On March 3, Princess Lilibet Diana was finally christened at home in Montecito. When the Duke and Duchess of Sussex announced the news, they made a point of using Lili’s royal title, and they later made a point of saying that there were conversations between Montecito and Buckingham Palace over the kids’ titles. Keep in mind, King Charles had been openly briefing the British media for months about how he felt like Lili and Archie’s titles needed to be “earned,” which is why the line of succession hadn’t been updated with their royal titles. Keep in mind that Archie and Lili have been prince and princess since the day QEII passed away too. It’s not about the Sussexes “wanting” this or that – it’s about “is.” Lili IS a princess, per the Letters Patent. In any case, the palace went on briefing spree once again with some nonsensical cover story of “Charles gave in to what the Sussexes wanted because he’s also evicting them from Frogmore.” It didn’t make any sense because the palace was clearly caught with their pants down, looking like they were too f–king racist to recognize the king’s mixed-race grandkids. Well, the Telegraph has a new story and at least this version makes a bit more sense?
Buckingham Palace offered to update the Sussex children’s titles online to make up for embarrassment over their eviction from Frogmore Cottage, friends have claimed. Prince Harry and Meghan made the decision to use Archie and Lilibet’s prince and princess titles last year and shared their decision with Buckingham Palace.
However, they were frustrated that the Royal family failed to immediately recognise Archie and Lilibet’s elevated status on its website following the death of Queen Elizabeth II, not least as the Prince and Princess of Wales’s titles, and those of their children, were swiftly changed.
There was no movement on the issue until a tabloid newspaper broke the news that the Sussexes had been asked to vacate their Windsor home. They had been asked to give up Frogmore Cottage in January but the news did not become public knowledge on March 1. The Sussexes only learnt then that the keys had been offered to the Duke of York. On the same day, the palace offered to update its website with Archie and Lilibet’s new titles, it is understood.
One friend of the couple raised an eyebrow about the timing of such communication, which was interpreted as an attempt to curry favour or to smooth relations amid the public humiliation. But palace aides are unlikely to have known that a week later on March 8, the couple planned to make a public statement about the christening or that they would use the opportunity to confirm the use of Lilibet’s new title.
In the event, the website was not updated until last Wednesday when the Duke and Duchess made a public announcement, initially via People magazine, that their daughter, “Princess Lilibet” had been christened in California. A royal source insisted that they had always planned to wait until the Sussexes chose to reveal the news themselves rather than make the announcement on their behalf. Buckingham Palace declined to comment.
I sort of believe that people were incorrectly conflating or connecting the Frogmore eviction with the title announcement – all signs point to Harry and Meghan just doing whatever they want on their own schedule at this point. I believe that they told the palace that their children would use their royal titles last year and the palace failed to update the line of succession list for months. Then Charles ordered the Frogmore Cottage eviction in January and the Sussexes didn’t release the news, the palace released the news to deflect from Charles’s political moves with the EU. Basically, this was always Buckingham Palace’s mess, and I absolutely believe that the palace waited until this month to “offer” the Sussexes an update on the titles. Now, all that being said, I believe that the Sussexes “invited” Charles to the christening too, so he had to know that the Sussexes would make an announcement about Princess Lili at some point.
Photos courtesy of Misan Harriman/The Sussexes, Netflix and Backgrid.
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- Windsor, UNITED KINGDOM – The Duke and Duchess of Sussex have handed over the keys to their UK home Frogmore Cottage to Princess Eugenie and her husband Jack Brooksbank. Frogmore Cottage is a historic Grade II listed home on the Frogmore Estate, part of Home Park, Windsor, England. It was built in 1801 at the direction of Queen Charlotte in the gardens near Frogmore House. A part of the Crown Estate, it is the private residence of the Duke and Duchess of Sussex Pictured: Frogmore Cottage BACKGRID USA 21 NOVEMBER 2020 USA: +1 310 798 9111 / usasales@backgrid.com UK: +44 208 344 2007 / uksales@backgrid.com *UK Clients – Pictures Containing Children Please Pixelate Face Prior To Publication*
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- Sandringham, UNITED KINGDOM – Members of the Royal family attend the Christmas day service at St Mary Magdalene Church in Sandringham, UK. Pictured: Princess Charlotte, Camilla, Queen Consort, King Charles III BACKGRID USA 25 DECEMBER 2022 USA: +1 310 798 9111 / usasales@backgrid.com UK: +44 208 344 2007 / uksales@backgrid.com *UK Clients – Pictures Containing Children Please Pixelate Face Prior To Publication*
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- Sandringham, UNITED KINGDOM – Members of the Royal family attend the Christmas day service at St Mary Magdalene Church in Sandringham, UK. Pictured: Prince Louis, Prince George, King Charles III, William, Prince of Wales BACKGRID USA 25 DECEMBER 2022 USA: +1 310 798 9111 / usasales@backgrid.com UK: +44 208 344 2007 / uksales@backgrid.com *UK Clients – Pictures Containing Children Please Pixelate Face Prior To Publication*
Nope. If it had been BP’s idea they wouldn’t have been caught out doing so much explaining now. They would have leaked it themselves to get ahead of H&M. Tell me another few. There will be as many lies around this as the crying story.
EQUALITY It’s the Palace panicking because Harry and meghan called them OUT. They realised that they had no choice now as the whole world would want to know why, if Charles is such a stickler for rules, his biracial grandchildren were NOT on the line of succession. Now we have the headlines on the late UK news last night, that there is NO ROOM FOR ARCHIE AND LILLIBET at the clowning, WTF. No room for his grandchildren but room for camzilla ‘a kids!! This is them trying to keep meghan away as well so that Khate and BULLYAM get more press coverage. I’m British, I served the the British army but I say loud and again, NOT MY KING AND NEVER WILL BE. He is just a nasty manipulative cretin
Not including the biracial children is a terrible look. Charles is not only a horrible dad but also a bad grandfather and a racist, vicious king.
