Isaac Hempstead-Wright on the GoT finale: ‘Life doesn’t have neat, happy endings’


The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge at Chelsea Flower Show

SPOILERS for Game of Thrones.

One of my unanswered questions about the Game of Thrones finale was when Tyrion argued that Bran Stark should be king, and Bran replied, “Why do you think I came all this way?” We know Bran knows the history of Westeros. We know he can warg into a raven and see whatever is happening currently. We also know that he sometimes has vision to see some limited stuff in the future, right? It’s not ALL just history and present, although one could make the argument that Bran still hasn’t fully developed ALL of his Three-Eyed Raven capabilities. But that question he asks of Tyrion… Bran obviously knew that Tyrion would ask him. But how long has Bran known? Did Bran sit back and allow a Kings Landing Holocaust to happen? Did he know the ending of the Long Night? Did he always know that Jon would kill Dany? If he did something or said something to change the future as he saw it, would time collapse in on itself? I guess I don’t understand the “rules” of Bran’s power, and I definitely don’t understand why he was suddenly keen to be King of the Six Kingdoms after basically spending the past two seasons as a robot.

All that being said, the actor Isaac Hempstead-Wright seems charming. He was only 10 years old when he was cast as Bran, and he’s grown up with Bran. He feels strongly about all of this. He tells EW:

On the ending: “Not everyone will be happy. It’s so difficult to finish a series as popular as this without pissing some people off. I don’t think anybody will think it’s predictable and that’s as much as you can hope for. People are going to be angry. There’s going to be a lot of broken hearts. It’s ‘bittersweet,’ exactly as [saga author] George R.R. Martin intended. It’s a fitting conclusion to this epic saga.”

On finding out that Bran will be king: “I’m happy. Though I kind of did want to die and get in one good death scene with an exploding head or something.”

Whether Bran will be a good king: “I think he’ll be a really good king actually. Perhaps there will be something missing in having real emotive leader, which is a useful quality in a king or queen as well. At the same time, you can’t really argue with Bran. He’s like, ‘No, I know everything.’”

[From EW]

Isaac also wrote an essay for The Hollywood Reporter about Bran’s evolution and how life-altering the show was for him personally. He talked about Bran’s journey and how he sees it as more of a parable of slow & steady winning the race:

As for me, I am thrilled with the way the show ends. At the beginning of the show, Bran is a disabled 10-year-old with slim chances of surviving in this harsh universe. He will never be the warrior who comes in on horseback and saves the day, but he is resilient. He survives attempted murder more times than I can count; he journeys with only a handful of other people to one of the most dangerous and northerly points on the map, and he returns one of the most powerful characters in Westeros. I find it an extraordinary character arc to see him go from a vulnerable character totally dependent on others to the one person who holds all the keys to understanding the world. Bran becoming king is a victory for the still and considered people of this world, who too often get side-lined by the commotion of those who are louder and more reactionary. He doesn’t shout to make himself heard, but instead waits and chooses his words and actions very carefully. In that, I think Bran presents a valuable reminder to us all in this day and age where sensationalism is rife and anybody can voice an opinion to millions, to sit and consider things a little more carefully.

The ending of the show has been dramatic and unexpected. Witnessing Dany descend into primal anger is hard indeed, and I can see why people took it to heart. But Thrones is at its best when it does things that hurt us — Hodor’s death, for example — and episodes five and six of the final season are no different. There is perhaps no harder scene to watch than when Jon kills the woman he loves in the hope that it might save the kingdom. It is an impossibly difficult decision to make, and the jury is out on whether it was the right thing to do — and we will never know.

Life doesn’t have neat, happy endings; it is ambiguous and ultimately inconsequential. To end Game of Thrones with uncertainty is perhaps the most honest way to end a story so vast and complex — and that uncertainty is what we all feel as we begin our life after Thrones.

[From THR]

I agree that “Life doesn’t have neat, happy endings; it is ambiguous and ultimately inconsequential.” But that’s what bugged me about Tyrion seemingly pulling Bran’s name out of the air and arguing that he should be king – Tyrion’s reasoning about “he has a good story” is utter bullsh-t and a complete rewrite on nearly every other character’s journey. Putting Bran on the (proverbial) throne WAS too neat, too happy, too “welp, we wrapped this up with a bow!” Also, it’s pretty rich to claim “but it’s realistic!” about a show involving magic, dragons and fire spells.

The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge at Chelsea Flower Show

The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge at Chelsea Flower Show

Photos courtesy of HBO/Game of Thrones.

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95 Responses to “Isaac Hempstead-Wright on the GoT finale: ‘Life doesn’t have neat, happy endings’”

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  1. Oh No says:

    At this point the actors don’t really need to explain anything to the fans. It wasn’t good writing and if their goal was content over substance, then they deserve all of the applause.

    These actors should stop trying to force us to accept this crap ending, because it doesn’t even sound like they do.

    Y’all knew it wasn’t good, stop trying to hype it up to everyone else because you got played like the rest of us

    • Kit says:

      I just read GRRM’s blog about the end of the show ( http://georgerrmartin.com/notablog/ ) and now I’m thinking this was part of the plan, it is really a great incentive for people to buy the books to get an alternative ending (as he says here, it won’t be exactly the same). Then again he lists a ton of other projects he is working on now, writing is maybe not a priority.

