John Oliver discussed the Orlando tragedy last night. NSFWish language. [Pajiba]
Here’s James Corden’s opening number for the Tonys. [LaineyGossip]
These parrots are so beautiful and sweet! [Dlisted]
I adore this Christian Siriano dress! [Go Fug Yourself]
Donald Trump says words about Orlando. [Jezebel]
Real Housewives of Toronto is coming & it sounds polite! [OMG Blog]
Mel Gibson is doing a sequel to Passion of the Christ. [The Blemish]
Love & Hip Hop Houston was not canceled. [Starcasm]
Is Jill Zarin coming back to RHONY? [Reality Tea]
An interesting theory about Littlefinger, Ramsay & Sansa. [Mashable]
Taylor Kitsch is done with Friday Night Lights. [Wonderwall]
I was expecting the worse from Taylor but, no good interview.
I’m sitting in a waiting room right now with the news on and I can’t escape it.
UGH. Precisely why I carry headphones with me everywhere.
The tragedy of Orlando is gut wrenching. I think to myself, “ok maybe this will get someone’s attention and maybe we’ll finally do something. ” That hasn’t happened. Children are getting massacred at school, people are getting shot at in movie theaters,clubs, places of worship. When are people going to rise up and say enough? !
I’m angry. Nobody should live with terror or uncertain on whether they or their loved ones will come home. It’s so sad and discouraging and tragic. It’s like people have lost their humanity and empathy. My deepest condolences to the families and loved ones who sadly and tragically lost someone in Orlando.
Yeah if that extremely sad elementary school shooting didn’t wake up Americans to their gun problem, then I don’t think anything will. So I feel like this latest tragedy won’t have any impact on the NRA and some American’s desire for everyone to be armed to the teeth at all times.
Most Americans are awake. Its just that some, mostly our politicians who are beholden to a powerful lobby. This lobby doles out campaign money to the people who advance their agenda, which is to make as much money as possible, BTW. And they dole out anti-ads to those people who don’t.
It will take a fearless politician to stand up to them, and so far we haven’t gotten one. Sadly their membership falls for the same lies over and over again. Never realizing that the big gun manufacturers are behind the NRA. Not the common man. Not the constitution, but major gun companies
Companies that are in business to make money…at all costs, it would seem. As soon as President Obama was sworn in, some people fell for the lie that he was going to take away their guns. They had record sales.
They are a small group that is holding the entire country hostage. We outnumber them by a wide margin, but we aren’t organized, nor do we have the same agenda among ourselves. It puts us behind before we even get started.
The problem is that what you want is not a possibility, I don’t think. Terrorism cannot be eliminated. Hatred cannot be eliminated. Risk is a part of living in what we generally call a “free society.” And it sucks.
I think it’s hard for people to accept, because we want both. We want copious liberties and rights and also safety and security. And the problem is that those are opposed in most cases. The more freedoms we have, the higher the risk that a small number of people will abuse those freedoms and cause issues for the rest of us. But the only want to stop the abuses is to cede those freedoms, which very few of us are willing to do. We agitate for greater security but at the same time, we rail against the militarization of the police and greater government surveillance. It’s come out that this perp was on a watchlist and had been interviewed by authorities multiple times, but they never brought him in because nothing he did rose to a threatening level. But what if the government could bring in people who are considered low-level threats or possible future threats? Something like that certainly could have prevented an attack like this – which is good. But it also would mean a serious expansion of the government’s abilities to detain citizens without cause – something that most of us would oppose. And that’s the problem here, now.
I agree with people who argue that gun laws should be assessed, but I believe it needs to be done in a rational, evidence-based way, which is generally not how it goes on. I think it’s totally true that it’s likely that the casualty count was so high due to the type of weapon he used. It’s highly unusual to see one person able to inflict that high of an kill, unless he’s using a gun designed for rapid fire. However, I do also believe that he likely knew exactly how to execute to ensure maximum casualties, regardless of the weapon type. However, I do not think most gun laws would prevent a situation such as this, as this was an individual dead set on killing, and I think little was going to stop him. But like I said, I support looking at the situation and seeing if any changes to the gun laws would have actually made a discernible impact here.