Cold shouldering the Sussexes is also a stupid move. The cameras will be pointed at that behavior and away from the chinless monarch on his gold throne.
Charles was assuming passivity on the part of the Sussexes. He’s used to deference. When they went ahead and did it w/out the website update (i.e w/out his unnecessary sayso) he quickly briefed all sorts of arguments. IMO, the Edinburgh announcement was to deflect from his flatfooted responses to the Princess title.
IMO, Charles planned to keep the Edinburgh title. He tried to use it himself as his Scottish title. Later there were articles about how such a Senior title needed to stay in the core family. I dunno, maybe for Louis?
He gave it to the Wessexes as a lifetime peerage. Every other duke is a hereditary peerage. (Charles is so petty.) It’s no accident that the Edinburgh announcement followed the Sussex announcement. Charles is hoarding titles – but is too afraid to take away titles.
The latest news is he also appears to be hoarding money. I wonder if Charles is getting even with the Queen’s children who were not sufficiently deferential to him. “They’ll see! Once I’m King!”
MaryPester, I have a feeling IF H&M went to the Clowning, they would never let the Firm use their children. IF they all go, the children will be a Frogmore Cottage with their parents as they were at the Jubbly. I suspect H&M will only be present for the Clowning IF THEY GO, and no other scheduled thing during the Chubbly. Will there be pictures of the whole family? You guess is as good as mine, but if so that would be the only place those kids would be photographed with the family/Firm.
A new day, a new version of the story with BP covering its own azz and an anonymous source speaking for the Sussexes, which doesn’t happen.
Thank! You! @ThatsNotOkay
I don’t know why some folks insist on pushing narratives that reference “a friend” of H&M when we all know that it’s BULLSHIDT that any friend or any anonymous person speaks on behalf of H&M.
Right @ThatsNotOkay. The BM/palaces are like teenagers changing the story to avoid/accommodate their own guilt/false narrative. It’s like a recent funny story I’ve heard. Funny to me because I don’t have a teenager in the house anymore. A Dad’s extended pickup got totally jacked up. Dented, mudded up and the transmission needs to be replaced. All the while, the parents believed their sweet teenage boys were just hanging out and watching movies at one of the boy’s home. Not all the parents. It took one Dad to look at the situation and the different versions to simply say ‘bullsh*t). One set of parents tried claiming the pickup was stolen in their nice neighborhood. Love the one Dad who explained with great sarcasm, that the pickup was stolen and then returned in bad condition whilst containing a bottle of good vodka that was now missing from their liquor cabinet.
there has to be a part of Meghan that wonders if this life is worth of the crap that comes along, I know Harry loves her but yeah
Of course Meghan wonders about what her life would have been had she not met Harry mainly because of their children. The little ones don’t deserve to be treated the way their extended family on their dad’s side are treating them. Meghan doesn’t deserve it either but she is a grown up and she can handle it.
There were times I was super afraid for Meghan to be honest; that’s when I decided to always support whatever she does or buy the majority of what she wears…I know she has her kids now, her mother, a tight circle of friends but had I been in her shoes, I would have said “NO MAN is worth this shit!”
I believe it was a thought. I think both H&M discussed it. Their love for each other prevails tabloid headline nonsense. They love each other. That’s enough. A reminder, because it’s awesome.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffNXlfP8De8
I was surprised that BP was so quick to update the titles after the christening was announced. They must have received a TON of backlash after the Frogmore eviction story.
That is what I am thinking. Chucky didn’t realize evicting H&M for a home that they paid to renovate as well as pay market price for a monthly rental would go down so badly. His advisers for once recommended that he backtrack a little, but not too much. The are still evicted.
This complaining/explaining ‘sources say’ story also makes no sense because if the Sussexes informed them that they planned to use the Prince/Princess titles for their children LAST YEAR then…what was the hold up with updating the website? it should have been done at that point.
Chuckles and his mistress queen, BP, Peggington, they’re all just so stupid and can’t see beyond their own gripes to see the bigger picture of how their behavior looks to the non-racist people of the world and the damage they are doing TO THEMSELVES and their own reign/monarchy. I get that the non-racist world isn’t their base, but wow, talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face. They are all so insulated in their echo chamber of stupid that they just continue to make things worse for themselves. Don’t get me wrong, I love that for them, but damn, how utterly idiotic and incompetent do you have to be to continually screw up this badly?!
Yes to all of this. As Archie and Lilibet automatically became elevated when QEII died then, if they’d had ANY sense, BP should have updated the list when they updated the Cambridges to the Wales – even if Harry and Meghan hadn’t said anything – the promotion was AUTOMATIC. It didn’t require a conversation and the Sussexes to approve.
Now, worse, we find out that H&M had expressly told the palace they DID want to use the kids’ titles last year – and they STILL didn’t update the list. These so-called defenders of protocol deliberately left the list inaccurate just to exact some tiny, petty blow. However the only thing it served to do was make them look like petulant idiots – because, As H&M susbequently demonstrated, they could call their children Prince or Princess whenever they liked irrespective of what the stupid list said.
I mean..the idiocy is off the charts.
Agree. I also think that Prince Harry, still trying his best to come to some resolution with his terrible family, probably asked about having Princess Lili’s christening in the UK, like all the other royal babies. I also think that’s why it’s taken so long for her to be christened–BP was stringing H along. Can you imagine that he didn’t want QEII to be present for her christening? Or for Princess Lili to have the same experience that he and Archie had? So, BP manufactured the delay or outright told him no, not possible.
So, Harry said f*ck it and the Sussexes planned her christening to be in California and invited the RF and the Spensers. Because honestly, it still takes some planning to get on the Archbishop’s schedule, catering, flights, etc. And since the RF weren’t going to participate then People got the announcement along with the debut of her royal title.