    • buensenso says:

      I think it’s a brilliant ending for bran to become the king. while all the others were aggressive and greedy, he was underestimated and then this ending…it’s kind of glorious. I’m very happy with this.

    • Mrs.Krabapple says:

      Maybe I could have accepted the crappy ending if they showed Bran at least TRYING to stop Dany’s destruction of King’s Landing. The way it played out, Bran allowed this mass slaughter knowing that it would lead to him being king. I know the message is probably “there are no good people” in Westeros, but I didn’t expect the Starks to turn out to be the real villains of the story. When they all laughed at Sam’s idea that the people should decide who leads them, it was the nail on the coffin. The people will continue to be ruled by tyrants . . . only those tyrants are now named “Stark.” I don’t doubt there will be another rebellion soon, but I’ve lost interest in any sequels.

    • Patty says:

      Says the guy who thought the final script was a joke.

  2. IlsaLund says:

    I think the writers made Bran too much of a robot…too unfeeling these past two years. And he was supposed to be this all knowing being and didn’t do crap to help out. Maybe if they’d shown Bran giving counsel and sharing what he knew with others it would have helped to build the case for him being chosen as king. Again, I think it all boils down to lazy writing and rushing to finish the show. It would have been better if it’d been given more time.

    Lainey linked to this article which shares an interesting perspective:

    The Real Reason Fans Hate the Last Season of Game of Thrones
    https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/the-real-reason-fans-hate-the-last-season-of-game-of-thrones/

    • Bella DuPont says:

      I think Bran has the potential to be a useful part of the council (as another commenter mentioned), but definitely not as King. You need a wider skill set than he’s displayed so far. (Ruthlessness, for one).

      The biggest problem is his lack of interest in the present and the consequences are immediately obvious. For example, Tyrion repaying his personal debt to an assassin by 1) Gifting him the largest and wealthiest region, Highgarden 2) Bringing said sellsword/assassin into the small council! The obvious corruption is not called out or checked because the King doesn’t even care enough to sit through the meetings. He pisses off to warg a dragon as soon as shit gets boring. I can’t even.

      • Agirlandherdog says:

        You bring up some excellent points. I was a frequent commentor for GoT stuff, but quite frankly, this is the first post I’ve bothered to read since the finale aired because quite frankly, it’s done, it was terrible, and I’m not wasting any more time on it. I do feel pretty bad for the actors who poured a decade of their lives into this, only for the show to bomb at the end. But that’s par for the course with HBO. They spend years building up a show, only to roll over and play dead in the last season.

      • Lala11_7 says:

        I think Bran showed that he’s the most RUTHLESS of them all…. LOL!!!!!!!!

        Politicians need folks like Bron…pitdogs who don’t mind doing dirt and getting dirty…POTUS Obama had one…it was Rahm Emmanuel…and Obama did the EXACT same thing that Tyrion did…gifted Rahm with the City of Chicago…my hometown…where Rahm used his bigotry to further decimate the people there…

        And there you go…

    • Other Renee says:

      Ilsa, thank you for that link. I really enjoyed reading that article.

  3. Incredulous says:

    He’d be a better Hand or Master of Whispers and I’m not sure how a treasonous dwarf gets to assure people that lanky robot dude is a great choice for King unless they are convinced they can push him down the nearest stairs but I wrote neither book nor show. Anyway, now Bran can Pod race.

    Honestly, I could see Bronn on the throne before him.

    • Bella DuPont says:

      After the prisoner Tyrion is aggressively ordered to shut up, the next minute he performs a huge, meaningful monologue and then decides the next king. 🙄

      • chloe says:

        That part cracked me up, Greyworm is telling him to shut up one minute and then intensely listening to his suggestion s on who should be the new king next, the writing was horrible.

  4. llvanslyke says:

    Exactly. And so what if life doesn’t have neat Happy Endings. We aren’t living in a storybook. Game of Thrones is a story. The Writers decided not to take an extra season to let the plot develop so that the endings made sense. They left so many questions unanswered and so many open plot lines. I’m a little bit annoyed at being condescended to by the writers and actors and everybody who says we should have seen this coming. Well, we did see the ending coming. But we saw it coming after it made sense to do so. After an additional season. Whatever.

  5. Bellagio says:

    The moronic fanbase who wants the season rewritten is giving me so much joy. It’s like spoiled children that throw temper tantrum when they don’t get what they want. Thank God we didn’t have social media during Titanic madness.

    • The Dot says:

      Yeah, call people names because they have a different opinion from yours. Super classy.

      I didn’t sign any petitions but I get where they’re coming from. I think most people agree that the ending makes some kind of sense. It’s how the writers got there that is pissing them off. Major plot lines were ignored, a decade’s worth of character development and storytelling were thrown aside, and major plot developments/conversations happened offscreen and ONLY so we could get to the ending as quickly as possible. I think most people feel that D&D were ready to be done and so they half-assed it, and that’s why they’re all so upset.

      • Erinn says:

        There’s a difference between having a different opinion and being absolutely entitled though.