“I believe it needs to be done in a rational, evidence-based way”
There are many studies, that have shown that gun owners are likely to use guns on their family members.
Also, are we going to discount the fact that countries with strict gun laws have less massacre than America.
Then there is common sense, why would ANYONE need a semi – automatic machine gun? The kind that have been used in all these massacre.
The bottom line, is “money over people” that is what is happening right now. “Special interest over people”. It is just mind boggling and astounding that we have decided to accept this as the norm.
Cynthia – but that’s not exactly true. There are nations that have gun ownership rates quite similar to those in in America. For example, the country with the most similar gun ownership rate to America is Bosnia – which, keep in mind, is a former communist nation ravaged by years of civil war. Gun ownership among them is common – actually more common than in the US (US actually has a fairly low per capita gun ownership rate, but a higher her household rate). Bosnia also has nowhere close to the homicide rate of the US.
But how can that be? Many gun advocates hold fast to the “more guns – more crime” mantra. But…that’s not true. If that were the case, Bosnia’s homicide rate would be similar to ours. But it’s nowhere close. What’s the explanation? It’s not actually true that lack of guns – less homicides. Lots of gun advocates like to bring up the United Kingdom, but here’s the thing about the UK – The organization that tracks intentional homicide rates internationally, UNDOC, actually groups the US and UK as having “comparable” homicide rates – the UK hovers between 1.0 and 2.0 per 100,000 and the US is between 3.0 and 4.0 per 100,000. So…oops on that comparison. Now, that’s not to say that the rates are the same – the UK’s rate is a slightly lower. However, for a nation that makes guns nearly impossible for the average citizen to acquire, you’d expect something far more dramatic, at least compared to the US. But Bosnia, a country with a gun ownership rate very similar to the US, somehow has dramatically less crime. Those numbers fascinate me and tell me something important – that guns are not the crux of the issue, and cultural shortcoming might be far more. (By the way, after the whole gun banning didn’t work out for them, the British now have implemented stringent restrictions on knife-buying in the hopes to quell their crime rate once again – you now must be 18 to purchase cutlery).
Again, I’m not posting this to be snarky, or facetious, or mean. But this is what I’m talking about when I say it’s not being done in a rational manner. Rational means looking at the numbers, the facts and all that – which if you do, you can see the portrait is far more complex. I tend to agree that I think that the large number of casualties may be directly attributable to the automatic nature of the weapons. However, as others I’ve seen have pointed out, you can also achieve that casualty count through tactics if one knows how. For example, Anders Brievek killed 67 people without an automatic weapons by managing to trap large numbers of people. I’m sure the investigation will reveal how he did it. Like I said, I’m open to that conversation, but I’d first be curious to know if the weapons did play a pivotal role in the casualty count.
I am willing to give up my freedom to buy an AK-47. Sorry but I am getting really tired of hearing that people who want to kill are going to kill any way. Random mass killings by formerly law-abiding owners of legally purchased weapons are common in the US and nowhere else because it is more difficult to buy such weapons elsewhere. Making it more difficult to obtain the tools to kill dozens in a matter of minutes will reduce the number of these horrendous incidents.
While you are citing the UK, how many incidents have there been of an individual killing multiple strangers in a public place in the last five years in the UK
Current UNDOC figures are 1.0 for the UK and 3.8 for the US. This would make a person almost four times as likely to be the victim of murder in the US than in the UK. This is not statistically insignificant.
The last mass shooting (12 dead) here was Derrick Bird in 2010. We have had fewer in our entire modern history than you guys have in an average month. Again, this is not statistically insignificant.
No skin in the game – you guys have got to come to your own conclusions about what to do for the best in your own society – and clearly it isn’t ONLY about access to guns. It has to be about cultural tolerance to violence and a gazillion other things.
But – it makes no sense to claim that the US isn’t an outlier among developed nations for murder rates and gun crime. It is. You guys simply have to decide whether it is or it is not a price worth paying for the benefits (freedoms? protections?) some of you believe it brings.
But, Sam, we live in a country that’s willing to enact any number of absurd and dehumanizing laws in the name of life: limiting access to birth control, forced vaginal exams, criminalizing miscarriages, conducting genitalia checks at public bathrooms, but we will not even consider limiting access to guns. We’ll doctor statistics and spout anecdotes to suggest that there is no way to reduce gun violence, all while confiscating my toothpaste at airports to keep us safe.
