Molly Ringwald wrote a thoughtful piece about John Hughes in the #MeToo era

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Of all John Hughes’ films, I’ve probably seen The Breakfast Club the most times, followed by Sixteen Candles. While I was too young for them to have a huge impact when they were released, they were staples for anyone growing up in the 1980s and 1990s. That being said, I haven’t seen those movies in years. I wonder if I would watch them with different eyes today, at my age and at this moment in our current cultural conversation about feminism, abuse and more. As it turns out, Molly Ringwald wondered the same thing. Molly starred in three John Hughes films – The Breakfast Club, Pretty in Pink and Sixteen Candles – and those films made her a star. They made her a cultural phenomenon. She was on the cover of Time Magazine. She was the It Girl for an entire generation. Molly is 50 years old now and the mother of two daughters and a son. Upon one of her daughter’s requests, Molly recently re-watched The Breakfast Club and she came away feeling discombobulated and uncomfortable. She ended up writing a piece for The New Yorker about revisiting John Hughes’ work and legacy in the age of #MeToo. It’s a good read – go here for the full piece.

It’s a strange experience, watching a younger, more innocent version of yourself onscreen. It’s stranger still—surreal, even—watching it with your child when she is much closer in age to that version of yourself than you are. My friend was right: my daughter didn’t really seem to register most of the sex stuff, though she did audibly gasp when she thought I had showed my underwear. At one point in the film, the bad-boy character, John Bender, ducks under the table where my character, Claire, is sitting, to hide from a teacher. While there, he takes the opportunity to peek under Claire’s skirt and, though the audience doesn’t see, it is implied that he touches her inappropriately. I was quick to point out to my daughter that the person in the underwear wasn’t really me, though that clarification seemed inconsequential. We kept watching, and, despite my best intentions to give context to the uncomfortable bits, I didn’t elaborate on what might have gone on under the table. She expressed no curiosity in anything sexual, so I decided to follow her lead, and discuss what seemed to resonate with her more. Maybe I just chickened out.

But I kept thinking about that scene. I thought about it again this past fall, after a number of women came forward with sexual-assault accusations against the producer Harvey Weinstein, and the #MeToo movement gathered steam. If attitudes toward female subjugation are systemic, and I believe that they are, it stands to reason that the art we consume and sanction plays some part in reinforcing those same attitudes. I made three movies with John Hughes; when they were released, they made enough of a cultural impact to land me on the cover of Time magazine and to get Hughes hailed as a genius. His critical reputation has only grown since he died, in 2009, at the age of fifty-nine. Hughes’s films play constantly on television and are even taught in schools. There is still so much that I love in them, but lately I have felt the need to examine the role that these movies have played in our cultural life: where they came from, and what they might mean now. When my daughter proposed watching “The Breakfast Club” together, I had hesitated, not knowing how she would react: if she would understand the film or if she would even like it. I worried that she would find aspects of it troubling, but I hadn’t anticipated that it would ultimately be most troubling to me.

[From The New Yorker]

Ringwald then goes on, in a very journalistic way, detailing the moment of John Hughes’ arrival and how no one was making films about teenagers that seemed authentic TO teenagers at the time. At every step, Ringwald gives Hughes credit for the authenticity with which he wrote so many characters, and for choosing to make her the rare female protagonist in his first two films (Sixteen Candles and Pretty In Pink). She gives him credit for treating her well, for respecting her opinions, for listening to her and for even making some script changes when certain things made her uncomfortable. But, as time has passed, she sees clearly that so many of the storylines she was apart of were and are problematic. For example, Bender’s verbal abuse of her character, Claire, in The Breakfast Club, and Bender’s sexual harassment and perhaps even assault of Claire (the scene where he puts his head between “Claire’s” legs underneath the table).

Ringwald talks a lot about Sixteen Candles and the character of Caroline (Jake’s beautiful girlfriend) who gets blackout drunk and then traded to the Geek, who apparently rapes her when she’s unconscious. Ringwald even contacted the actress who played Caroline, Haviland Morris, to ask her what she thought of that part of the story now, looking back on it. Haviland seemed to blame her character for getting that drunk (ugh). Haviland later sent Ringwald an email saying that on second thought, she did have a problem with all of it. That’s the thing about these Hughes films – we grew up with them and we grew up thinking they were amazing, and once you see them with fresh eyes, you’re like “holy God, this story is problematic as f–k.”

Ringwald ends on a note of “where do we go from here?” She really doesn’t have an answer – she used to be proud of the work she had done with Hughes, and she still feels proud that those films touched so many people in very positive ways. She’s clear that she’s not advocating for erasing Hughes’ films from the film-nerd conversations, but she suggests that we should review these “old classics” with new eyes and a new understanding of many of the problematic stories and characters.