        Are these people who are THAT obsessed with a show that – even with different writing – would have ended the same / was approved by the author going to pay for the season they want redone? Because where the f-ck do they think that money is coming from? Where do they think people who have other projects lined up are going to find the time to reshoot everything/rebuild sets?

        That’s absolutely childish, temper tantrum behavior. It’s fine to be upset about the ending, the writing, whatever. It’s fine to want to vent. But when you’re demanding people give up their planned current/future lives to redo something as idiotic as a television series because you felt robbed by the ending you are an absolute brat and I don’t have an issue with that being called out.

      • The Dot says:

        Those people waited two years and instead of the epic they were expecting (because that’s what HBO and the writers led them to believe they would get), they got some terrible writing and plot lines that didn’t make a lick of sense because all the dots are connected offscreen. I was kinda ambivalent towards Game of Thrones returning, but if I were a super fan who invested years of my life into the show, I might be pissed and want a do-over too.

        And please, can we stop calling people expressing disappointment on reddit and Twitter “temper tantrums”? I’m sure if you shared their POV you wouldn’t want someone shutting you down and dismissing your opinions as moronic or spoiled or entitled.

        As to your silly question about where the money comes from…HBO offered the writers more seasons and a blank check. They turned it down to churn out some half-assed piece of garbage, so the money is OBVIOUSLY there.

      • Becks1 says:

        They aren’t going to redo the season. I get that people are disappointed, but they are not going to redo the season, even if HBO has millions to throw at them to try to make it happen. This is the show. This is how it ends.

      • The Dot says:

        Yes Becks, I doubt anyone signing the petitions actually thinks the season will be redone. They’re blowing off steam and venting their frustration. Give them space, they’ll calm down, and this will be mostly forgotten in two weeks.

      • Bella DuPont says:

        Of course they’re not going to redo the show, that’s a preposterous suggestion (by the fans who are actually serious). Having said that, I think people are entitled to critique to show and express their honest opinions on it, for better or worse. So for example, I should be able to say:

        “The cinematography and score were glorious, but the writing was a big, stinking, festering pile of shit 💩, compared to past seasons”

        …without backlash.

      • Becks1 says:

        @Bella – I get it. People can vent. But saying HBO has millions and there is money there indicates that there is an actual expectation of the show being redone. And its not.

        And some people are absolutely having tantrums about it. You can be annoyed or disappointed by the ending, and you can throw a fit over it. I know a lot of people doing the latter.

      • The Dot says:

        Becks

        I said there were millions available in response to Erin who wanted to know where all the money would come from, which was just laughable. It’s HBO and GoT is their cash cow. OF COURSE the money would be there if it were only a matter of how to finance things. Sorry if I was less than clear; I don’t desire or expect the season to be redone. I DO want people to back off and allow people to express their disappointment without the name calling though.

      • Bellagio says:

        Just write your own show then. I don’t want to insult anyone and I apologize if I did, , but expressing displeasure at a fictional show ending, which the person that wrote the series had in his mind, is next level ridiculous. It is the sole definition of temper tantrum. A child doesn’t get his way, and he or she starts crying. I guess, the adult version is signing an online petition that is futile. Good to know that you can make your idiocy known by signing your name.

      • Bella DuPont says:

        @ Bellagio

        To be honest, I’m right in the middle of a proper temper tantrum and I’d quite like to continue it in peace without all of the interruptions and judgement, thank you very much. 😁

        Besides, has it occurred to you that HBO would much rather have all of this backlash (aka publicity) vs complete insouciance?

      • The Dot says:

        Bellagio

        And calling people names because they disagree with your take on how one should behave when a show ends in terrifically bad fashion *isn’t* a tantrum? Hypocrisy, pot meet kettle, etc etc.

      • Bellagio says:

        @The Dot
        Not really. Calling out the childish behaviour is not akin to throwing a tantrum. Every now and then parents discipline their children when they throw a temper tantrum, but it is far from a tantrum. It is a response to one. You can behave however you want, and as evident from this thread, I will still deem it ridiculous. Just by being a fan or viewer, you are not automatically entitled to creative participation when it comes to the show.
        Very hypocritical, I must admit.

      • Bella DuPont says:

        @ The Dot

        Great points. It’s always baffling when people can’t see how sanctimonious they’re being, no matter how clear it is to everyone else.

    • Louise177 says:

      Nobody actually wants or believes that they will redo the season. People are signing the petition to vent. The writing for GOT has been horrible this season. It’s not so much about the ending of storylines but how they got there. It was so rushed and changing of character arcs/personality was too dramatic.

      • Steff says:

        Yup. Remaking the season never will happen and I hate that people are complaining about the petition like it matters. It was just a way of showing that a lot of people thought it was a garbage season and unacceptable for a show that popular. D&D have always been hacks and you could see the difference in the show’s writing from when they left the books behind.

    • Meghan says:

      I am a casual fan who basically watched this season to be part of the big pop culture moment and even I am disappointed. The last episode was BORING. I did not sign up for the Jon and Tyrion Hour; if I wanted to watch white dudes plan the future I’d turn on CSPAN.

      I feel like the writers lied to the fans, and not in a “just hype it up” way. I mean didn’t they say Ghost was going to do some really cool stuff and then he was barely in it. And again, as a casual fan, I was like “why is Bronn on this council?” And in a show that kills people off left and right only one person died in the finale. Blow em all up, I say.

