Here are some photos of Kate Winslet at the Palm Springs International Film Festival over the weekend. Kate wore a sleek Roland Mouret gown with a very familiar silhouette. The past few years, Kate has worn a seemingly endless succession of similar gowns, usually Mouret or Stella McCartney. I don’t hate it, honestly. I feel like she’s never really been a “fashion girl,” so she’s just sticking with something comfortable and familiar. While Kate has scored Best Supporting Actress nominations at the Golden Globes and SAGs, I’m really, really hoping she gets snubbed for an Oscar nomination for Steve Jobs. She was the worst part of that movie.
Meanwhile, back in November, Kate got a lot of pushback and WTFs when she said some words during a BBC interview. Honestly, her entire Steve Jobs promotional tour was a mess and the whole thing made me realize that she’s really stuck up her own ass for the most part. But during the BBC interview, Winslet was asked about Jennifer Lawrence’s wage inequality essay and Kate shut down the conversation by saying that the whole discussion was “vulgar” and “strange” and that we shouldn’t be talking about any of this publicly. While at the PSIFF, she was asked about her “vulgar” statement, and this is what she said:
Kate Winslet says previous comments she made about the hot button issue were “misinterpreted” when she described public discussion of salaries as “vulgar.”
“When you’re talking about specifics of pay that is a line of questioning I really had a hard time with,” the Oscar winner told me exclusively last night at the Palm Springs International Film Festival. “So my remarks were in response to that but only that. Of course we should be paid the same as the boys. We want to stand alongside them.”
Winslet praised her fellow Oscar winner’s response as “entirely appropriate. It was a very difficult situation for her. Hopefully these discussions will continue to support the efforts that are being made all over the world for the right to equal pay in this field and all other industries. For my entire career, I’ve really stood for women’s rights and I will always remain entirely committed to empowering women and the right to equal pay is a fundamental part of that. Of course women should be paid the same as men. Of course they should. Of course I should.”
I said at the time that her “vulgar” comment was mostly about being British and not wanting to discuss money whatsoever, but I also thought (at the time) that Winslet was wrong to shut down the conversation and seemingly insult Jennifer Lawrence. If Winslet doesn’t want to talk about money, sure. Don’t talk about money. But don’t dismiss the conversation out of hand just because you’re uncomfortable.
Kate was also asked about her “vulgar” comment when she sat down for an interview with CBS Sunday Morning (you can see the full video here). She discussed other things, of course, like how she was “bullied,” how she was so brave to wear a brown wig for Steve Jobs, etc. But this answer about the vulgar question:
“What I think is vulgar is talking publicly about actual earning of money. Even as I’m saying it now, I’m feeling a bit sick in my mouth. I’m British, we don’t do that. Jennifer put it brilliantly; she did it so gracefully and graciously. What I object to, unfortunately, is the line of questioning that it almost gives journalists permission to open with, which I don’t like. I fully had a journalist say to me, ‘Do you know if you got paid more or less than Michael Fassbender?’ I don’t ever want to be asked that question. I certainly wouldn’t answer it. That’s what makes it difficult. Would it make it better if I told you that if I’m ever in a situation where I feel like there’s something unfair happening, that I always stand up for myself? Would that make you feel better?”
If her answer sounds awkward and strangled, it’s because it was. You could feel her discomfort and props to the CBS journalist for not saying anything and letting Winslet talk herself into a circle. I mean, we get that Winslet (and other British people) think talking about money is vulgar. But Winslet is so stuck up her own ass she doesn’t get that not everything is about her and her feelings. She comes from a place of enormous privilege and instead of sticking up for women around the world (which Winslet insists she does), she makes it all about what journalists should and should not ask her, because she lives in a vulgar bubble of privilege, amirite?
Photos courtesy of WENN.
i like kate, but her generation is so disappointing in terms of feminism. and i’m british, so kate, this argument doesn’t wash with me.
The entirety of the Steve Jobs flick was forced, strained, and stupid. So Winslet fit right in!
yep, you’re right. Stuck far up her own in deep darkness. Whew. Pompous.
Stop calling men, ‘boys’, Kate! Unless you actually like being treated as a ‘girl’ and not like a woman.