2016 Tribeca Film Festival

Photos and posters courtesy of IMDB, WENN and Universal Pictures.

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95 Responses to “Molly Ringwald wrote a thoughtful piece about John Hughes in the #MeToo era”

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  1. Betsy says:

    Yes, I used to watch and enjoy these movies; then just a few years ago they all of a sudden seemed really gross and my interest is no more. She’s really on point that so much used to seem normal and now it’s been unmasked and it’s just not benign.

    • ElizabethL says:

      It’s crazy going back and watching old favorites….growing up I used to love the Back to the Future movies. Last night I re-watched the second movie and was shocked by how violent the scenes involving women were. For example, Biff, eerily resembling Trump and operating a casino high-rise, severely beats his wife Lorraine in front of son Marty McFly and Biff’s security posse. After this, Lorraine tells Marty that Biff was right, it’s ok that she got beaten because Biff pays all the bills. We also learn that Biff forced her to get breast implants.

      Also, Doc and Marty keep knocking Jennifer (Marty’s GF) out and leaving her in random places?!?

      • NotSoSocialButterfly says:

        I was over 21 when these came out. I remember that those script aspects were gross, but at the same time, it was a case of art imitating life, and it was accepted.

        Lately, I have been listening to satellite radio stations with music from the 70s, and so many of the songs I liked sonically back then are problematic AF in reality, and I cannot enjoy them. So much embedded rape culture & misogyny. Ugh.

        The one positive I can take away, is that change is slow, but women’s voices are changing society.

    • Helen Smith says:

      When I look back on so many things I liked as a teen and in my twenties I see how much I’ve grown and how much society’s attitudes have changed for the better. Then, I think about how much farther people have to go not just in the USA but around the world and try not to become despondent.

      At least that is my thought process.

    • Rascalito says:

      It’s so true how we view these John Hughes movies so differently today than we did when we were growing up watching them. Just a few years ago, I remembered for some random reason, the scene in 16 Candles where the Geek and Jake Ryan are talking in the kitchen after the big party, and Jake, supposedly the awesome nice guy, said that he could violate his passed out girlfriend upstairs 6 different ways if he wanted to. What the fuuuuuu…?! When I was a kid, I didn’t even blink an eye hearing that, because that kind of behaviour and talk was just so common at the time.

      There’s still a long, long way to go of course, but I’m really glad we’re starting to actually SEE and HEAR these things finally, and do our best to improve people’s behaviour and attitudes.

  2. Sayrah says:

    I hadn’t even thought of that scene with the panties. I thought she was going g to talk only about Jake Ryan trading his drunk girlfriend to get back at her for throwing a party at his house ugh.

  3. Brunswickstoval says:

    I may not express this well (tired) but I believe it’s worth remembering John Hughes wrote these movies from his perspective as an outsider at school. They were, in some ways, his view of how he wished his high school years had been. I think they were written from the point of view of someone who idolised many of the roles he wrote without really understanding the nuances.

    But yeah they are problematic and I wouldn’t want my girls to watch aspects of them.

    I always thought Cameron Crowe’s Say Anything was superior to any John Hughes movie.

    • Esmom says:

      I hadn’t heard that about Hughes but it makes sense.

      ITA with you about Say Anything, which makes those Hughes films feel really flat and kinda ridiculous in comparison.

      • Carey says:

        I also loved Say Anything but John Cusak’s character stalks the girl. My husband brought it up to me when we were discussing the Molly Ringwald article and he’s right, that’s messed up.

    • Kittenq says:

      Say Anything was awesome.

      • Lala says:

        “Say Anything” is one of the ONLY “teen” genre movies from back in the day that I can watch without cringing…and STILL love both characters…however, to me…Crowe was ALWAYS on point when it came to writing about women characters in his movies…”Almost Famous” got it SO RIGHT regarding women on the fringes of the music lifestyle…I’ve read enough auto-biographies from women who were involved with musicians from back in the day…what they felt and what society has ALWAYS projected about them…were entirely TWO different things

      • NotSoSocialButterfly says:

        Almost Famous was terrific.

    • Kelly says:

      This makes sense to me. The geeks were the break out stars of his movies and had most of the famous lines – other than Bender of course. “Screws fall out all the time. The world is an imperfect place”.

  4. Esmom says:

    My son’s sociology class recently watched The Breakfast Club. He didn’t tell me much at all about the discussion — he always says the dynamic in class is strained because a MAGA kid always hijacks the conversation and everyone else shuts down, sadly — but I wonder if consent came up. I need to ask him.

