The Countess of Wessex’s ‘fans’ demand that she receive a title upgrade

Here are more photos of the Countess of Wessex at the state banquet for the South African president last week, as well as some recent Remembrance pics. Sophie has been around in recent weeks, and she and her husband have been invited to some of the biggest royal events of the year. Sophie is also still allowed to borrow royal collection jewelry – for the state banquet, she wore the specially-made aquamarine tiara, which was made for her circa 2005. She also borrowed the Pear-Shaped Diamond Demi-Parure earrings and the Modern Fringe necklace.

So, clearly, Sophie in particular is still in the royal fold to a certain degree. She’s still invited to royal events, she’s still borrowing big pieces of jewelry, she’s still given royal tasks. But she’s not going to get a title promotion. King Charles has made it perfectly clear that he’s not going to give Sophie and Edward the Edinburgh titles, which they were promised when they got married. QEII and Prince Philip BOTH wanted the Edinburgh titles to go to Edward and Sophie, and Charles simply refuses. So here we are. Here we are with the Mail running stories about how Instagram commenters “demand” Sophie become a duchess.

Royal fans have praised Sophie Wessex after she spent time with sick children on a visit to London Zoo this week. The stylish royal, 57, braved the cold weather to open the new Monkey Valley exhibit and pose with its inhabitants ring-tail lemurs. She was joined by children who receive support from the Kaleidoscope Palliative Care and Community Children’s Nursing Teams as she exploted the enclosure – and her natural affinity with the children led royal fans to brand her their ‘new favourite royal’.

After the Royal Family’s official Instagram account posted a photo of the Countess looking at the lemurs with a little girl, fans left comments hailing her as a ‘wonderful member of the royal family’ and added they wanted to see her made Duchess of Edinburgh.

One person said: ‘Love her! Deserves to be Duchess of Edinburgh.’

Another said: ‘This woman deserves the coronet of duchess! She and her husband have been a strong support to the crown and should receive the title promised to them by the late Prince Philip and Queen Elizabeth!’

Prince Philip, who held the title Duke of Edinburgh until his death in April 2021, is understood to have wished for his youngest son Prince Edward to inherit the title when he passed away. As Prince Edward’s wife, this would make Sophie Wessex the Duchess of Edinburgh.

[From The Daily Mail]

Yeah, the Mail is doing this on purpose. Granted, they love turning “social media comments” into royal stories, but the issue around the Edinburgh title has genuinely upset some royal establishment figures and royal reporters. They really feel like the Wessexes should be upgraded. After all, Queen Elizabeth and Philip literally put it in writing!!! They said publicly that they wanted the DoE titles to go to Sophie and Edward. Charles isn’t respecting his parents’ wishes and it’s ruffled some feathers in the media and beyond. I’m very curious to see how this plays out long-term.

Photos courtesy of Avalon Red, Cover Images.

You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed.

123 Responses to “The Countess of Wessex’s ‘fans’ demand that she receive a title upgrade”

Comments are Closed

We close comments on older posts to fight comment spam.

  1. Neners says:

    Obligatory, American “these titles are silly” comment.

    • Flowerlake says:

      Not an American, but let them fight with each other for a bit to take some of the anger for M&H away

    • DK says:

      While I totally agree, as a fellow American, that these titles are silly and absurd, can someone explain to me why, when the Queen made it her expressed, written request that the public call Camz “Queen Consort Camilla” after her death, everyone had to follow that rule, but when the Queen and Prince Phillip made it their expressed written request that after their death that the Wessexes get the Edinburgh titles, no one had to follow that rule?

      From an American perspective, it is yet-more-silly-layered-upon-silly with all the rules that go with these titles…

      • Kathleen says:

        Because the Q was blackmailed into Camilla Queen Consort in exchange for £12.5million for Randy Andy. As soon as the Q closed her eyes all bets were off. Camilla became straight Queen, Edward and Sophie had the rug pulled from under them and Andy loses security in December. If the Q had bone cancer, she was probably doped up on heavy pain meds for some time now and Charles and William have been calling the shots. Now we know why she suddenly couldn’t see H&M after inviting them to spend the night with her. They have been pretending the Q was in charge for the last 2 to 3 years when in fact, they were overruling her and disrespecting her wishes.

  2. equality says:

    Don’t care if she gets it or not. The big point they are all missing is that KC gave his word at the time and agreed. He is proving exactly how good his word is by not giving Ed the title.

    • Snuffles says:

      Charles is living out his lifelong revenge fantasies on EVERYONE he feels has done him wrong or who he feels like his parents loved more. Everything he’s doing is through the lense of what HE wants and not what the monarchy or the UK needs.

      • molly says:

        A broken clock is right twice a day and all because I enjoy watching him punt Andrew into the sun. That’s one grievance I’m happy to see play out.

