Between my job and my mom being moved into a physical-rehab center this week, I really haven’t had the time or the patience to watch the two Democratic debates. What little downtime I have, I spent relaxing (watching tennis), not stressing about old dudes yelling at clouds. I apologize to everyone who wants to give Bernie Sanders another f–king chance, but I can’t watch him or listen to him. That happened on Tuesday night. Last night was the debate with Joe Biden, Kamala Harris, Cory Booker and Julian Castro. Again, I didn’t watch it. But I hope this accurately summarizes what went down:
Most candidates mentioned their websites during their closing statements. Biden said this
📹Courtesy of CNN pic.twitter.com/RmkgYjhReP
— Bloomberg TicToc (@tictoc) August 1, 2019
What? Let me write it down… Joe-3-0…3…3… wait wot?
There was also this moment at the beginning when Biden shook Kamala Harris’s hand and said “go easy on me kid,” which was supposed to be charming but all of the ladies in the timeline were like Devil Emoji, Skull Emoji, Misogyny Emoji, Nail Emoji, Angry Red Face Emoji.
Joe Biden and Kamala Harris just shook hands before facing off tonight on stage for a #DemDebate rematch.
“Go easy on me, kid,” Biden told Harris. https://t.co/UjbrSN09XU pic.twitter.com/GVSrzhFxJM
— CNN (@CNN) August 1, 2019
And finally, Cory Booker pounced on Biden too.
The 5 minutes when Biden and Booker's simmering fight erupted https://t.co/YA8wI1kPdu pic.twitter.com/3NSQhBBYE2
— POLITICO (@politico) August 1, 2019
Photos courtesy of Getty.
Super cool to call an accomplished professional woman “kid”. Great stuff, Joe.
Former AG of CA. Senator. I can’t.
I’m a white lady, so I don’t know the answer to this, but is calling a black woman “kid” similar to calling a black man “boy”? Is it racist-offensive? Or is “only” misogynist-offensive because it diminishes her accomplishments and status as a senator?
It’s certainly demeaning and sexist, of which Joe is both.
You could also make the (very valid) case that, like calling a black man “boy”, his referring to an accomplished black woman as “kid” is also racist. They are both intentionally demeaning nicknames intended to remind someone that they are not your equal.
Either way, he is not the man I want for president. I’ll vote for whoever gets the nomination because anyone is better than Trump, but we don’t need another bigoted old white guy in office.
it’s not racist….but definitley demeaning and not aproppriate unless they are besties…(which i doubt)
I’m a white woman, too. Calling any woman “kid” is condescending, dismissive and really rude.
Even coming from other women, I don’t like to be called kid, babe, hun, or anything like that.
I’m a grown-a$$ed adult woman. Call me by my name, call me by my last name, call me “Miss”. Ask me what I’d like to be called. Don’t assume.
Don’t be rude, condescending, or dismissive.
Joe Biden isn’t dumb. There is no excuse for this garbage.
I’ve had a couple of older guys call me kid at work, but they’re people I’m friendly with and it doesn’t feel insulting. But a presidential debate? Insulting. Plus he’s trying to “charm” her into letting him off the hook. That is not a luxury you get when running for POTUS .
I didn’t find Biden’s “kid” comment sexist or demeaning. But there were a lot of zingers thrown out last night. I especially like the “clorax” comment from Gillibrand and the “koolaid” comment from Booker even if I don’t know what it means. He gets points for delivery.
Was Booker’s koolaid comment something along the lines of ‘you’ve drunk the koolaid’? That’s a saying that derives from the Rev Jim Jones disaster in South American, where he convinced (most) everyone in his cult to drink the poisoned ‘koolaid’ just before the compound got raided. It’s a weirdly lighthearted comment that comes from a tragedy.
Hi, the Kool-Aide comment is actually a reference to an old school clap back in the black community. We used to say it when I was a kid and it means that someone is “all up” in your business, but they don’t know what they’re talking about (they don’t know the flavor) i.e. that their information is erroneous or faulty in some way..lol!
As expected, it was cringeworthy. Booker came out swinging and looked great. He was definitely the winner and the interactions between him and Biden are a virtual goldmine of memes.
I remember not so long ago when people in this very forum were yelling at me because I said I’m voting for Elizabeth Warren.
Them: “Then you will elect Trump! Only Joe can win!!!”
Me: “Wait till the debates.”
The only thing I can think of is that most of the people screaming about how Biden is The Only One have never watched him in a debate. Because he was no different in the debates this time around than he’s been in previous debates. He’s clumsy and awkward and out-of-touch and unprepared. He sucks, basically.
Contrast that against Liz in her past debates for the senate seat or her work fighting corporate giants on the Senate floor or even her post-debate debates on MSM.
She can handle anyone. She’s fearless.
My partner and I have been team Liz for a while, and it’s heartening how many people in my circle who despised her in the beginning have come around.
Same. Been with her since Day one and it’s been great to see people get to know her the way people here in Massachusetts know her.
She’s the real deal.
I mean, the attitude towards Biden/Warren is typical. Women like Warren work twice as hard to be seen as half as good as men like Biden.
Warren was amazing two nights ago. It’s appalling that anybody would watch those debates and still support Biden. He’s a mess.
Kamala has been amazing in the debates too, you’re right Joe kinda phones it in.
