Here’s some photos of Shailene Woodley visiting David Letterman last night. She’s wearing a Valentino dress, and her legs look a thousand miles long. Shailene didn’t say anything super wacky to Letterman, but they did talk about clay eating. I’ve included a clip.
We have other pressing Shailene matters to discuss. We know she thinks of herself as an enlightened soul in tune with the indigenous people. She forages for leeks and dances with hairy pits. She crafts her own weapons from nature. She gives her vadge doses of sunshine. Yet Shailene has no bloody idea how to define the word “feminism.”
Shailene is not alone. Many other starlets don’t know what feminism means. Miley Cyrus thinks that she’s “part of the evolution of feminism” because she flashes her hoo-ha. Selena Gomez thinks feminism means all women should support everything that other women do no matter what. Katy Perry says that feminism “just means that I love myself as a female & I also love men.” Courtney Stodden feels that she is “a true feminist” even though she doesn’t read or write. Cameron Diaz is not big on labels but is “not looking to have all the things that men have.” Let’s turn it over to Shailene:
Is she a feminist? “No because I love men, and I think the idea of ‘raise women to power, take the men away from the power’ is never going to work out because you need balance. With myself, I’m very in touch with my masculine side. And I’m 50 percent feminine and 50 percent masculine, same as I think a lot of us are. And I think that is important to note. And also I think that if men went down and women rose to power, that wouldn’t work either. We have to have a fine balance.”
If not feminism, then what? “My biggest thing is really sisterhood more than feminism. I don’t know how we as women expect men to respect us because we don’t even seem to respect each other. There’s so much jealousy, so much comparison and envy. And ‘This girl did this to me and that girl did that to me.’ And it’s just so silly and heartbreaking in a way. It’s really neat to see: there’s that new Judd Apatow movie, The Other Woman, and that looks really good because I think it’s really neat that it shows women coming together and supporting each other and creating a sisterhood of support for one another versus hating each other for something that somebody else created. They create a sisterhood. And he did something wrong, and they’re, you know. They’re going to go after him for it. I think it’s great.
[From Time]
Shailene doesn’t dig feminism, but she blindly endorses The Other Woman. I haven’t watched the film because Cameron Diaz’s press tour of antiperspirant doom took its toll. Thank goodness. I wouldn’t have enjoyed watching “sisterhood” culminate in making a man sh-t his pants after he ingests a bunch of laxatives. I guess we’ve got a new definition of feminism now. Making cheating men poop their brains out. Go team.
What’s the saddest thing about all of these female role models not knowing the definition of feminism? It’s so easy to check a dictionary or Google the word. If I was a celebrity publicist, all young actresses would know the definition before their first interview. It’s not that difficult.
Here’s that Letterman clip. Dave’s head can’t take the clay eating.
Photos courtesy of WENN
Stupid is as stupid does.
Feminism is taking power away from men. Oh. I was unaware of that. I just want to scream. I don’t like to call people stupid, but I honestly can’t think of a better word in this case. So much for her being harmless.
Maybe we should send this to her:
YOU ARE MISINFORMED. THE END.
Lol. Don’t forget there will be retribution.
I wish, just once, the interviewer would call out one of these idiots and say “uh…that’s NOT what feminism is. if you are unsure of the definition, why don’t we just move on?”
maybe the embarrassment will prompt some of them to actually educate themselves.
She is hella stupid.
Single-celled organisms have more depth and intelligence than this chick.
This makes me feel kind of panicky inside that young girls will read her uninformed and WRONG definition of the word and will believe it!
How did the interviewer not shout, “Feminism IS about balance, ya fool! It is not about putting men down, it is equality!”
Look at our congress and tell me if that balance is reflected there Shailene? With women being over 50% of our population but only 18% of our congressional representatives!
LOL you guys. I need a good laugh today and you are delivering!