      • Sugarhere says:

        @Snuffles: “Charles is living out his lifelong revenge fantasies on EVERYONE” = The most accurate diagnosis on Chucky’s pathology, vindictiveness and sadistic enjoyment of hurting others. The old man is barely reigning, since a monarch is expected to make dispassionate decisions grounded on the greater good. “King” Charles has been settling scores like a serial avenger with a kill list:

        -Kill mommy’s horse breeding program
        – Kill Archie’s and Lilibet’s royal titles
        – kill my youngest brother’s royal title
        – Kill my son’s book release, and son and so forth.
        The English king is a mental patient.
        Feeling kind if sad for Sophie. It’s a breach of contract and they cannot press charges.

      • Yvette says:

        @Sugarhere … The decision had already been made not to give Archie the Prince title before Harry and Meghan stepped down from royal duties. That was supposedly one of the ‘lies’ Meghan told during the Oprah interview since, of course, Harry’s children would automatically receive prince and princess titles once Charles became King, don’t you know. I recall how salty Brits and the DM went on and on about Meghan’s ‘ignorance’ about how the Monarchy worked.

      • Flynn says:

        King Charles enters his villain era

    • Tacky says:

      Charles is a small, petty, and greedy man. We knew he would keep the title for himself.

    • esline mills says:

      He also gave his word that Camilla would not be styled Queen Consort, yet here are.

    • Tigerlily says:

      @Equality This!

    • Lorelei says:

      For all of the love and affection they proclaim to have for Elizabeth, the royalists and the press have been pretty quiet about her son blatantly disrespecting her wishes.
      And although I don’t believe Sophie has any fans (let alone “clamoring” ones), at least she works, which is more than KC3 can say for Kate. Sophie does seem to keep up a regular work schedule, even if she doesn’t get a fraction of the coverage that Kate does. Charles is being so short-sighted.

    • Jenna says:

      If QEII wanted the title to go to Edward, why didn’t she give it to him before she died?
      I don’t understand.

      • Feeshalori says:

        Ok, there have been so many explanations about this. The queen did not have the power to give the title to Edward because when Philip the DOE died, Charles inherited his title as the oldest son and heir. That’s according to the laws of inheritance and primogeniture which she could not change. That was not her title, it was given to Philip by her father George VI on their marriage. So once Charles became king, that title and all else of his titles merged back with the crown and he could do with them as he wanted. The only thing the queen and Philip could try to do was have that agreement that when Charles became king, he’d then give Edward the title. And we can all see how that played out.

    • The Recluse says:

      Down the line Chuck is going to wonder where all the public ill will came from and this pettiness will be part of it.
      Saw the report today about the very real threats to Harry and Meghan and how the Royal Family just hung them out in the wind. Thank goodness for Tyler Perry.
      Also…Sophie has fans???

    • Mrs.Krabapple says:

      Why should Charles keep his word? He’s the king, and he will be king until he dies. That’s how monarchies work. These people don’t have to keep their word, or be decent people, or even refrain from raping trafficked girls. There is no comeuppance for them. The British people are too apathetic to do anything about it, and Charles knows that.

  3. Ginger says:

    She has fans?

    • Liz Version 700k says:

      Ginger my question exactly! She has more than a dozen people who care about her title?

      • Jillian says:

        Oh cmon, Sophie bought bots to make these comments. Smart, honestly – the royal crowd is so dumb and backward they might interpret this as “public pressure”

    • OriginalLeigh says:

      Her “fans” are probably bots purchased by the Wessexes…

      • Kingston says:

        Seriously, the wessexes have no money. Neither to buy bots nor dress regal.
        Look at sofiesta in her borrowed regalia. BTW, this is pretty common among the nobility/aristocracy: i:e the keeping up of appearances. They fiercely protect their image, such that if one of them is to represent the whole, then they have to make said one look the part.

        Rmbr the outfits sofiesta wore in all the times we’ve seen her, even in recent times. Rmbr her dresses? Yeah, nothing to talk about. Now here she is all decked out. Peep the shoes! LOL

      • aftershocks says:

        ^^ This appearance by Sophie isn’t really much different than her usual. She looks in good taste here. She has a history of looking very good sometimes, and then poorly put together at other times with clueless choices that don’t enhance her. In other words, Sophie is not consistent sartorially, and she doesn’t have an innate sense of style like Diana had and like Meghan has.

    • Becks1 says:

      I don’t think Sophie has fans, not like Meghan does (even when Meghan was a working royal there were obviously lots of people who were Meghan fans and nothing else).

      But I do think some of the royalists probably like her, IF they think about her. And that’s the thing – I think most people, even royal followers, don’t think about her unless they’re seeing a p[icture of her on their social media or something.

      So that’s why I think its funny the Daily Mail picked some IG or twitter comments and made a whole story about her being DoE. I don’t think even her “fans” care that much lol.

    • BrainFog 💉💉💉😷 says:

      .. paid ones, I strongly assume. This just screams “paid bots” to me.

    • dlc says:

      1. Lol, she may have hundreds of fans, lol. I think all famous people have at least a few. 2. Charles comes out of this looking like a dick. 3. Harry is SO lucky he got with Megan and she helped him get out of this shitshow.