Blown away with Warren after the debates. I mean I always liked her but she is just so damn impressive.
I have seen Warren speak a number of times over the years and she is amazing in person. I am rooting so hard for her.
That is what drink the Kool Aid means but I think a lot of those poor people were forced at gunpoint to drink it and to give it to their children, according to a book I read about it 🙁
It’s such a sad story.
Please see above re: Kool-Aide comment..its a comeback we used as kids..meaning someone’s being nosey, or involving themselves in your affairs, and they are clueless/or wrong about what they are implying.
I swore so, so much in front of my children over this this morning. KID. F YOU YOU CRYPT KEEPER WITHERED OLD WASTE OF AIR TIME. TELL ME AGAIN HOW MUCH YOU RESPECT WOMEN. I AM WAITING.
My reaction to this comment was also “WHAT THE FUKCKCKCKCKC YOU FUCKCKCKCKC FUCKC FUCKCKC FUUUUK”
Gosh, I think it’s charming to be called kid by a white haired person. Guess I’m a sexist, racist 50yo WOC. Eeessshh people, this cannibal fest is just GROSE.
I watched both but not all the way to the end. Bernie kept yelling, a lot. And last night they kept attacking Biden, some of which I think was justified, some of which wasn’t.
I don’t think Biden came off like someone who could take Trump in a debate (and Trump performed horribly in the debates.)
I think Harris and Warren did really well, and I think Castro, Booker, and Buttigieg also did well. What was nice overall was, beyond the yelling and the horrible format where no candidate gets to talk and there was so much interrupting – there WAS actual policy debate, about healthcare, immigration, etc.
I do think there is a divide between the pie-in-the-sky ideas, and the people who want to get stuff done. That’s Warren’s appeal for me – she has these big ideas, and she has a plan to implement them. I think some of the others – Delaney, Bennett- are more practical, so there is less appeal and fewer big ideas, but they could actually probably accomplish more than someone like Bernie.
“some of which I think was justified, some of which wasn’t.”
That’s what I got out of it, too. I think there were plenty of valid criticism, but I think there were also cases where some candidates felt like they HAD to go in on him for whatever reason.
And I agree on Warren – that’s the feeling I get from her. I think she has some really huge ideas, but she seems like she has at least some form of action plan at the ready. She’s really really impressed me lately, and I kind of stan her.
I mean, I’m Canadian, so my opinion is definitely not that important, but I’d love to see Warren get it. I was a little worried for her early on, but she’s shown that she’s ballsy.
“some of which I think was justified, some of which wasn’t.”
The Democrats need to quit beating up on each other and go for a FULL FRONTAL ASSAULT on Donald J. Chump, the orange shit-gibbon.
I mean..it’s a debate? Someone has to win. It’s only natural that we would start to widdle down the field by contrasting the candidates’ respective platforms.
The best candidate will survive the attacks. Personally, I was happy to see Delaney go after Liz and Bernie. It worked in their favor IMO and hopefully means that Delaney won’t be on-stage at the next debate.
Yeah I get that its a debate. I just didn’t think attacking Biden the whole time was necessary – not because he can’t take it, because I didn’t think it was that helpful overall.
I was replying to BayTampaBay but yeah, I get it, Becks1.
It did get uncomfortable at several points because it felt like most of the candidates teamed up against Biden. I think they’re just really struggling to set themselves apart and honestly, Biden has done next-to-nothing to win our votes yet is still leading in the polls. At least Harris, Booker, Castro etc are coming up with ideas to improve our current circumstances. I don’t know. I’m probably being unfair because I just don’t like Joe LOL.
I actually DO think it’s worth it for people to go after Biden right now. He’s the supposed frontrunner, but he’s trying to run off of Obama’s legacy when it suits him. Of course the other candidates are going to challenge him, and they should. We don’t need another person in office who can’t follow through on their promises.
@Kitten – now THIS, I agree with completely:
“Biden has done next-to-nothing to win our votes yet is still leading in the polls. At least Harris, Booker, Castro etc are coming up with ideas to improve our current circumstances. ”
I just said to someone today that I think Warren is going to get the nomination, and then I think VP will be Booker or Castro.
I think battling over ideas is so important. On the other hand, it was incredibly stupid to go after Obama. Obama is popular, he has a great legacy, and it only helps Trump to paint a democratic administration as a failure. I’m seeing this headline all over the news today, and it was such a strategic mistake from these candidates. It’s amazing how people can be so selfish and ultimately self defeating in the quest for scoring points in a debate.
I agree with you, I don’t think Biden can take Don the Con in a debate. I try not to type or say #45’s name, I rather call him Don the Con. Anyway, I have not settled on a candidate. I live the following. 1) Elizabeth Warren; 2) Sen Bennett; 3) Sen Cory Booker; 4) Beto O’Rourke. I still think joe Baden is too old for the job. I’m thinking by November I maybe have to change this list because it’s early to make a firm decision.
No Kamala?
To me she seems shaky on health insurance plan, I really don’t know what her plan will be next week, it keeps changing and that’s important to me.
I like Kamala a lot. I think her record as a prosecutor is going to be a weak spot for her though (I don’t know that much about her record, I need to research it more, it just seems to be main criticism that gets lodged at her.)
Ah I see. Yeah that seems to be a common criticism of her, BNA fan.