    • Sayrah says:

      First world problems indeed.

      I love the show and yeah the dialogue left something to be desired in seasons 6-8, but this is what we have. We can dissect whether plot lines make sense and if Jon was justified in murdering Dany but a petition to redo the whole season? phshht

      • buensenso says:

        you got that right. first world problems. I mean, people need to get a grip. it’s a tv show. I was disappointed many times by the decisions some directors made regarding my favorite shows and movies. however, you are sad for a couple of days and then you move on.

    • Maria says:

      Please keep in mind some of us have been waiting for the ending of this saga since before the show was even conceived of. We are likely not getting the books, so this is the best it’ll get?

      I’m pretty sure nobody who signed that petition thinks it’ll be redone.

      The plot points don’t bother most people. It’s the rushed writing, having half the action happen offscreen, ridiculous lines that are totally out of character, no development on half the storylines they’ve built up, no closure or sense of significance whatsoever.

      What happened to Kinvara? What was up with the Lord of Light? No explanation of the time travel Hodor thing to explore Bran’s powers? There was no point to Jon’s heritage except to somehow help kill Daenerys? I could go on and on.

      I think it’s telling that all the actors whose characters had semi-decent endings were super offended at the petition, and Emilia Clarke just said “oh, I hadn’t heard of it!” (I love her)

    • jen says:

      It’s the entitled narcissism that social media has spawned. Dare I remind people that it’s not real life? It’s not even gossip!

  6. Anitas says:

    If anyone should’ve given Bran the Broken speech, it should have been Jon. But again he had no say in his destiny. All those smartasses at the council – his best friend Sam never standing up for him, his siblings who were quick to spill his secret when it suited them – pretending like they have no idea who the rightful king was, “ummm guess we might as well elect one”.

    The writers could’ve made this ending so much more more interesting if they hinted at the Three Eyed Raven possessing Bran’s body to be more of a self-serving character than it is revealed. That he had ulterior motives, that not all is as it seems. But I guess they didn’t, and Isaac confirms it. I guess the writers kind of forgot that Bran had been repeating ad nauseam throughout this season that he’s not Bran anymore and that he can’t be the lord of anything. Suddenly he is back to being Bran again and made the overlord of everything, and it’s supposed to be logical. Right.

    • Lightpurple says:

      But they gave Jon EXACTLY what he wanted. Jon did not want to be king of Westeros. Jon always wanted to be a ranger beyond the Wall, guarding the realm of men. And that’s where he ended, a ranger, in the North, free, not caged by walls or protocol, with his friend Tormund, and his beloved Ghost, guarding the realms of all men and women as the Free Folk return to their homes.

      • Anitas says:

        I said he should’ve been the one to give Bran the Broken speech, not that he should’ve been king. He should have been acknowledged as the rightful and deserving heir to the throne because everyone on that council knew what he was. The fact they all just kept quiet and played idiots is incredible, and it makes his lineage completely pointless. He should have been finally acknowledged by all the great houses as the legitimate heir, not a bastard, and entrusted with power. And then he could’ve given it away to Bran or whomever, to walk away as a free man.

        It doesn’t matter what they gave him. He was exiled. And it’s basically a lucky coincidence he was exiled to the place he likes. He ended up staying exactly what he’d been the whole time to the power players of Westeros: a useful bastard. It’s crazy that writers were more concerned about appeasing an inconsequential character like Grey Worm than completing Jon’s story in at least somewhat satisfying way.

    • bears says:

      All of that lead up to us finding out about Jon’s claim to the throne and then no one even bothered to discuss it at the giant meeting to decide who gets to be king.. so bad. I’m convinced D&D were drunk when they wrote those last two episodes and they should have just gone home.

  7. Wilma says:

    You know, I’ve gone to bat for Bran as the ultimate endgame for years now and that never was a popular opinion. I always felt strongly about the character, having gone through a serious car crash and subsequent injuries, rehabilitation and still having some disabilities as a result. I loved seeing a character going on that journey and I think I inferred from the books that it might be Bran to get to the throne at the end. I also get why it’s an unpopular opinion, dude has turned into a robot, but I think he’s going to be a good king.

    • Coco says:

      I have no problem with Bran being king, I personally think it’s an interesting solution. But the writing?!?!?! We had multiple episodes and seasons dealing with warging and the 3ER story all to be disappear this season. Where did Bran warg to during The Long Night? There was all this buildup about his story over the years and nothing to show for it besides he’s randomly selected as king after barely being part of the past six episodes except for some some throwaway lines and pointlessly warging during the most significant battle of the show where he was used as bait. I’m not mad at the finale but how we got here this season.

    • Linn says:

      How is he going to be a good King?

      At best he’s a robotic creep who tells his sister she looked beautiful while she was raped.
      More likely he let 100.000+ people die although he could have stopped it be warging into Drogon or he even went as far as actively plotting to drive Daenerys to the point of completely madness so he could be King.

      He
      -announced a guy as his Hand who was a complete failure as the job the last time he did it
      -made a greedy Sellsword the Master of Coin
      -he gave independence to one Kingdom which is prone to cause conflict with the other Kingdoms who were fighting for independence in the past and who didn’t get any now.