Anyone who truly cares about protecting our fellow humans would be willing to try limiting access to guns.
In Massachusetts, there is a ban on assault weapons. The Tsarnaev brothers only managed to get their hands on a Ruger 9mm semiautomatic handgun and of course, they were able to construct pressure-cooker explosives that resulted in the death of 3 people and injuries to 274.
Still, I’ve no doubt that the casualty count would have been far higher had they had access to assault rifles.
Huh? Comparable homicide rates in the US (3.8) and the United Kingdom (1.0)?
Thank you, Sixer. Just as I thought. I believe it is also important and necessary to distinguish between shootings/killings where the shooter knows the victims (domestic violence/gangs – yes, too many) and the standard stranger crime (convenience store robberies) from these large scale random attacks in which the shooter gains nothing but death. These people know they are going to die. The death penalty is no deterrent. And they are determined to take as many innocent people with them in the process. And we experience these attacks so frequently, yet all our congressional leaders do is hold moments of silence, scream that those who want change are politicizing deaths, mumble about radical Islam, despite most of these killers being Christian, mumble about mental health while blocking funding for mental health, and arguing that if more law-abiding people had been firing their guns in the random direction of the shooter in the dark, while others were running in panic, everyone would be safer. Ban assault weapons now, mandate waiting periods of 30 days, cross-reference lists and bar anyone with criminal backgrounds, mental health problems, or presence on a watch list from obtaining guns. On the federal level.
PS. My reading of the Second Amendment differs greatly from Antonin Scalia’s, but I’m not a puppet for the NRA.
If you have had enough, contact your Senators and representatives, and party leadership in both houses. Let Paul Ryan feel your anger at his neglect of our safety
You compare us stats to the uk but these type of mass killings over here (I’m In the uk) are few and far between. The tragedy in Dunblane was twenty years ago and the most recent was maybe 5 years ago in Cumbria. The argument why these mass killings are less in the UK isnt really worth talking about, because we all know it’s due to us not being able to get guns in our local shop. What is worth noting is that when these tragedies happen over here they were done with revolvers or non automatic rifles. So although still terrible the casualties are usually at the very most in the teens. Why is it possible to be able to buy an assault rifle or any type of semi automatic weapon in America. I just can’t see the purpose of them. I can’t imagine they are hunting guns. If your protecting yourself, which I don’t really buy either, surely a fully loaded revolver would do the job. And your less likely to kill every innocent bystander in the room with a revolver.
@BettyRose
“But, Sam, we live in a country that’s willing to enact any number of absurd and dehumanizing laws in the name of life: limiting access to birth control, forced vaginal exams, criminalizing miscarriages, conducting genitalia checks at public bathrooms, but we will not even consider limiting access to guns”
Amen!
People are so worried about my Vagina in the name of human lives, but are not willingly to do anything to stop the death of people. Conveniently choosing when human lives matters.
Sam, I appreciate a lot of what you’ve said and especially appreciate the tone of your discussion. I’m less interested in having to agree with every single point than I am having a context in which to have a rational conversation.
Lilac – “I believe it is also important and necessary to distinguish between shootings/killings”.
Yes, and also to pay attention to other harms from gun ownership. The firearms-related death rate (again per 100k people per year) is 0.23 in the UK and a shocking 10.54 in the US. You are 40 times more likely to die as a result of a gun than I am. 40 times. That is a lot.
According to the Brady people, 289 people are shot in the US per day. 86 of them die but only 30 of those are murders. 50-odd are suicides. 3 are police shootings. The rest are accidental. That brings us on to suicide rates. 6.0 in the UK and 12.0 in the US. You are twice as likely as me to kill yourself. We don’t have 289 people shot in a year, in two years, in a decade.
Would your suicide rate go down if people didn’t have such easy access to guns? I don’t know, but it has to be worth a conversation, doesn’t it?
Again, no skin in this game. I’m not American. But I find it difficult to believe that Americans are uniquely violent people for whom freely available lethal weapons are the only answer.