I was going to say that. A man using the term ‘girls’ would immediately be attacked. I recently read an article where an actor who did that in an interview was described as ‘patronizing’ . The author then went on to say that his form of sexism was more dangerous than overt misogyny.
So talking about wage inequality is vulgar but talking about your urinary incontinence isn’t? Sure, Jan.
lmao, very true.
Also, “I’m feeling a bit sick in my mouth.” That’s incredibly vulgar and I wish people would stop talking about throwing up over anything that makes them uncomfortable or causes some distaste. Say it makes you uncomfortable or causes some distaste.
Has anyone noticed the women most against discussing feminism/addressing equal rights are usually always successful white female actresses? Apparently they’ve come far enough to be considered the top tier but even with their positions are too terrified to fight for anyone/thing other than their own meager paychecks (comparatively).
Jennifer Lawrence was forced into it with the Sony hack but I give her credit for at least speaking out when women twice her age can only stutter through all kinds of excuses.
“Apparently they’ve come far enough to be considered the top tier but even with their positions are too terrified to fight for anyone/thing other than their own meager paychecks”
this. and it’s disappointing because you made it and have the means to speak up.
I don’t know if she’s necessarily conscious about it, but I wonder if that’s why she’s reluctant to discuss her salary in relation to another actor. She might be paid less than Michael Fassbender, but probably is aware that she gets paid more than other actresses who have less of a standing, and the average female on the street, so probably doesn’t want to get involved in discussions where this could be pointed out (as in what right do you have to complain when you’re making millions of dollars a year? The push-back against Jennifer Lawrence was sort of along those lines). I think Chris Rock mentioned something recently about women of colour being paid significantly less than white actresses in Hollywood.
Even if top white actresses were to stand up for their right to equal pay, I don’t know if that would have a ricochet effect into other industries outside of Hollywood, since Hollywood plays by much different rules (i.e marketability, box-office receipts, etc. Labor is hard to quantify there). So maybe that’s where her reluctance comes from…
In the US ( in the corporate world) we are actually contractually prohibited from discussions or disclosure of salaries. It is in our employment agreements.
I wonder if actors have the same.
Argh. I can’t reply to Farhi, but this is a good read re: pay secrecy!
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2014/07/when-the-boss-says-dont-tell-your-coworkers-how-much-you-get-paid/374467/
Farhi, I honestly think pay transparency should be legislated. If everyone knew what everyone else was paid, then companies would have to pay a lot more equitably, or they’d lose staff/struggle to recruit.
Exactly! Kate wants the ‘boys’ to like her. So she will absolutely not be rocking the boat.
That’s exactly what I think. I’ve met so many women like her. They don’t even know what they think about feminism. All they care about is maintaining their status as the “boys'” favorite. Gross.
I read about this yesterday and had similar thoughts. It’s not vulgar when phrased in the context of two leads are hired for a job and one gets paid less because she’s a female.
Now, I certainly understand being uncomfortable with talking money, and if you were at a party it might be weird for someone to say, hey what do you pull in a year? that might be a bit vulgar for small talk conversation with someone you don’t know.
However, she’s a bright girl. She knew that wasn’t what was being asked, or how it was being asked. It was a direct question about wage and pay equality, and this one just dropped the ball.
Side note and slight repost:
Happy New Year and thank you to ALL of you who contribute exciting, challenging, thoughtful and usually HILARIOUS commentary.
I’ve been on board with CB since the beginning, and reading the awesome, well written and well resourced articles by our fave authors is seriously a highlight of my day.
Not only are the articles informative, but the site supports women, intelligent and fair political views and the commenters support fairness and dignity when expressing opinions. And the commenters are usually supportive and kind to one another, while showing great amount of care, empathy and desire to see other people’s perspectives. It’s refreshing to me!! I’m also super thankful to the new writers too – y’all are killing it!
Thanks to all of you lovely people I share this space with, and I look forward to another amazing year!
In love and snark,
Little Darling
Well said Little Darling! Cheers. Here’s to 2016.
What an appropriately thoughtful and lovely comment! 😊
Right on, Little Darling. happy New Year!
That rule of not talking about money was for aristocracy. They were so above it all, all such small concerns as money and where the money came from (slave labor). And they lost everything to the enterprising capitalists for whom money was all they talked about.
These days most actors can’t afford not to talk or think about money. A life of an actor is hard and the job is low paying unless they hit it big.