Maybe she can’t read… We should e-mail her the definition but in a video form?
feminism /fem.ɪ.nɪ.z ə m/ noun [ U ]
the belief that women should be allowed the same rights, power and opportunities as men and be treated in the same way, or the set of activities intended to achieve this state
She had a lifelong commitment to feminism. (taken from Cambridge Advanced Learner’s Dictionary)
She is frickin saying it in her answer. If the interviewer just stopped her and said, ” Balance, yes, thats what feminists want: balance, equality,” it might go over well.
Her comment made me see red, but I’m so happy to see that I’m not the only one!! Why don’t all of these starlets educated themselves?????
So if feminism is the belief that women = men, men = women as far as treatment and rights, isn’t the very nature of the word feminism anti-equality, because it’s specifying gender? It’s because of feminists/equal rights activists we have mail carriers and flight attendants and not mailmen and stewardesses. It’s like saying “if this equality thing works, we’re going to call the concept ‘ladies’ idea’.“
I’m hereby founding univism. Because separatebutequalism is just too long.
#univism
She would be so much more likeable if she just stopped talking for a very long time. For instance, until she turned 40.
Nope. Until 60 at least…
Of course she’s not a feminist, she loves men. Now can someone explain to me, what does it have to do with anything? Can someone explain to said women that being a feminist has nothing to do with hating men?
@june what can one say… People don’t know what feminism is… and you can’t just open their heads open and stick a dictionary inside it… 🙁
Unfortunately….
Well, we all hate our husbands and sons, you see, and don’t think a world in which human beings can be defined by who they are and what they can offer instead of things such as gender or sexuality or skin colour or…
…it makes me want to cry, reading young women saying this shit. No wonder we live in a world in which over 90% of major corporate CEOs are men and an overwhelming majority of judges, politicians and senior public servants are men. And where national news channels sadly talk about how tragic it is for rapists when they are convicted of multiply attacking an unconscious, underage girl at a party, and how hard it is on their future lives. And a Grand Slam winning woman athlete says it seems kind of unfair and questions whether she was even a virgin. Yeah, feminism is all about men being done down, and the real issue is women being catty to one another. If only women were a bit nicer to each other there’d be no problems left for us, right?
Racism is obviously abhorrent, but at least there was an international outcry, sanctions and condemnation when South Africa legislated to elevate white people and white people alone to full human rights. Not seeing that level of concern regarding the (multiple) nations where women’s suffrage is unequal, their human rights in every area lesser, and in Saudi, women can’t even drive cars, leave the home without male relatives, leave the country without written consent from their male next-of-kin and two princesses can be held captive and nobody can help them. Because they are chattel.
When a young woman talks as this one did, it pretty much serves as an object lesson on why feminism is needed and how powerful the patriarchy is.
Oy vey. Feminism is civil rights for women. Should African-Americans renounce their civil rights because they have white friends?
These young girls and personal definitions of feminism make my teeth itch. I wish Ms. Woodley was on Twitter, I would love to provide her with the actual definition of feminism.
Lol! True.
Then we wonder why there is so much sexism in HW. Look at what comes out of actresses’ mouths these days. Total nonsense.
@Kiddo
I think Forrest Gump would be offended to be compared to this chick.
Why don’t these young women KNOW what the word “feminism” mean? Do a little research or STFU.
Yet another female in Hollywood who has no clue what feminism is. Here’s a tip for you Shai, maybe spend less time sunning your vadge and actually educate yourself on things that matter every once in a while?
Yeah I posted similar below. So thoroughly depressing. The worst part is that this is becoming a trend. Where are these young ladies’ mothers? Why are they not imparting the basic knowledge of what feminism means?
I just don’t get it.
There’s really a huge disconnect there that I find incredibly disheartening.
It is disheartening, I don’t know what kind of world these sort of people grew up in. I always grew up with the notion that feminism was a positive thing and that it was to my benefit, all this talk about man-hating never came up for me when I was growing up and I still don’t understand how Shailene can see equality as an imbalance of some sort. How does that make any sense?