I know why the UNODOC says the UK and US rates are “comparable” when one number is 4 times higher than the other.
They are using the the word in its statistical sense: the data is comparable because both countries use similar record-keeping and similar definitions of firearm and homicide. It means you can fairly compare the statistics. Uncomparable data are those from messy war-zones like Afghanistan or Syria, where numbers of civilian casualties (unintentional casualites of war) and intentional homicides can be confused/conflated.
They never meant to say 1 is the same as 4. In fact, I found at least one chart where UNODOC define a “low homicide rate” as anything less than 3 per 100,000 people (which’d include UK, Australia, Canada, most of Europe etc) and medium homicide rate as between 3 and 20. And anything over 20 is “high”. By that definition the US is a different category. (I actually disagree with them on that. I’m totally side-eyeing their brackets. 3 to 20 is far too big a range. If it’s unfair to say 1 is the same as 4, then it’s also unfair to say 4 is the same as 16. There are other UNODOC charts where the brackets are 0 – 3, 3 – 5, 5 – 10 etc. That seems more reasonable.)
@chilicat,
Its because some Americans are scared of everything. A crime happens in a neighboring city? Buy a gun. You see a group of gangs with guns on TV, but you don’t live in a gang infested neighborhood? Buy a gun. Some talking head tells you that the President of the United States will take away your guns and your ability to defend yourself, even though he doesn’t have the authority? Frack that, buy a gun just in case the President of the United States goes crazy and starts enacting laws. Do you think the end is near and the Russians, Chinese or Space Aliens will land at any minute? Buy an arsenal and a build a bunker. And don’t think about drones that can be sent from miles away.
After the Sandy Hook massacre & nothing changed, I knew nothing will ever change. I’m going to force myself to move forward, because right now I feel like all hope is lost to evil. Sad.
Sadly, I am with you.
Me too. The Republicans will blame this on terrorists and the mentally ill; and, the Democrats will blame this on lack of gun control. When you think about it, they are both right to some degree. Nevertheless, nothing will be done because our politicians refuse to try to see the other side’s point of view and work together; and, nothing will be done because we have money in our politics.
It is really sad and extremely frustrating!
Every time I think of Sandy Hook I get goosebumps and tear up. It’s heinous.
@Rebecca,
I don’t think one can discount the fact that a lot of the shooters have had mental issues. IMO, it doesn’t detract from the fact that we need to change our laws and mentality on guns. In fact it should help us in getting laws passed. Every type gun shouldn’t be on the table for someone to own. Everyone shouldn’t be allowed to purchase whatever they wish, be it for mental issues or terrorists affiliations and leanings.
@iheartgossip,
I agree. The age and number of victims is not enough to get the gun lobby change their tune. When they sent out their mouthpieces to shout down parents who lost kids at Sandy Hook, I knew that money will always trump doing the right thing.
Another day, another unfriending on Facebook. No amount of lost life seems to move people who equate the “right” to own a handgun with the “right” to own a military assault rifle. I can’t respect their paranoia about gun confiscation. It is not a slippery slope to loss of liberty. Deal with your fears another way folks – or leave the country if you want the right to own a small arsenal, but you’re not gonna like it where you can.
Exactly. When does having a GUN take more of a priority then safety and human life?
I’m so beyond that stupid argument. I guess until those fanatical people have someone,God forbid, that they love become victims to gun violence. Then they’ll maybe change their tune. Again, lack of compassion, empathy and humanity.
@aims- “I guess until those fanatical people have someone,God forbid, that they love become victims to gun violence.”
They won’t though. They’ll just use the same argument that they always use: if they had been there with their gun, their loved one never would have died.
They are delusional and cowardly.
I saw a very well intentioned post on FB this morning saying “I support your right to hunting rifles but we need to limit access to assault weapons.” I mean, okay, I’m all about compromise and I’m not coming for your hunting rifle, but let’s stop misusing the concept of rights. The 2nd Amendment does not guarantee the right to hunting weapons. Hunting weapons owned outside th context of a well-regulated militia are a privilege. Just as a driver’s license is a privilege. When used responsibly there’s no problem and no one’s going to take it from you, but it’s not a right.
yes.