      The guy is nearly impossible to overthrow as he sees and knows everything and can control people and as the last three-eyed lived for more than 1000 years the time of his ruling is basically unlimited.
      If he turns out to be a bad and/or evil King the whole world of at least continent is screwed for good

      Bran should be at the Citadel and share his knowledge with a bunch of writers so other can learn from it and it won’t be lost if something happens to him without training the last three eyed raven.

  8. aiobhan targaryen says:

    It does if you are a Stark or those POS Tyrion “plot armor” Lanniister and Bronn. Not only do you get to fail upward you get turned into a hero for it.

    Having said that, I don’t really mind Bran being King He is the only Stark I actually enjoyed in the books. If you follow the so called logic of this world, Dr Manhattan Stark is more than likely going to be just as shitty as everyone else was. Or at least the sadistic grimdark logic from the books: no one learns to communicate, anyone can be taken out at anytime, the sins of the parents will stain the children and everyone lives in some loop where the names change but the same mistakes are made.

  9. SM says:

    Tyrion actually gives a motive. He says that Bran never wanted power. In terms of power analysis even ancient Greek philosophers held a view that the best leaders are the ones who do not fancy power. Not only because politics is a hard business (which is why anyone wanting power must be treated with caution; they probably do not comprehend the responsibility it intails), requiring compromises that may put the leader in very unpopular position but also because they will not use the political power to advance their own interests and not utilize all the power at their disposal with the sole goal of staying in power. In this way also the “Why do you think I came all this way?” does not make it obvious that Bran saw into the future and “made” the lady of dragons burn the town down but it may an indication that someone set on the path realizes the meaning of their journey when presented with the opportunity he did not consider as a goal of said journey.

    • Becks1 says:

      I agree, and also, because Bran does know all the stories and histories, he’s going to be a better leader. Leaders cant live in the past, no, but having an understanding of what has happened before can be really powerful and useful, especially in a place like Westeros. And Tyrion says something along those lines, about how he knows all the relationships, etc.

      I don’t think Bran knew all along this was going to happen, but I think once he heard Dany was dead, he probably knew he had a bigger role to play.

    • aiobhan targaryen says:

      Greek philosophers also believed that slavery was natural. No those who don’t seek power don’t always make the best leaders – those who focus on their vision generally do make good leaders though. What is Bran’s vision for the future? He is an emotionally detached other in a human fleshbag. Dr. Manhanttan Stark

      Jon is example of a shitty leader who did not seek out power. It was always foisted on him and he was always relectantly accepting it. He did a half-hearted job of whatever it was that had to be done. He was a stubborn, barely communicative ass who always had to do things his way, even at the cost of others. He rarely listened to criticism, was dismissive, and cold at times. But he kept getting promotions. He failed upward.

      Tyrion should not have any say in the rebuilding of Westeros as he is a liar and traitor. He spent how many years giving Daeny shitty counseling. Before that he was giving counseling to his sadistic nephew and trying to fight to be just as disrepected as his stupid siblings. Tyrion was wrong with Daeny, wrong with Jofferey and wrong here. Tyrion was just as power hungry as his family. How is the man who was working for the other side WILLINGLY for years getting rewarded again.

      • SM says:

        I love it when people envoke “but slaves” as if that completely nullify all the ideas and I always add that women were also treated as second class citizens. Terrible. The slavery was also alive and well when the Declaration of Independence was adopted and it does state that all men are created equal. Do we throw away the Declaration or try to review our habits and practices and laws according to the ideals? Or if you consider yourself a liberal, does that mean you are aware of and free of all and any prejudice you may have or do you consider that people can and do learn along the way? Slavery back in ancient times was a rule of habit. In the end we managed in the modern world to reestablish a democratic rule while realising that equality for all really does mean for all. In the end, even take away the greek part, the argument that power hungry people become tyrants and worst rulers is evident if you look at history of the world.

      • Sheila D says:

        However, Jon’s hair was glorious in the last episode. Thank goodness for the “little” things..😂

      • aiobhan targaryen says:

        And I love it when you pull back the thin veneer of someone who considers themselves to be an academic you see the raging ignorance. Let me remind you, slaves were women too, not just the upper class and the uber rich.

        Yes, it does nullify what they have to say and I actually provided my examples for why they are wrong on that particular subject. You still not have provided one shred of evidence that what you believe is right.

        We were not talking about white women being treated as second class citizens, were we? Why would I need to change the subject. We were talking about your idiotic idea that someone who doesn’t want to rule would make a good ruler.

        I don’t even know where to start with your last comment. There is no justification for slavery. None. Just because a collection of men can come up with an elloquently justification for putting people in bondage does not mean they were right, not was it ok. Your feeble attempt at trying to dismiss me and not tackling my initial response to why I think your argument is wrong is duly noted.

        And yes, we should throw away the constitution and start over so that it reflects what is currently going on in the country. It should say “all people are created equal” It is more inclusive and not just something that benefits one gender and one race.

        “In the end we managed in the modern world to reestablish a democratic rule while realising that equality for all really does mean for all.

        This is a falsehood. If you actually are paying attention to what is going on none of what you wrote is happening. Do you know how many black trans women have been murdered this year alone? Do you know what is happening in Alabama? What has been happening to voter’s rights? Racists activists trying to get rid of affimitive action. First Nation’s land being taken away from them. etc.