I think it’s a commentary on how successful the right and conservatives have been in that whole feminism aka feminazis=man haters. Sadly, some of the most ardent anti-feminists I know are women.
And for those misogynists that hate/fear feminism, it is all about them fearing men losing their footing. Down from their position of privilege where they get to make more money/control everything, but where everyone is EQUAL for doing the same work with the same skill set regardless of gender. To them being on the same equal playing field with women is the ultimate failure and that is what they fear. Hence all their ‘man hating’ nonsense.
It’s not only that people are uninformed about the term, but I feel very strongly that many in my age group are embarrassed to call themselves feminists because they think it means they are militant about women and women’s rights.
I, too, think that there’s a huge disconnect and it’s sad. Especially because most of us belong to countrys which are educational and support more or less women’s rights, but there are still many countrys in which women have no rights at all.
This is why I taught my daughter early on what feminism is, just as my mother taught me. She is now 9, and my mom asked her if she was a feminist, and she said, “Of course! Girls can do anything boys can do, and boys can do anything girls can do. We’re all equal.”
So if a 9 year-old can figure this out so easily, why can’t these silly star-twits?
@ Dani2
I think these ignorant young ladies assume that the world they grew up in is the one that has always existed. The idea that they have feminists to thank for the rights, opportunities and freedoms they enjoy today never enters their mind.
And it is disheartening, particularly given the push from some on the right to roll those hard won gains back.
My mother passed away a few months ago. I remember her telling us girls what “feminists” are. She said ” It means you are as equal and valuable as a man in every area of life”. That was it. We got it. What are these girls thinking? Why do they equate feminism w man-bashing/man-hating? Why is the oatmeal cookie in Woodley’s head making her spout off about “sisterhood” being preferable to feminism? Someone please get this girl a one-way ticket to Yellowstone park so she can terrorize beavers with her beaver and eat tree bark marinated by deer pee.
Exactly. I grew up knowing what feminism meant and knowing that I AM a feminist, thanks to my mother.
You guys are awesome. I’m going to make today “Appreciate Women Day” in your honor.
ScienceGal, I so agree.
kri, I’m sorry to read your mom just died. She sounds like she was pretty awesome.
Yeah, I’ve known what that word meant – and that it was a good thing to be – since I was in elementary school. I have my problems with my parents, but BOTH of them made sure to teach me that.
(I’m sorry to hear about your mother, kri.)
Brilliant and true, @L.
I didn’t have a mother growing and was basically raised by nuns. They taught me what feminism was. I remember Sister Paul telling me that “girls are no different than boys in terms of capabilities. Girls are infinitely stronger than boys though, because they have to fight for the recognition of their capabilities. Fight on until no one has to fight for equality anymore.”
Mine always told to be self suficient, rely on me, and above all respect myslef and others as equals… Never be below others nor above others… 🙂
My mom always told me to shut up and quit embarrassing her. I’m a slow learner.
@bluhare, I missed this before and it’s cracking me up.
You’re welcome, Kiddo. It’s totally true, too.
So idiotic. She sounds about as dumb as that woman on 20/20 defending Donald Sterling.
These people should ask the interviewer what they mean by feminism. Even if that potentially sounds bad, it’s not nearly as bad as these responses from starlets.
Or better yet when celebs are asked whether or not they are feminists, they should just say “no comment”.
It’s a trend of, “I am a woman thus I get to define anything female-related (like feminism) however I want bc that is my inherent right”
I agree with L.
The conservatives (especially Rush Limbaugh who started the whole “Feminazi” verbiage) have successfully rendered the word “feminist” into a shameful and dirty word. When you say the word feminist, people automatically go to the “well you hate men” card. It is so, so tiresome.
