VF: The Sussexes made the Cambridges ‘seem dowdy, suburban & rather dull’

VF diana harry william

Vanity Fair just dropped their new cover story and hallelujah! I’ve been lamenting the fact that no American outlet has done a significant and deep dive into the Windsor family’s current dramas and here we go. Notably, VF didn’t ask Katie Nicholl to write this piece, with all of her sugary Middleton sources. This was written by Michelle Ruiz, and it was written for an American audience as opposed to the repressed, regressive psychodrama playing out in the British media and British public right now. The VF cover story is absolutely worth reading in its entirety, and unlike a certain Tatler cover story, this one was not written to embiggen the Cambridges and it doesn’t seem to be done with any of the Windsors’ approval. It does seem like there are some Sussex allies quoted, but mostly this is just straight analysis.

Diana & Meghan exposed the monarchy’s wooden ways. Like Diana in her day, “Harry and Meghan were suddenly too electric,” said Anna Pasternak. “They made the Cambridges”—Bill and Cathy, goes the joke—“seem dowdy, suburban, and rather dull. That does not go down well in the palace.” For continuity’s sake, the House of Windsor prefers to train the spotlight on the monarch and her direct heirs.

Pushing Meghan and Harry away: Three decades later, Meghan was staring down the paradox that had plagued her mother-in-law: The royal family demands duty from the women who marry in—to relinquish normal life (and their passports, according to Meghan) in service of the Crown. But if they’re too sparkly, the palace, like a sullen teen, gets jealous and resentful. It’s a no-win predicament familiar to women, and women of color in particular: You’re either too much or never enough. When Meghan and Harry announced their decision to step back as senior royals last year, the fusty palace establishment “started to push Meghan and Harry away completely,” Diane Abbott, the first Black female member of Parliament and former shadow home secretary, told Vanity Fair.

The monarchy is out of touch: Instead of protecting the monarchy, the Firm’s alleged unsupportive treatment of the Sussexes has only lurched the institution into existential crisis, fueling questions about its colonial roots and Britain’s systemically racist present. “The queen is a figurehead for an empire that refuses to understand that its days are gone,” said Kelechi Okafor, London-based host of the Say Your Mind pop culture podcast. “Diana came along…and then Meghan Markle came along, and everything started to fall to pieces.”

William & Harry are playing out their parents’ dynamic: “William and Harry are playing out the dynamic of their parents,” Pasternak says. Harry tracks with Diana, a rebel spirit fueled by fury at the tabloid press, blowing up the family’s cone of silence in a blockbuster interview. Meanwhile, she says, “William is very aligned with his father in his sense of duty above emotion.”

Speaking about racism: As president of the Football Association, William has spoken out against racism in the sport before, including in January, when he condemned “despicable” abuse against Manchester United player Marcus Rashford. In the fallout of the Oprah interview, the Duke of Cambridge found himself making a rare public statement to declare, “We’re very much not a racist family.” “It begs the question: Why didn’t you speak up against racism put out against your own sister-in-law?” says Shola Mos-Shogbamimu, Ph.D., the British intersectional feminist activist and author of This Is Why I Resist: Don’t Define My Black Identity.

MP Abbott on the courtiers: She says this coterie strikes a “monolithically white, male, and upper class” profile—what Bonnie Greer, the American-British playwright and former deputy chair of the British Museum, calls “bloke culture.” According to Stott, who has raised money for the Royal Foundation, formerly shared by the Cambridges and Harry, stiff palace staffers “feel like they’re protecting them, but actually they’re doing a disservice to the royal family.” The entrenched male establishment at the palace seems unlikely to engage with the racial firestorm now burning outside. Meghan and Harry’s allegations of racism within the royal ranks is fueling a deeper reckoning on race in Britain. “If you can treat a princess that way,” said Parliament member Dawn Butler, “just imagine what ordinary Black women go through every single day.”

The future of the monarchy: “I think the monarchy as we know it will last as long as the queen is alive,” Abbott said. After her death, “I think there will be a big public debate…and I think what the royal family and their advisers did with Meghan will be part of the argument for change.” Abbott anticipates the debate to reach the floor of Parliament, with a “clamor to look at the current arrangement and maybe move to a more Scandinavian monarchy, where you don’t have all the pomp and ceremony.”

Wait, what?? “I’m not 100 percent sure that we will see Charles ascend to the throne,” Pasternak said. “The Sussexes have sparked something so fundamentally incendiary in this country that it is changing the face of Britain, and I think the monarchy as an archaic institution may well topple.” Busting the palace’s meticulous Operation London Bridge succession plan for the queen’s death would seem unlikely, but “it may be that there is such a groundswell of public opinion against [Charles] that it’s deemed by the firm preferable for William to ascend then because he’s younger, more relatable.”

[From Vanity Fair]

Again with the pipe dream about William ascending to the throne instead of Charles. It won’t happen. What will happen is that Charles ascends to a weakened throne as a deeply unpopular and irrelevant king. And William, as Prince of Wales, continues to be a holy terror and people stop pulling their punches about what’s really going on with both Will and Kate. While this VF story came a lot closer to what’s really happening in the monarchy right now, there are still too few people actually laying much of the blame at Baldemort’s feet, which is where it belongs. Sure, Charles and the Queen could have changed things significantly. But William has f–ked things up completely.

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132 Responses to “VF: The Sussexes made the Cambridges ‘seem dowdy, suburban & rather dull’”

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  1. bonobochick says:

    Didn’t Michelle Ruiz get called out on twitter for being anti-Meghan?