@Becks1-Yeah the DA stuff is complicated and definitely something that she can get attacked on. I would worry about that with Trump because you know he’d talk about what he’s done for criminal justice. (eyeroll) But Kamala could easily point to his ad about the Central Park Five, not renting to black people etc…I think she could overcome it.
Meant to comment on health care, not health insurance, lol.
I didn’t have the energy to watch either. I’m voting for Warren (though I’d be happy between Harris and Warren, I’ve liked Warren since 2002 and she’s got the association with Paul Wellstone that as a Minnesotan I cannot ignore).
Bernie and Tulsi are both Kremlin supported. I won’t accuse them of knowingly working with the Kremlin because I am too lazy to look it up, but Tulsi is pro-Assad and is winning a Drudge poll, plus there’s a Tulsi or Trump twitter thing. I don’t like Yang because I don’t like the Bernie Bros 2.0 and I don’t like anyone Silicon Valley supports. Biden is too old. His age isn’t too old; he’s too old and far too problematic. Buttigieg is fine but so help me if another relatively inexperienced wunderkid gets it over several qualified and experienced women, I’m going to hold a rage circle.
I like Klobuchar but she’s going nowhere. The rest… go run for Senate in your home states. We need to flip the Senate more than anything.
I don’t understand the appeal of Harris. Her policies as DA/AG weren’t progressive, her big health care plan is terrible (why does it take 10 years—after she would leave office—to really kick in?), and I don’t understand her big overarching theme.
Warren? She wants to take on the 1%. Biden? Return to normal. Buttigieg? A new voice for a new era. Booker? Love. But how do you sum up Harris?
I was lukewarm on Harris until I saw her in person. She’s still not my top candidate, but she’s dynamic in the flesh.
Harris is a well educated and well connected woman from the fifth largest economy in the world. Her Senate seat is safely Democrat . Experience in California demonstrates she knows how to govern.
FYI: IMHO, Governing and generating change are not the same things.
It doesn’t take 10 years to get covered though, if you want Medicare you will be able to buy in immediately. You cannot kick millions of american off of their employer insurance without a big transition period, and staying in the bernie bubble and believing that the people are clamoring for that? Hello Trump 4 more years. Listen to the people when they talk, and i don’t mean on twitter. Her plan is fantastic, listen to the health care experts. Progressive health care experts. Not the I demand a pony twitterati.
I absolutely love Harris’s work in the senate and she’s an amazing asset to the Democratic party but…I guess I agree with sandy in that I’m not 100% sure I understand what she stands for. Like, Booker has a lot of the same fight that Kamala has plus he’s really capable, fairly progressive, and a really smart guy. But overall, he doesn’t have the baggage that Kamala has. Don’t get me wrong–I like Kamala–but I guess I just can’t see a reason why I would vote for her over Booker.
@Darla- The transition for M4A is 4 years. I don’t know if that will be long enough but it seems reasonable to me. Also, most people aren’t in love with their private healthcare plan, they just love their doctor and they can keep their doctor with M4A.
I’m for Kamala and Warren second. I want a women and she is whip smart and could take on trump and leave him reeling. I also like that she is a women of color (I’m white) and would be a symbol to the rest of the world that America can reject the bigotry and racial hatred that trump has unleashed. Biden would be fine and would bring back great competent smart people to the executive branch, but I worry that he will not hold up well campaigning against trump. Two old white guys on a debate stage optics doesn’t thrill me. Warren is brilliant but if Bernie doesn’t drop out at some point they may split votes and hand the nomination to Biden.
All the great ideas for health care and loan forgiveness and cheaper college are pie in the sky if we don’t have the senate and would probably need 60 votes so really difficult. We also need dem governors so we can expand Medicaid in red states, something important that the republicans refused to do. So, I like policy debates but in the end we need a dem to bring back sanity and decency and competence more than anything else and we need to be realistic about what we can accomplish.
I’m voting for Warren too. I feel like she is supersmart, super prepared, and would seriously get to work. And dear God, there is a lot of work to do.
There’s a number of candidates I think would be great, but she is still my top pick. If she doesn’t get the nomination, I will be disappointed, but I will gladly donate, volunteer, and most importantly VOTE for whoever the Democrat nominee is.
In case we* get lucky to have a blue POTUS again ( * “we” includes the world outside the US, too!) she might end up in a situation like Obama who has been blocked for eight years by the Republicans. And in the end people were complaining he got nothing done.
@ Allie-Literally ALL the candidates will be in this position if we don’t have the senate–it’s not unique to Warren.
Darla, that’s Buttigieg’s plan and has been for months—way before Harris came out with hers this week. So why not just vote for him?
I admit Warren and Buttigieg are my two favs right now. I just don’t see Kamala’s rationale for running other than she saw an open field and decided to run. (Which is what a lot of these candidates did, but they’ve come up with an elevator pitch and she really hasn’t).
@Kitten: Yes, I know. That comment was about Warren, though, that’s why I mentioned her. It’s ridiculous that bipartisan work seems to be the exception for years. I have the impression that it’s especially Republicans blocking anything that is initiated by the Dems even when they might agree with it. This is a problem in other countries, too, but not to this extend.