“An assault is carried out by a threat of bodily harm coupled with an apparent, present ability to cause the harm. It is both a crime and a tort and, therefore, may result in either criminal or civil liability.”
I think the word ‘assault’ says enough about about the purpose of an assault rifle. It should not be meant for everybody.
I lived in Wyoming for awhile. I was shocked to find out that many people there actually believe these mass shootings do not occur. They think they are made up by liberals and it is a liberal conspiracy. What was shocking is that it was not just one person who believed this, it was several. Those are the people who will be voting for Donald Trump.
I am by no means a John Oliver fan, but he and the people at Pajiba are right on the money when they say that the best revenge against these dipsh*t gun people is to carry on doing ordinary, everyday things, and try to live a good life in spite of these nutters. Yes, things need to change, but for me, an ordinary person, I feel it is the only recourse I have, to live life as best as I can, and not let fear triumph. I think of that every time I line up at an airport to be screened by security, it is a modern necessity, and I am grateful to those who man the ramparts and try to keep us all safe. The same goes for all military personnel, my gratitude knows no limits. I was deeply moved by the lines and lines of people in Orlando who were waiting to give blood. I am certain that LOVE ALWAYS wins in the end. Perhaps I should change my name to Pollyanna, but I will live in hope, even if I may die in despair.
Why settle for revenge? Why not change the composition of the US Senate and the US House of Representatives in November so our common security can extend into our common areas by restoring the assault weapons ban and closing loopholes in background checks for buying guns?
And change the composition of state governors offices and legislatures so that they enact legislation in their states as well.
No mentions of Christina Grimmie being shot by a deranged fan?
It’s really sad. My stepkids loved her. They’ve been watching her Youtube videos for years, and she always seemed so sweet.
I do feel horrible that the Orlando tragedy has downgraded her story from the news. It is just as important, IMO.
Yes very sad. She seemed like such a sweet girl. It is crazy how both incidents took place in Orlando. America, do something about your damn gun laws !!!!!
Samtha – That news came out Saturday, right? I had hoped we’d have a thread about it on Sunday, but you know the world had changed by Sunday.
I’m glad I’m not the only one mourning Grimmie’s loss as well. I feel disproportionately affected by it.
This week totally sucks.
Yes, very sad that her murdered occurred right before the Orlando shooting. Both were in Florida where I don’t know if I will ever visit because of its lax gun laws. Absolutely terrifying how both Grimmie and these people at the night club were going about their lives and were gunned down in an instant. I did not know of her until only several weeks ago when I saw her rendition of Hold On We’re Going Home on Youtube. I saved the video and was shocked to then here her name on the news saying she was murdered. So young, only 22-years-old.
Vladimir Lenin said, “The purpose of terrorism is to terrorize.” That sounds so redundant, but it’s so right. Terrorism’s point is to so frighten people that they cower, that they’ll willingly submit to your demands. That’s the whole point. And that’s what Oliver is getting at, I think. If people stopped going to clubs, stopped living their lives as they wish, etc. – that’s terrorism doing exactly what its supposed to do. Carrying on is the biggest middle finger you can give them – he’s totally right.
My one middle finger is directed at the US Congress and the US Supreme Court for allowing these weapons to be readily available to nearly everyone. My other middle finger is directed at the homophobic state legislators and religious extremists who have been spreading hate. I wish I had another middle finger. I’m sure I’d find a use for it.
Who ARE these people:
Yes, I agree with that completely.
bettyrose you always struck me as the sensible type : )
Yes, but the shootings in Colorado could have been perceived as attempting to scare people from public venues. The shooting in Tucson, which actually took place at a political rally, could have very much been perceived as an attempt to frighten people from attending political gatherings, the very definition of terrorism, and yet, they were not labeled as such.
And what was the “terrorist” point of shooting dead more than 20 children in Connecticut?
Was it meant to frighten children from attending school, or frighten parents from sending children to school?
No, it was the deranged act of a deranged man who had access to a war machine and wanted to use it. He had no demands. He killed himself after he killed all of them.
The common element is the weapon.
And until that morning when he killed his mother, then murdered those teachers and children, he was a shining example of what the NRA describes as a “law-abiding, responsible gun owner whose rights would be stolen by gun reform.”