    • Cecilia says:

      She is. She was all for princess kate until after the interview kate started getting some flack. All of a sudden it was “we shouldn’t put women down”. However, this piece really is a good read. And im happy they actually threw people in there who know about race and are black women themselves. Instead of a white palace source bleeping about “we aren’t racist”

      • GINEVRA says:

        For those people who revere the Royal Family and think of them as a deity and look at them through rose-colour glasses then I will recommend the following list of books which, if you’ve not already done, are enlightening and jaw-dropping. They are factual as the writers did research from documents sealed in vaults in Windsor Palace; the documents called The Marlburg were in the hands of the Nazis and seized by the American and British forces who were stationed in Germany….see below

        Marburg Files – Wikipediahttps://en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Marburg_Files
        The Marburg Files, also known as the Windsor Files or Duke of Windsor Files, are a series of top-secret foreign minister archives discovered in Germany, May 1945 near the Harz Mountains and compiled at Marburg Castle, Hesse.


        Author. Peter Fearon: Behind the Palace Walls: The Rise and Fall of Britain’s Royal Family
        Buckingham Babylon : The Rise and Fall of the House of Windsor
        by Peter Fearon

        The Royals: Author/Kitty Kelly

      • Carmen-JamRock says:

        I’m a recent convert to watching Netflix’s ‘The Crown’ and wow! I really only got the account because i wanted to see what the season 4 fuss was all abt but my daughter insisted that I cant possibly see S4 before starting from the very beginning so I’m binge-watching and am now on S2: Ep9 (Charles going off to Gordonstoun) and I JUST! watched (then went to research) the Marburg Files like…2 episodes ago. And…..wow! These royal hypocrites are soooooo full of shite.

    • Bren says:

      Yes. I read one article from her – the golden era of Kate – and I haven’t read another article from her since.

      • Cecilia says:

        I just read the article and i have to admit: it was a good one. Not perfect tho. But it was good

    • Moxylady says:

      Yeah. Well. They ARE dull and boring.

  2. Aaliyah says:

    Not going to lie, I actually agree with this article…. Let’s face it, the Sussexes were the more interesting, charismatic, dynamic and ambitious young couple, while the others, not so much. Jealousy is an absolute incurable disease, it seems, in the British monarchy. No wonder the press has to prop the heirs up. They’re not willing to work and prove they’re worthy of praise, but want their sycophants to praise them anyways. Good thing Harry and Meghan left! Onto bigger and better things now.

    • vs says:

      I don’t think work would have changed anything…..Meghan is just way more charismatic and way much smarter than Kate could ever be. Remember that famous panel with the 4 of them? Meg outshined them all including Harry but strangely enough Harry was proud…. look at kate on that panel and you wonder if she could even articulate a single thought that is worth listening about….after that Meghan’s intelligence somehow became a flaw. To this day, Meghan is quoted, can you quote a single thing Kate said? she is not a smart woman and that should have been OK.

      Now let’s look at H vs the other brother. People are drawn to him; he has that warmth that cannot be taught; you either have it or not! H despite his flaws was able to create the IG and Sentebale….despite being born and raised just like W. W is just uninteresting, no matter what. Every thing he does ring false; like he is doing it for his profile not because he cares. I am looking forward to what H&M will do…..the “work” of W&K just rings hollow. Look at his supposedly anti-racist stand in football; the guy is clearly an idiot! who can believe him when he said nothing when his own sister-in-law was attacked?

      As far as Charles is concerned, he is no different from Thomas Markle. he just has more money!

      • Merricat says:

        The Cambridges have zero charisma, but that’s no excuse for laziness. Hard work goes a long way toward creating good will.

      • Brielle says:

        I agree with you:on that panel,I was astounded that Meghan blew them,she was just better…I could not to this day understand what Kate was mumbling…
        William has sycophants who tell him that he is the best and his poop smell roses so why would he work on himself? Harry,on the contrary has to learn cause nobody was propping him…

      • (The OG) Jan90067 says:

        The thing is, while the Cams DO NOT have charisma, they also just don’t give a shit. Now, if *that* was not the case, if they threw themselves into causes, showed *some* warmth, caring, some REAL empathy to those they deal with, the *star wattage* charisma wouldn’t matter so much, nor would it be that glaring a difference.

        But they just. don’t. care. They feel you should just be grateful they showed up for 30-45 min (if at all!). Unless of course, it’s football (for William).

      • Mrs.Krabapple says:

        “can you quote a single thing Kate said?”

        Kate’s two most memorable quotes are, “Can you . . . um, . . . test the . . . um, . . . smell of the tea . . . by smelling it?” And (while touring the royal art collection with the Queen and discussing Faberge eggs), “Do the still make these?” She clearly went to college solely for the “MRS” degree.

      • swirlmamad says:

        In hindsight, that panel was the beginning of the end and it hadn’t even really started yet. She hit the ground running, just like they claimed Kate would do. It’s been 10 years….bellyflopped and faceplanted is more like it.

      • Alexandria says:

        @VS I did not even watch the engagement interview. That panel was the first time I heard Meghan speak and I was shocked at the difference in quality. But Harry still seemed genuine when he was talking. Meghan showed she did her research and she articulated so well. I was speechless. This is not an easy skill to attain.

    • Betsy says:

      I agree with you that it was fundamentally about the work in some ways (or lack thereof, rather). I can’t fault people with no charisma. Most of us have no charisma. It’s a special thing and you either have it or you don’t, but that’s no excuse not to do your job.

      Charles is a charisma vacuum relative to Harry and Meghan, as are Anne and the TQ, but they absolutely put in the time and effort. They don’t get the press attention they once did for a variety of reasons, not just lack of charisma, but they still keep going. Bill and Cathy Cambridge barely deign to do work, and it’s appalling.

  3. Cecilia says:

    “William is very aligned with his father in his sense of duty above emotion.”

    Did pasternak forget that charles did a very public and quite frankly embarrassing interview in which he admitted to cheating?

    Also she’s quite the william cheerleader. Lmao. Charles won’t be skipped, people need to leave that idea behind

    • WithTheAmerican says:

      I was coming to highlight that sentence too, because Charles and William both are nothing but emotion, Charles couldn’t even be kind to Diana because he was so besotted with tampon dreams.

      William’s rage issues are nothing but leading with emotion. What this sentence should say is both Charles and William are invested in their privilege to maintain and keep the power they’ve inherited though no merit of their own.