@ Allie-It really is insane. It’s so frustrating to be in a position where we can vote for a candidate who has a dream platform, knowing that almost none of her policies will be passed unless we gain senate majority. It’s nuts. And it does make you wonder if the arguments among Dems re: policy is even worthwhile when we know that we’ll likely be hamstringed in the Senate. Sigh.
Betsy I love that you said that you’ve loved Warren since 2002. Some Sanders folks like to make it seem that she just got into politics yesterday and decided to copy Sanders’s platform.
Fighting for consumers and battling corporate corruption is literally her life’s work.
I heard her speak at a small fundraiser for Paul and she was MINDBLOWING in person.
Gabbard’s Kremlin support was pretty much confirmed for me on Twitter last night where former NRA spokesnasty Dana Loesch was pushing Gabbard hard.
Let’s not forget her support for Assad, and that family “commercial” that espoused homophobia.
I just cannot with Tulsi. I don’t understand why anyone would trust that woman.
I was telling my BF last night that I think the horseshoe theory applies here where candidates like Tulsi are so far left that they’re basically far right. It sort of reminds me of the Glenn Greenwald/Aaron Mate crowd and that ven diagram where self-described progressive Tulsi supporters overlap with the QAnon crowd. Like, what are you fighting for? Russia? It’s bizarre.
@Lightpurple – What connection are you making between the NRA and Russia …?
@agenbiter – it’s come out in the last year or so that the NRA is largely funded by Russia and LaPierre and several other bigwigs went to Moscow, to say nothing of Marina Buttina’s relations with them. It’s one of the ways the GOP took in millions from Russia.
Kitten
Have to disagree Booker has baggage. In fact I’d venture everyone has baggage, it just depends which issues you view as more important. Warren for instance is not popular with native Americans but that’s largely ignored because they don’t have the voice and power African Americans and Latinos have sadly. If you follow natives on twitter they are very anti warren.
Also what’s happening is that the front runners baggage is aired much more both in the media and by their opponents so if the impression is that Kamala has more baggage then say Klobuchar who was also a prosecutor its kind of a false narrative shaped by the fact that Klobuchar is not a threat to anyone and therefor nobody is really attacking her much.
Kamala last night got attacked by both moderates and progressives because she’s probably the only viable candidate that can sort of bridge centre and left. Beto was supposed to have that potential too but he’s kind of faded.
If booker was polling as well as Kamala he’d get attacked on Wall Street, big Pharma and education (charter schools), issues where he’s been very much to the right of Harris.
Dear Biden,
Are you kidding me with your statement “Go easy on me, kid?”
Sir, as POTUS, NO ONE is ever going to “go easy” on you.
Commander in Chief of the US Armed Forces comes with the job, do you honestly think making decisions as the leader of the free world is ever going to be “easy?”
The US has so many problems in the 50 states, and as a world leader.
We need someone who understands what the job of POTUS actually is, has the smarts, and humanity to work with everyone to get things done. It is not a popularity contest. Neither is a job you take simply because you have worked inside the gov’t. for decades and now you feel its “your turn.”
Biden, as a lifelong Dem, I say to you….You are past it. If you can’t hold your own in a debate htf are we supposed to actually think you can do the job of POTUS?
Man, this 2020 election is gonna be a sh*t show. Should we all just write in “None of the above?”
No, because the Trump supporters will still vote Trump, and he will win.
I get it, I absolutely do. I think Biden is pathetic at best and bigoted at worst. But Trump is literally a white nationalist. He thinks Nazis are “good people”. No Democrat (even the worst one up there on stage) is as bad as Trump.
It saddens me that our bar has dropped this low, but we cannot forget that it has.
Ann, yes I am in total agreement with you. We can’t expect perfection, but we can certainly do better than Trump and a legacy of TrumpKushner. And yes the bar is low and it’s sad but in this case, for myself anyway… anybody but Trump. This is a very critical election! We know that. So any Dem will do, and let’s hope a few emerge further and do well for us. Normally, I would be more discerning, but then normally I would NEVER have a toilet brush with ANY President’s likeness it on, yet LOL I do now. (Didn’t want to intrude on CB’s great Amazon recommendations but yeah you can buy one there, highly recommend it!)
Sanders and Warren mopped the floor with those Republicans who were on the stage with them. The corpratists are gonna need all the help they can get from the DNC, MSNBC and CNN to stop them.
LOL
Bernie is a union buster.
I do agree that Warren was good. I still have Warren, Castro, Harris, and Biden as the final four.
I wish people would leave Biden in the dust. Not choosing him is not a bad reflection on Obama at all. Most of us know that the only reason Biden was choosen as VP was to keep the racist whites in the Dem party quiet. The ones that don’t think they are racist but have no problem supporting policies that hurt brown and black people. Those who cringe at slurs but not bad behavior.
Sanders *dodges tomatoes* and Warren were the winners for me, too. I loved Booker last night, though. I assume that you probably aren’t crazy about Booker’s foreign policy or the pharma stuff but did you watch last night and what did you think?
I thought Booker came off as the “winner” last night. Castro had a lot of good things to say as well. I like Kamala, but I wasn’t impressed last night. Bennet (reminds me of the Jimmy Stewart character in “Mr. Smith Goes to Washington”) had a *lot* of good things to say, but sadly, he is so lacking charisma, I don’t think he has a chance, esp. in this political urgency. Yang’s only “thing” is giving everyone $1K/mo: he’s a one and done.