    • ML says:

      Ginger, *snort*!
      On a more serious note, in pictures at events with children, Sophie does a better job than her Paddington-endowed sister in law. In fact, she often photographs better than Kate as well. (She’s patron of various children’s charities pertaining to disabilities.) I honestly have no idea what she’s like in person, but could imagine that among families with, for example, autistic or blind kids, she might have a bit of popularity. Beyond that, no, not really.

    • Cessily says:

      That was exactly my thought..🤣

    • Nanz says:

      Beat me to it.

    • SarahLee says:

      Sophie’s little fingers must be tired from typing all those Instagram comments from her ‘fans.’

    • Esmerelda says:

      My thoughts exactly.

      It’s her own PR, she’s always be heavy handed. Pipe down Sophie.

      “Goody goody” Sophie here grates on my nerves a lot more than Kate does, honestly. The Middletons are at least entertainingly villainous. She’s the ultimate jumped up middle class pick-me.

      Also, not to defend Charles, but I thought that getting the additional and Scottish Earldom of Forfar in 2019 meant that the matter had been settled to everyone’s satisfaction back then. Again, pipe down Sophie.

    • Nadia says:

      I said the same thing aloud after reading the headline. She is a nasty, mean-girl.

    • Renata says:

      Sophie has fans?

      • SussexFan says:

        I just find it amazing how much older, worn, and hard both Sophie and Kate look. Must be great reaching for power…

  4. Emily_C says:

    Charles wants everything all to himself forever and always. It doesn’t matter that it will do nothing for him — what matters to him is that no one else can have it. It’s ridiculously preschool, but also it shows that Charles either doesn’t know or doesn’t care about how to get good pr. Who cares about titles, but obviously these people care — and these people *have* to care. It has to matter to them, or the entire mass delusion falls apart.

  5. girl_ninja says:

    I don’t care either way but seeing how Sophie is quite a mean old girl to Meghan “Oh well.” The energy you give…

  6. Rapunzel says:

    “The Countess of Wessex’s ‘fans’ demand that she receive a title upgrade”? How about QE2 and Prince Philip demanded it? They had it put in writing, apparently.

    The way it has been minimized that Charles is ignoring his dead mother’s expressed written wishes is astounding.

    • ML says:

      Rapunzel, considering KC married Diana because of his parents’ wishes, I actually wonder if QE and PP did not listen to Chuckie and this was their wish not his. Either way, not a good look, but I just am curious as to when and how KC decided differently than agreed.
      I mean, I know it was their wish, but I don’t know if KC was in accord when this decision was originally made.

      • Feeshalori says:

        Hmm, you mean signing under duress scenario? “I didn’t want to, but Mummy and Papa made me sign that nasty agreement!”

  7. Harla A Brazen Hussy says:

    From the reflection in the mirror behind Sophie, one can see who she’s giving the stink eye too.

    Charles is a liar, first he said he wouldn’t marry Camilla, then he swore she wouldn’t be made queen, now he’s refusing Edward the title that he agreed to. Charles’ word means nothing and why anyone trusts him is beyond me.

    • Flowerlake says:

      Yeah and it’s not smart making enemies.

      Even if they don’t openly turn against him, they might let some things slip.

    • Lolo86lf says:

      Not many people will shed a tear when KC3 passes on. She is doing people around him so wrong.

  8. Becks1 says:

    Yeah, there are comments along these lines to basically any post about Sophie now on the royal family social media. the thing about Charlotte getting it didn’t help, even on the Mail most of the comments were like “love her, BUT sophie….”

    I don’t like Sophie after how she publicly treated Meghan (who knows what she was like behind the scenes), but I can dislike Sophie and still think that this is spectacularly shitty of Charles, considering his mother and father’s wishes could not have been more explicit.

    • Noami says:

      exactly this. you can dislike sophie relative to the sussexes (bc she absolutely was complicit in the anti-Meghan campaign) but still acknowledge that she & edward are being done wrong by charles. as a commenter above said, the real red flag here — irrespective of how you feel about the wessexes — is that charles lied; he did not keep his promise to his parents & and his brother and SIL. In this particular situation, Charles’s crappiness trumps Sophie’s crappiness (I like to think of this drama along the lines of real housewives, where they are all horrible but you somewhat sympathize with some of the players in particular situations.)

      • SomeChick says:

        this is exactly how I see them. a reality series in realtime. what will they do next?! it’s the royal housewives of windsor!

      • Margaret says:

        *gigglesnort* I used to think I didn’t watch reality shows, but I’ve just realised I do. The BRF is an enormous source of virtually free entertainment to me and it is a reality show that plays 24/7/365. Every morning I come to my computer and find one or more of them has done something silly or bitchy or otherwise worthy of a gasp or giggle. We see them parading in all manner of fancy clothes and jewels and feathers, and we watch their marriages and funerals and see them going to church and go about other aspects of their lives. Yep, it’s a reality show, and I love it!