      “William is very aligned with his father in his sense of duty above emotion.”

    • Ronaldinhio says:

      Unless something particularly awful was revealed about Charles – he will be king.
      I’ve wondered forever how much information the British press hold and withheld around the relationship between Charles and Jimmy Saville (prolific abuser and sexual predator)
      This information and how they can spin it will keep him in their pocket forever.
      Andrew and Epstein is just a demonstration of their power

    • mimi says:

      Which is funny because I am 99.9% sure she was the one who wrote the Kate The Great article in Tatler that caused all that commotion!

      • windyriver says:

        You’re right, that was Pasternak. Still have the digital version of that Tatler issue and just checked.

    • ABritGuest says:

      Exactly. And he authorised Dimbleby book which said he had an unhappy childhood & was forced to marry Diana by Philip but never loved her. And William was known as reluctant who only started doing full duties in 2017 so where’s this deep sense of duty please?

      Anyway another article with the refrain about how much William needs Harry & Harry knows him best (where’s Kate in all this?). It says the monarchy’s survival depends on a reunion between the brothers.

      Will never understand why the institution was so cruel to someone (Harry) that is apparently so important to them. No strategic thinking but I guess they thought things would be back to normal if they drove Meghan out, never thinking Harry would step back too.

    • Isabella says:

      Yes, and the ending of the story is vomity. William won’t be king for many years, unless Charles gets killed in a car crash. So “before long” could mean 20-30 years. Being king isn’t one of the most important jobs in the world. It’s a silly job & will seem even sillier when William at long last ascends to the throne. He doesn’t need Harry’s help.

      “Before long, William will have “arguably one of the most important jobs in the world, and he’s going to need the support of the person who has been his right-hand man since he was a child,”

      • (The OG) Jan90067 says:

        “…..and he’s going to need the support of the person who has been his right-hand man since he was a child,”’

        Uhm…isn’t his WIFE supposed to be his biggest support(er)?

      • swirlmamad says:

        Unless the talk behind closed doors is that his wife won’t be around to be his biggest supporter by the time that day comes.

    • what's inside says:

      Lead by example. Those are golden words of wisdom when adhered to in the best sense. Charles has paved the way for William through his example. Charles has been petty, jealous, entitled, cruel, ruthless, and vindictive. William is applying all the lessons he has been taught starting from early on watching and listening to his parents tear each other apart. If she were still living, Diana would be horrified at the toxicity, but Charles ultimately is responsible for it all.

    • Agirlandherdog says:

      The only thing William has a sense of is entitlement.

  4. Julia K says:

    When people, or institutions fight for their very survival, they will resort to any means possible to preserve their reason for existence. Harry and Meghan threatened their centuries old way of life so they need to not survive in order for the rest to exist as before.

    • Cecilia says:

      The irony of that is that meghan and harry are more a thread to the institution outside of it than when they were still a part of it. If there was somebody in that institution with any braincells they would have made a real thing of this fab 4 thingy. And they would have defended meghan. No matter what the real feelings about her were behind closed doors. If you are an institution that needs star power to survive, you need to harness that star power no matter who brings it.

      • Lizzie says:

        Agree. It would have been so easy to let Harry and Meghan do what they do best and then in 20 years baldy could claim he was always working queitly behind the scenes. It isn’t hard to see this was all so unnecissary.

      • Betsy says:

        Yep. It was just that William the rage monster wanted them gone, leaked appropriately to get that done, and Charles did nothing to stop it.

    • Myra says:

      The Sussexes were a gift from above for them, but instead of using the idea of the couple to their advantage, they resorted to their old-age tactic of backstabbing, undermining, plotting and scheming. The Brexit environment made them believe they could get away with it, but ultimately there will be a reckoning for what they are doing now. When you think of it, William will be one of the most compromised monarch when/if he ascends the throne. A compromised person is a dangerous person (See Trump).

    • Noodle says:

      I loved her coinage of “Bloke Culture”. Apropos and witty.

      • Alarmjaguar says:

        Agreed, I hadn’t thought about how the courtiers might be mostly male (maybe because of prominent stories about, who is it, Angela Kelly, the jewelry lady?) but that’s very interesting to chew on.

  5. Nomegusta says:

    There’s a lyric in the song Apesh*it by Beyonce and Jay Z that goes

    “I said no to the Superbowl. You need me I don’t need you.”

    That is exactly how I feel about the monarchy in relation to H&M. They don’t need the monarchy, the monarchy needs them.

    Saddest part is, if Jawz and Buttons weren’t so jealous they would have benefitted the most. They didn’t need to knock H&M down to feel taller, the latter would have reached out and elevated them just because it’s their nature.

  6. Woke says:

    I think one thing that doesn’t get talked about enough is the role the UK political climate played in the harassment of Harry and Meghan by the press. And honestly I don’t see any change happening while the current government is in place. And until reputable British media start writing pieces like this I don’t see change happening either.

    • Sofia says:

      I do agree. Meghan joined the family when Brexit and Nationalism was growing. As was anti immigrant sentiment. Hence Meghan became the poster child for the Brexiters as she represented everything they hated – not British and a non white immigrant. And then social media amplified that.

      Had she married in 2012/2013 possibly even 2014 which was a time when social media wasn’t as big, maybe the media coverage wouldn’t have been that bad (I mean it still would have but not AS BAD if you know what I mean?)

      • Woke says:

        Sometimes I get the impression that some people think if the royal family stop briefing against the Sussexes the negative press will die down. I don’t see that happening exactly because of the political climate. Many right wing media figure jumped on the anti Meghan bandwagon and won’t let go.

      • Merricat says:

        @Woke, the right wing media is not the Sussex audience, obviously. And really, the more H & M do in the world, the more unhinged the right wing sounds. Who would be proud of have the approval of the Piers Morgans and Sharon Osbournes? Oh, right–racists. Who cares.