I hear far too many women who cringe in terror at the thought of being called a feminist because they fall for the canard/myth that all feminists are man-hating, hairy legged, lesbians who think the world should be rid of men.
She is an idiot, though.
The only young starlet in recent years who knew what feminsm is was Lorde. I can’t think of anyone else.
I’m with you. I weep for the future of womankind.
I don’t get how they all don’t know these things. She’s older than I am and I’m pretty sure most of my friends know at least what feminsm is.
I seriously worry about my generation, I really do.
I’m around the same age as Shailene-the-beaver-sunner and if there are any women my age who think the same as she does, I truly don’t know what’s going to happen.
Hopefully the suffragette film that’s in production could spark interest in women’s rights again when it comes out.
oh good lord. I had hopes for this one. All dashed upon the rocks now.
Yeah, I still held onto a glimmer of “well, maybe she’s not so bad” and there it went. I’m done with her now.
My dad saw a commercial for that awful ‘secret life of the american teenager’ and was like “I like that girl. She reminds me a bit of you in her looks, Erinn.” I almost died.
MTV (or whatever) could start a new category price for the stupidest actress/actor and breakthrough stupidity act. Shailene would be a strong contender.
And this is why it’s not a good idea to have all your formal education provided on a TV set (Miley, Selena, Shailene).
This girl is going to get to 30 and look back at all these interviews and think….. man, I was an IDIOT!
Is she, though?
Is she a feminist?
“No because I love men”
Yeah ok you can stop right there. You obviously have no f*cking clue what feminism means so please do all of us unabashed feminists a favor and stop talking about something you know ZERO about.
I am so f*cking SICK on these young women who don’t understand the basic concept that lies at the heart of feminism: f*cking equality, you morons.
If you don’t believe that men and women are equal, then you are correct: you are NOT a feminist. It has nothing to do with “hating men”, you f*cking fools.
Gah! I am so stabby right now.
THIS. ^
Now, There’s my OKitt! I think her brain has been overwhelmed by rhizomes and the fumes from airing out her furries.
I can’t wait until she takes some empowering photos with Uncle Terry. /s
@Kiddo
empowering photos with Uncle Terry while touching her “natural” side…She will Kiddo, I’m sure she will…
Totally. Next Stop: Uncle Terry’s Studio of Doom
I wish I could laugh about this but I just can’t. These f*cking toolsheds are out there perpetuating a false idea of what feminism means. Why are these airheads allowed to speak about serious topics?
Maybe Shailene needs to pick up a f*cking book instead of f*cking rhizomes in the f*cking Forest of Brainless Half Wits.
“there’s that new Judd Apatow movie, The Other Woman, and that looks really good because I think it’s really neat that it shows women coming together and supporting each other and creating a sisterhood of support for one another versus hating each other for something that somebody else created. ”
WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT????????????
*bangs head repeatedly against desk*
Yeah Shailene, some sh*tty rom com by a MAN that’s trending at 37 on Metacritic is gonna change the world!! Sit down, Gloria Steinem-all your work was for naught because f*cking Judd Apatow is here to save the day by teaching women about “sisterhood”!
Get me beers like, now. Six of them and make it snappy.
No-scratch that, bring on the cheap vodka-I need it.
@TheOriginalKitten….Uh-oh, it’s not even Thursday yet. But yeah, dumb as a box of crayons.
*rocking back and forth and shaking*
Please make her stop please make her stop please make her stop.
Thank you for debunking Judd Apatow as a feminist leader, TOK.
Word! Sometimes I think these young women think feminist is like being a racist, but against men. Something must be very wrong when it comes to basic education when you still hear people say such dumb things. It takes like five seconds to look up what feminism really means!
No, feminism USED to be about equality. Unfortunately, it’s evolved to become nothing more than a support group for women with persecution complexes and abortion fetishes. Susan B. Anthony would puke if she were alive to see what feminism has turned into.