I honestly hope they decide not to go to the Clowning but something tells me they’ll take the high road and go. Especially since Harry will need to be in court right after for his phone hacking suit. Who do you think they’ll stay with? The Spensers?
Yeah, I know, like KFC was waiting for H&M to say that they actually wanted to live in the house that he turfed them out of before, you know, before actually turfing them out of it.
Because that is the default for some.
They must really hate over in Saltine Island
Dealing with Diana was a cake walk for Chucky compared to dealing with his son and his wife, when he tries to embarrass them he ends up looking more derange. Not allowing Harry to wear dress uniform to the Queen’s funeral and the pictures in procession, made it look like they were supporting Harry.
The Sussexes walking down the aisle may be the most memorable thing about the Queen’s funeral.
The picture of the Royal Bitches ignoring Meghan at the funeral was so classless.
Meghan’s deep curtsy to the queen’s casket is what will stand out to me, forever. She showed so much class in that one moment, while all the other “royal” women were absolute hags to her, except for the obvious exceptions of Eugenie and Beatrice.
Each new spin is less believable than the previous spin. The fact that the royal commentators and British media keep writing on the subject shows that they were and still upset that Prince Harry use the royal titles which forces the palace to update the website.
Nobody believe this spin, “A royal source insisted that they had always planned to wait until the Sussexes chose to reveal the news themselves rather than make the announcement on their behalf.”
Their actions are speaking a lot louder than their words at this point. They can try to spin it however they want but when it is always the Sussex family that is being “othered” and briefed against the words are hollow and meaningless.
Yeah, Archie and Lili being prince and princess isn’t news. It happened the moment the queen died, and they ALL know it.
The Rats are getting all their stories muddled up. So, Andrew has been given the keys to Frogmore Cottage before the Sussex lease is even up? Or, Eugenie and Jack have moved in? So… which one is it?
Or is Andrew expected to rent a room off his daughter?
So Charles evicted Harry for writing a book and the Netflix show? He’s such a terrible person, all while trying to shove his mistress/wife’s kids and grandkids front and center.
The entire fucking point of royal titles is that you get them just by being born to the right family. I literally can’t with this asshole. Did you earn your title, Chukles?
LOL If Charles’ title was “earned,” Anne would be ruling in his place, I bet.
If titles were earned, nobody in that family would have them because they’re severely unqualified.
The lack of self-awareness in that comment…JFC
I don’t believe Frogmore had anything to do with the titles and the Palace would have continued to be silent on the titles if Harry and Meghan hadn’t said anything. The Palace has never considered Harry and Meghan’s position or feelings on anything but now all of the sudden they’re waiting on them to say something about titles? Nah that’s Palace spin. If they were going to acknowledge Archie and Lil as Prince and Princess, the Palace would have leaked this to press the weeks ago.
+1
Before last week the BM were still writing that the kids’ titles were a “ bargaining chip” for Charles. These fckrs need to have all of the seats.
I also think that they are trying to deflect from the Frogmore eviction also. No matter what they say no one evicts a market rate paying tenant who has literally put up £2.4 million for restoration that will now have to be returned. People just aren’t going to buy that. This family has no issue making sure the nonce has a royal residence along with everyone else in that family but for some reason they just had to strip the Sussex’s of their only residence in Britain.
Yes, to think that they don’t see how extremely disgusting it is that they are willing to house and protect a pedo on royal grounds with security. but not a young family, with a 3 and 1 year old, who were actually paying to live there. It’s the choosing to protect someone who has violated child(ren) while refusing to protect children and their parents from credible threats, that is the type of people they are revealing themselves to be. Yet they don’t understand the outrage.
IIRC someone was speculating that by offering Frogmore to Andy, Chuck relieves himself of personally providing for Andy’s security while offloading it to taxpayers since Frogmore Cottage is within the boundary serviced by Metro Royal Protection Group, whereas Royal Lodge is outside that perimeter.
Oh, the palace “offered” to update the website with the titles that changed the day the Queen died, months ago?? How big of them.
Do they seriously not realize how this looks to the rest of the world?? Or do they know, but they just don’t care, and are pandering to their base?
I’m sure that they didn’t “offer” Willnot’s kids the upgrade in titles after QEII died, did they? They’re just making this shit up as they go along and it shows. The double standards are pathetic.
The line that the palace was waiting for H&M to announce it themselves makes
Little sense considering the briefing over the past 6 months about how Charles wanted them to “earn” the titles etc, BUT it is the only explanation that lets BP save face so I think BP is going to stick with that one, even if it’s not true.
I do like that this article points out that the Wales’ titles were changed very quickly, so they absolutely could have updated the Sussex titles at that time and it would have been much easier for BP. I think Charles did plan on taking their titles away but not right away and they were hoping H&M would never use their titles, so they could say “well the titles aren’t being used anyway so what difference does it make.”
It’s true they take away things supposedly not in use. That was one of their ever changing explanations for the Frogmore eviction. This time, H&M beat Charles to the punch.
Not only did the Wales title get added with speed in their social media, but they changed everything even though the Letters Patent making the Wales title official didn’t happen until recently. Meanwhile the title change for Archie and Lili happened officially on September 8th and there was nothing.
It looks racist that they held off for the Sussex kids for so long and I am sure H and M could have confirmed back in September that they wanted the full honours given to their kids as is their birthright.
Actually, in a twisted way, it does make sense — at least to me. Charles and his minions are used to dealing with people who grovel and try to appease them to maintain transactional relationships within a very f-ed up hierarchy that’s based in part on placating people who are prone to tantrums. They don’t expect straight up assertive behavior — and therefore they may not anticipate or even plan for it.