    • BlueToile says:

      It is interesting that you mention the political environment around H&M, and their subsequent racist treatment. For some time it has been in the back of my mind that the treatment if this couple is somehow tied to Brexit/Nationalism/MAGA/science denial/the rise of the far right across the globe. Now we see P Morgan on Tucker Carlson, anti-Sussex stories being floated in the US media, them being labeled as “woke” as if that is a pejorative. I just can’t seem to shake the feeling that it is connected. I have wanted to ask here about other’s impressions.

      • Robin says:

        BlueToile, you are absolutely right, and I have been thinking along similar lines for some time. Hatred of Meghan and Harry has become the point of commonality for the uneducated; the sexist; the racist; the disenfranchised left-behind voter; the immigrant persecutor; the covid myth maker and vaccine conspirator; the rigged election theorist, and so on. They make people very angry, because they make people feel very defensive of a world view that is essentially individualistic and wilfully ignorant rather than collective and aspiring. And such an idealistic couple got the worst timing possible – marrying onto a world stage hit by covid and into a UK buoyant with Brexit racism. The pandemic called on people to work together, but large numbers wouldn’t join in the effort. So, show me an anti masker and medical expert hater, and I’ll show you a Meghan vilifier. The UK didn’t want to be part of a collective and pulled out of the EU. So, show me a Brexit voter, and I’ll show you someone who wants Harry stripped of his titles. Similar polarisation was of course concurrent in the States, with Trump and his anti science, anti immigration, lowest common denominator drip feed. So, no doubt you could show me a person who believed that covid could be killed by drinking bleach, as well as someone who hopped a few tweets sideways to a thread about Meghan’s fake pregnancy and how Archie doesn’t exist. Social media has been so febrile with hate from all sides and about all things, with M&H in the middle, that I thought either one or both of them would be killed if they didn’t leave the royal family.

      • Saucy&Sassy says:

        Robin, I agree that the timing of H&M’s marriage made it much more difficult, but I can’t help feeling that because they married and because of who they are, they are keeping to the forefront the issues surrounding . . . well, everything you listed. I don’t think that’s what they want for themselves (who would) but the light shines not just on them but the really good things that they are doing, and will continue to do in the world. They’ve brought a lot of people together worldwide as supporters–think about that for a minute. I think as bad as it was for them in the past that the future will be pretty spectacular for them.

      • BlueToile says:

        Thank you both for your replies. I had wondered if it was just me, but apparently not. I agree that if they had not left the UK something very dark was going to happen to that little family. It sounds as if their security in the UK may have been being reduced in an effort at sabotage or otherwise plotted against. IMO monarchists better hope nothing happens to Meg or the kids. I truly believe Harry would burn the House of Windsor to the ground without a second thought if that occurred. There has to be some part of him that blames Charles/Institution for his mom’s death.

    • SenseOfTheAbsurd says:

      Yes. Like with Brexit, there was a lot more racism and hostility seething beneath the surface of British society ready to be weaponised than a lot of us realised.

  7. Pepperpot says:

    Yawn, same old same old.

    The institution is not going to skip Chuck and Bill has no sense of duty. Bills idea of duty is doing as little as possible.

    • Lucky Charm says:

      Oh, William has a sense of duty, as in he knows what that means in the abstract. He just doesn’t act on it.

  8. Becks1 says:

    Huh. this is interesting. I’m definitely going to read the whole thing. yay for a Dr. Shola quote!

    And of course Harry and Meghan making Will and Kate look boring was a problem – not just boring, but lazy.

  9. OriginalLala says:

    Burn it down, burn it all down. None of these people deserve the insane and unwarranted priviledges and platforms they receive for simply being born.

  10. Tiffany says:

    The more I look at pictures of Harry from his youth until now, the more I just cannot fathom there are people out there that do not think he in a Windsor.

    I mean, come on.

    • equality says:

      I wouldn’t be surprised if the RF quietly did DNA tests on him or, if they thought/knew he wasn’t, they would do one now and completely disown him. So, yes, he is one of them.

    • (The OG) Jan90067 says:

      He looks exactly like Philip did when he had a beard (there’s a pic out there of PP in his naval whites side by side w/one of Harry). Twins.

    • Elizabeth Phillips says:

      Yes, it’s REALLY obvious, but you can’t reason with the people who are convinced he’s not, because he’s a redhead.

  11. MerlinsMom1018 says:

    Please Kaiser, NEVER stop printing that pic of the CW entrance by the RF. It says absolutely everything without saying a word.

    • Tiffany says:

      I am surprised a hole did not pierce through Waity’s chest with the way Harry was staring at her.

      If looks could kill, Harry would be on death row.

      • MerlinsMom1018 says:

        She damned well knew it too…the look on her face 😆

      • Feeshalori says:

        Was this during the service because I didn’t see that at all unless l wasn’t watching the right coverage. Others have also made mention of how hard Kate was staring at Harry as well and I didn’t see that either.

      • Nic919 says:

        This was at the end of the service as they were leaving their chairs. So Harry had the entire service to stew on Kate’s little bitch face move when they first arrived. His look to her is why any of her pale attempts at flirting or reconciliation will never work on Harry.

      • swirlmamad says:

        @Feeshalori, I think they are referring to the CW service last year when Harry looked like he was throwing flaming daggers from his eyes walking up the aisle.

      • Feeshalori says:

        Oh, duh, my frazzled brain is on overload these past days with all these threads and occasions running together! Yes, l remember the CW service very well, but l actually meant the funeral. I didn’t see Kate staring at Harry during the funeral and was wondering if that was something l missed. Thanks for your responses though!

  12. WithTheAmerican says:

    Bill and Cathy. Yessss.

  13. Seraphina says:

    The Sussexes make the Cambridges seem lazy, incompetent and rather toxic.