BEST LINE OF THE NIGHT: Gillibrand: “First thing I will do is Clorax the Oval Office.” Love it! She made a few good points (as did Insley, but he doesn’t have a chance). Overall, I just don’t care for her for some reason.
And yeah, no one should be getting in w/out *real* experience. As of now, my picks for who will be in the lead: Joe, Kamala, Liz (who was *amazing*) , (sadly) Bernie, Pete, Corey, Julián, and MAYBE Amy.
My motto still is: VOTE BLUE NO MATTER WHO!
I cannot stand Yang. Completely agree with you about Bennet (lol @ Jimmy Stewart).
I feel really bad for Gillibrand because she has a fairly sold progressive record, she’s a really strong fighter and has a lot of great qualities but…I always forget about her for some reason. I feel awful saying it and maybe it’s just a function of having such a crowded field but yeah..she did good last night but always seems to struggle setting herself apart from the pack.
I don’t know about Castro being in the final but I hope so. He’s one of only a few candidates that I’ve donated. I just wish we had seen more from him last night. He kinda got lost in all the fighting between Biden and Harris and Booker.
I feel like I was watching something else, because what I saw was the dems taking their eye off the prize, dismantling everything ‘Obama’, and skimming over what’s happening now. Booker’s peacemaker moment looked phoney when he quickly took his turn to beat up Biden…c’mon, the ‘in my neighborhood’ stuff to look too cool for the room? What I saw was a sad demonstration of dems eating their own, ignoring the good/hope the party represents, and trying to destroy the wrong old white guy. So very disappointing.
It almost feels as if Joe is solely relying on his connection to Obama, esp. for the AA vote. That’s only going to take him so far. Watching him up there, sometimes like a stunned wildebeest, just grinning and shaking his head, or stumbling over his words… it doesn’t inspire much confidence.
IF he is the nominee, I only can hope he has a real dynamo for VP (Liz, Kamala, Pete, or Corey).
I seriously cannot wait until the 2020 election is over if only so I’ll never have to hear the terms “eating their own” and “circular firing squad” ever again LOL.
And hey, maybe Biden will ride Obama’s coattails to victory because some Americans naively believe we can rewind to 2008 and pretend that Trumpism was just some weird fluke and not a wholly predictable manifestation of several decades worth of increasing right-wing extremism.
But I’m pretty sure that if Biden gets the nom and is lucky enough to win, we’ll have another Trump in 2024, possibly Dan Crenshaw or maybe Ivanka. I also know that if Biden is the nominee we will lose the level of grassroots excitement that gave us the House in 2018. In other words, his presidency would be disastrous in terms of alienating the progressive left and left-leaning independents alike.
I agree with you, Kitten. We NEED that Blue Wave energy, and we need the young voters to come out in DROVES. Dems need to be coming out against DUMP, not cannibalizing each other. There’s GOT to be another way to *stand* out: get your message out w/out totally denigrating other candidates. Disagree, put out YOUR message, and move on.
While it’s probably a futile dream, I just hope Bernie doesn’t &^%$ things up this time, but not reining in his “Bros” to siphon off voters for the Dem candidate. I also fear Gabbard will pull a Jill Stein (another one in that photo with all the Russians), and move to Independent and siphon off voters as well.
I just don’t think Joe Biden is really dying to be president. I feel like he took the nomination from the DNC and said “okay if I have to” but doesn’t really want to be there.
I mean, Warren manages to do it, right? They’ve given her so many opportunities to take shots and she always says “I’m not here to to go after other candidates”. She pushed back against Delaney only because he attacked her first. So yeah, I think it’s possible to focus on how Trump’s destroyed our country and the plan to fix it.
Sadly, I think a portion of Sanders-supporters will stay home if he’s not the nom. I REALLY hope I’m wrong but judging by the #NeverKamala, #NeverWarren and #NeverBiden hashtags on red rose twitter I think they’re pretty dead-set on Bernie or no one. I’d love to see some poll numbers on that topic.
@hunter – You’re right that he seemed much more motivated when he ran for President in 1988 and 2008. This seems more like the opportunity was there and it was something he once wanted to do.
Biden cannot beat trump in the debates. I pray the dem base wakes up in time. I think Kamala can and I think Booker can. Warren, probably can. Biden cannot. He is showing his age big time people.
Booker and Harris have both proven that they can annihilate Biden. Warren could go after him for his cozy relationship with credit card companies. Biden is just..bad. Sorry. He just is.
Donald’s brain is liquefying. I sincerely doubt they’re going to bbe able to hide his dementia that long. It’s obvious if you watch clips of his speeches.
At this point…I don’t think Trump will actually debate anyone. I can see him throwing some kind of fit, saying they (media) are all biased and he won’t play. Because he’s scared of course, but as President, he’s made it clear that he will break precedent in order to avoid doing things he doesn’t like to do.
Is it just me or did Biden have a facelift! His face looks like a Michael Myers mask in one of the pics above 😳
It was SO distracting last night! He’s obviously had Botox (TBF, I think most of the female Dem candidates have as well) and he has veneers and *maybe* a facelift but possibly just fillers.
I mean, he’s an admittedly handsome guy but he’s definitely starting to go overboard.
I was actually wondering why Prince Charles was on stage when I saw the profile picture in this post. I did not know he had so little hair left. But yes, there’s at least botox involved.