    • imqrious2 says:

      Ahhh of course: the MAGA kid is a braying bully…just like his “chief”…SAD

      Where is the teacher shutting this kid down? When I was a teacher, if one kid always called out and tried to take over the discussion, I would always make sure he didn’t (if a request didn’t get him to stop, than after the second attempt, I’d give a (not sharp) reprimand, or walk over and stand by the student, sometimes putting a gentle hand on the shoulder to remind them to not interrupt. It was my job to also teach them how to listen, not just speak out.

      • Esmom says:

        I really like the teacher but she’s retiring after over 30 years in teaching and I sense that she burned out quickly upon the election of Trump (she also teaches government). Like all teachers she needs to remain politically neutral, which I know is harder for some than others. The MAGA kid has politically active MAGA parents and my guess the teacher doesn’t want to piss them off. I know she encourages other viewpoints and voices but it seems like the kids are also wary about debating this kid so it stays pretty quiet. It’s really unfortunate because we’re at a time in history when there’s so much to talk about in both government and sociology classes.

    • Kelly says:

      I’m exactly Molly’s age and I grew up in the Chicago suburbs, so these movies really mean a lot to me. TBC was huge because it was about cliques in high school. Even though the five kids became close at the end of the day. Molly’s character states that she’s not sure if she would even acknowledge anyone but Andrew back in class. The audience hopes that they will stay friends, but we never really know.

      One kid is physically abused by his father. One kid is pressured by his father to be perfect and even participates in bullying to please him. One girl is ignored by her family, and having no friends she shows up at detention because she has nothing else to do. One boy is so pressured by his parents to make perfect grades that he contemplates suicide. One girl is used by her parents to get back at each other and she’s bribed with material things to keep her “happy”.

      There wasn’t one kid I knew who didn’t identify with at least one character. Sure there are troublesome elements from that time, and it would have been better with at least one POC or two. But it really tapped into teen angst in a way that felt genuine. Whereas I didn’t know one teen girl who ever had a guy beneath their window blasting a song on his boom box.

      • margot t says:

        this

      • noway says:

        I still like these films because the overall messages and themes are good, and like it or not they represent our history. Yes there are some scenes in all of them that are certainly out of step with today and problematic. However, they were the way kids were talking and doing things at the time. Molly is right that was unique at the time. Trust me I knew a lot of people who said a lot mare racist things than long duck dong for laughs, and unfortunately at the time a lot laughed. Ignoring that doesn’t make it not real.

        As for the supposed rape scene in sixteen candles, I have a problem with how it is being portrayed. Sure the boyfriend giving the drunk girl to a 15 year old boy is gross, and if that was what bothered Molly I get it. Still, the girl attacks Anthony Michael Hall the Geek who was 15 and playing a character who was 15. Remember he doesn’t have a license to drive. Is it rape of him as she was an adult acting like a senior in high school 17-18? This is where I have a problem with this overanalyzing, as legally the problem would be the girls. Is it really okay to view a 15 year old guy being attacked by an adult or almost adult. Doesn’t anyone think not thinking about that makes us a bit sexist still. Why didn’t Molly call up Anthony Michael Hall too about that scene instead of just the woman.

    • Shappalled says:

      MAGA kid. 😅

      I had to Google it to find out what it meant.

  5. Luna says:

    Shallow comment: M.R. Has always been a hero of mine, and she looks f*cking amazing.

    • Christin says:

      She does look good, and seems content with her life. Not many child/teen stars achieve that.

    • NotSoSocialButterfly says:

      She does look great, but I think her brow lift is a tad aggressive.

  6. Eric says:

    Molly Ringwald does a great job of being conflicted about the movies of Hughes and Hughes himself. It’s a well thought out article and has strong arguments about the juxtaposition of man vs movies.
    One must keep in mind that both Hughes and Ringwald were products of their respective eras (60s vs 80s) and while that’s no excuse for poor behavior, it colors people differently. It seems pretty obvious that Ringwald’s mother was much more conservative (protective) than Hughes, even though they were if the same era. The 80s generally were far more conservative in manner and fashion than the 60s. Still, Hughes comes off as being amiable to Ringwald’s film suggestions at that time and shows that a boor from the 60s could (and did) use the advice of a teen girl in the 80s.

    • Christin says:

      I read the part about the proposed pool scene, and was glad that he listened to MR’s input and cut it from the final script. The principal came across as a jerk, and a leering scene was not necessary to demonstrate that.

      I’m a big classic movie watcher, so I’m accustomed to recalling how so many films are (for better or worse) a product of those times. At least it creates a dialogue.