  14. Lauren says:

    There was an article in an Italian newspaper talking about the unsure reign of Chuck. It said that the succession is a given, but the consequences are not. Because Chuck is not popular in Scotland, the Commonwealth is pretty meh on him especially after Meghan, and he does not inspire the trust that the Queen does. There are talks that Charles could do a “soft regency” in favour of his more “popular son” Baldingham, the source quoted for this in the article comes from Politico. And I think I know just who is the source. The thing is if this is true, that they are having these talks behind the scene, then they are aware that they are in deep sht and the survival of the monarchy is not so sure, and that maybe Sussexit wasn’t a good thing for Chuck at least.

    • Nina says:

      Charles has been waiting 70 years to ascend the throne. There is no way he steps down in favor of Baldy. No matter how unpopular he is. He is a selfish little man. If he cared that much about the future of the monarchy, he wouldn’t have jeopardized it with his demand that he be allowed to have a mistress because every previous Prince of Wales has had one.

      • Lauren says:

        A soft regency isn’t necessarily Chuck stepping down. It’s Chuck handing more roles to Baldemort than normal. Which let’s make no mistake: he will have to. Charles is not young and I’m not sure if he will be as long-lived as his parents. Add the fact that Camilla has health issues and is even older than Charles. Then take into account that by the time Charles is king, if he follows through with the plan to slim down the monarchy they will be down to 4 senior royals: the King, the Queen, and the Wales. So either Baldemort is given more stuff to do as to not stress out the not-so-young King or Chuck will have to suck it up and ask his siblings for help, and Baldemort might throw a tantrum because he isn’t getting the attention he deserves.

      • Becks1 says:

        I think we will definitely start to see William and Kate do more tours when those pick back up again – we all know they love to use them as vacations but its also the only way we really see them out and about.

      • equality says:

        But post-pandemic with countries struggling with economic effects how many are likely to be keen on a high-priced royal tour?

    • Cecilia says:

      Not just for charles. Sussexit wasn’t good for william either. Why do you think we see so many articles insisting that william needs his brother? And with plans to slim down the monarchy and limit the amount of engagements im not sure if william will be as popular as his grandmother.

    • Nic919 says:

      Changing the order of succession in any form will not happen. If it can skip Charles then it can skip the Cambridges altogether and so they will never do that. It only happened with Edward VIII because of his nazi connections and Charles has nothing remotely close to that in his background.

  15. Ann says:

    There was the first Elizabethan era. There was a Victorian era, and a Georgian era. There will be a second Elizabethan era. The writing is on the wall, though, and there will be no more eras. The world has evolved, people!

    • Bettyrose says:

      ITA. She’s been queen longer than most of us here have been alive and in many cases longer than our parents have been alive. She’s a cultural icon. She’s just a thing that is and none of us remember otherwise. And Charles, well…

  16. IRMAVEP says:

    OMG! William is the skid-mark on the underpants of the RF! He hasn’t even begun to show the world his toxic, psychotic personality. There could be no worse outcome to the current mess than William ascending the Throne. Charles has had an additional thirty years experience and would be a far steadier hand at the helm than arrogant ignorant William. Although Charles has betrayed Harry, my impression is that Charles is being emotionally blackmailed by William to do his bidding ‘Or else!’ You can picture him threatening his much smaller, less powerful and less confident father. Imagine William as king- lazy, arrogant, entitled. He would, I believe, allow Carole to rule as a defacto-monarch to save himself the effort , and Kate would be in her element – having gained Carole’s approval at last. Kate would become the face of Windsor – and as she ages that face will become harder, more brittle, more chilling. Lord help the Brits if William makes it to Monarch.

  17. Lizzie says:

    Someday someone involved in the shenanigans will write a tell all. Then the lamebridges will be seen for who they are and who they never were.

    • Jais says:

      Yeah, I would love a tell-all on the Cambridge’s someday. The article talked about the familial jealousy, esp. when Meghan sparkled too much. But the article doesn’t explicitly say what are the consequences of that jealousy, just that the sussexes left. There’s a whole lot that happened in-between there. A reader might conclude that the jealousy is the reason Meghan and Harry felt “unsupported.” But it was more than just being unsupported. The bigger conclusion is that the Cambridge’s jealousy led them to literally leak false stories bout Meghan making Kate cry and pretty much tell the tabloids that it was open season on Meghan, sanctioning them to go after her. I don’t feel the article quite went there in making that bigger connection and maybe that’s bc William is still being protected as he is, as the article states, the future of the monarchy. Yes, they called the Cambridge’s dull and jealous, but there is so much worse that can be written about their involvement. That said, I really appreciated the diverse voices in this article and the distinction made between those voices and the bro-club voice of the courtiers.

  18. Mads says:

    William is Charles on steroids when it comes to jealousy and his sense of entitlement. I picture a future King and PoW briefing against each other and the tabloids pushing for more and more to feed the voracious clickbait revenue stream. Charles will throw William under the bus and his affairs will become media fodder; likewise William will brief against Kate to keep her in check if she begins to get positive press. In his mind, there can be only one.

    It will reach saturation point and the irony is that the two who want the spotlight so much will probably be the ones to push it into irrelevance.

  19. FancyHat says:

    Really interested in how US and UK coverage has diverged so much on royals.

    Also curious when Charles starts leaking against William. His ego isn’t going to handle William being more popular when Charles is king.

  20. Kalana says:

    Harry and Meghan made the Cambridges look not surburban or just dull but small, superficial and smug. They made the Cambridges look like Dursleys.

    Kate does seem very much an Aunt Petunia and William is a bristlingly angry close-minded Vernon.

  21. Lizzie says:

    If Charles ever has to pass to the other brother he will leave scorched earth. He will not be passed over quietly.

  22. Amelia says:

    “Made the Cambridge’s seem dowdy, suburban and rather dull” they still are, even more so now. They’re both just all talk and no show
    (P.s. has anyone seen Willileaks babbling on Twitter again about football? Another example of all talk and no show)

  23. JanetDR says:

    Nobody in their right mind would want William over Charles. For all of his faults as a husband and a father, I believe him to be a decent manager.