Hah,
I think he looks like Jeff Dunham’s “grumpy old Walter” puppet. It’s distracting!!!
OMG – I just hopped on here to ask the same question. At the very least, he’s had a gallon of Botox.
When I see Bernie Sanders yelling and waving his arms, I imagine him in a meeting with world leaders. He doesn’t have the gravitas to be president.
Bernie will never get elected in the general. Middle America won’t vote for him. My top choices so far: Pete, Cory and yes, Joe. I’d also go for Yang, but I know he won’t make the next cut.
Agreed.
Neither does our current president, but let’s all hope this has been a temporary abberation and not the new normal.
Debates are a forum to present your ideas and explain why they are better than your opponents. But being able to debate well is not necessarily an indication that you can govern well. As far as I’m concerned, my cat can beat Trump in a debate and she would govern better too. And that’s the message we need to get out to people to get them to the polls, this person, whoever the nominee is, will govern better than the Orange Voldemort.
You heard it here first: Lightpurple’s cat for president!
So sorry about your mother. Tough times for both of you.
I am a feminist and a Democrat. I honestly don’t believe the “kid” part of Biden’s comment to Harris was sexist or demeaning. I do think if she had been a younger white man (to add the racial element) he would have said the same. From an older professional person to a younger professional person is the way I view it. I don’t think people should pounce on him for this and we should not bring our “super politically correct” game to demolish our own candidates in the fight of our lifetime to destroy the dictator trump. Remember: the enemy is Trump and all our efforts in the end must be to bring him down. Let’s not squander energy. Remember the main goal. Internecine squabbling can only debilitate us in the fight to preserve our democracy.
Kamala Harris didn’t seem to think it was either and she brushed it off later in an interview
A lot of people seem to feel this way, and I guess I get it, but I am the opposite. I am looking for a cut throat bitch (man or woman). I want someone who is going to cut them up and leave them bleeding on the ground begging for their mommies, and then I want to nominate them and set them at trump and his enablers like Moscow Mitch. That is what I want. So if you cannot cut throats, I’m not interested in you. That sounds terrible. Don’t care. We’re in a war.
Hear, hear!
YES. I keep telling my sens and rep this!!
I can’t say that I picked on any demeaning connotations in Biden’s joke. Even after readings others’ objections, I still don’t see it. I think that Biden was going for deprecating and avuncular, as in emphasizing his own advanced age.
I agree. I felt like he was making fun of himself, not her.
Emphasizing his advanced age and emotional fragility — not a good look for a candidate for US president.
Thank you.
I was so confused when I read that. I can’t keep up with what I’m supposed to be offended by this week.
I hated last night. Tuesday was better. I am disgusted with CNN. The questions were awful and clearly meant to instigate in-fighting. Horrible moderators. The whole thing may as well been in a boxing ring. I will never watch any debates hosted by CNN again.
It was SO obvious that they were trying to pit the candidates against each other. They weren’t even subtle about it. Personally, I don’t mind a little squabbling but I wish the candidates would get there themselves, without having the moderators lead them there. Also, there were moments of real discomfort, like when Tulsi went after Kamala.
But I thought Tuesday night was pretty awful too in how the moderators framed M4A and also Chris Matthews post-debate interview where he was essentially attacking Warren.
They prioritized drama over being informative.
I HAAAATE that they give absurdly small time limits for candidates to explain complex problems and policy ideas. So pissed that they frame questions with GOP talking points. It validates the talking points when they aren’t worthy of that.
This is exactly why I can’t and won’t watch these debates. I agree that the Republican talking points are being validated and that makes me crazy.
I was out with friends last night, consciously not watching the debate, and most of us seem to prefer Warren although a couple people think the Pocohontas baggage has ruined her chances of winning. We had an interesting debate about whether the country is ready for a gay president. But we all agree that Joe’s time has long passed and that the only way the Dems will win is with a candidate who can fire up and inspire young voters the way Obama did. A tall order for sure.
CNN wants to turn the debates into a free for all reality show for ratings and ad money. They should be moderated by non famous policy wink types and get rid of the audience.
Also get rid of all the people polling at 0 or 1 percent. Enough already.
To me, the top tier is still the top tier. I didn’t like the way CNN produced this set of debates, and I wanted them to ask about working to protect the election and democracy itself. I didn’t watch all of both but my impression is that just Mayor Pete and Cory Booker found ways to bring it up. It’s hard to get into policy details when it’s not business as usual. And gratitude to Inslee for correctly framing the urgency and pervasiveness of the climate emergency. Perspective is needed.
PS I hope Castro stays in the game at some level.
I don’t for former Republicans…PERIOD…so that knocks out Warren and Gillibrand…and Biden’s policies over the decades have been detrimental to everyone I know…so there ain’t no way I would EVA vote for him for ANYTHING and I was DEVASTATED when POTUS Obama picked him to be his running mate….
So I am picking the person that Hillary Clinton took to meet her money people back in 2017…because I have been down for Hillary for over 35 years…
I am picking Harris….
Gillibrand was a Republican? I know she was a conservative dem when she repped an upstate NY district, never heard she was a republican. That’s interesting about Warren. I follow a lot of black women on twitter because I know who the dem base actually is, and I have seen this mentioned a lot.