        In the end, even take away the greek part, the argument that power hungry people become tyrants and worst rulers is evident if you look at history of the world.”

        Your argument is partially incorrect. Can some power hungry people become tyrants, yes? But some can pull back before they cross a line. This idea that all of our destinies are set in stone once you make a decision is wrong. How are you going to advocate learning, changing, and growing in one sentence and then basically state in another that what you previously wrote is bs?

  10. Incredulous says:

    As an addendum, I will say I find it mildly (mildly) amusing that, ultimately, the fate of the kingdoms going forward has been decided by cripples, bastards and broken things. There is probably a forgotten plot thread about that in the books that shall remain unwritten.

  11. LolaB says:

    Why is Bran so valuable a character because he “holds the realm’s history” or whatever? Do these people not have books? You can write down history in books!

    • DS9 says:

      Those books were mostly in the Sept, yanno, that great big place Cersei blew with wild fire…

      • Anthi says:

        Actually the books are in the citadel of Oldtown, Cercei basically burned Kings Landing cathedral

  12. Becks1 says:

    I rewatched the finale last night and liked it a lot more/ (that’s been true for most episodes this season, I watch it at first, think meh, then rewatch and like it more). Bran as king makes sense – he’s been saying “I’m not a Stark anymore,” so its not like they were putting a Stark on the iron throne. And with the whole “we are going to elect a king or queen,” it means that the ruler isn’t invested in consolidating power for future generations. And because Bran CANT have children, it also makes sense because they WILL have to elect a new ruler when he dies. (except, does the three eye raven die? wasn’t the last one pretty old?)

    I agree that this season was rushed, but not as rushed as some people insist. I think 8 episodes would have made a WORLD of difference – same three episodes to start, fourth episode is all about the aftermath, fifth episode is Dany at KL, losing Rhaegal, etc, and then the 6th episode is the bells, 7th is jon killing dany, and 8th is the wrap up.

    Like I said yesterday, one thing that bugs me is that Jon’s parentage meant nothing. I guess we could say it made Varys turn against her, and made Jon unwilling to “be” with her, and those two things definitely pushed her closer to the edge, but what did it matter beyond that? Varys sent out the ravens, surely other people know at this point; maybe going beyond the wall was a way to keep him safe?

    • Cherie says:

      The only reason I can come up with is that, with KL still smoldering, it would be a really bad time to say oh hey, that’s ok, we have the true Targaryen King over here with a much better claim. The Unsullied and Dothraki would have revolted and the other kingdoms represented would have noped out. Not mentioning Jon”s heritage was one of the few things I thought made sense .

      • Becks1 says:

        @Cherie – I can see that, especially since Jon killed Dany. He didn’t kill her to become king, he killed her because he thought she was dangerous, but if he became king, it would seem like that was why (that he killed her to take the crown.) I just wish that it had been discussed at some point in the last episode – Sansa and Arya agreeing to keep the secret, or something.

        ETA oh and I guess that jon’s fate is similar to that other Targ – the old one he met at the Wall. Aemon? The one who had a claim to the throne and went to the Wall instead. I cant remember the specifics though.

      • Anitas says:

        What about Varys sending letters about Jon? What was the point of that scene if not to indicate the truth about his lineage was spreading? And nobody even tried to bargain with Grey Worm, who really just wanted to GTFO. Kingdoms didn’t nope out when Robert took the throne after killing the previous heir – and that was a rightful heir he killed, unlike Jon who killed the demented usurper – why do you think they would struggle to accept Jon? Didn’t Varys say he was basically a beloved war hero?

        @Becks1 Maester Aemon went to the wall of his own free will. Jon didn’t have a say in the matter.

      • Becks1 says:

        @Anitas – yeah that’s why I think it was weird. Why make such a big deal about Varys sharing the news about Jon if it didn’t go anywhere, or mean anything? I thought there would be more Westeros people rallying around Jon or something. But it never happened.

        Yara did say that she did not forgive Jon, but she seemed to be the only one.

      • Anitas says:

        @Becks1 Yara kind of forgot to push for Ironborn independence at this ideal moment even though they’ve been the most rebellious kingdom in Westeros. She also forgot that the basis of her support to Dany was that the Ironborn are given autonomy, and submitted to Bran with no such stipulations. I’m sure for plot purposes writers would make her forget about Jon too.

      • Becks1 says:

        @Anitas like I said I rewatched it last night and I admit Yara’s face in the scene cracked me up, when Sansa was like “and the north will be free” you could see Yara thinking, “wait we can just demand that?” lololol

    • Iknow says:

      I still believe that there was no one else who could’ve been Queen or King. Dany was tainted. Jon killed her and he is a Targaryen. Sansa, perhaps, but I saw her more of wanting to just keep the North. Arya wants no part of that crap. They needed stability. They needed a steady hand. The realm needed someone who wasn’t concerned about keeping the throne. Constantly worried about who is plotting against him/her. It needed someone to rebuild the kingdom.

  13. Brooke says:

    I was never really a huge Bran fan. His story was always so boring to me compared to the others. Sometimes, I forgot his character was even still alive. So, I never thought he would be king but I don’t hate it. I just wish that Cersei and Jaime lived long enough to see it. I feel like that would have been a great full circle moment.