    • anotherlily says:

      I agree. Years ago he tried to combine all the administration into one unit at Buckingham Palace instead of having three separate administrative offices. It didn’t work because the various courtiers and staff undermined him and he hadn’t the authority to insist. As King or Regent he will have the authority and it would be a very popular move in today’s political climate. There is no need for three separate admin and press offices to serve the six or seven working royals who make up the ‘Firm’. Promoting this as a cost-cutting measure would be highly popular.

      • Jais says:

        Wow that would be interesting if Charles does converge everything into one office/court after the queen passes. I’m guessing the downsizing would start at KP…whew that would be something.

      • Pepperpot says:

        That is not correct. Supposedly, Charles and Andrew ganged up on the courtier that was trying to unite the offices and kicked him out. Google Christopher Giedt. Charles is a not a good manager at all. He can’t even maintain good relations with either son and treated Diana like crap.

      • Brielle says:

        I thought it was the Queen secretary,Christopher Geidt,who wanted to do that and Charles with Andrew undermined his efforts and get him fired and replaced by Young…Charles better be reuniting all offices under one roof cause their communications are messy and not coordinated…That’s why Louis 14 had everybody at Versailles,he wanted them under one roof to keep an eye on them and prevent dissensions…

  24. Victoria says:

    I JUST cancelled my VF sub too. Ugh.

    Well, I can’t wait to dig into this. Michelle sounds like she’s going to spill REAL tea and not the mishegas these heathens like Katie and the so called carnival of experts insist is truth.

  25. ThatgirlThere says:

    Michelle Ruiz is not to be trusted. She and that lady Elizabeth Holmes took jabs at Meghan for the get go and backtracked once they were called out in mass. Especially that awful Elizabeth woman who made comments about Meghan’s hair. I lump them in with that mediocre author Emily Griffin.

  26. TigerMcQueen says:

    “William is very aligned with his father in his sense of duty above emotion.”

    That’s a funny way of saying “aligned with the status quo because, as a rather mediocre white male, it benefits him HUGELY.”

    I do agree that H&M’s shine just made it obvious how dull and dim-witted Bill and Cathy (HA!) are. And that must have been a bit of a shock to the thin-skinned system, Bill’s especially, because as FFK he’s been showered with everything without actually earning anything. That’s a dynamic that’s played out time and again in his family.

    Look at Elizabeth’s reaction to the Kennedys, specifically Jackie. I mean, all her life, Elizabeth has been fed this line about how the British monarchy is the be-all-end-all, and she’s presented in the press as young and glamorous, and she’s put on this pedestal above everyone. Then she stands side-by-side with Jackie Kennedy. They were only a few years apart in age, but in contrast to Jackie, Liz looked frumpy and dull and kind of dim (sound familiar?). She’s known to be intellectually ‘incurious’ and dressed like a granny. The former first lady, on the other hand, was glamorous, stylish, witty, and was no dummy (despite that damn breathless voice she used in public). And the Kennedys were, apparently, unimpressed with Buckinham Palace.

    So as much as the RF gaslights, they (the heirs in particular) are in turned gaslit over and over by being treated as the be-all-end-all. It’s a huge shock , I guess, when an outsider exposes their mediocrity just by naturally being so much more in looks, intelligence, grace, achivements, etc.

  27. Brielle says:

    Wow Pasternak from Tatler who cannot stop criticizing Meghan finally said something true…

  28. Sunnyvale says:

    ” Really interested in how US and UK coverage has diverged so much on royals.
    Also curious when Charles starts leaking against William. His ego isn’t going to handle William being more popular when Charles is king. ”

    I LOVE how American/International press isn’t buying this “kate the peacemaker” palace PR machine talking point. I was watching the cnn coverage(I switched off whenever that smug squirrel max foster appeared🤮) and none of them were falling for it. Everyone saw how choreographed it was and the over the top briefing about the walk showed everyone how much they work with press. They keep confirming all of what Harry and Meghan said

    • Brielle says:

      Lol finally,ppl see through them…US networks always invite those English RR like Angela levin and they say the most bizarre things…Max Foster is really a let down

  29. anotherlily says:

    Charles will not be a deeply unpopular king. There is support and affection for him from among the kind of people who don’t take much interest in social media. He was being overshadowed by the Cambridges and Harry long before Meghan appeared on the scene. Meghan has been a catalyst within the Palace system. She has exposed attitudes and behaviour that need to be challenged. Charles is far from stupid and he has issued many challenges himself during his long tenure as Prince of Wales.

    William hasn’t even begun to make an impact. He has nothing like his father’s work ethic. At nearly 40 he has achieved very little that is noteworthy. He also has a consort who is every bit as dull as he is.

  30. Reece says:

    Reading the title: “Seem??”

    Reading the story: The Monarchy is going to implode under The Other Brother. It just seems like a matter of time at this point.

  31. lanne says:

    The RF have a big problem in their hands post Covid. The Sussexes will be out there doing project oriented work, saying quotable things. Meghan has written an editorial for the NY Times about pregnancy loss–when has Kate ever said anything? Her best attributes, according to the BM, are her appearance and her silence. How will Kate’s silence compete with Meghan’s voice and charisma? We already see how–we saw it at the Fabulous Four press conference. Meghan was leading the show, the center of all attention, Harry was beaming with pride, William was incandescent with rage, and Kate was, there? This is the Cambridges “competition” since they chose to take it that way.

    The absense of the Sussexes will be present at every Charles and Cambridge event from this point forward. It shocks the hell out of me that none of those gold-dusted turd advisors had the foresight to realize this. This is a problem of momumental importance and the royals apparently have no idea how to respond other than through dirty fighting. Which of course, ultimately tarnishes the monarchy.

    Whatever happens in the UK with the monarchy is their business–if the right wing press wants a right wing monarchy and the public accepts it, then Willnot and Cannot will be fine. All they have to do exist and be white and all will be well. If they want a place on a global stage, well, being white and entitled isn’t going to cut it.