  7. Nicole says:

    I thought the piece was amazingly written. It felt like an authentic exploration of old favorites through today’s lens. Which doesn’t always mean erasure but acknowledgment of why not everything holds up years later. That the world is changing.

  8. Lucy says:

    Great read!! Very insightful and thought-inducing.

  9. Jenns says:

    All of this makes me think about how we as women were conditioned to believe that all of this terrible behavior by men was acceptable. I still have nostalgia about these movies, and other 80s movies, but so many of them were problematic AF.

    • Patricia says:

      YESSSS! I thought it was just how boys behaved! (And so did the boys, I know many of them grew into respectful and good men but behaved terribly as teenagers, partly influenced by pop culture like this). In high school (in the 90s and early 2000s for me) boys would snap bras and the backs of panties, expose themselves, and say extremely sexual things. And we thought “oh it’s just how boys give attention”.

      • Mel M says:

        Right, I just commented below about remembering an incident from 20years ago when I was a freshman in high school. A boy snapped my bra strap and I slapped him (which I know also isn’t right) but everyone was appalled at me and thought nothing about what he did because it was just something boys did back then and we were expected to put up with it.

    • Grant says:

      Right! Not to mention how homophobic these movies were. I cringe every time I hear the use of the word “f@ggot” and how even the movie’s protagonist usually joins in on the snickering.

    • K.T says:

      Agree! Every movie is so different when I watch it now…so much stuff to cringe at now and it’s all so subliminal.

  10. Carol Hill says:

    Revisiting so many “classics” is problematic for women. We have been use to seeing ourselves through the sexual lenses of directors and believed their versions of what we should be, what we were and what they wanted us to be. Just watch season 1 of The Office. I had never seen it till my nephew made me. I was appalled. The overt sexual discrimination and inappropriate sexual “jokes” was horrible. Parks and Rec wasn’t much better. We need to understand that we have accepted men’s versions of what women want and need for too long. We need to set up new narratives that express women’s feelings and needs as seen from our angles. More women writers and directors are needed. Great job, Molly.

    • Anastasia says:

      With “The Office,” though, Michael Scott is a character who is meant to be laughed AT. He is roundly hated by the entire office, except Dwight, who is also sexist and problematic AF. It’s satire. Not meant to be taken seriously.

      Same thing with “All in the Family” back in the day. Archie Bunker was not a character who was loved. Those writers wanted to satirize the typical old racist sexist white man, and they did.

      • eto says:

        Michael isn’t hated though, is he? He’s shown to be bigoted and inconsiderate in really every episode but his team loves him and puts up with it. I’m a fan of the Office but I can really only watch a few episodes at a time without getting too frustrated.

      • Anastasia says:

        @eto: they don’t love him. They often put up with it, but they don’t love him. Just one example: Stanley. He absolutely loathes Micheal and makes no secret of it. Has zero respect for him.

  11. L84Tea says:

    All I know is this. Even as a kid when I first saw TBC, the character of John Bender always made me uncomfortable. I despised the way he verbally attacked Claire, making fun of her name, her family, and generally trying to beat her down and shame her–and like Molly, I hadn’t even thought of the desk incident as an assault, but whoa, she’s right–and it always made me angry as hell that she (sort of) ends up with him at the end of the movie.

    • VirgiliaCoriolanus says:

      I’ve only seen parts of one–I think Pretty in Pink…..but even as a kid, I thought it was gross when Molly Ringwald gave her underwear to this nerdy blond guy in the bathroom after he was peeping on her and basically being a pervert up until then…….

    • Millenial says:

      I watched that movie so many times as a preteen and I remember thinking he was the bees knees. Now it’s super obvious he’s just negging her. It’s sad that I thought that was normal.

    • Christin says:

      Bender was the least sympathetic character to me, despite his claims of physical abuse from his father. I also could not believe Claire ended up with him at the end. I thought the other coupling (the jock and the outcast) was better.

    • Kittenq says:

      Same. I remember thinking he was just a terrible person and being disappointed that Claire ended up with him.

    • Asiyah says:

      I love TBC, even knowing that Bender was either a sociopath or a guy with borderline personality disorder. I did think it was ridiculous yet typical that Claire ended up with him. Then I remember the stereotype of women liking bad boys, or that when men verbally assault you it’s because they secretly like you. It doesn’t make me hate the movie less; it’s just things that I keep in mind.

      • Anastasia says:

        Yes, Asiyah. Molly’s character has internalized misogyny and goes for the bad guy who treats her badly, but at least pays attention to her, unlike her mommy and daddy.

  12. Eric says:

    Great comments from all of you. Thank you.