I think that the palace may have been “waiting” for Harry and Meghan because the palace mistakenly believed that Harry and Meghan would ALWAYS have to rely upon the Palace to make an official announcement. The palace and Charles both underestimate the Sussexes and fail to understand what healthy, self-actualized behavior might look like in the age of instant communication. It’s not 1923. With access to media and the internet, no one has to wait until the Palace approves communications for them to be released.
So the Palace was “waiting” because they thought they could wait indefinitely, if not forever — because no one has ever publicly and directly challenged them before. I suspect that in the flurry of the coronation, Charles planned to update the letters patent — and deny the Sussex kids their titles, especially after he knew for sure that Harry and Meghan wanted them, which gave Charles an important bargaining chip. Charles isn’t used to playing fair with people who genuinely understand the rules and who are genuinely not afraid of him.
Harry and Meghan have shown unimaginable patience and grace under pressure.
You’re right @Blithe, I’m sure the palace expected H&M to ask for “permission” to release the statement referring to Princess Lilibet. They could then leak and let the press ridicule them while making up protocol nonsense to delay the “approval”. Control and abuse.
How many more years until they finally come around to the fact that H&M are not beholden to them anymore, for anything!!
I find it an interesting tidbit to note that the Sussexes were notified of eviction in January but didn’t release it. Why note that? Do the tabloids still expect H&M to announce everything? Do they imply H&M play the same media games and will weaponize that info? Did Charles expect them to announce it but H refused to play the game so C had to put it out there? Interesting interesting
There are lots of discussions between Harry and the Palace that we don’t know about.
It is clear that the role the Sussexes and their children will play in the Coronation is being planned right now and decisions about what will be fed to the public.
PrincessK, I’m not convinced there is a lot of discussions behind the scenes. I think one of the things H&M are waiting for is to discover if they will be able to pay for the proper security while in the UK. That court action (I think) is in April. It’s interesting that there isn’t anything about that. Also, I can’t imagine that H&M would let the children be photographed by the rrs at a Firm event. I would anticipate they would be at Frogmore Cottage like they were during the Jubbly.
If the Sussexes and their children do come, they will be in the Coronation group photos that will take place in Buckingham Palace. Camilla’s kids will be in the group portrait too l would imagine.
The palace updated the website to make-up for embarrassing the Sussexes after evicting them from Fogmore? Nah, the Sussexes were not embarrassed about frogmore. More like, appalled and disgusted. Charles is the one who came out looking terrible and petty in all of this. This is obvious spin to try and make themselves look better but it’s not working. Liar liar pants on fire.
I think also that the BaRF doesn’t want us to see the true story beyond Charles being petty- when kicked out in Jan, there was no longer a place in England that was safe (since RAYVEC not decided yet). Lots of court cases are coming soon against the tabloids and Charles is in bed with all those tabloid rats. Charles is trying to make it very impossible for Harry to testify (it’ll be more powerful if he testifies in person).
Jais, I think they didn’t expect H&M to announce the eviction. KFC and bm were probably going to go into how horrible a Son H is because he didn’t attend the Clowning, when they were supposed to be evicted in January. Then H&M announced the christening and Princess Lili’s title. So, I think it was a petty move on KFC’s part to announce the eviction to get back some control. KFC was forced to delay the eviction until after the Chubbly and Clowning, because the bm were hyping the ‘will they’ ‘won’t they’ attend coverage. So, KFC extended the eviction until Summer (vague date) and then extend it until Autumn when it became apparent how bad the optics are. The damage has already been done. IMO, in some respects it doesn’t matter whether H&M attend the Clowning, because KFC has told the world he doesn’t want them there. They could not have attended if they had to vacate Frogmore Cottage well before the event.
It’s the crying story all over again. 25 different versions, none of them entirely true. This will go on for years.
Here is what I think went down.
The titles were automatically eligible to be used once Charles became king last year because the children inherited them at that moment. Charles made a speech to the world last year and acknowledged Will and Kate as Prince and Princess of Wales and maliciously did not acknowledge the Sussex children as Prince and Princess. Bear in mind, the Prince and Princess of Wales titles were not automatic and were only confirmed in parliament this year, a few weeks ago, which is why I view Charles’ actions regarding the Sussexes children’s titles as malicious and I think the courtiers also did see his actions that way too. Consequently, the courtiers did not update the website and allowed their sycophants to believe the children would not be Prince and Princess. They were also never going to make an announcement about the titles. They always figured they (the palace) had the upper hand regarding official announcements. They never expected the Sussexes to make an announcement about the titles, otherwise they would have updated the website before the christening because they knew when the christening was going to happen. The Sussexes, however, justifiably utilized the announcement of Lilibet’s christening to make it known to the world that she was a Princess. Add the Anglican bishop to the mix and voilà, checkmate.
Afterwards, the institution and their tabloid friends tried to spin positive narratives for the courtiers and the royal family. Their clean up the mess narratives, however, all came across stupid because they were lies and many people globally saw through the lies. They cannot hide the maliciousness of Charles and the institution. The rest of the world sees it.
We should not allow them to spin any narrative that is remotely acceptable or lacking in the malice demonstrated. They (tabloids, courtiers and royal family) deserve no grace for their I’ll-judged actions against two innocent children. They are vindictive, malicious, cruel people and they pursue every opportunity available to denigrate the Sussexes.
And notably the website should not have updated the Wales title until it was official, but they did that within days, but meanwhile the HRH granted to Archie and Lili that was official as of Sept 8th took almost six months to be changed.
There is no explanation for this outside of spite.
And once it was announced Edward became Duke of Edinburgh, his, Sophie’s and James’ titles were immediately updated on the website. No delay there, either.
I think the immediate title update for W&K was to D&D of Cornwall & Cambridge, then a second swift update after the official announcement of their getting the PoW titles. So, line of succession was updated twice for them, not at all for the Sussex kids. Until now.
I don’t think the royal family website updated with the Cornwall title. It was the Cambridge social media that added Cornwall within seconds of the official confirmation of the death of the Queen.