    • Brielle says:

      I know now that the Cambridge’s are right wing tories but they were so happy to meet the Obamas or even last year Obama shouted the earth award,William’s project and William was begging money to Bill Gates…

    • L84Tea says:

      @lanne, You know it’s funny, but I find myself sometimes forgetting in these weird, locked down pandemic days that it won’t be like this forever. Right now it feels like this is it from here on out for all of us, but it won’t be. We’ve yet to see H&M in real action on their own due to the timing of their departure and Covid hitting. But you’re absolutely right. When all of this comes to end and we’re allowed to venture out and do our things, Bill and Cathy are not going to know what hit them. Meghan and Harry will be seen and heard everywhere. She’s not only going to dazzle us with her fashion (which I am totally looking forward to), but with her brains, her words, and her actions (Harry too of course). They are going to be the ultimate US power couple. If the RF were intimidated by them then, yowzas, just wait…

    • swirlmamad says:

      @lanne, you mention Meghan’s op-ed about pregnancy loss and how Kate has said nothing comparable in her entire time as a royal. Perfect example — she literally had THREE opportunities to shed a light on hyperemesis gravidarum and not one word. There are SO many missed opportunities and letdowns with that woman. Yet they continue to hoist her up as practically the second coming of Jesus. (I know there are some who think her HG was a bit exaggerated…..but even so, a savvier person would have utilized that for some spotlight — and thus good PR)

  32. Brielle says:

    I just don’t understand why William was jealous of Harry’s popularity with Meghan because he was always be king like Charles is always be king before William..it’s not a popularity contest,it’s just how the monarchy works…how couldn’t he know that?did he believe that he was deserving of that popularity? Ppl are just drown to charismatic ppl ,Harry and Meghan are and he is not but they weren’t a threat to him..Harry is sixth in line..Will he be jealous of George if he is more popular?

  33. Gina says:

    What I find utterly interesting is the constant idea that Baldemort needs Harry. That the future of Monarchy depends on the reconciliation of two brothers. Something suspicious is happening in the British Royal Family. Maybe TOB is more unfit to rule than we allowed to know?

    • anotherlily says:

      I have the impression there is a lot of unease about the Middletons. Something is being covered up.

    • Talia says:

      I wonder if the ‘incandescent rage’ coming out means there are a lot worse behavioural issues behind the scenes. It might explain why Harry is blaming Charles more – if he knows William has issues, that might explain it

    • TeamMeg says:

      I don’t get this, either. Why does William or the BRF in general “need” Harry so much? When he was the spare, that was one thing. But now he’s 7th in line… not so important. Let him live his own life, and let the “senior royals” get on with the job.

    • Deering24 says:

      Agreed–even the rota keeps mentioning William’s temper, and there has to be a reason for that. I’m betting untreated behavioral issues from that childhood concussion–and those seldom get better without help.

    • Golly Gee says:

      I think they need him, because the dynamic in the royal family has for generations been the heir using the spare as a scapegoat. The spare is not just there to become king if something happens to the heir. (This is sounding like a very boring Dr. Seuss verse) The scapegoat becomes a lightning rod to draw attention awayfrom any problems with the monarch or heir to the monarchy. In their minds, the survival of the monarchy depends on the monarch being seen positively by the public.
      Now, they have lost their scapegoat. I think this is huge for them. We have seen so many examples of them being unable to acknowledge their mistakes, poor behavior etc. The only way they know how to deal with these things is to dump on a scapegoat. They are naked now and probably feeling terrified and not knowing what to do about the new dynamic they find themselves in.

  34. Lori says:

    How would they ever justify skipping Charles in favour of Bill? Public opinion? Because honestly if they are going to start asking the public I think the lot of them are in for a shock. Republic Republic!

  35. Amy Bee says:

    Abolish the monarchy!

    • True says:

      What amazes me is once Charles is gone it will all be Middleton influence. Uncle Gary’s money basically bought the monarchy!

      Abolish the monarchy period but especially the Middleton Monarchy!

      • Elizabeth Phillips says:

        Reminds me of Edward IV and the influence of the Woodvilles, including Elizabeth’s influential mother, Jacquetta of Luxembourg.

  36. Lizzie says:

    “William is very aligned with his father in his sense of duty above emotion.”
    Replace duty with entitlement and it becomes a true statement.
    Neither know duty. THey seek glory which is not the same.

  37. Vanessa says:

    I think that William and Kate are scary as shit that the monarchy won’t lasted past Charles that why they have their friends in the media hyping up the pass the throne to William BS . They think if they keep this one side campaign up that it will happen it won’t . No one wants the stale bread Cambridge’s their boring . Everyone can see that those two were the most threatened by Meghan and Harry star power that’s why the Cambridge’s work hard then they ever did to get rid of Meghan the only thing those two idiots didn’t see coming was Harry there favorite scapegoat the three person in there marriage leaving with his wife and child Harry choose his family not the Cambridge’s. That’s what upsetting the Cambridge’s they wanted Meghan and Archie gone forever but they wanted Harry to help them be less boring and Kate needed someone to flirt with it .

  38. Emily says:

    I’m so happy to see Diane Abbott and Dawn Butler quoted in this! 🌹

  39. Carabella says:

    Totally agree that William — and Kate – have f’ed things up completely. The monarchy will end in our lifetime. It’ll be the equivalent of an apartheid ending, it will be Windsor castle’s Berlin walls come tumblin’ down. It will happen. My money’s on Billy fleeing to Africa.

  40. Lizzie says:

    For the right amount of money someone who the other brother is trusting to keep his secrets will cash in and write a tell-all. It’s coming one day.

    • TigerMcQueen says:

      I do believe that one day, likely when Liz is gone, the veil of pretense will be lifted and expose the Keens as they are. And woe to them when that happens.