        They are not the paragons of virtue they like to pretend they are though. They can’t be trusted to keep their word, as their new leader has just proven by going back on his promise about this title.

      • Becks1 says:

        @Margaret LOL that’s exactly how I describe my royal following to people. Part of it is history, I love history and somewhere along the way I got sucked into British history, especially royal history, so that’s sort of the catalyst for my general interest. But overall, to me, these are my Kardashians or my Real Housewives or whatever. I don’t watch reality shows, I don’t really follow any soap operas anymore (daytime or primetime), etc. The royals are basically my reality drama show.

        For H&M, I follow them bc I genuinely like them and their approach etc, but for the rest of the family, I follow for the shitshow that they are.

    • Haylie says:

      Charles and the Ford Fiesta of royals are both awful racist people. I weep for neither.

      But I will laugh about SoFiesta not becoming DOE after all that Cambridge ass-kissing, shadiness towards Oprah, and a pathetic DOE media campaign before QEII’s body got cold.

      It’s what she deserves.

      • Becks1 says:

        I didn’t say I felt sorry for her, just that this is shitty of Charles, which it is. But at any rate, that is what keeps me from feeling sorry for her (and let’s be honest, even if she seemed to be a wonderful person I’m still not going to feel that sorry for a rich person not getting their title upgrade).

        But there’s a certain sense of irony, or poetic justice, or something, in Sophie going so far out of her way to make it clear that she was Team Firm, and aligning herself with William and Kate especially (against H&M), and then for charles to just be like…..nah. Thanks for your efforts but nope.

  9. Miranda says:

    Forgive my ignorance, and this may have been covered when it first came out that Charles was refusing to give Edward the title, but is there a reason why QEII didn’t/couldn’t make him DoE herself after Philip died? Was it just a matter of decorum or protocol, like it would’ve been considered inappropriate not to wait a certain amount of time? Was it due to her speculated mental decline? Or was it simply that she was incredibly naïve and honestly thought that Charles would follow her wishes, not realizing that he had inherited her own pettiness to that extent?

    • Becks1 says:

      It’s because it wasn’t hers to give. As the oldest son of the Duke of Edinburgh, Charles inherited the title when his father died. When he became king, the title merged with the crown and became available again. So the Queen could not give it while she was still alive.

      The most she could do was put out a statement saying that she and Philip wanted Edward to have it, which……she did.

      • Haylie says:

        QEII also put out a statement saying she wanted Camwhorse to be called Queen. She also put out the “Recollections May Vary” statement.

        I’m suspicious about any statements coming from QEII.

      • Becks1 says:

        At the time of the Wessex wedding, the queen was cognitively all there (i.e. there was no soft regency going on) and Philip was still alive and very much still running things, family-wise. It’s very different from the statements put out over the last year or two.

    • Jessica says:

      When Prince Philip died the Duke of Edinburgh title waa inherited by his oldest son(Charles). Meaning QEII couldn’t give it to anyone. When Charles became King the title merged with the crown and can now be given to someone else.

    • Amy Bee says:

      Titles are inherited by the first born son. So when Philip died it went to Charles. It could have only given to Edward after the Queen died.

    • Rapunzel says:

      The title went to Charles after Phil died. Charles had to become King to free up the title to bestow it on anyone.

    • Miranda says:

      Ahh, thanks everybody! I really should’ve known that. I guess I thought that, being the Queen, she could make her own special rules for that particular title.

    • Popsicle W says:

      I am sorry. I am on Charles side with this one. Elizabeth should have never promised something she could not give. If she wanted Edward to be Duke she should have made him on outright.

      • molly says:

        Yeah, I’m kind of in this boat too. The Wessex wedding was 23+ years ago, and while she had no way of knowing she’d live as long as she did, a LOT has changed since then.

        Elizabeth was hesitant to throw another Dukedom around since she was spectacularly 0-3 in the marriage of her children, but she had to know Charles was a serious threat to eventually do something petty and self-service when he became king.

  10. Amy Bee says:

    Royalists only started paying attention to Sophie after Meghan joined the family so I’m not they can really be considered true fans.

  11. Paulkid says:

    I think it is also telling that the Queen and Philip felt it necessary to put their wishes for the ducal title in writing. It seems they didn’t think much of Chawlz’ word either.

  12. Mtl.ex.pat says:

    Tell me this is fake without telling me this is fake… Quote from the Mail article:

    “Another said: ‘This woman deserves the coronet of duchess! She and her husband have been a strong support to the crown and should receive the title promised to them by the late Prince Philip and Queen Elizabeth!’

    No one talks like that. Especially no one who reads the mail.

    • Haylie says:

      Sophie’s “work” for the royal family isn’t out of the goodness of her heart or duty. It’s her punishment for alleging her husband is gay, trash talking the queen, and having to be bailed out of her failed media empire to the tune of millions.