    Just wondering if we could look at shows of today and wonder if we will cringe in twenty years?

    I’ve watched GoT and WestWorld and see garish exploration and abuse. I’m not talking about the characters but the actors. Season One of GoT is almost unwatchable for its rampant sexuality (if that’s what they call it) and nudity. I’m surprised the show wasn’t derailed at that point. WestWorld Season One also has many of the same aspects as GoT S1. Lots of nudity and crude sexual practices.
    Not saying they are remotely similar to 80s Hughes movies, but if Molly can (rightfully) question some content of her three movies with Hughes, then certainly the actresses on HBO can do the same.

  13. Maum says:

    Quite depressing that so many of these films are so awful.

    If there any French speakers here, how about ‘La Boum’?
    THE coming of age classic 80s French film that everyone has watched. I hadn’t and only got round to doing so last year.
    In the film an 11 year old flirts very explicitly with the teenage main character’s father. It’s treated as a recurrent joke throughout.

    Also main character’s dad cheats on his wife. In order not to get found out he fakes a broken leg (complete with cast)- when she eventually realises her mother tells her she should be flattered(!) as it is a sign of his love.
    And of course at the end of the film they reunite romantically…

    Ugh.

    • Bishg says:

      “La Boum” is actually one of my favourite coming-of-age movies! (I’m Italian). While I see your points, I don’t read those as problematic. The character of the granny is deliberately and thouroughly portrayed as an unconventional, over-the-top elderly woman. She uses humour and detachment to go through her life and overcome a lot of sufferings.
      As for the little girl’s crush for the friend’s father, it is nothing inappropriate ; the man is clearly embarassed and uncomfortable due to her (unwanted) attentions and I seem to remember (although I might be wrong, I haven’t seen the movie in a while) that at some point he also shares a sweet, innocent moment when he confronts her and makes her realise he is way too old for her.

      • Maum says:

        The granny is indeed very unconventional and ‘fun’ which is why I was shocked- when it comes to her daughter’s marriage she’s surprisingly conservative and tells to buckle up and go back to her husband.
        I found it really sad- the mother had moved out, became herself again (marriage was clearly in a rut while her husband was cheating) and met a much better looking man:)
        However her poor husband was so lonely without her… so she goes back.

        I’d be curious to see what you think watching it now. As I said I never saw it as a teen and it was so different than what I expected.

        I also have major issues with Grease by the way. Never liked it and even less so now.

      • Bishg says:

        @Maum, it’s hard to disagree with you! The mum’s new lover (which happens to be her daughter’s German teacher) is indeed quite charming and definitely an upgrade in terms of looks compared to the dad. But I actually think that the message of the movie is quite mature and unconventional in that sense: the grandmother tells her daughter to “stick with it” not because she sees her as a pushover, but because she knows that they still love each other and sometimes you go through a bumpy road in your marriage but you can still patch things up and save it.. also, I’ve always had great respect for the mum’s character, I’ve always thought she was a total boss for getting back to work and pursuing her dream career, kicking her husband in the ass when he deserved, getting herself a hot piece and then deciding her family was still worth a shot!
        The movies’ qualities lie, IMO, in the depiction of a normal, bourgeois family, without the usual, sugar-coated Hollywood crap..

    • greenmonster says:

      German speaker here but La Boum has a huge following in Germany (at least in my generation). The 11 year old flirting with Vic’s father was Samantha, right? That always made me uncomfortable to watch (when I saw the movie for the first time I was even younger than her and thought this was so creepy).
      I was even more disgusted when I read years later that Sophie Marceau had a “new” movie coming out in which her La Boum father was playing her lover.

      • Bishg says:

        It’s great to get to know different perspective on this.
        I’ve never read Samantha’s behaviour as creepy, even though I was her age when I first watched the movie. First of all, I’ve seen little girls showing affection for adults whom they’ve idealised and equated to “princes in shining armours”. It’s not uncommon. There’s nothing sexual here; in the movie, Samantha suffers from having an immature, unreliable and absent father and she clearly projects her need for a stable father figure on Vic’s dad. Her character plot line is actually quite sad since she was never taken care of or loved by her own father, therefore the only adult male she sees having a shred of decency and kindness towards her turns into a prince charming and she mistakes it for love (at least that’s how I’ve always read it!)

      • greenmonster says:

        Oh no… I meant it as creepy for me, that this young actress had to flirt with the older man. I absolutely agree with your interpretation of her storyline. She wanted a father figure. I was just creeped that it had to be Samantha who was so flirty.