By the time the royal family website updated the line of succession Charles had announced the Wales title. Again W and K updated their social media seconds after Charles spoke.
The palace is the one conflating the Sussexes’ eviction from Frogmore with the publication of the children’s titles as if it’s some kind of quid pro quo. They are so eager to look like they have the upper hand and as if the Sussexes are the ones grasping and desperate for relevance.
It also tells us a lot that the palace never tried to get ahead of this, even though several family members received invites to Lilibet’s christening, so they knew it was happening. They were very obviously surprised that the Sussexes referred to Lily by her real title in the announcement but also, I think, by the fact that it was picked up by news outlets and the palace had to formulate a response. And it still took them a day to update the website!
I think this tells us a lot about the palace machinery. I get the sense that they were surprised and alarmed by the sudden public uproar about the titles. I think the royals believed their own hype a little bit that Harry and Meghan are increasingly unpopular and irrelevant, so it must have been worrying for them to have to suddenly answer questions from outlets like People. But again, it’s not like People were blindsiding them with this story – they are friendly media, they would have sent the inquiry to BP in time to include their comments in the story. People is not out to play “gotcha” with the royals.
So why, having told People that they were going to update the website, didn’t they simply do it to coincide with the article being published? Presumably it would have taken the same amount of time and keystrokes to simply update the names then to say you’re going to update the names. Instead they chose to wait and see which way the wind of public opinion blew.
If they had simply updated the website when contacted by People, they could have pretended like oh, we were just waiting to make sure both children were baptized to make sure they stay in the line of succession! But they blew that play. Instead, we get this predictable and desperate scramble.
Just wait for the next story, now you’ve given them another twist; they waited until Lilibet was baptised.
That, like all of their other arguments or excuses, wouldn’t make sense either. The Letters Patent doesn’t emphasize that a child must be christened first before they receive their title. The moment their grandfather became king, they became Prince and Princess, no matter what Charles, the courtiers or their parents say. The lie claiming they were waiting for Harry and Meghan to give the okay doesn’t make sense because their titles are automatic, much like Charles becoming king the moment his mother died. He didn’t need to say anything for his title to change on the line of succession. His Con-A-nation isn’t until May yet the second his mom died he was automatically called king. The titles being listed in the line of succession doesn’t dictate what Harry and Meghan call their children, so the “waiting for Harry and Meghan” lie doesn’t make sense. One doesn’t impact the other.
@Nerd nothing of what they do make sense. They’re suppose to be all about protocol, but don’t bother to follow the protocol, the law or even common courtesy towards the Sussexes.
With Archie christened in the Church of England already, that excuse would not have worked for him. And it was unrealistic that Lili would be baptized Catholic, which was the only thing that would remove her from the line of succession. She would still have the HRH though. Being Catholic doesn’t exclude someone from having the HRH, only from the line of succession.
Of course an unnamed friend is.mentioned.
Charles and Company had no plans what so ever to acknowledge Archie and Lilly titles they allowed the British media to run with stories. That a baby and a toddler would have to earned their titles while William and his band of all white children titles were automatically updated within seconds of the Queens passing. Once again the palace is lying about respecting Meghan and Harry wishes and waiting on them to decide if they wanted to uses their children titles. Just like when the palace lied and say that it was Meghan and Harry who didn’t wanted a title for Archie or the photo at the Royal hospital . I don’t Believe for one second that the palace had any intention of ever acknowledge The Sussex’s children titles not acknowledge their titles allows Charles to appear like he was tough and it gave the Racist what they wanted which was that the two mixed children not be prince and princess . The palace is trying their hardest to muddy the water and make themselves look good the palace wants to cozy up the racist as much as possible but the moment they get backlash for the public about the treatment of them Sussex’s family they immediately started to back tracked .
I think Charles screwed up the Edinburgh title fight because he dragged his feet on that too. Once Archie and Lili got their titles you know Sophie and Ed made a fuss. This is Day 3 of Title Fight and they are still doing damage control to no success.
I don’t think Edward and Sophie have the upper hand here. They need to stay on SG funding to stay in Bagshot, they cannot afford it otherwise. Yes they work more than W&K (who doesn’t) but no one notices they work. Charles has been trying to offload them for years, fired Lord Geidt when he publicly advocated to keep E&S on.
Sophie has been kissing up to Keen for years now, pulling her own meangirling of Meghan to publicly be on the W&K ‘side’ in things. All because she wants W&K to advocate to keep E&S on as working royals.
To sum up, the new title only came about because Charles is covering his a$$ about refusing to acknowledge the prince/princess titles for Sussex family. Otherwise DoE title wouldn’t have happened. That’s why he limited it to Edward’s lifetime and didn’t make it hereditary. He couldn’t completely control his petty fit about having to give Papa’s fav his Papa’s old title.
Could they sublet the main house or rent out other structures on the property for income? I bet Sophie has made it her business to know all the family secrets too.
Did not know much about Bagshot, so did some research. 120 rooms on 51 acres. Edward does not pay rent, but paid £5 million for a 150 year lease. He split the cost of a £2.6 million reno with the Crown Estate. When the Queen was alive, she paid the estate upkeep for them. No idea if KC does the same. Rather grand home on very inexpensive terms for Edward, Sophie & their two children (one of whom is away at university). I don’t understand why UK taxpayers put up with this nonsense.
They own the legal lease, they can sublet part of the house (like they used to do with his production company). They can also sell the entire lease to someone else. That’s how Princess Alexandra ended up with Thatched House. Her late husband, Angus Ogilvy, purchased the Crown Estate sublease on the house from someone else.
That’s funny, aquarius64. I would have liked to hear that conversation between Charles and Edward. I wonder if Sophie cried? I hope so. She needs a new look. That sour twisted face of hers is getting boring.