  13. Pumpkin (Was Sofia) says:

    So the Fail picked a few comments from generic royalists and packaged them as “Sophie fans”. That’s it. That’s the extent of the “demands”. Anyways I do agree that Charles going back on his word/promise to his parents is a shitty thing to do even if I personally, don’t care much for Sophie and think the way she treated Meghan was terribly rude.

  14. Cel2495 says:

    Lol… couldn’t happen to a “lovier” woman. 😂 hope Charles make them sweat a little longer and simply doesn’t give them anything. Sophie aligned herself to those bullies against Meghan now she is just having a little bit of her own chocolate.

    Charles is petty and vindictive and has a long long memory apparently. He has. En waiting a long time to be king and now he is settling scores.

  15. JJ McClay says:

    I don’t see a problem with this. Honestly, I think a slimmed down monarchy (Charles’s vision) is the only hope for securing the future of the royal family. This is a hereditary title, so if Edward gets it, it goes to his son, then his son and so on. Not exactly aligned with a slim monarchy. I think it’s understandable to want to “reclaim” the title and move it closer to the line of succession.

    Then again, I think all these titles are complete bs and the monarchy should be burnt to the ground, so…. *shrug*.

    • Emily_C says:

      It’s not like Charles is slimming the amount of money he gets. He just wants it all to himself/his heir. And if he could keep it all to himself, he would.

      • QuiteContrary says:

        What Emily C said!

        In the royal lexicon, “slimmed-down monarchy” is starting to bug me as much as “never puts a foot wrong.”

    • Becks1 says:

      But giving the title to Louis or Charlotte isn’t really moving it closer to the line of succession. It just seems that way right now. In 25 years, if George is married with kids (which is likely, considering he’ll be mid-30s), then Charlotte is no longer the spare and Louis is just bumped that much farther down the line. They would no longer be in the “direct line of succession.” so why should one of them be the DoE? Eventually they’ll be just like Edward, the younger sibiling of a monarch.

      If given to edward, the title would soon go the way of the Gloucester and Kent dukedoms (at least the way they’re heading) and cease to be royal, so it wouldn’t really have anything to do with the monarchy in a generation.

      • aftershocks says:

        @JJ McClay and @Becks1, this discussion about bringing the title “closer to the line of succession,” doesn’t hold water. Edward is in the line of succession. If you mean the title should be kept for the direct heir, history proves they don’t need it because they inherit other titles. Look at my historical background post down-thread. The first holder of the title in 1726 (Frederick, son of George II), held it for 25 years, but only used it for three years, because he was named Prince of Wales in 1729. His son (George III) had the DoE title for about nine years, but he used the title for only three weeks before being named Prince of Wales by his grandfather. Queen Victoria’s second son, Alfred, held the DoE title for 27 years, before receiving a Germanic dukedom, which took precedence.

        Prince Philip actively held the title for 74 years, and he deserved to have a say in who it gets passed down to. As we know, Charles III inherited the title and held it for over a year, but he never used it because he has so many other titles. Thus, William shouldn’t give the DoE title to his eldest son, George, because he won’t need it. Depending on logistics and how long Charles lives, he could give the DoE title to Louis (or as king, William could), which would be similar to giving it to Edward in that it would eventually become a non-royal title, if Louis marries and has a son.

        Bottom line — at this point, it’s more about sentimentality and respecting Philip’s wishes. Edward was apparently close to his father, and he has also been actively involved in managing Philip’s projects.

    • Kit says:

      I actually agree with Charles here about these titles, however think going forward the Heir should be de only working Royal on de tax payer dime with a Royal title.

      Everyone else in the Winsdor clan including Charlotte and Louis will just have to get a decent Education and a job. They need to look at how the other European Royal Houses are working now and take examples from them. Definitely Sophie nose is out of joint but she simply played it all wrong and backed de wrong horse. Very unlikeable lady.

      • Becks1 says:

        I honestly think that’s what Charles should do, he should announce that going forward, only the direct heir is a working royal (so out of William’s children, it would only be George.) Reach a deal with the current working royals for them to retire at a certain age with a pension (maybe a little less than they’re getting from the SG now). Announce a reduction in the sovereign grant going forward as a result and that in the future the SG will be reduced even more (i.e. when some of the older royals pass.)

        slimming down the working royals without touching the SG or other spending really does nothing.

      • Concern Fae says:

        The problem with that though is that there are so many organizations and events that want a royal patron or a royal person to attend their event.

        The real problem with a ‘slimmed down monarchy’ is who will do the work? Perhaps Charles is thinking that getting rid of all the people who actually work will help hide how lazy W&K are. Because if he thinks he’ll get all the money, without having to share and jettisoning the duties, that may not work out like he plans.

    • Tigerlily says:

      Really though charles not giving Ed DofE title changes nothing. Ed & Sophie’s children aren’t HRH or Princess/Prince. Ed would be a royal Duke but unless James is made HRH Prince James (unlikely) then when he inherited the dukedom it would then be downgraded to a non Royal title. Similar to the current Duke of Gloucester who is HRH Prince Richard (grandson of George V), when Richard passes his son Alexander inherits dukedom. Alex isn’t HRH so it reverts to non Royal title.

