/quarterly/annual basis. The basic agreement is that if something is important to you, you do that chore. We occasionally have other grown-ups staying here for an extended period of time, and if they ask how they can help, we just point to the list and say “pick something”. If something doesn’t get done because it’s not important enough to get picked, then so be it. No one gets to complain if something doesn’t get done.
Well. I get up at 6am every morning (I also get up between 5:15-5:30am for morning prayer and then lie back down) and I am most definitely a morning person.
I am NOT a morning person so maybe I do not know of what I speak, but I sometimes have to get up early (sometimes 4/4:30) depending on my job at the time or special events etc so I CAN get up early. I have that capability (sometimes it feels impossible though…but that’s another story).
I’ve always thought the “morning person” thing was more about how you feel in the morning, both mentally and physically, and what you can get done. Like when are you performing optimally? Maybe that does go hand in hand with getting up before 6:30 but idk it seems nitpicky to tell someone they can’t possibly be a morning person if they don’t get up at 5 am.
Due to some unexpected circumstances, my husband and I made the decision when I had a baby last April that he would stay home full time with the baby (and my 9yo from my previous marriage, who spends most of his time with us, and who’s in school during the day but has activities after school). My job is intense, demanding, comes with a commute, but also with some flexibility and tech company benefits (amazing health insurance for the whole family).
At first it was really tough, because I was still doing most of the “default” parenting. Having to ask and remind him of everything, give him lists for groceries etc.
A year into the experiment, it’s been an amazing change. He’s pretty much doing 75-80% of the domestic and childcare work. I do as much as possible (and struggle with major mom guilt) but he’s really stepped up. It was a combination of me being honest about what I needed him to take on, having lots of communication, and being as generous as possible when we can give each other more time.
I have two boys and I cannot tell you how amazing it’s been for them to see me growing my badass career and still being there for the school and kid things and being the same loving mom as always, but also seeing my 6’4″ former frat boy husband being nurturing, taking care of them, cooking dinner, and doing laundry.
I like what Melinda Gates is saying, but agree that having her husband performatively announce that he’s taking care of the dog mess isn’t really very inspiring.
Ask me how many times I’ve cleanup our two dogs’ vomit and sh*t off the floor if they’re sick compared to my husband…or fed them, or made sure they’re walked. Once our 2 have crossed the rainbow bridge, no more dogs. EVER. With 2 kids and 2 dogs, I get the short end of the caretaking stick. My husband is convinced we’ll always have dogs but as much as I love and adore and would do anything for our puppies, I just can’t expend that mental and physical labor towards more dogs.
Ever since having our first baby explaining the concept of emotional labor to my husband and finding balance has been my biggest bugbear. All hetero women need to listen to this: https://www.wbur.org/dearsugar/2018/05/05/emotional-labor-invisible-work /
thanks for the link!. Great podcast. But now I question myself not if but when i have a divorce.
I AM LIVING THIS right now. We just got a goldendoodle puppy for our 4 kids and guess who is the only one actively potty training her?? ME!! Thankfully after potty training so many humans it’s not so bad and she is an adorable fluffball.
Not getting a dog either – husband travels for work, daughter out of the house half the year, lousy climate. They’re dog people, but they’ll have to enjoy other peoples’ pups. I am not the bottom of that slippery slope.
It is so lovely to read about the uber rich dedicating themselves to something to make the world better. When have we ever heard of Paris Hilton doing anything other than promote herself? All that money and she has never volunteered, taken part to help others or the planet…basically nothing to give back at all.
And yeah the dog is another kid. I went out of town once and had to call my husband nightly to remind him to fed the dogs. “Why do you THINK they are staring at you like that?!?!”….oh brother.
I’m loving the shade for 6:30 not being a morning person. As an unabashed night person, 6:30 sounds crazy early to me (Y’all would hate me! I am more a 1 am – 8 am sleeper.)
I work nights and 630am sounds LIKE HELL to me. So yeah, 630 am allows you to say you’re a morning person b/c that’s pretty damn early in the morning.
I grew up in a different household than most. My dad has always done the cooking, it’s his domain and I can’t cook in the same kitchen with him because he is so particular about everything. He also picked up my sister and I after school and helped us with after school homework/dropped us off at after school activities (he did our ballet buns before ballet class after my mom taught him how). My mom had a better paying job with longer hours so my dad was a semi stay at home dad (he went to work super early arriving at 6 AM and leaving at 2 PM to take care of me and sister after school). My dad also mostly took care of the dog once my sister and I went to college. My mom’s job is out of state during the week so my dad by default was responsible for dog care in general. My mom did the laundry and paid the bills but that’s about as gendered as it got in my house. So I can’t really relate to anyone who grew up with a stay at home mom because I never had that ever.
Early on when the kids were little, husband would tell me into to worry about the dishes, but when I would get up the next morning they would still be dirty. I finally had to ask, “Is this ‘don’t worry about them now because you can do them later’ or ‘don’t worry about them because I am taking care of it’? Because only one of those is helpful to me.” It was crazy that I had to ask, but to his credit he apologized profusely. I do appreciate Bill reminding her he had the dog so she should sit down. I assume it wasn’t a one time “favor,” but he gets it now.
I think she meant she’s more productive earlier in the day, hence a morning person. Doesn’t mean she has to wake up at sunrise.