No mention of Gillibrand being a Republican in her bio. She did start her political career running in a conservative Republican district. Why would anyone say that? Either ignorance or ambush. Gillibrand has moved to the left as she took on more statewide office.
But you can learn about her background here. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirsten_Gillibrand
It doesn’t matter that Warren began as a Republican. The Republican party used to represent a very different set of values. Hillary Clinton began as a Republican too. We can’t draw these lines now — DONALD TRUMP STARTED AS A DEMOCRAT.
@Who ARE These People….
First of all…I don’t need to be told to research anything…when I say what I say…I’ve already done my vetting…I’ve been tracking Gillibrand FOR YEARS…I think she’s a wonderful Senator representing her district….whose right leaning ways, which comes off as “Republican Lite” would not garner my vote in a POTUS primary….
And It doesn’t matter to YOU…it matters a HELL of a lot to me…if someone was a Republican voter during the 1980s…Elizabeth Warren was FIRMLY a Republican…and I would NEVA vote for someone in the primary who voted and supported Ronald Wilson Reagan….and his horrific policies that damn near destroyed SO MUCH! And btw…I know of MANY who are STILL dealing with those horrific repercussions!
And Liz tore HER DRAWS WITH ME PERMANENTLY when she stated that the Dems rigged the election for Bernie….that told me…EVERYTHING I needed to know about her….
And furthermore…Donald Trump was NEVER a Dem…he gave $ to Dems to help him in business…but I’d bet a year off my life that POS NEVA voted in an election….
PERIOD!
There are at least five of the candidates that I would be happy to support: Warren, Harris, Booker, Biden, Bennet, etc. Not Bernie! But, Instead of delving into their opponents’ history, why not debate policy? Give the voting public a chance to really know their positions, not just that they are great at going for their opponents’ jugular. Our country needs a President who is not only smart, but who will bring dignity back to the office. Save the hellfire for Trump!
My impressions from last night (disclaimer: I’m a die-hard Warren fan from back when she was at Harvard criticizing Bill Clinton for Glass-Steagal repeal and bankruptcy reform): Joe Biden is a disaster for the Dems if nominated — out of touch, fumbling, unconvincing and unable to explain his middle-of-the-road ideas. He will kill the enthusiasm of young voters in the party and depress the hell out of the base. Fortunately, de Blasio seems hellbent in taking him down. In fact, I most enjoy de Blasio when he’s attacking Biden. Ditto for Booker.
Gillibrand can’t seem to gain any traction even though she’s decent in the debates. Kamala’s health care plan may be good, but she can’t explain it, can’t seem to spit out her answers and seemed off her stride last night. Yang is putting it all on his guaranteed minimum income idea. Inslee is as freaked out about climate change as I am and seems like an empathetic & decent guy. Castro gives the best answers on immigration reform did a good job selling universal Medicare. I want the nominee to be more compelling than a ham sandwich and Bennet does not satisfy that criteria.
Conclusion: I think my winners were Castro and Inslee, but no one has yet knocked Warren of her pedestal. She’s still the gold standard on ideas, expertise and personal character, IMO.
It doesn’t matter if anyone wins a debate with Trump. Hillary beat him hands down, but the media still said it was a tie. The debates don’t matter. The only thing that matters is that our nominee wins the electoral college–getting to 270 is the game. We don’t have time (or the majority) to do away with the electoral college before the election. We also can’t change the fact that Biden is polling so high with moderate Democrats all over the country. He was our VP and will build on Barack’s policies. NATO and our allies respect him. I’ll vote for our nominee, whoever it is. But we can’t let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
I read this today and it really spoke to me (for me?).
Here’s the first part, but the whole thing is worth a read.
“I really don’t care about him.
I know you think I do, but my sadness really has nothing to do with him.
I know who he is—and more accurately, I know what he is.
I know that he is just a mirror.
He has simply revealed clearly the disfigured ugliness of the place I call home and the people I live here alongside—and that is the thing I grieve over. And this is not the mourning over a singular loss, it is a daily grieving.”
https://johnpavlovitz.com/2018/12/13/i-dont-grieve-over-his-cruelty-i-grieve-over-yours/
Oh I like Jon Pavlovitz…follow him on Twitter. Will share and thank you.
So true . Also depressing is the realization that so far we have very few checks and balances against facism. We were just relying on people in government to be good.
Thank you for this; right on target.
You beggars sure are choosy. Trump won’t debate anyone, and if he does, he will just personally attack them.
You can like Harris and Warren all you want- this country is not electing a woman.
Its Biden or Trump, unless the foolish Democrats tire him out with their relentless attacks.
YAWN.
Yawn away, but I live near Macomb county, Michigan, the region who flipped the state for Trump, and those knuckleheads won’t vote for a progressive (gender less important). Upsetting as it is, because I don’t see a better candidate than Warren.
Yawn? Republican? No, I’m just being realistic. I cried when Hilary lost.
My personal opinion, which is certainly as valid as yours Kitten, is that the left has gone too far left to be seriously considered as a real leadership option. I mean, these people were bashing Obama. Who I also voted for.
Anyhow, it’s been real, I love commenting on this site, it’s always a crazy fest.