    • aftershocks says:

      @JJ McClay: ” … it’s understandable to want to ‘reclaim’ the title and move it closer to the line of succession.”

      Not sure what you mean by ‘reclaim,’ in this context. At this point, the title can be recreated. It can not be ‘reclaimed’ by anyone. After Phil’s death, Charles inherited the DoE title (but never used it b/c he has more titles than he needs). The DoE title is now merged with the crown, so it’s considered extinct or dormant.

      FYI–Background on DoE title: It has been bestowed three times (and inherited once, by Charles, but not used by him b/c he had other titles, and now he’s king). Obviously, Charles’ parents knew had no use for the title, which is another reason why they wanted it to be passed to Edward. The first creation of the DoE title was in 1726 for the eldest son of George II, Frederick (who died b/f his father, thus Frederick’s eldest son ultimately became George III, and the DoE title became dormant).

      The Edinburgh dukedom was created for the second time by Queen Victoria in 1866. It was bestowed on her second son, Alfred, who later inherited a German dukedom, while retaining his British titles. The DoE title was not passed down to Alfred’s only son (b/c his son committed suicide in 1899). Thus, the title became dormant/ extinct again when Alfred died in 1900. Few people realize that it was George VI who created the title for a third time in 1947 for his soon-to-be son-in-law, Philip. It was Betty who designated Philip a British Prince in 1957 (as he had no right to use his Danish/Greek princely title in the UK).

      This historical info should clear up assumptions. The DoE title is once again considered extinct or dormant. Had Charles followed Phil’s and Betty’s wishes, he would have created the DoE title a fourth time for his brother, Edward. That is truly what should happen since that is what Philip and Betty desired.

  16. Maxine Branch says:

    I often wonder in what world does these folks exist. Do they really believe these titles give them credibility. I live in a world where substance and actions define you, not titles. I pity the whole of this institution became they operate in another world which to me is an alternative universe. 21st century folks groveling over titles as if it will define their life and the gutter press whipping this up into a frenzy. While folks are declaring who should or should not have a title as if somehow this will enhance the quality of their lives.

    • aftershocks says:

      ^^ I agree with you @Maxine Branch. Even in checking the history of the title, it’s so obvious how convoluted, random, archaic, and overly entitled the entire process is. Royalty brandishing often meaningless, embiggening titles about. But it’s been going on now for thousands of years and is thus deeply embedded in the British psyche and in its snobby traditions.

      Correction to my previous post: the DoE title was inherited twice, by C-III after Phil died, and initially by George, the eldest son of Frederick, Prince of Wales, the first recipient. Three weeks after inheriting the DoE title upon his father’s death, George’s grandfather (George II) named him Prince of Wales, and nine years later, he became King George III, so he barely used the DoE title.

      Prince Philip held the DoE title longer than previous holders. It’s most associated with him, so his wishes for the title to be passed to his youngest son, Edward, should have been followed.

  17. Mooney says:

    Can we talk about how she still looked so basic and boring? That dress,if shortened, would look better as a daytime dress. And those jewels and tiara simply don’t go with it.

    And well, should have just been neutral,if not nice, with Meghan. Make your bed, you have to lie in it.

  18. Laura D says:

    As mentioned up thread this isn’t about Sophie and Edward not receiving a title, it’s about Charles going against the wishes of his mother and father. It’s about a king tearing up a contract and going against his word. IMHO this shows how little regard the monarch has for anything that doesn’t concern him/her directly. This just supports the belief that no-one who sits on the throne can be trusted. All the crape we hear about honour and loyalty about kings/queens in fairy tales is nonsense.

    Oh and while I’m at it. Did anyone see the recent article about the courtiers latest snub towards H&M? They are now referred to as the Duke and Duchess of Overseas! I put it here because:
    1. I KNEW in that speech about loving H&M and wishing them luck “Overseas” was Charles throwing shade at them. I bloody well knew it.
    2. If Charles can publicly insult his son on national TV why on earth did Sophie and Edward think he would honour the wishes of a father and mother who he really hasn’t had a lot of good things to say about?

    • Jais says:

      The overseas thing is funny. While they think they’re being shady to the Sussexes, TOB is obsessed with going overseas and being popular too. They actually want popularity overseas and internationally so that’s just not the dig they think it is.

    • Feeshalori says:

      The emperor with no clothes, the king with no morals.

  19. JCallas says:

    I wonder if they’re also miffed that Meghan has a higher title than Sophie, especially since she made it quite clear how much she despises her.

    • MsIam says:

      To me, that is the best part of this whole thing, that Sophie must curtsy to Meghan when Harry is around. If Sophie hadn’t been so awful to Meghan then I probably could squeeze out a tear on her behalf. But now? Nah. I think Charles will run the Wessexes ragged and make them pick up all the patronages that the others won’t do.