Is Winslet from a well to do family?
Winslet is from a family of unemployed actors. Her mom worked as a barmaid or a nanny , and her father is an actor, but he rarely had acting roles, so he had to find various jobs to raise his 4 kids .Even her sisters are mostly unemployed/ strugggling actresses. I think Kate is mostly embarrassed because of that background. She’s from a family of empoverished actors, and she probably thinks millionaires actresses shouldn’t really complain of being paid less …when you know they are millionaires, and they have no problem to work ( which is her case, Directors are willing to delay their shooting for years so they can work with her!!)
I saw the CBS interview those article are based on and she says -but of course it isnt printed in those articles- ” Do you think female schoolteachers for example want to sit at home and listen at hollywood actresses saying basically that they aren’t paid enough ?”.
Ah, ok. It makes sense now. Maybe she was misinterpreted or rather she misspoke.
It is still not vulgar to talk about money.
I watched a documentary about the place where Downton Abbey is filmed (Highclere Castle) and the Earl who owns it talked about how much it costs to maintain it – 2 million pounds a year and how happy he was to have Downton Abbey filming there to help with the costs,
I wondered if that was what was affecting her thinking — as in, she knows she’s paid more than the average person on the street, even if she’s not paid as much as male actor X, and feels weird discussing her pay because it’s in the millions.
Yes, actors are overpaid. But male actors are usually (over)paid far more than their female counterparts. The playing field needs to be level. That’s what the discussion is about. She knows that because she goes on to say that the wage gap disparity applies to other industries as well.
She doesn’t want to discuss it, fine but I seriously doubt her reasoning has anything to do with sensitivity towards us regular peons whose salaries are far less.
I don’t think she necessarily has sensitivity towards regular people not related to her, but I don’t think she’s unaware of how much she makes in relation to the rest of her family either. She always seemed kind of cognizant, and maybe even slightly guilty, of the fact that she made “it” whereas her sisters didn’t. I think that could influence how she approaches the topic of money in terms of being asked what her personal salary is.
In addition, Hollywood gives salary based on marketability, not labor, so I think it is a difficult topic to navigate in that respect. Jennifer Lawrence is recognized for the time being as highly marketable, but I’m not sure of whether Kate Winslet is viewed that way or if she even views herself like that based on the kinds of movies she’s chosen to do over the years, despite being a very respected actress and having starred in Titanic. So it is somewhat of a complicated discussion to tread into because of the other factors affecting how actors get paid as opposed to how accountants or engineers do.
She could then say< "I find it vulgar to talk about MY pay, because women on the whole are paid so much less for doing so much." But, that's why actors come off better with a good script, they're not always so well expressed on their own.
I think she implicitly said that when she said “Do you think a schoolteacher wants to hear a Hollywood actress complaining about her pay?” (I’m paraphrasing a bit). When I watched the interview in full, her answer seemed more rounded than what was excerpted. She’s not as articulate she could have been, but she did seem to say it was vulgar to talk about MY pay when there’s a schoolteacher out there making less.
@ perplexed, i agree completely about her probably feeling guilty about being the only one to have succeeded in her family . She always repeated hollywood actresses shouldn’t complain because they are very privileged people ( she said it about motherhood , balancing private et professional life) and i often sees in interview hints of embarassment to discuss certain topic because of her family background. I remember an old interview , where she said that during the shooting of Titanic she complained to her older sister about the difficult conditions on the set ,the cold water, exhaustion, etc… and her sister told her to STFU because at the end of the day she was happy to have a job, a well paid and prestigious one, when in her family they struggled to even land an audition.
She made multiples comments of that sort through the years .
But btw , she’s also an actress who doesnt want to disclose herself, she doesnt want to talk very private matters ( like the reasons of her divorces ) nor very serious or controversial issues. She isn’t Emma Thompson, who doesn’t mind speakingher mind about all subjects.
Kate doesn’t want to Discuss Politics, for example, she just doessn’t want to express her views. She’s the type of actresses who think that she should stay a mystery to the public. I think that also explain her embarassement when asked about such matters.
You know what is more vulgar? Inequality.
…or signing on to do a film directed by a known pedophile who preyed on a 13-year-old girl. How Hollywood has given Roman Planski and Woody Allen a pass makes me so mad it activates my deodorant.