  14. Sophie F says:

    Actually, Haviland Morris doubled down on her views after the interview:

    “the more I think of it this evening, oddly, the LESS uncomfortable I am with Caroline, Jake was disgusted with her and said he could violate her 17 ways if he wanted to because she was so trashed, but he didn’t. And then, Ted was the one who had to ask if they had had sex, which certainly doesn’t demonstrate responsible behavior from either party, but also doesn’t really spell date rape. On the other hand, she was basically traded for a pair of underwear . . . Ah, John Hughes.”

    She says less UNcomfortable, so more comfortable in essence. Bizarre, but just thought I should point it out…

  15. JustJen says:

    Maybe I was naive, maybe I still am but I didn’t think the geek and Caroline did it. Only because I remember him asking her if they did it and she said she thought so.

    • psl says:

      I never thought they did either…..

    • Anastasia says:

      She says “Yeah, I’m pretty sure.” They did.

    • Asiyah says:

      I always thought it was ambiguous, or that she came on to him after he decided she was too drunk (not that she deserved to be slept with while drunk, duh). I am not sure but either way it is problematic.

    • Mel M says:

      Me too, I always thought she was mistaken and assumed they did just because she thought there was no way they didn’t right? Like that was what she would normally do (with Jake) when she got black out drunk so she assumed she did it with this guy. Plus he wasn’t drunk so how could he not remember? Side note, last time I watched it the f word and the r word was used and I was not amused.

      This was my favorite movie of the 80s along with Ferris Buler. It is amazing how all of that behavior was deemed typical boy behavior and it’s was. Like someone above commented when I was in middle and high school guys did all that bra shaping and sex jokes and just being disgusting to girls. I actually slapped a guy in the face when he snapped my bra strap freshman year, Spanish class (I still remember it clearly 20 years later) and I remember everyone being appalled…. with ME!!! I know slapping someone is not the right thing to do either but no one thought his behavior was bad, it was just something that boys did and we were expected to put up with it. It was a “joke” and I needed to lighten up.

    • Kelly says:

      I never thought they did either. And Jake sure didn’t expect Caroline to be take advantage of any way, as he was pissed when he found them together the next day. Considering Ted didn’t even know if they “did it”, I’m pretty sure they didn’t. Jake was tired of hauling her drunk ass around so he asked Ted to drive her home. How that turned into Jake handing helpless Caroline over to be raped I’m not sure. Ted did take a detour to show off to his geeky friends and he took a picture with her – fully clothed and no groping.

    • perplexed says:

      I didn’t think they did it either, but I’m not really sure why this is the conclusion I came to. I’d have to watch it again.

      I did think the mocking of the Asian character was strange, nonetheless.

  16. Zondie says:

    Movies made in the 80ies objectified women so much. I remember countless topless scenes that were unnecessary to the plot. There was a term for this: gratuitous sex. Also lots of gratuitous language. When the Weinstein story broke I was not surprised because judging from these movies, of course woman were viewed only as sex objects by Hollywood. That said, John Hughes movies at least gave us a thinking female protagonist.

  17. Neelyo says:

    I can’t wait to read it. I grew up in the Northwest suburbs of Chicago and was even an extra in SIXTEEN CANDLES (look for me over Molly Ringwald’s shoulder during the dance). Ostensibly, those movies were about me and my generation right down to the locale, but not really. I was a gay, black kid and the one of the few minorities around. The movies always made me feel isolated and left out plus they are problematic as fuck so I’m glad they’re being seen that way.

    • Anastasia says:

      I know exactly who you are! I’ve watched that film maybe 100 times, and I love all the extras in the gym dance scene! One girl is wearing an outfit I owned at the time.

  18. windyriver says:

    I disagree on one point re: Sixteen Candles and your discussion of that scene with Caroline and Ted (Anthony Michael Hall’s character). She was drunk, but pretty sure she wasn’t blackout drunk in that sequence. I always thought they had sex, but she didn’t completely remember the details when they woke up in the parking lot. IIRC, don’t think he did either. Believe the dialog was something like – Him: “Did we…?” and Her: “Yeah, I think so.”

    The description “apparently rapes her when she’s unconscious” is not what I saw portrayed, though how they both ended up in that situation to begin with was definitely problematic.

    Otherwise, agree with many of the points raised.

    • windyriver says:

      Not sure how to edit above, but wanted to add, pretty sure the dialog in that scene continued with him asking, “Did I enjoy it?…uh, I mean, did you?”, and her responding, “Yeah, I kind of think I did.” Assume Hughes was trying to make a point about geeks and cool kids, understanding each other, etc – but again, there’s the part of how they ended up there together in the first place.

      Obviously I saw this movie way too many times over the years! But not recently, and it’ll be interesting to take another look at it now.