      Right now, Bill’s popularity is based on the fact he’s Diana’s son, and Bill and Cathy’s popularity is based on their ‘solid’ marriage, so unlike what Charles and Diana had. The Keens and the courtiers (hypocrites who didn’t like Diana because she didn’t play the game) know this and manipulate that image to maintain power. Charles is deeply unpopular, and if the next generation is seen as being no better than him…well, the walls tumble down and they’re ALL out of a job. And the courtiers have the most to lose, because they don’t have millions in private wealth.

      That’s why Bill and Cathy have to be propped up and protected at all times. That’s why Bill’s pre-marriage cheating on Cathy is stated as ‘biding their time to make sure she could handle the job’, why his partying it up during that male-friends-only ski trip and the affair with Rose were hushed up, and why Meghan got thrown so quickly under the bus. But the paps have to be fed, and when the Queen’s gone and H&M are still in the U.S., someone’s going to spill some tea and someone’s going to report on it.

    • Alexandria says:

      That person will make bank because even HM fans will read it. That person will do many rounds of interviews on US television for years. It’s very tempting, isn’t it.

  41. Mooshe1 says:

    I’m also going to have to disagree with VF on the succession. It’s definitely going to go to Charles. His age group and the people loyal to the Queen are not going to change that. Billy on the other hand will end up with a Scandinavian like reign. He doesn’t connect with the younger crowd, they’re not so stuck in tradition that they’ll just take anything, especially because of the effects of Brexit. Apparently it’ll also take years to recover from covid. I think that’s why Charles is talking more about a slimmed down monarchy. He knows what’s coming and has known for years. The Cambridges don’t earn their keep, and they can no longer hide behind Harry and his wife. They hadn’t planned on Harry’s wife being a biracial woman just as dedicated to work as he is

  42. SenseOfTheAbsurd says:

    Emotion before duty? Give us a break. William and Charles are ruled by emotion, but it’s all selfish. Entitlement, self-pity, anger, petulance, jealousy, vengefulness, greed. None of the good emotions.

  43. A says:

    I find it extremely interesting that Anna Pasternak is speaking on the record like this, right now. She also piped up sometime last week in a different article to offer insights, and unlike most other royal commentators who pretend to be neutral while they’re not (*cough* Robert Lacey *cough*), she actually manages to come off pretty even-handed here.

    And it’s surprising to me that she’s out here saying that people, perhaps within the palace staff itself, could be considering the prospect of skipping over Charles and making William the monarch. She’s fairly well connected in aristocratic circles–there’s no way she could have done so well with writing that Tatler article if she wasn’t. So I wonder how serious they really are about that. It could honestly just be something they were spitballing but not really considering. But, I’m curious to know more about the sort of discussion that’s being had around this point, if that makes any sense.

    • Saucy&Sassy says:

      A, my first thought was that she was pushing this particular view point because KP? I know nothing about the monarchy, but I can’t imagine after the Nazi King abdicating ANYONE would step back and skip a generation? I don’t believe that on its face. Maybe they’re fishing. I’m just not sure who is doing the fishing. Could it be the courtiers themselves putting up a balloon. I suspect Wont is much easier to manage than Charles. Wont isn’t very smart and as long as they compliment and pander to him I bet they can get what they want. Hmmmm

      • A says:

        I think it depends on a lot of factors, and it’s not necessarily William who’s pushing the idea to the surface. But it all hinges on how the people at the palace are assessing the likelihood of the monarchy existing into the future, after the Queen’s passing. Their goal, above all else, is the survival of the institution. Ensuring a line of stable succession from parent to child is a big part of that, obviously, but at the end of the day, it’s only one part of that.

        For the monarchy to continue to exist into the future, it also has to be an institution that is seen as necessary by the people, and who is at the face of it seems to have a big impact on how people view the set up. If people aren’t as enthused about the idea of a monarchy with Charles at the forefront, but are more excited about one where William is, then I can’t see how even a cursory discussion on the subject of skipping over Charles wasn’t had. If it’s a question of preserving the future of the monarchy, I don’t think anything is really off the table,

    • Sid says:

      Would they go so far as to set Charles up in a situation that would force him to abdicate? I finally watched the play/movie King Charles III which some Celebitches mentioned previously. The most striking thing to me was how it made me feel much of it could actually happen in real life…

      • A says:

        Honestly, if such a situation is a possibility, I can see them letting Charles rule with a give time limit–maybe 10 or 15 years or something like that, after which point he’d be pressed into abdicating “for the sake of his health” or something like that.

        Like, the Queen is 95 now. Let’s assume she makes it another 5 years. Charles would be 77. Assuming he also makes it up to a 100, that gives him another 23 years, and that’s barring any potential health issues that he’s got going on himself. I don’t think, if they wanted to get him to abdicate, they could force him to do that right away. I think they’d give him some time, then slowly plant the seeds by implying that he’s infirm and too sick to continue ruling.

  44. Starryfish29 says:

    William’s quest to put the Sussexes in their place is one of the best examples I’ve ever seen of ‘be careful what you wish for.’ He hated how much attention they got and in the end has ensured that they will always be bigger than they were in the first place. He wanted the headlines and instead has ensured that he can’t ever get one without M&H’s names inserted into it because that who people are really focused on. He’s a petulant man child and watching it all come crashing down around him with his permanent narrative being one of impotent rage has been and will continue to be glorious.

  45. Robin says:

    I always felt Charles was itching to reign and that he would be King for years; also therefore that William should get used to waiting a similarly long time for his chance. But looking at Charles over the past couple of weeks, he seems utterly done for and done in. I know he must have boiling anger about the interview, what with his written rebuttal, and sadness about his father, but the decline is rapid. I wonder now whether he really wants it as badly as before. The burden of a family gone wrong seems to be weighing heavily on him. My fear is that William is going to be more of a key player than I thought. There has been speculation that Charles is ill or something. I know it’s just tabloid gossip, but it seems to make sense. I stand to be corrected.

  46. Agreatreckoning says:

    Curious if Katie Nicholl tipped Cathy(haha) off that this article was coming out therefore Cathy’s extraness in her funeral look for glamour shots.