Lolol yes. the way people casually mention Polanski in interviews freaks me out.
And that’s actually beyond vulgar.
I’m British, and I too was raised to think it’s vulgar to talk about money. And you know what? That’s why we have a stupid culture over here of no pay transparency, where women and racial minorities are completely taken advantage of in the job market because we’re not supposed to discuss it. To hell with that bullsh*t, I’d rather be vulgar.
Exactly. She’s trying to use old practices that defeat and enslave people as an excuse for why she can’t change and recognize how those old practices were useless.
Oh stop it. Blaming your culture for not wanting to talk about it is so lazy. Instead of using it as an excuse, maybe say “You know, I wasn’t brought up to talk about money but I see that it’s necessary.” Being uncomfortable with a topic is usually a sign that you SHOULD talk about it. But she doesn’t have to so … good for her I guess. And f*ck everyone else.
I know she tried to explain it away but she just dug a deeper hole so I’m sticking with my reaction from last time.
Yeah, just shut it. I was brought up never ever discussing money, too. My generation just didn’t – how much someone made, how much something cost – strictly off limits. It was even considered bad manners to mention that someone was wealthy. But times have changed, and this conversation is necessary. For her to act all fluttery and incapable of discussing such a vulgar topic is just an excuse.
It’s like Scarlett O’Hara at the opening of GWTW, “Woa, woa, woa, all you boys ever want to do is talk about woa.” By the end of GWTW, she’s faced reality and turned into the Money Honey.
I was brought up to talk about money, actually. My dad has no concept of it, it comes in and he spends it. Not in a crazy way but he grew up during two wars, it was more about survival than a savings account. My mom always handled the finances and taught us to work for it and yes, then ask for it. As women, we need to ask a little louder but most of us don’t really speak up at all. If there is one thing I learned from my mom, it’s that you need to open your mouth. Open. Your. Mouth. Nothing will be handed to you. Be polite, work hard. But ask for things too. And talk about money. I love that she was never precious about it. She will straight up ask us what that new purse cost and I have no problem telling her. I earned it, I bought it. Done. My sister is a bit funny about it, no idea where she got that.
I think I’m probably older than you? Things started to change when I was in my twenties, but as a child and teenager – no money talk, ever.
GNAT, I’m 31. And German. I guess that makes a difference but it’s not like I see many women around me (my age) who discuss money.
She included this as part of her statement in one of the interviews:
Winslet praised her fellow Oscar winner’s response as “entirely appropriate. It was a very difficult situation for her. Hopefully these discussions will continue to support the efforts that are being made all over the world for the right to equal pay in this field and all other industries. For my entire career, I’ve really stood for women’s rights and I will always remain entirely committed to empowering women and the right to equal pay is a fundamental part of that. Of course women should be paid the same as men. Of course they should. Of course I should.”
Basically, she clarified that she found talking about her own money as vulgar and un-British, but she does iterate that talking generally about money as a social issue is something she has no problem with.
‘Talking about money is vulgar’ – said by people who have it. Yeah, randomly bringing it up without context might be but discussing money, no. Not vulgar.
Not vulgar. I’ll talk about it all day happily, and I’m a little priss.
Let’s chat. I’ll bring the coffee.
I think she’s saying she doesn’t want to be asked about her salary and thinks it is vulgar for her to discuss her specific salary. Which is fair – she’s in a no-win position when it comes to discussing her salary. If she complains about it, someone will tell her, “who are you to complain, you’re a rich actress.” And if she talks about it positively, someone will say, “aren’t you arrogant, boasting about your salary.”
That being said, there are ways to discuss wage inequality and unequal pay without talking about your own salary. Jennifer Lawrence was able to discuss it in a way that has helped advance the discussion along. Hopefully Kate Winslet will get there, too.
Exactly.
The issue is not how much she’s being paid (we all know actors are paid ridiculous amounts) but the discrepancy between salaries between A lister female and male actors.
I think it’s vulgar to hear multi millionaire people complaining about not being paid enough
She actually said that! I wonder why it was omitted from the excerpt from above. She ended the segment with something like “I am sure a school teacher thinks it’s vulgar that two movie actresses are complaining about salaries.”