Bottom line: when women like Marissa Mayer disown feminism, it’s time for feminists to closely examine what’s happened to their cause.
nothing more than a support group for women with persecution complexes and abortion fetishes.
So I see someone has taken a ride to Crazytown and forgot to get off the bus on the trip back.
Regardless of any personal issues you may have with feminism’s current incarnations, it is still MUCH better to self-identify as a feminist than to perpetuate the falsehood that it’s about “hating men”.
Not even sure what you’re talking about with “abortion fetishes”…sounds like some crazy Tea Party sh*t.
EDIT: LOLOL, Kiddo
Marissa Mayer can disown whatever the f-ck she wants, and you can join her too if that’s what you think is best, I wouldn’t be who I am in a world devoid of feminism so you can save that old argument for people like Shailene.
Kiddo, ask the National Organization for Women if you can be pro-life AND a feminist. You know what their answer would be.
Like I said, if Susan B. Anthony (who was completely anti-abortion, by the way) were alive today to see what’s happened to the movement she helped create, she’d puke her guts out.
A few things, first:
fe·tish
noun ˈfe-tish also ˈfē-
: a strong and unusual need or desire for something
: a need or desire for an object, body part, or activity for sexual excitement
: an object that is believed to have magical powers
It doesn’t mean what you think it means.
And yes feminism allows you to decide to procreate, it also allows others to make a different decision. That is called PRO-CHOICE. It allows people the right not to have to follow a particular religious doctrine which was enforced in the early days.
@Dani2 – it’s that very attitude that’s made feminism the fringe movement it is today. You’re still clinging to the 1930s definition of feminism and have made yourself willfully ignorant of the fact that THAT version of feminism died a long time ago.
Most women today DON’T consider themselves feminist. Why? It’s not because THEY don’t know what it means – it’s because YOU don’t know what it means.
Feminism has devolved into something very bizarre and ugly.
Oh @Star. *eyeroll* So by your logic Islam should be eliminated because some Muslims are terrorists and all Christianity should be discarded because of a few fascists? Feminism is literally defined as seeking EQUALITY. If some extremists and right-wing loons have appropriated the word? Fight back!
@Star Susan B. Anthony never wrote or said anything about abortion. There’s not a single paper, article, or speech tied to her. Anthony spent no time on the politics of abortion. As a agnostic, it was of no interest to her, despite living in a society (and a family-her sister had a abortion) where women aborted unwanted pregnancies It’s historical revisionism at its worst. Never mind that Anthony isn’t the end all be all of the feminist movement. Go read up on Margaret Sanger, another early pioneer.
And NOW’s answer would be-Of course you can be personally pro-life for yourself as a INDIVIDUAL, but once you start getting up in other women’s vaginas-all bets are off.
@Star
A. So the basis of your argument is that one single national organisation (NOW) should define what feminism means?
B. I very much doubt that the reason young Hollywood starlets shuns the word feminism is because of the abortion issue.
Well one thing is for sure, you’re not clearing up the definition of feminism by saying it’s about “abortion fetishes”.
I think Dani2 knows exactly what feminism means.
+1, Kiddo
@Star The fact that you have taken feminism and reduced it to women insisting on having control of their bodies is disgusting. Us little ladies should just shut up and look pretty and pop out baby after baby after baby while never leaving the kitchen, amirite?
Because it can never be posted enough, a simple answer to those who say they are not a feminist: Yes you are,
http://tomatonation.com/culture-and-criticism/yes-you-are/
WTF is an abortion fetish?
True feminism is still about equality. People can devalue it, and people can slag it, but feminism is about women being treated equally. Period. End of story.
The fact that people today have twisted the word to mean something different does NOT take away what it was originally about. You might want to ask yourself why that happened too.
@ Star: So you’re taking a minute group of women and applying it to every woman who calls herself a feminist? Please.
I think the others in this thread have answered you appropriately.
The tag of “feminism” has been co-opted by the very conservative who have reissued it as a dirty word.