    I also think maybe his robotic behavior was because he knew how everything would turn out. At the same time, I don’t think he was necessarily robotic as much as he was calmer than the other characters who were usually freaking out around him. There were a few moments that he comes off straight robotic and cold but all of the characters have those moments.

  14. Dina says:

    The more I think about Bran getting picked to be king, the stranger and creepier it seems.

    Say you’re on the council – you know that this man knows everything about you. Every one of your secrets, everything you’ve ever done. Any conversation that you have – including those about him – he’ll know.

    He essentially has 24-7 surveillance of you and everyone in the realm. If defying or deposing him becomes necessary, his powers mean you’ll probably fail. He also has the power to take over people’s minds and control their actions.

    Also, he’s not Bran Stark anymore – you literally know nothing about him.

    How does the 3-eyed raven formally known as Bran Stark define “the greater good”? What does he think is worth sacrificing to achieve that? No one knows.

    I’m honestly confused about how anyone would consider all these factors and say, “Yes, making you king sounds like a good idea. Also, I love utopian movies like Minority Report!”

    • Kris says:

      My thoughts exactly. It blows my mind people continue to think it’s a good idea. I think they’re distracted by the wheelchair and think he’s harmless. Mind control is scarier than someone who can physically come after you. I think folks who read the books are using that knowledge to rationalize it even though that info isn’t available to people watching the show.

    • Jenns says:

      Exactly. It makes no sense. And while I know there is more info in the books, the show did not make a point to explain his abilities. Hell, he was so inconsequential to the plot at one point, that he sat an entire season out.

      And he still should explain what he was doing during the battle at Winterfell other than an impersonation of a house plant.

    • Anitas says:

      Exactly, I just wished the show at least hinted at his ulterior motives, instead of giving us whatever this is.

  15. Iknow says:

    I’ve started rereading the books to see if there are any clues to Bran being end game. And you know what, after the prologue, the book started with Bran. Bran has always been as equal to Daenarys, Jon, Sansa, and Arya. Though Jon, Daenarys and Arya’s journeys have been all physical and Sansa has been growing cunning, Bran’s journey has been different. It’s not exciting, you some times forget about him, but he knew what he needed to do. The Three Eyed Raven warned Bran about interacting with his visions, he saw first hand, with Hodor what can happen when he interferes. My theory is that if Bran got a glimpse of the future, he knew he could not steer anything.

  16. Miss M says:

    Remember Tyrion had a convo with Bran that was not shown…

  17. Miss M says:

    We forget Tyrion and Bran talked and we never saw their convo…

  18. Mabs A'Mabbin says:

    I haven’t read all the posts because so many need shock therapy and perhaps some lithium, but where exactly was Bran’s story to go? He wrapped up the first episode being tossed out a tower. Visions take over. He meets up with travellers explaining he’s the most important person in the world. The audience is given historical references through Bran. He’s the reason we know anything at all. One character’s entire existence was to literally hold a door shut for escape. And while everyone’s discussing the ultimate winner of the game of thrones, he quietly and methodically comes to everyone’s aid albeit short and sweet. He obviously tells Tyrion everything, which is why Tyrion pushes for the most apparent option. His decisions aren’t based on emotion but facts. He’s the three-eyed raven who’s been flying and weaving in and out of episodes the entire show. His character wasn’t going to waste away in or beside a pretty tree.

  19. Jay (the Canadian one) says:

    Life doesn’t have neat happy endings. That’s why we turn to fiction to fulfil that need.

  20. IR says:

    Bran is entirely devoid of feelings. He simply stands by and watches, utterly detached. When he replied to Tyrion “Why do you think I came all this way?”, it comes across like he knew all along what would happen. And he let everything happen (all the carnage, war, suffering) so that he would be king in the end. As if he were a merciless god, playing with the suffering and fate or humankind, as if they were mere pawns. He could also be an AI being – feeling superior to humankind, feeling nothing for them. As if the whole thing had been an experiment. Someone who feels nothing can never be a good ruler. No one would ever follow a robot. All the “Bran” in him is gone – he is a shell, sheltering some sort of AI being.

  21. DS9 says:

    Again, I feel as if I’ve been watching a different story.

    The name wasn’t pulled out of thin air. He was pretty much what was left and he’s a transition king as well.

    To me it seemed as if Tyrion came to respect and admire Sansa. They had several conversations and he saw her response to Daenerys. He’s also a veteran of the Northern rebellion era. So the independent North deal was hella predictable.

    He also knows Davos who learned to read last week, Gendry who was bastard until last week, Arya who is a badass but incredibly restless, Yara who is at heart a reaver, and I’m sure he knows of Edmure who is a damned fool. The Prince of Dorne was appointed last week and no one knows for sure who the rest of those people are.

    And he knows Jon Snow doesn’t want it and knows Grey Worm and the Dothraki better than anyone who remains.

    He also sat down and had at least one good, off screen conversation with Bran before the NK battle.

    Bran will be the only Stark king of the six kingdoms. The rest of the Starks are now possible heirs to an independent kingdom. His kingship gives the other houses time to rebuild, to regain trust and alliances with the other houses and it also seated a council with direct ties and experience from the old ways to bring to the new.