At the same time, said school teacher might also think, If movie actresses can fight for equal pay then so can I.
Would a schoolteacher really look to an actress for guidance or any kind of aspirational thinking though? They’re in completely different worlds, and how Kate Winslet negotiates her pay (with a team of agents and lawyers) is way different than how a schoolteacher (on her own) would be allowed to.
I also don’t get why that part was omitted.
She did also say that every situation is different, but ultimately believes in equal pay when the man and the woman have equal lines of dialogue and the work-load is the same. Her full answer sounds nuanced in terms of discussion about Hollywood salaries. The full video makes it clear that she simply isn’t comfortable talking about her individual salary. Since Michael Fassbender is playing Steve Jobs himself in Jobs and the whole movie is built around the Jobs factor, maybe Winslet doesn’t feel personally underpaid in that instance, and thus doesn’t want to be asked about her salary in relation to Fassbender’s.
Hahahahahahahah hilarious watching her backpedal furiously.
Problem with Kate is that she’s trying so hard to create this down to earth ‘I’m working class I had my wedding reception in a pub’ image but she also wants to be the new generation Emma Thompson national treasure luvvie.
She wants EVERYONE to love her and doesn’t want to ruffle feathers. As a result she’s just try hard.
As well intentioned as these discussions may be they seem to be geared toward helping white actresses earn equal pay. There is little discussion about women of color earning significantly less. That is a discussion that should be taking place simultaneously.
The white actresses may feel safe enough to go first.
No, they aren’t. They are about actresses earning equal pay, which means all actresses, not just the white ones. This argument – that white actresses shouldn’t discuss it unless they mention the racial disparity – is IMO self-defeating because what it sounds like is people saying that white actresses should shut up and stop complaining because someone else has it worse. The more any woman discusses unequal pay, the better the chance that all women eventually be paid at the same rate as their male counterparts.
I believe that a discussion about the racial disparities in earnings should continue to take place. But I see no reason why a woman can’t discuss gender inequality in and of itself. It doesn’t always have to be in conjunction with racial disparities, despite the insistence by some that intersectionality is the only thing that matters. Intersectionality is important but women – including white ones – should be allowed to discuss their experiences without being told that said experience is discounted unless they acknowledge the existence of and damage done by racism.
This ties into Celebitchy’s Megyn Kelly post today. Winslet’s discomfort is with airing her high earnings or details of salary negotiations in public. Fine.
However, if she agrees wth JLaw’s general point and a reporter asks whether she earned less than Fassbender, why not simply answer something like: “I can’t discuss those details, but I certainly agree that all workers, whether in film or elsewhere, should be paid fairly and equally. It is a concern when women or minorities are consistently paid less.”
I don’t like her contributing to the crippling notion that women who talk about money are uncouth, which sets them back in negotiations, as JLaw expressed so well: “But if I’m honest with myself, I would be lying if I didn’t say there was an element of wanting to be liked that influenced my decision to close the deal without a real fight. I didn’t want to seem ‘difficult’ or ‘spoiled’. At the time, that seemed like a fine idea, until I saw the payroll on the Internet and realized every man I was working with definitely didn’t worry about being ‘difficult’ or ‘spoiled’. This could be a young-person thing. It could be a personality thing. I’m sure it’s both. But this is an element of my personality that I’ve been working against for years, and based on the statistics, I don’t think I’m the only woman with this issue. Are we socially conditioned to behave this way? … Could there still be a lingering habit of trying to express our opinions in a certain way that doesn’t ‘offend’ or “scare” men?”
You expressed it very well.
This whole “it’s vulgar to talk about money” thing may be awareness of class difference, but it also ties into the convenient mythology that women are uncomfortable about money and/or can’t handle money, that money will sully their delicate little hands. When women aren’t supposed to care about money, it’s easier to pay them less and justify it.
I wish JLaw would come off as good in average interviews as she came in that letter. It was so intelligent and thought out that I could like her, then all her casual interviews are about vomit and butt sweats.
I do think you’ve hit the nail on the head. There’s an element of fear of not being liked or ‘the’ girl that the guys like and I have to admit that repulsed me. I understand why it happens, women are unfortunately trained as children to make people happy and it’s hard to break but how long can you cling to something g that’s hurting you? Are you really content to be a second or third class citizen so long as you feel like you’re the one they ‘liked’?