Yeah conservatives have played a part in that for sure but I think people like Shailene, Katy Perry, Taylor Swift, Gaga, etc are more damaging because young women have more exposure to these pop stars than they do Rush Limbaugh.
Teenage girls listen to what these chicks have to say-they’re not watching Fox News.
Also the much-repeated:
“I’m not a feminist, I’m a humanist” = “I’m a feminist but I’m scared that I’ll alienate my audience by saying so.”
GET SOME F*CKING BALLS.
–I mean ovaries–
GET SOME F*CKING OVARIES.
@Star I do not undertand “abortion fetish”. But you may be right about one thing-clearly these distortions are meant to destroy the truth about feminism and the real message here. Feminism is a very easy concept. Please read the comments above by these amazing people on this post and pass it on to the young women of Hollywood. And thank you all for your kind words concerning my mum. She was a rock star.
Right. NOW owns the rights to the word “feminism.” Did not know that.
hang on…
OK. Sorry, I had to unstick my eyes from rolling back into my head so far.
@TheOriginalKitten, It’s about playing to men. Being the attractive nature girl who really doesn’t try being pretty, it just happens, and “I love guys and I’m just like one, except I’m non- threatening to their power and influence, so they’ll like me”* (see “What about Mary”). This is also my issue with Diaz, although she’s trying to play both sides, albeit largely unsuccessfully. I dislike her (Diaz) mostly for promoting that crap fest of a film as girl power and Woodley for perpetuating the stupid by promoting it as that, as well.
Mia4S, that is a great link. Thank you for posting it.
Star, I shake my head in your general direction. Sigh.
Star, check out the group Feminists for Life sometime. I think you might appreciate their views. They claim to be both pro-life and pro-woman.
@Star say what??? I’m feminist, to start with, and I’m proud of it!! “support group for women with persecution complexes and abortion fetishes”. First of all, doubt there are many women with persecution complexes in modern world, but definitely we want the same rights, the same pay checks, and also the same duties as men.
Secondly: abortion fetishes? Do you even know what a fetish is?? Women, even the ones who agree with abortion (Pro-choice) don’t have a “fetish” on abortion. Women who make abortions (for the many varied reasons: rape, malformation of fetus, danger for their own lives) really have a hard time making that decision; I doubt it is easy on them.
The National Organization for Women say you can’t be pro-life AND a feminist ? I don’t give a f*cking sh*t about what that organization thinks of me or feminism. One can definitely be a feminist and pro-life at the same time; I really don’t get the correlation between the two themes, but I guess they’re just a bunch of fanatics… like so many out there in the world….
And I’m sorry, because some idiots think feminism is related to other things beyond equality between men and women, maybe they should start reading more and spend less time watching “big brother” and “the loser wins”… definitely…. Maybe they’d learn something. AND YES, WE KNOW WHAT FEMINISM IS…
Me, too, stabby. What is wrong with these women?? Feminism is not about taking anything away, you clueless moron. Or about hating men. Gah! I am sick to my stomach.
@Star
Says who? A small group if extremists doesn’t speak for me or any other feminist. And women still don’t receive equal pay for equal work, so how is that a persecution complex? And being pro-choice doesn’t mean I have an abortion fetish. What happened to the feminist cause is women who are afraid to alienate men and couldn’t care less about equality for other women.
“women still don’t receive equal pay for equal work, so how is that a persecution complex”
EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!
It isn’t a problem with perception (aka persecution complex), it is a logical acknowledgement of FACTUAL inequalities that still exist in the US and around the world.
+ everything..
this is truly annoying, open a f-ckin dictionary ya dillhole.
makes me want to shake the sh-t out of these young girls.
“dillhole” made me laugh.
TOK, I agree so much I have to ROAR!!! (And that’s not a Katy Perry roar either for you young uns.)
++++100000
^This! A thousand times. Gah.