Three out of the four people in that household are citizens of a country that does not recognize titles of nobility.
Harry has said he felt having the Prince title was a burden growing up and he wanted his children to grow up having a normal life. He just ended that possibility for them.
Those kids will be bullied in school.
Um the children’s parents are known as the Duke and Duchess of Sussex and their father is named Prince Harry. You think people, including other kids, would be surprised that Archie and Lili have titles? And compared to their Windsor cousins, the Sussex kids will have a normal and very privileged life. The Sussex kids will not be paraded around to every event to make their parents look good and to hide the crumbling marriage. As for them being bullied because of their titles, kids get bullied for all kinds of reasons because bullies exist in life. Doesn’t matter if you are royal or not.
@Misami I have a different view of US citizens living in the US using titles of nobility and would not address any member of that family by the titles and would never curtsey, if you live in our country follow our rules.
As for the kids, they will be going to a private school with many children with more money than the Sussexes. If the other parents see any hint of privilege being given to A&l over their kids, they will raise hell. They will be bullied.
@Nonya. You don’t know those children. You have zero idea about their personalities.
@Patty — “if you live in our country follow our rules.”
Should I remind you it is as much your country as it is theirs? Those kids have a US American mother; they are as much US Americans as you are or as I am.
We don’t care about titles over here; I do agree with you there but neither Meghan nor Harry has ever asked any US American to curtsy to them; that’s a disease that only exists in the UK.
Not sure why you needed o talk about ” our country our rules” but none of us in the US is more of a citizen than Meghan, Archie or LiliDi is
Thanks
@Patty people in “America” have a love affair with Princess Diana to this day, much to the chagrin of her miserable ex-husband and his Horse. Many Americans loved her, title and all and if she had decided to move here nobody would have had a problem with it or demanded that she drop her title. Nobody that I’m aware of has a problem with the Sussexes either except right wing Fox News loving MAGAs. You know the type?
@Patty lol….no they’ll be fine. Little Archie is a sweetie.. they will be the kids that other kids flock to, and not because of titles, but because they’re awesome kiddos …
WEATHER WARNINGS IN THE UK. TORNADOS were spotted over London. However weather forecasters now believe it was most prevelant over Buckingham Palace, as it would seem to much spinning was taking place 🤔
Mary Pester😂! 🌪🌪🌪🌪
@Patty Harry was raised in an aristocratic society as the Spare with red hair. The majority of the bullying he experienced was within his own family. Reading Spare made it painfully obvious that Harry was raised to not see his true potential. Outside of the love he received from Diana, he was seen as the jokester or someone who was only there to fulfill a role. The disproportionate sized bedrooms as boys. The uninvited lunches or afternoon tea with the Queen mother. The constant displeasure and jokes about his red hair from Charles, William and classmates. The disgusting and not funny joke from Charles about not being his real father. The shipping him off for summer breaks away from family so that Charles can spend time with his once mistress now girlfriend, Camilla. The constant taunting articles from grown adults in the media trying to paint him as some type of problem prince even from a young age. The lies written about him even before he was a man. The worst bullying Harry experienced was within the confines of his family and aristocratic circles. His princely titles weren’t the contributing factor to him being bullied. Bullies existing is the reason for him being bullied. Bullies existing within his own family, aristocratic circles and within the media is why he was bullied. Once he experienced the military he started to see and experience the world differently. Archie and Lili, regardless of their titles, won’t be raised in such a sheltered and toxic environment as Harry was. Harry’s bullying happened not because he is a prince but because children can be cruel and find different reasons to bully others. So your assumption that having titles is what spearheads bullying is inaccurate. Regardless of what Harry and Meghan call their children, their children ARE prince and princess.
Actually this won’t happen @PATTY. Do you seriously think the kids will be addressed as Princess Lili and Prince Archie on a daily basis by their teachers and peers or have their titles printed on their school backpacks 🙄. They will have as normal an American childhood as any other kids with very famous parents, probably more normal because H&M clearly work hard at ensuring they are protected from the madness.
They, like all famous celebrities or high profile politicians, will educate their children about the dangers & pitfalls their status can bring as they grow. This will be done slowly & sensitively with age appropriate information at different stages of their lives. As a Brit I 100% definitely know that they have much more chance of growing up mentally healthy, media aware and able to have a chance of non-stalked, independent lives with genuine life choices as adults where they are now. Just look at the dysfunction among the royals brought up in the system, look at the damaged childhoods, the fish-bowl lives. Then x that by 1000 because they would be treated like shit by the press, the family & the hangers on. They would never be fully accepted in places like Eton because of, well we all know because of what don’t we. And finally, dual citizenship is a thing.
Totally agree JoJo. And Harry was bullied because his shitty father didn’t care enough to pay attention and his shitty brother enabled it.
Archie and Lilibet have loving and attentive parents.
@JoJo, your spot on again lovey. The ONLY reason Harry pushed the title issue is because it’s HIS children’s birthright. Both Harry and Megan have gotten on with their lives without all the media bullsht. But Harry wanted to be sure, that if (god forbid), anything happened to him and Megan the children would still have the security their titles warranted. There is no way on this earth the Palace (especially BULLYAM and KHATE) can deny their existence or tamper with their titles and let’s hope, as the house of Windsor disappears down the sewer it has created that these beautiful babies grow up happy, free and loved
@Patty: They’re not going to be using those titles in their everyday life and they’re not going to be paraded for the Royal Family. They’re not going to be living a royal life.
Way to victim-blame for bullying that hasn’t even occurred yet. If somebody is a bully, any excuse will do, because it is about the bully not the victim. They could just as likely be bullied for their grandfather ignoring them and not acknowledging their titles as for having them.
They won’t be expected to do appearances like the Wales chikdren do now. Like little George being taken to a tennis match having to sit in sweltering weather wearing a suit with cameras watching his every move
William mentioned he was a target when he was at school so the reality is more likely that the Wales kids get bullied even if they attend elite schools with other kids of rich aristos.