Why, oh why, are civilians allowed to buy automatic weapons? Ok some people like to do target shooting, as a sport, but you don’t need a automatic weapon to do that. You con’t need an automatic weapon to protect your home.
But then I’m a Brit so what do I know?
Hi Brit. You know how to keep yourselves safer at home. I’m Canadian (also American) — there is zero need for these weapons. People are paranoid and also they are status symbols. People don’t need to drive Hummers either.
What I want to know is how someone on the FBI’s radar, who had multiple ties to radical Islamic groups, wasn’t blocked from buying any weapons. This is more of an indictment on the FBI and law enforcement than anything else, IMO. He should not have been eligible to purchase any type of firearms at all.
Law enforcement can only enforce laws that exist. We have no laws prohibiting those on terror watch lists from buying weapons. The President, who doesn’t write the laws, has asked for these changes. Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnell, who pass the laws, have responded with inaction and support of the ability of anyone to buy any weapon at any time
It’s easy to look up contact information for Senators and Representatives, and to call or write requesting changes to laws — in particular, federal laws about background checks, and reinstatement of the assault weapons ban.
Took me 15 minutes all told this morning to look up the information and make some calls. Make sure to remind them how much you’re looking forward to voting in November.
This blood is on the hands of Congress.
There’s actually a bit by Obama circulating on FB right now that addresses that and specifically says that because of the NRA blocking every bit of legislature, the FBI literally cannot prohibit known terrorist sympathizers from buying guns.
He shouldn’t have been eligible because of his mental health issues. Just a waiting period might have helped – he was unstable and likely to spill his plans to someone. But nobody should have been able to purchase that weapon, that’s the real bottom line. His “ties to radical Islamic groups”, whether real or imagined, are not really so much the point despite Donald Trump’s blatherings. Do they let radical Christians purchase guns? They’re a more common danger here. They kill people, too.
Hateful, dangerous idiots are not a new phenomenon. Hateful, dangerous idiots with high powered weapons, however, not considered in this country’s original documents on the matter. There was a bomb set off in a Target bathroom. Most of these people claim to be doing these things in the name of a god that allegedly told their asses not to judge, unless they wanted it in return. Where’s the love they claim to have in spades? You may not like or agree how another person lives their life. But be a decent human and love them anyway. Because unless they are holding a gun to your head or a knife to your throat, it does not affect you. And isn’t that the irony here? Whiny bitches whining about how gay or trans people being allowed to live with the most basic of freedoms and protections affects them, meanwhile gay and trans people aren’t the people killing others because they feel like their rights are being trampled.
I’ve seen a list of I think blood centers in the Orlando area that Prime Now is delivering to. Can’t donate blood, but helping with supplies is the very least.
I am a longtime lurker and never comment. I live in Orlando and have lived here for most of my life. I knew the owner of Pulse many years ago and have worked in the HIV/AIDS community in the past. what I appreciate about what John Oliver said was that he didn’t enter in to debates and focused on the now. There will be time for debate about gun control, home grown terrorism and hate crimes later. Focusing on love, acceptance and compassion for the lives lost. That will help us now. Just my statement, I feel better for making it.
<3
I like that about Oliver too, KelBells.
There have been countless open windows for debating gun control, and each time the US Congress votes it down. This is absolutely the right time to call and write Senators and Representatives to demand a restoration of the ban on assault weapons and the closing of loopholes in background checks. There’s a big election in November. Are they going to do anything for us Americans or are they not?
But there’s always statements and sorrow after your country’s mass shootings…which are always followed by…more shootings. The world news is always your president expressing his sorrow to the world and other world leaders expressing theirs. It’s fine to mourn, it’s fine to be sad, but when nothing ever changes…when will be the right time to take action? The right time was yesterday. The right time was last year. The right time was a decade ago.
Hugs and support to you. I get it, I really do.
We’re all thinking of Orlando out here in Boston and sending you positive vibes/prayers/love. ♥
This was London today, KelBells. It’s a lovely video and I hope you watch it.
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/video/2016/jun/13/orlando-attack-thousands-attend-soho-vigil-video?CMP=share_btn_tw
Sixer
Thank you for posting that, it was heart warming to see.