  19. poppy says:

    while i agree with her, a lot of what the boys in the films do is an accurate depiction of what that age is like. the female responses are what are not quite fair. and it is ok to show this behavior if you do it responsibly, without glamorizing and encouraging the bad behaviors.
    if there were a balance of stories written by women and directed by women then i don’t feel there would be an issue with depicting the gross immature behaviors of teen boys these stories depict.
    and isn’t that the age the lessons should be applied to? i know teen movies are heavily viewed by preteens so why not depict life as is with the idea of showing kids to be immature (as they are) but they learn! they grow! they become better than the depicted behaviors.
    the breakfast club did this with outsiders so it can be done and what are they waiting on? there is a way to teach young men how to lose that puppy pack mentality with grace and become a real adult men that learn from their mistakes. that stop acting like entitled hormonal jerks because they realize women are human people too! it can be done but for some reason the powers that be don’t like this?

    • Kittenq says:

      Right. This is where I struggle, too. I feel like it’s a fine line between a movie that accurately reflects the frighteningly common reality of nonconsensual sex acts and a movie that minimizes/dismisses these acts as merely comedic fodder. These issues have to be handled delicately and I think some of Hughes’s films fall flat in that they normalize assault or make it the butt of a joke.

      In 1995, people accused the controversial film “Kids” or normalizing similar behaviors but I personally found that movie horrifying. I don’t think Harmony Korine glamorized or sanctioned the creepiness of Telly’s actions….or at least if that was the intention, he failed miserably as it had the opposite effect on most people I know. But yes, he was using the movie format to show the world a sampling of the culture that he was very accustomed to: teenage skateboarders in NYC who seemingly grow up way too fast. It had a disturbing effect versus the casual, almost-lighthearted way that Hughes portrayed such acts.

  20. Deanne says:

    That was a really well written piece and so timely. The part in Sixteen Candles where Jake loads his drunk girlfriend into his Father’s car and sends Ted off with her ,always really bothered me. The racist depiction of the Long Duck Dong character also made me cringe. I didn’t find anything romantic about Claire and Bender getting together. He was abusive towards her and basically assaulted her. It was problematic then and still is.That being said, I still loved those movies when I was young. It’s sad because a lot of things that bring me nostalgia are really problematic if I revisit them now.

  21. Sayrah says:

    I was going to say St Elmo’s fire is better but I thought about the scene where billy treats Jules so poorly trying to coerce her into having sex.

    • Boxy Lady says:

      I love St Elmo’s Fire but I didn’t see it for the first time until maybe 5 years ago when I was well into my 30s. I quickly realized that all Emilio Estevez does in that movie is crazily stalk Andie McDowell. Seriously, that was his entire plot line.

  22. Anastasia says:

    I almost can’t watch ANY classic films anymore! Anything from the 80s on back (or perhaps the 90s!) is so problematic.

  23. MoAnne says:

    Yeah, I watched 16 Candles a few years ago with some friends. Everyone became eerily quiet when the Long Duk Dong character came on screen. My friend was like, “I don’t remember this being that racist, do you?” When it got to Jake’s girlfriend, we were done with the movie. 80s nostalgia only goes so far…I will honestly never watch that movie again. I think Pretty in Pink is still watchable, but some movies are just out.

    I think Molly is a terrific writer, too. It’s a very well-written piece about what was acceptable back then, and how far we have (or have not) come since then. I’m thinking about our current p-grabber in chief, and how many people excused it as “locker room banter.” I bet in the future, they will look at our culture as seriously unhinged for accepting that, too.

  24. Sarah says:

    I went to a co-ed Catholic middle school in the late 1980s…what the boys were allowed to get away with was nauseating. I remember having hands up my skirt, my bra snapped too many times to count, tampons taken from my purse and thrown around the room, remarks made about my body, etc.
    I finally snapped during the spring of my 8th grade year, and physically retaliated against several of those boys, which ended with them having some bloodied noses and bruises.
    The whole thing was ignored by my school administration, which I look back on today with astonishment.
    The memory of those behaviors can still conjure up an anger in me that is vicious. I am SO grateful my daughter isn’t dealing with the same type of crap. The “boys will be boys” stupidity really harmed a lot girls at that time. The Hughes movies were a pretty true illustration of those issues, sadly.

    • Lisa says:

      When I think of bra snapping, it was always the girls doing it to other girls! They wanted to see who was wearing a bra yet. I remember someone trying to snap mine and SCREEEEECHING when there was nothing to grab. “YOU’RE NOT WEARING ONE!!?????”