Because just like with Megyn and Jennifer once it’s all written down in black and white those men will support each other and leave you with the scraps.
—However, if she agrees wth JLaw’s general point and a reporter asks whether she earned less than Fassbender, why not simply answer something like: “I can’t discuss those details, but I certainly agree that all workers, whether in film or elsewhere, should be paid fairly and equally. It is a concern when women or minorities are consistently paid less.”
Isn’t that basically what she said? This is from the above post and said by Winslet:
“When you’re talking about specifics of pay that is a line of questioning I really had a hard time with. So my remarks were in response to that but only that. Of course we should be paid the same as the boys. We want to stand alongside them….Hopefully these discussions will continue to support the efforts that are being made all over the world for the right to equal pay in this field and all other industries. For my entire career, I’ve really stood for women’s rights and I will always remain entirely committed to empowering women and the right to equal pay is a fundamental part of that. Of course women should be paid the same as men. Of course they should. Of course I should.”
Fair enough, but it’s very waffling, isn’t it? Like a politician hedging. Compare that with her pithy, clearly memorable, “What I think is vulgar is talking publicly about actual earning of money. Even as I’m saying it now, I’m feeling a bit sick in my mouth” that Kaiser highlights. I take your point, though.
I didn’t really think she was waffling so much as emphasizing that she doesn’t like discussing the specifics of her own actual pay (i.e “actual earning of money”). That’s what she finds vulgar — talking about how much money she personally has earned or personally has not earned. I don’t think she’s saying that she finds talking about money in terms of the gap as a collective social issue as vulgar.
Should she be paid less than Fassbender for Jobs? Yes, she should. She had about 20% of his lines and screen time (i.e., she worked far less). Should Amy Adams be paid less than Bradley Cooper for American Hustle? Hell, no.. she had a similar if not a bigger role, similar screen time. I’m all for pay equality but let’s keep the ACTUAL, performed work in perspective.
*sigh*
Sit down Kate, it’s not 1997 anymore. You’re just another old not understanding the young and their desire for progress.
I’m British and I really don’t like kate winslet. She spends so much time forcing how down to earth she is but she is actually so pompous about every topic she is asked. I have no problem talking about pay and neither do many of my friends. She really thinks she’s above everyone and to me what was tacky was her desperation for that oscar and she hasn’t come down since her win.
If you do not talk about things, nothing changes.
Oh, Kate. You self-centered wanna be. Used to like your work until you opened your mouth and used your own words.
It’s of course always the privilege of the wealthy to consider discussing money “vulgar”. I hope she takes the time to reflect on that.
Once upon a time, women who wanted to vote were considered vulgar. Financial equality is a huge part of feminism, and needs to be discussed, sorry Kate!
I don’t know whose ass she’s kissing but her continuing avoidance of addressing the discrepancy in salaries in the movie world speaks volumes. She’d much rather talk about how she loves her big bum and womanly figure and how there’s too much pressure placed on women to be thin in her industry. That’s only one of the many burdens placed on women in Hollywood and equality in pay rates should be a number one priority. Shame on you Kate, you’re taking the weasel way out.
is no one going to talk about her botoxy face? it bothers me because a while back she made such a fuss about it
I love Kate Winslet. I know she’s persona non grata here most of the time, but I have always liked her.
I am an American, but I was raised in a part of the country where discussing money is something we are taught from birth never to do. It DOES make me queasy to talk about money (and I’m not rich by any standard in the developed world). I have friends who make more and friends who make less, and I do not like talking about money.
I get the validity of many of the arguments made here, but I think there is a shocking level of intolerance for differences in personal and regional culture.
Talking about money is vulgar where I come from, too. It simply is not done. We can address things like wage gaps and inequality, which I think Winslet has done. She simply said she doesn’t like being asked how much she makes or being asked to compare her wage to another particular person’s wage.
If someone asks my household income on a government form, for crying out loud, I get offended…it’s part of my culture. So…ease up on this woman a bit. Please. And don’t throw things at me. Ha ha ha!
It’s not vulgar, it’s activism. I don’t think this is generational, either — I’m her age. We acbsolutely need to talk about this stuff or it will never, ever change. Kate is too rich, too successful and too british to see how important this is to half of the rest of the world.