  20. ML says:

    Beyond H&M, no one in this family is at all sympathetic, although I do sympathize with certain members’ situations at times. This (Sophie, Edward and to be or not to be DoE) is not one of them.
    Admittedly, I am curious as to when KC decided against bequeathing his little brother the title. Did he at first agree and later change his mind? Or was he always against it, but seemingly agreed while his parents (father) was alive knowing he would never give Edward the title?

  21. Brassy Rebel says:

    Charles has broken a promise made by his mother and father which he himself agreed to. Even more concerning for the other royals, he has proven that loyalty won’t be rewarded and may result in humiliation. So, tell me again why Harry and Meghan were wrong to leave.

  22. blue says:

    I can hardly wait for Sandringham Xmas. What if none of the inviteds accept the invite? What could Chuck do – lop off their heads? He could cut their allowances to some degree but none would starve in any case. Speaking of starving, will he still do the old weigh in-and-out? Any of the pudgier relatives should refuse. I thought Andy could break the scales but if this was done when old Edward #7 was around, the scales can probably take the weight.

  23. Chantal says:

    Sophie who?
    Anyway, karma is kicking ass again. C-Rex is alienating family members and potential allies all over the place (except Qatar). The rest of the royals and the establishment should be very worried about this vengeful, petty, greedy, and power tripping king. He really can’t help himself or get out of his own way. If he keeps this up, his only ally will be the pedo prince. Wait, he yanked his security too. Nevermind.

    C-Rex and the War of the Windsors. Let’s go!

  24. TangerineTree says:

    This is C3’s reign. He is king, and he makes the decisions. His parents should have said, “We hope during your reign you give the title to your brother, but of course, that decision will be yours.”
    Ford Fiesta’s “fans” clamoring that she “deserves” the DOE title makes me wonder if they understand the system at all. It is a monarchy not a meritocracy – no one deserves anything. Once W ascends, he will make the decisions (along with his Tory and BM masters, but that is another story). IMO it should be abolished.
    Personally, I hope C3 never caves and E and Fiesta are never elevated. Seeing her so miffed after her groveling is hilarious.

  25. notasugarhere says:


  26. Beverley says:

    Given how horrid Ford Fiesta was to Meghan, how she played along to shun the Duchess during the funeral, how uncomfortable and inept she and Edward were during their own Caribbean Flop Tour, I will lose no sleep over Charles refusing them the DoE title. It’s obvious that they were willing to go full throttle racist and wicked in order to seek favor from W&K and Charles. Yet they have nothing to show for it. Karma works in mysterious ways! This is their big reward for throwing their support to the racist KP branch – nothing. Enjoy remaining lower ranked than Meghan, Sophie. You deserve it..

    • aftershocks says:

      I don’t get all the revenge-minded posts. Plus, I doubt Meghan cares at all. She’s not a vengeful person. I don’t care what happens regarding the DoE title at this point, but out of respect, Phil’s wishes should have been honored. I find some of the Windsor family drama and historical nuances interesting. I’m also beyond happy and relieved for M&H that they courageously got out at the right time!

      Notably, Edward was friendly and talkative with M&H during the 2020 Commonwealth Day service. It was Sophie who followed Kate’s lead in being snotty and disrespectful. Of course, Sophie & Edward cluelessly made unnecessary comments in the aftermath of the Oprah interview, in 2021. But honestly, they are fairly trapped within the royal web without any power or influence. At least, they make concerted efforts to work and earn their keep, unlike W&K.

      It seems to me that S&E have mainly been groveling and sucking up to W&K (not to Chuck), which may yet net them something down the road. S&E probably knew Chuck is not to be trusted. And with the age gap between Edward and Charles, they certainly have never been close.

  27. Jess says:

    I don’t see why they can’t have the title. It’s not like it’s the only Dukedom left and nothing will be left for George and Louis. Charles is being petty and it will eventually haunt him with the Wessexes start to pull back.

    • MsIam says:

      Charles knows he has his siblings right where he wants them. None of them have enough money to maintain their lifestyles, unless the queen and Philip left them a load of cash. When he says jump, they will all say “How high?” Charles is a big time control freak and I think that is why he hated Diana, he couldn’t really control her so he looked for other ways to hurt her. Same with Harry, he can’t control him so he looks for other ways to hurt him, like the thing with the kids titles or the way Harry was treated during the queen’s funeral.

    • Jenna says:

      Or maybe give them a different title than Edinburgh?
      Why wasn’t Edward a prince when all his siblings are?

      • Feeshalori says:

        Edward is a prince and is also the Earl of Wessex and Forfar. He received his title on the occasion of his marriage, Forfar being added afterwards for his 50th birthday, l think.