We need to build more bridges.
Another hug from Boston, KelBells.
A big hug to you, KelBells, on this terrible day.
Buying a fire-arm for “home security” is ridiculous. Buy bullet proof glass, buy a vest, buy good door locks, buy a security system…don’t buy a gun! As another commentor mentioned, many argue that it’s not safe if the police are the only ones with guns…um do you really think civilians could go up against the US army and their drones/tanks/special weaponry? No. All that happens when civilians are armed to the teeth is a way higher risk of Domestic violence becoming deadly and accidentally shootings. A farmer living alone in the country needs a gun. A teacher does not. A mentally ill person does not. Bob from accounting does not.
Wake up America. The world is beyond frustrated with your looney laws.
Then don’t live/visit here and appreciate that perfect country you live in.
Invalid argument, especially seeing as how America constantly meddles in other countries affairs when we have zero basis for doing so.
Ah, the ‘love it or leave it’ argument. Worked during Vietnam, still so impressive.
Hey Tiff,
Actually this is why I DON’T live there and would be scared to visit. Also, if I didn’t care about PEOPLE I wouldn’t be frustrated. I think it’s odd that you don’t like that it upsets others. Innocent people dying is super upsetting. So what if it’s not in my country? Do I like hearing about innocent people being killed senselessly? of course not! Hence my outrage. And no, I’m not foolish to think my country is “perfect”.
Since you seem to have all the answers, as evidenced by your multiple diatribes on this thread, what would you propose as a solution? For whatever reason, a large proportion of us citizens are obsessed with one ambiguously worded line in a 200 year old document. Many of us ARE protesting, are actively writing our representatives and senators, are certainly not voting for the people who will do nothing to repeal these laws. But there simply aren’t enough of us. We’re drowned out and out-voted by the gum nuts. Do you think we’re not also frustrated, horrified, feeling hopeless?
So, again I ask, what do you propose as a solution? Should we just shut up and give over? If by some miracle we did pass gun reform laws, what would you gloat about then?
Thank you for this.
I was going to respond to the OP but I’m already too exhausted after the other thread from today.
No starkiller that’s exactly what you should be doing! That’s exactly it, there needs to be more Americans doing what you’re doing! passionately trying to convince others.
Also the reason for all the “diatribes” as you so nicely put it, is because this is something I feel very passionately about because I feel very, very frustrated by the lack of action to correct the problem. I can’t do anything since I don’t live anywhere near to you but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t affect me. It honestly hurts to hear about these shootings again and again. it really, really affects me emotionally. I really, really want the US to do something active to combat the problem so I guess what you’re hearing is the extreme frustration in my voice that the majority of Americans aren’t doing anything and in fact, are ACTIVELY working against reforming the looney gun laws. I clearly am siding with the minority of Americans that DO see the harm and DO want change.
I hope that clarifies things.
No. You are still condescending no matter how ‘upset’ it, like Starkiller wrote, what is the solution.
@pinetree13 Ah… The Passionate post with no compassion.
I’m from Orlando. I frequented Pulse in my younger days and it was an inclusive, friendly and safe environment for every person that walked through that door regardless of orientation, race, or religion. That was taken from every person, every gay person especially, in this city. We’re mourning, heartbroken, angry. We are devastated.
You know what doesn’t help? Condescending finger wagging at Americans from people in their Ivory Towers, preaching at people that they know what’s best while blaming an entire country for this hate crime, this terror attack, because make no mistake, it is BOTH.
Maybe I’m too close to this being from Orlando to not be emotional. Maybe calling people Sunday morning to ensure they were safe has gotten to me. Maybe checking the list of victims to make sure there was no one I knew on it has broken me down. There’s some perspective for you but preach away.
Tell me about YOUR anger again.
@Neal…YES! Thank you.
You want change, write the politicians at your local, state and federal level. If they know large amounts of people won’t vote for them, they’ll change their tune instantly. The NRA can give them all kinds of money, but you can still vote. This November, VOTE THEM OUT!
This.
Yes Lizzie! preach!
I bet the vast majority of US citizens commenting here don’t vote, and I’m not talking once every 4 years. If you want to own your vagina, vote. If you don’t want assault weapons, vote. I’m a big believer in voting. Also look at what MADD accomplished. The power of women who organized for a cause.