American kids don’t give a shit about royal stuff and it’s not like Archie and Lili will be announcing it to their friends. There is no daily media coverage in the US about Archie and Lili, unlike in the UK.
@patty, where and when did harry or Megan say their titles would be used? And why do you assume that money plays into how bullies behave. Bullies don’t need an excuse. It’s their own insecurities that MAKE THEM BULLIES. In print or in real life bullies exist and so do mean girls don’t they
@Patty – Harry said it was a heavy burden and that he struggled to deal with being a member of the royal family. Being the “spare” meant being relegated to showing up and playing nice for the tabloids when they were making his life a living hell, and having no agency or role until he got into the military. But he had been so constrained and treated so badly compared to William that he thought seriously about bouncing even before he met and married Meghan. So it wasn’t the “Prince” title he was chafing against, it was the dysfunctional family dynamic and the archaic institution, the endless useless protocols and feeling like a scapegoat and punching bag for his brother’s amusement that he hated.
And no, his children won’t be bullied because of their titles. Meghan and Harry are wonderful parents who will ensure their two wonderful kids have the self-esteem, humility, compassion and confidence to deal with that kind of childhood silliness.
Oh Patty! Three out of those four people are citizens of a country that does indeed recognize nobility. How odd — and possibly racist— for anyone to assume that the kids don’t have dual citizenship, particularly Archie, who was born in England.
I imagine that Harry, like most parents, wants to keep as many options open for his kids as possible. It amazes me that so many people predicate their arguments on assuming that where these biracial kids live as toddlers should somehow irrevocably limit their future choices for the rest of their lives. Does nobody imagine that Lili might want to go to Oxford or Archie to Eton? It’s an interesting block that I’ve never seen for other royal offspring or even for white people with dual citizenship.
As to your assertion that “they will be bullied in school” — probably not, although your dripping concern is ….interesting. They will, however, be bullied in the wider — racist — world. They already have been bullied in the press, the internet, and in their extended family. Some of us are working to create a better world for them. Others are pushing them to give up their birthright privileges— because they like and champion the hierarchical world that we’re already in.
I’m in the first camp. You?
@Blithe, THIS ☝️
Your comment is interesting. Perhaps you are predicating your view on the information that both Fails and son George have used the “I will be King”, to school chums. I would suspect that would set a child up to be bullied. I can’t imagine that either of H&M’s children will go spouting off about being a Prince or Princess. That isn’t a ‘thing’ here in the US. They are kept out of the public eye and I’m sure that will continue. They will just be the same as the kids around them.
I don’t know whether you think they will be bullied is concern or wishful thinking. If the former, I doubt you need worry. If not, sorry to burst your bubble.
Please learn to recognize t r o l l s and ignore them. They’re only going to get worse in the next two months.
Why does BP refuse to see what the world sees, that treating Prince/Princess Archie and Lili different that KC3’s white grandchildren is racist? Are they really so clueless – or hateful – that they stay laser-focused on marginalizing mixed-race royal toddlers?
They don’t see it as racist because they’re racist. It’s as simple as that.
They really are that hateful.
I think what they fail to see is that in the wider world, being racist not only matters but is a negative factor to an immense amount of people. Colonialism has meant power to these people for centuries and generations. Charles is old enough to have experienced this personally. His birth and his whiteness have literally symbolized power and privilege to millions of people supported by the systems they built to sustain their supposed superiority. I think they’re clueless and racist and in a bubble that supports this. I think it will take something like a “white” institution formally questioning the status quo or actively revolting against these assumptions for BP to even begin to openly address the issues.
I also suspect that like Charles with Spare, the BRF may rely on other people— who may be biased, and have their own agendas — to filter the news for them. They like the bubbles that they’ve constructed for themselves, and likely have few plans for the possibility that those bubbles might one day burst.
The more I think about stuff like this, the more unexpectedly awesome Diana and Harry seem in my eyes.
I think Harry wanted his children to have their rightful titles so that they are not discriminated against, because there was no need to not announce their change in status at the same time as the Cambridge title changes. They were not something to be bargained with. The titles were theirs by right of existing Letters Patent. Harry stepped away from royal duties; he didn’t disown his family. I don’t imagine the children will ever use their titles in the US where they will be raised. It’s enough that they have what is rightfully theirs as long as there is a monarchy. Harry uses his title because that is his “name.” Meghan uses the Sussex title because she is entitlted to, just as she would be able to use Mrs. So and So if Harry were so named. And a propos to the comments of monarchs female siblings’ children having no titles, titles are passed down through the male line. The Queen gave her sister’s husband an hereditary earldom so that her children through the male line would have a title. I could be wrong on this but I think Mountbatten’s daughter inherited the title so that it could be passed down. Apparently, the monarch can also do that.
The Sussexes released one statement on the Frogmore eviction and one statement about Princess Lilibet’s christening. Meanwhile how many articles are coming out in the British press about this, each constantly saying what the Sussexes feel or don’t feel? They said what they said so all this info is the palace basically saying how they feel about it and part of the obsessive churn.
Anonymous sources don’t speak on behalf of the Sussexes so who is the “one friend of the couple”? These losers stalk Sussex supporters’ tweets and pass them off as sources close to H&M 🙄.
Lol. That would be the infamous imaginary ‘friend of the couple’ @THEWIGLETOFWAILS.
One thing that has particularly angered me from the beginning of all this is the slew of tinpot, faux, sleazy ‘journalists’ using and abusing their right to keep any sources anonymous.
Maintaining the anonymity of an important, credible source is a vital basic principle when related to serious journalism. It can often mean the difference between life and death, persecution and vilification, for many brave people who personally risk a lot to get some stories out into the world.