  28. katherine says:

    is it just me or has the royal family account limited comments on their instagram? Because if they’re doing that over this, WOW. Also, this is just another example of how the family has always been a huge toxic, dysfunctional, infighting, competitive, jealous mess. Imagine being the oldest brother and treating your youngest brother like this. Having a life-long grudge and powertripping over something your parents both wanted. So glad Meghan and Harry are far away from all of the BRF’s petty BS.

  29. February Pisces says:

    Charles isn’t going to give them the title just like that because he doesn’t do anything for anyone without getting something in return. Sophie and Edward have nothing to give. Charles may give it to them when he wants something. Until then, he’ll dangle that title in from of them and willie like a carrot, offering it to the highest bidder.

    Also Sophie doesn’t have fans, her only fans are those who love it when her and keen band together to mean girl against Meghan in church. If it’s Sophie vs the other royals I don’t think she stands much chance.

    • SueBarbri33 says:

      Yep, this is the biggest problem. Edward and Sophie have no value. They can’t do anything and they have nothing to offer. No sizzle. He’s boring as heck and she never bothers to conceal her thirst and it’s a bad combination for royalty. There’s something needy and undignified about both of them, the way they always seem to be asking for something or disappointed or whatever. Like last week at the big shin-dig at the palace–they were both sulking because they’d probably heard that they wouldn’t be made DoE, but wouldn’t it have been better to put your shoulders back and hold your head high?

  30. crazyoldlady says:

    We need a royal family video game where players are assigned a peerage level, given a list of initiatives to complete and some amount of houses and money, and also assigned some debt and laggard family members. The players would form dynamic teams with other players (who are at the same or different peerage levels and who also have similarly aligned or misaligned initiatives) that change as drama happens as players work to complete their initiatives, and players gain and lose peerage levels based on drama – and the peerage rules (which depending on who is in charge – can also be moderately modified) depending on how a player does they can earn points to buy media and royal family staff that serve as fighters that can then be used to attack other players, complete work towards the initiatives, etc.

  31. Vanessa says:

    Sophie doesn’t have any fans if you did a poll asking people how many kids did Elizabeth have most people assume she only have three .Edward is the forgot one Sophie is stale boring she had to hire her own photographers to take her pictures in New York City that the only way she got attention she literally brought and paid for someone to take her pictures. This is pure karma Sophie and Edward had made complete fools of themselves kissing the Cambridge’s ass especially Sophie with her little digs towards Oprah in that interview she did when she thought she was being cleverly saying Oprah who then Twitter came back with Recipes which Sophie was praises Oprah back In day . Sophie was a complete mean girl towards Meghan during her time in England then during the funeral. Sophie and Edward are so desperate for Charles to pick them it’s fun to see I hope Charles never gives them their upgrades title it fun to see how Meghan will always have title higher than basic mean girl Sophie no matter how many times Sophie has tried with her pick me energy she will never have what she wants the most the title .

  32. Feebee says:

    Not a fan of Sophie and her just-sucked-on-a-lemon-faces she likes to make particularly on a job where Meghan was present *however* she and Edward do work, sometimes they even make the papers doing this work and in this sense Charles needs them more than they need him. I know people can say well he could just cut them off but then who’s going to pick up the slack? His ~74yo sister? The Waleses? Haha. Yeah ok.

    And the big thing – the late Queen and previous DOE in conjunction with Charlie said the title would go to Edward. It was in writing. And no one seems to have a problem with Charlie’s word being worthless.

  33. Plums says:

    Lady signed a long term bearding contract and toed the company line for decades in exchange for that title. Charles is hilariously petty.

  34. ThandieLand says:

    she has fans? i thought that was gouche?

  35. lanne says:

    Perhaps Duchess of Edinburgh is too elevated for our dear, sensible Ford Fiesta. A more appropriate title might be Administrative secretary for the PTA, or Delegate at Large at the Municiple Town Council. A nice, sensible title for our not-so-nice, sensible Sofiesta. Mustn’t rise above your station, darling.

  36. Cerys says:

    I don’t know or really care whether Sophie has fans or not but she does her fair share of often unglamorous royal duties which is more than can be said for certain other more high-profile royals. If giving the DoE title to Edward was the wish of the Queen and Prince Philip then it is very petty of Charles to not honour that wish.

  37. MerlinsMom1018 says:

    I’m here to say that in those pictures she’s probably thinking “All that ass kissing to W&K all the rudeness to H&M and look where its got me”

    Hope it was worth it darlin’

  38. dark n stormy says:

    Once upon a time the Mail would have started the story by referring to “loyal subjects” — “royal fans” indicates the Windsor are really just celebs even in their so-called kingdom.

  39. jferber says:

    I’m afraid Sophie is giving incipient Disney villainess vibes in these photos. She’s stealing Kate’s thunder in that department!

  40. L4Frimaire says:

    This woman is ridiculous. I don’t like her, she is lacking in style, is provincial, rude and ignorant. She was completely useless on their Caribbean tour. Don’t care if she what she does. He next title should be thirst queen.

  41. Over it says:

    I didn’t know anyone knew or care about anything sophie related. Really surprised she has fans to be honest.