      Like, hello? Look at me, I’m barely an A-cup. If I had worn one, they would’ve made fun of me for not having anything to put in it. I was just being realistic. 😂

      • Jazz says:

        Yes! That used to happen to me! In maths class the girl sitting behind me was always leaning forward to snap my bra strap. 😕

  25. Sasha says:

    Agree with all the comments so far. I love the nostalgia of these films but they really are incredibly problematic.

    Also just want to say I love Molly! She seems so intelligent and thoughtful and well adjusted considering her incredible fame at such a young age. I wish she was in more things now!

    • mssinglemalt says:

      I enjoyed Molly Ringwald’s book, ‘When it Happens to You’. It is a collection of stories that deal with betrayal, loss and love. I also enjoyed seeing her in Riverdale.

  26. Lisa says:

    Not one of her movies, but Fast Times At Ridgemont High is still one of the best 80s teen movies. It didn’t glorify the still-permissive attitude toward sex, which would soon change when AIDS became an epidemic in the later part of the decade. (Amazing how things changed in just a few years). It showed you that there could be consequences and the girl would be the one to be hit hardest by them.

    It’s still a product of its time in some ways, but it was also pretty progressive, in my opinion.

  27. Mabs A'Mabbin says:

    I don’t know. When you watch old movies, from any era, you have to understand, realize and accept, the time frame concerning culture, politics, et al. It’s for this reason I hardly watch anything from the 50s through the 80s lol. Except for science fiction, fantasy and historicals, I simply can’t swallow mindsets and generally cringe throughout. We will one day cringe over current releases as will our kids and grandkids and quite possibly over reasons we don’t yet know.

  28. Miasys says:

    Local theater had an 80s movie night so we took our 14 y.o. daughter to see TBC & 16 candles because I always loved them. She enjoyed TBC but I was legit cringing at so many scenes. So many things that i grew up just accepting are a huge problem for me now. At least it gave me the opportunity have the consent talk with her again. Ugh.

  29. Elena says:

    Are we only supposed to make art or movies that show an ideal? If so, what are we supposed to do with our feelings when #metoo stories happen to us? I’m not an expert, but I don’t think it’s the right thing to ignore those realities for the sake of presenting something untrue about ourselves or our experience because it would be less offensive to viewers. Art/film is a conversation between the artist and the observer. If the art makes you uncomfortable, that’s not a crime, but a call to examine the work to understand your own feelings. John Hughes movies aren’t exactly in a league with Salvador Dali’s work, for example, I understand that they were entertainment (and I grew up watching and loving them). But I think there is a deeper question here about not only the freedom of personal expression, but also about WHO the responsibility for one’s feelings’ lies with. As a kid, and now as an adult, I don’t appreciate any attempt to lie to me or hide the truth, and I also don’t appreciate being censored from telling my story (this is why I support #metoo), but censoring the artist or director or offensive work itself is not the answer. I don’t know that there is one solution, but I can see that at least partially, parental guidance – just as Molly Ringwald was doing by watching the movie with her daughter – is a crucial component for giving young people a mature frame of reference from which to observe the work. Molly Ringwald also says she may have chickened out from initiating the discussion with her daughter about the parts of the movie that made them uncomfortable. I appreciate her honesty there, because she acknowledges the difficulty with broaching the topic. I think that’s natural. However, whether it is difficult or not is irrelevant to the fact of WHO bears the responsibility for having that conversation with their child. One can either help their kid understand how to process uncomfortable realities, or push it aside and hope the kid understands on their own. The #metoo movement should focus on making the safe space for women and girls to have these conversations.

    • Mabs A'Mabbin says:

      I wholeheartedly agree. I’d never watch another film if they only wore halos and were homogenized for the masses. If the picture disturbs, don’t watch. I abhor censorship and want and expect a full rage of viewing options. Furthermore, I don’t expect the entertainment industry to be educators. That’s like asking Donald Trump to be the President.

  30. Amelie says:

    I recently watched The Breakfast Club for the first time all the way through (I had seen bits and pieces on TV but was honestly pretty bored with what I saw and never tried to sit through it). It’s an okay movie but I don’t see it as this amazing coming of age movie celebrating teen outsiders and teen angst. Molly’s character really annoyed me, the bad boy guy was just awful all around, and the nerdy kid was just a huge stereotype of a nerdy kid. I was really happy when it ended!

  31. Kim says:

    Wow. I had forgotten about that incredibly gross and problematic scene in The Breakfast Club where it is implied that Bender basically sexually assaults Claire, because that’s what we call that now that we’ve stopped brushing it off as boys being boys and started acknowledging as a society that girls have a right not to be poked and prodded and assaulted or raped by little idiot savages with emotional problems. Oh crap, some of my bitter leaked out.