@Jennifer: if you are going to call us “beggars” and “foolish” I’m asking you, Is Don the Con afraid of debating any one of those know nothing Democrats? You are saying Don the Con “won’t debate anyone” What is he afraid of? It’s Obviously, you are a republican who accepts a liar, thief, puss* grabber, race bater who was fined for discriminating against people of color. The person you are going to vote for was fined by NYS for discrimination and you call us foolish… Please have a seat.
I agree with kitten, YAWN
The only foolish person here is, look in the mirror.
This country already elected a woman as president by 3 million votes.
Now, we can argue over the electoral college, but saying that America won’t elect a woman has already been proven false.
Damn straight! Never forget that 45 had to con his way into the office. He lost the popular vote to a woman.
We did it once, we can do it again.
I bet Jennifer also said that gays will never be able to marry and marijuana will never be legal and stuff like that. Please, the country is changing and saying that a women can’t get elected is laughable. I don’t care where you all live, look at polls of people under 35-40, that’s the future, a much more multicultural liberal future that includes lots of women running things.
Thank you Jennifer, a voice of reason
Agreed, and THANK YOU. Enough of this BS. I’m no fan of Biden myself, but if he is our candidate then you can bet your a$$ I’m voting for him. As someone said above, we can’t let perfect be the enemy of the good. I will take an old man who sometimes makes clueless remarks meaning no real ill will over the wannabe fascists, oligarchy-embracing creeps, and true progress-blockers in office now. Male, female, almost 70 or not even pushing 50, IDGAF anymore, as long as they stand a chance to defeat the threat we are facing now. Pay attention to the policies and leave the wokeness tests at home.
And that’s where I get so frustrated on these posts now – enough of this stoking performative outrage over casual remarks. Was it a stupid comment for him to make? Yes. Could we have a better candidate? Yes. Does Biden have some problematic aspects to him? Hell yes, all the candidates on that stage do. But we are wasting our energy, anger, and attention in the wrong places. The more time we waste navel gazing and testing each candidate’s arbitrary “wokeness” the more chance we give the conservatives and Republicans to win this again. I feel a repeat of 2016 coming all over again every time a political post comes up on this site.
The one thing I do agree with in your post is that I think Trump will try to skip debates. He doesn’t like doing them, and I think he’s been spoiled so much as POTUS that he sees no point in doing things he doesn’t want to do.
No way is he skipping the debates. He didn’t skip them the last time and he won’t skip them this time. He loves his TV time. And he knows that his base loves when he goes on the attack and the debates are the perfect time for him to do that.
Last time he wasn’t president, though. He doesn’t need a debate to go on the attack, he can do it at a rally or on twitter.
He’s broken obligation so many times on matters that were of even greater importance than debates… I just don’t see him thinking the debates are a big enough deal that he can’t skip them.
I’m a progressive Warren fan and I think there’s a good chance he skips the debates. He’s not trying to win over voters, he’s trying to whip up his base into a rabid frenzy, get out the vote in the right districts, and win with a minority. That’s his plan.
In the meantime, could someone goad him into denigrating Detroit / Michigan the way he did Baltimore? Or maybe somewhere in Ohio? Don’t do it until October of 2020, obviously. But really, how hard could it be to draw him into a blunder like that?
I’m sorry for you and your mom. I’m sending love to you, favorite internet writer person Kaiser.
I think he was acknowledging that she was the only opponent that could take him down. It struck me as a real compliment.
We aren’t going to be able to have our cake and eat it, too. Again, we will have to try and choose the lesser, (but importantly – most viable), of some evils. The one who can unseat Trump will get my vote no matter how distasteful I find them. Because the fact is that almost nothing could be worse than Trump. I think the democrats should push the candidate that has the best chance, period.
I prefer that the nominee isn’t an old white guy. But I’ll be traveling to a swing state to get people to the polls no matter who the nominee is. I’d vote for a moldy sandwich in the general. I like Harris, Warren, Booker, Buttigieg the best… but seriously I’m an anyone but 45. And we all need to be there for the general. Republicans vote. Period.
Thank you so much for your commitment to go to swing states to get voters to the polls! Ground game efforts really do matter. THANK YOU!!!
I’ve naturalized and signed up to be a poll worker just so I can vote Trump out and help ensure that everyone who is entitled to vote gets to vote.
I understand why Biden polls high. People want normalcy and calm. I’m not saying he’s the best person for the job but I think the perception is that he’s a moderate and I think that’s what a lot of people are looking for. Some of the ideas that these candidates are floating are good ones but I think change will come slowly. It’s said most American’s are centrist and I agree. People want the same things every go round: jobs, healthcare and prosperity. And people want to know they have a future. If Biden ends up being the nominee I’ll vote for him. Trump must be defeated, that’s the first step we can deal with rest later. And we need to do everything we can to close that gap in the Senate. Eyes on the prize.
Darla, it’s best if the “cut-throat bitch” does not cut other Democrats to ribbons or there will be nothing left for the Rethuglicans to do. Let’s not slay our own warriors. The opposition is watching for the weak points in the dem candidates. Best believe they will exploit and distort any weakness to the max. Do not help them win the election! There’s a bigger picture here. Yes, one dem must win, but our party should be strong since we must all re-unite to face the biggest evil of our time and defeat it.
Because I’ve donated to the DNC, kinda regularly, I get so many texts and e-mails about donating. I finally replied to a text for donations saying that until Biden and Sanders are out of the running, I won’t be donating, please stop texting.