Yes, write by snail mail (they have to keep those letters as public records), email and call. Let them know that if they don’t act not only will you vote them out, you will find opponents who will act. Copy the party leadership on all correspondence
My thoughts and my love to those who lost their lives in Orlando, and to those they left behind. Be Yourself. And always BE PROUD! And to those who seek to do evil, my thoughts are with you. Because your end will be the worst of all.
I’m so angry. There are few words, but so much anger.
Pulse was my first gay bar (and my first bar, period)… my first experience in the gay community, as a bisexual teenager who came out as queer in a rural southern high school. I grew up half an hour from Orlando and the city has always been a surprisingly liberal haven. Live in Tampa now, and still visit about once a month for the vegan food and live music and progressive community. There’s so much talk about the religion that was twisted beyond recognition and so much dangerous visibility and notoriety for the killer, and so little talk of the sense of toxic male entitlement that caused both of this weekend’s shootings, or the lack of gun regulations that could have prevented both of them too.
Shaking with anger as my feed fills up with horrifying news about friends of friends who were there. Driving to Orlando and figuring out which lawmakers and lobbyists to contact and staying away from most comments sections and social media because I can’t take the lack of logic, there’s just no excuse anymore…
The gun law issue should be brought up…yes..but also the fact this man targeted the gay community.
I love John Oliver so much. He has filled a lot of my Jon Stewart void and every Monday I look forward to watching his segments online. I think he’s brilliant, hilarious, and genuine.
I am so sickened buy our lack of progress with any common sense gun laws. I am literally frustrated to tears. If someone can’t board a plane because they may potentially be a threat they SHOULD NOT be able to purchase a semi-automatic weapon. How is this not obvious? How do people continue to twist “well regulated militia” into “you get any gun you want, no questions.” And the argument about how it’s to defend against a tyrannical government, etc. PLEASE. If in some dystopian reality our current government decided to go after you with military force, your rifle isn’t going to save you. But not to be off topic, I fully support responsible gun ownership. I have just had it with these ridiculous arguments that support not changing ANYTHING that affects gun laws. I know that changing a gun law won’t end all violence but it may just make it harder for evil people to commit evil acts. We have to TRY. People keep dying from this. And we have done NOTHING and it breaks my heart.
There was a ban on assault weapons in the U.S. from 1994-2004. It ended because Congress did nothing to extend it.
Law enforcement and the President supported a continuation of the ban However, agressive lobbying by the NRA (shock) was instrumental in the lapse of the assault weapons ban (Los Angeles Times, September 10th, 2004).
No one, NO ONE should own an assailt weapon. No citizen of the U.S. should be allowed to own assault weapons, period. The framers of the Second Amendment (the right to beat arms) could never have forseen the existence of assault weapons. Assault weapons ate intended to shoot a massive amount of ammunition to hit a maximum number of targets.
A truly terrifying display of the right to bear arms in open carry states were images of people walking through there neighborhoods carrying assault weapons. I can’t express how horrified I was. Thinking about families living in these communities, seeing this, made me sick. Black Friday in 2015, in the spector of changes to gun laws, saw the greatest number of guns ever sold. Proud images depicting every member of the family carrying guns were posted. Children holding guns. It made me ashamed to be an American. We love our guns more than protecting children, for f*cks sake, following the Sandy Hook Massacre. We did nothing follwowing the murders of CHILDREN.
Our country has a sick obsession with guns. Responsible gun owners should be leading the charge to charge to change gun laws. But we’re too busy fanatically defending our right to bear arms. In his press conference following the mass murder President Obamsa asserted that doing nothing is a decison itself. Truer words were never spoken. A mass movement must begin to change these laws, muzzle Wayne Lapierrr (NRA), and unseat congressman who are bought and paid for.
True peace can only exist in a world that is committed to ending violence. I have been a pacifist since I was 7 years old. I respect members of the military and many law enforcement officiers for serving during these troulbled times. I realize that I am seeking for utopia, a pipe dream, but I have the right to dream of, and fight for a world which treasures peace. A society that does not not accept murder as the price forvthe illusion of safety.