This right for reporters to protect their sources at all costs has been shamefully distorted/abused by those writing for the gutter press in order to lie, make stuff up or support specific factions within the royal institution.
Real journalists, those with actual integrity, must just shake their heads in disbelief at the wholesale cheapening of the professional code of conduct they’ve long held quite sacred.
THIS.
I think the Frogmore eviction was one more attempt to tie Andrew and the Sussexes together in the public mind. The palace keeps trying to sully the reputation of H&M.
This may work in England but it won’t work in the United States.
Kaiser is so right. Charles really is a dog sh—-t father .
One day , Archie and Lili are going to grow up and read all these articles basically showing them how utter racist and vile their own grandfather was. Imagine knowing he never loved you enough to stop the briefings and did nothing to protect you not even when you were innocent children. To also know that your own fathers brother was just as bad if not worse.
My heart goes out to these two children. I am really happy that have a grandma Doria in their lives. So that they know that grandparents do know how to give love , affection and time to their grandchildren
Monarchy is so irrelevant and there is just so much going on in the world that watching lifetime welfare recipients fight over Duke and Duchess and Prince and Princess titles is just gross.
I agree with the above poster who questions whether Meghan just shakes her and most days wonders how the hell she got caught up in all this.
Also the institution and the Windsors and the media want to erase Harry biracial wife and children from history. So it’s very important that they claim their titles so this won’t happen. I am proud of Harry and Meghan for doing this. They don’t plan to use them in everyday settings but when those history books are written, the ones that come after us, Should know that Prince Archie and princess lili the first biracial grandchildren absolutely existed and weren’t a figment of our imagination.
I’m with you, Over it. Harry and Meghan are going to make sure their children aren’t whitewashed out. The Windsors are entirely despicable.
Charles and his crew are never forward thinking and always reactionary. What else is new 🙄
But its even worse than what Meghan and all said.!
Because the “tories”- including the Queen- refused to acknowledge the Sussex children’s correct titles from the day they were born ! and thus trying to erase Harry’s/family’s Dukedom-which if he has legitimate sons could last for thousands of years 🙂
— and The Queen and all the bp/BM knew this fact without a doubt. they are sticklers for this stuff.
and they have all gotten away scott free with this vile behavior from the *birth of each Sussex child– till the queen died — and then people noticed their newest title (prince/princess) were not updated.
Here is whats true:
From the day the Sussex kids were born, The Queen and BP/bm only ever referred to Archie as “Master” Archie mountbatton! and Miss Lillibet…
But those were not correct at all:
Archie and Lilli _ from the day they were born till the day after the Queen died_, *should* have been titled the way Prince Edward’s kids are now *currently on the succesion list:
14. James, Earl of Wessex
15. The Lady Louise Mountbatten-Windsor
EG) from birth to Queen’s death the Sussex kids should have been styled:
#) Archie, Earl of Dumbarton
and
#) Lady Lilibet as a Duke’s children.
Also by refusing to acknowledge them originally as Earl/lord and Lady, the royal family bp/bm are also trying to erase Harry’s Dukedom!
EG) Unlike the prince/ess titles that end by law with Archie and Lili,, the Sussex Dukedom can literally be inherited *forever by Archie/ sons!! (eg Archies’ children with be Earl/Lords /Ladies and the Sussex Dukedom could last -forever
🙂 as long as a son marries and has a son…
this erasure of Harry’s Dukedom is a HUGE issue because that Dukedom can be inherited by legimate heirs/sons of Harry and Meghan -forever!!
THAT is huge because of Debretts tracking Dukes . Harry wont’ be as forgotten in a few generations because of that Dukedom.
Princess Lilibet is such a beautiful child <3
I think that the neck-wrenching part of us all looking at this train wreck comes from the incredulity of it all.
Here is an anachronism of a man who beats up furniture and has servants to put his toothpaste on his brush
The man literally snarled at one of his servants on a live broadcast because they did not move his pen fast enough.
Then there is this whole cottage industry of people doing (an albeit crap) job of blowing smoke up his ass every day to a public that is having a hard time making ends meet
The whole thing is mind boggling why the public would accept any of it.
Throw in a few russian bot farms to sway opinion?
Now you have a right royal train wreck going on, one that almost anyone would turn to look at
The Sussexes decided to formally acknowledge their children’s birthright after patiently and respectfully waited for the normal procedure that is usual for this unique circumstance.
After some thought, they made the decision themselves to make the public announcement.
It would behoove BP to be decent for once in this case to be quiet, update the line of succession, instead they have all-kinds-of-everthing going on about something that is none of their business.
To try to justify their previous behaviour is like making a bigger mess.
The delay in updating the website because Prince Archie(3 years old) and Princess Lilibet Diana(1 year old) have to be the first Mountbatten-Windsors to earn their birthright is ludicrous.
BP can be better served by being magnanimous and gracefully in keeping quiet on this matter.
If the entire Sussex family goes to the coronation-I hope Archie and Lilibet stays at the cottage with their mother, grandma, or nanny-After Harry or Harry and Meghan attend the ceremony-they get back to celebrating Archie’s birthday-that’s the way I would handle it
@Kaiser. New World Central Kitchen cookbook coming out in September. Includes, among others, one recipe from Meghan The Duchess of Sussex and one from Michelle Obama.
I sincerely hope that with all that family’s disrespect, Harry and Meghan send out a public statement saying “With regrets, we will not be attending the coronation but we wish King Charles all the best” and they stay away from all that toxicity. Charles doesn’t care about them or their kids so why go to be abused and used? The crap treatment H&M got at the Queen’s funeral is enough to tell them that those people aren’t for them. If I’m Harry, Elton John is my new father and Tyler Perry is my new brother THE END.
If H&M go, I can’t see the children attending any of the events because they’ve made sure to keep their children as private as possible.
Can someone confirm that the security judicial action is in April? It seems I’ve read it somewhere. Perhaps here?