    • Starkiller says:

      Am I the only one who feels like Grey Worm really got the shaft in all this? The guy was dragged from his home to another continent, they killed his queen, they killed his lover, he seems to have suffered a mental break, and what does he get for it? Some land in what is basically a swamp where no one wants to live? What a load of bollocks.

      • DS9 says:

        Which illustrates quite clearly that he was never free. Just like Missandei who’s only possession at her death was a slave collar.

      • chloe says:

        I felt bad for Greyworm, he was used as a slave and then later as a soldier doing all the dirty work, but he also stayed loyal unlike Tyrion and Vary’s and in the end he had nothing to show for it, and I don’t blame him for hating Jon and the other Northerners the Unsullied wasn’t exactly welcomed with open arms.

    • Linn says:

      “Bran will be the only Stark king of the six kingdoms.”

      The last Three Eyed Raven lived more than 1000 year, so yeah that’s a pretty likely to be true.

  22. DS9 says:

    I forgot Robin Arryn but all he’s done is breastfeed for a thousand years and not stand in the way when Littlefinger brought the Vale army to Winterfell

  23. Sof says:

    I got the feeling that the crucial moment of the season was Bran telling Jon it was HIS decision to reveal his identitiy. Had he stayed quiet maybe Daenerys wouldn’t have gone mad with the notion of losing everything, maybe they could have ruled together. But he chose to tell the truth.

  24. CatWomen says:

    The remaining Stark kids were the best GOT players so ending made sense to me.

  25. Molly says:

    The writing of Season 8 is crappy. That’s all that matters.

  26. Molly says:

    On another note I just realized that Night King never did anything wrong, he was just trying to kill Bran to save us all from him becoming King and from this shitty ending.

  27. Peanutbuttr says:

    The story was never going to end with Dany or Jon on the throne. It was always about subverting fantasy tropes and the selfless, heroic outsider and the exiled heir reclaiming her birthright were about as tropey as it could be.

  28. Emilia says:

    I feel bad for Isaac. In recent interviews he’s talked about having to drop out of university because of fans hounding him, apparently his campus address got leaked and people would be waiting outside his door. Now that King Bran is endgame obnoxious fans are going to be harassing him for months, if not years, because they hate the ending and can’t separate actors from their characters.

  29. Moneypenny says:

    “Life doesn’t have neat, happy endings.” Well, life also does not give us dragons and yet, here we are.

    • Cirien says:

      Yeah. This is the BS that The Magicians’ writers gave for killing off Quentin at the end of Season 4…..that life doesn’t always resolve itself tidily, and sometimes you don’t get closure blah fricking blah and it’s. Well sure, but this was bad writing.

      You wanna see how it’s done, read the of Lord of The Rings again.

      That’s how you do a bittersweet, open ending

  30. Miss M says:

    Tyrion’s choice didnt come out of nowhere.
    They met up before the long night episode.

  31. Tiff says:

    I heard a theory about the 3 eyed raven being evil and the Night King being the good guy. Bran keeps saying he’s not Bran anymore and he’s not because the raven ate his brain. He then set it up so he could be on the throne and protected. Since Ravens can live for centuries he set it up so he would rule forever and now looking for Drogon so Jon doesn’t get it (Jon is the Prince that is Promised as he tempered his sword with the heart blood of his love). Basically evil won because everyone is stupid! I’m holding on to this theory because it makes the ending feel better to me.

  32. Skeptical says:

    Yeah kid, I know.

    Life’s not fair but that no excuse for pulling this lame ending for a TV show out of someone’s a ss.

  33. styla says:

    I thought the ending – aka, the last two seasons – were brilliant and perfectly in line with the course of the story. The character development was incredible.

    However, the past two seasons were SO rushed (after a ridiculously long gap between) that none of it is easily digested or particularly enjoyable.

    Also, when people complain about Dany taking a hard right into madness… I think they’re missing the point. There were never any complete heroes on this show. Every character did good and did bad and did the questionable and better still, even the ones who were aware of this potential in them (Ned, Jon) still ended up doing bad or questionable things or got the short end of the stick. This is consistent with real life. Dany was NEVER presented as the “goody” and a lot of the things she did before she got to Westeros made me side eye her. She did good things and she did bad things and ultimately, she did some very bad things and wrote them off as good things. Sorry, but you just believed the propaganda and needed to read the story.

    • Molly says:

      The thing is Daenerys was the most popular female character on the show and was also presented by the makers of the show as one of the lead characters even, so it was reasonable to expect a coherent writing where her storyline wasn’t rushed or made weird jumps just to take character from point A to point B asap because the writers needed it already. Since they didn’t manage to do it, this arc largely failed and most people simply didn’t buy it.

  34. Andrea says:

    I know not everything is neat–but Bran as king felt too neat and made me wonder lots of things. He can see everything so why couldn’t he save some people in KIng’s landing. I honestly just wanted Brienne with Jaime. His character arc deserved it. Not everyone crashes and burns themselves.

  35. Mina says:

    I’ve always find this kind of commentary he’s giving ridiculous. If we wanted to see real life we wouldn’t be watching a show with dragons and fictional kingdoms!