TOK
I wouldn’t have been able to say it better in a million years!
Clay eating = pica.
Exactly. I remember reading about it when I was pregnant-apparently some women get it then because of mineral deficiencies. I think she needs to see a doctor.
I IMPLORE HER AGENTS! A NEW PUBLICIST FIRM NOW!!!
or a wadded hemp sock to her mouth either or
Yeah I had a hunch she was an idiot. Now it’s confirmed.
For God’s sake even Wikipedia has a pretty good definition of feminism! I’m sincerely glad I’ve never paid a cent for anything done by this fool, Cyrus, Perry, or Gomez. Diaz…you’re on probation.
I wonder when these girls will get that feminism doesn’t mean you hate men, but that you support equal rights for women -_-.
If she’s not into feminism, why did she do Divergent? I just saw the movie with my little sister and it holds the same vibe as Hunger Games (although not as interesting as HG, IMO).
She did Detergent for the cash and the exposure it’ll give her as an actress, she doesn’t care about things that actually matter
Detergent. LMAO!
I don’t get why these actresses think they aren’t a feminist. Unless you think women should get paid less than men doing the same work with equal quality, then you are a feminist!
That’s what blows my mind – it’s about equality, which I’m guessing they’re all for. They have such a misconstrued or clueless attitude about feminism, they don’t even know what they’re agreeing with or not.
You’d think after 1 or 2 of these starlets got slammed for such comments, the rest of them would learn to simply say “I believe in equality for all” and leave it at that. You could even say “feminism means a lot of different things to different people, but I believe in equality” if you don’t want to attach to the word itself (which shouldn’t be a negative thing but has been twisted in some minds by those who don’t support equality).
Ive got news for you most actresses do get paid less than thier male counterparts
Seriously – of all the industries, entertainment has to be one of the worst. If young women like Shailene haven’t experienced that yet, she should consider herself lucky. Unequal pay, stupid crap like “women aren’t funny” still being said, females expected to not only have talent but be completely perfect looking 24/7, 25 year old actresses cast to be 50 year old actor love interests, casting couch, etc.
That’s not news. which is why Shailene sounds moronic
Omg these bitches just need to stfu.
Wow. She is stupid. Like making -Jessica-Simpson-look-like-an-intellectual level stupid.
So she doesn’t believe in equality? She’s stupid and needs to read a freaking book. There is a lot of reasons to be critical of feminism, but “no because i love men” is the dumbest answer one person could give.
The dumbest.
To be fair she did say she believes in equality and sisterhood. The only problem is she got definition off feminism wrong. Hopefully someone steps her aside explain it to her. There doesn’t need to be name calling on people who don’t understand . Most of them are going what society have been telling them about Feminest . Idk my IMO
I agree that it isn’t nice to call people names, but I think what she said warrants name calling. She’s going to be heard by many young women who admire her and takes what she says seriously. She should educate herself before she opens her big mouth on such an important issue. It’s NOT hard to understand, and her justification for rejecting the term feminist IS stupid.
@goodname. I agree her justification are questionable but im not going to be sending her death threats for it like i have seen already lol. People need just explain to her why she’s wrong. Lets see if her people will
Well, we can certainly agree that death threats are not productive. Lol
Name calling (descriptive nouns, in this case) does not = death threats.
Death threats=mentally imbalanced/unhinged
I can’t get over the hypocrisy of this chick. On the one hand she’s all “I’m down with the natives and I don’t bathe and I dance with hairy pits and eat clay and rhizomes and sun my vadge and I’m half woman half man and I love everyone…” and yet she’s actively pursuing a major Hollywood career with all the perqs that go with it – i.e. fashion, dyed hair, make-up, red carpet walks, money, hordes of fans (well maybe not that part).
Shai, honey, aren’t these the very things you actively and loudly eschew and abhor? And talk about in a nauseatingly sanctimonious and condescending way in all your interviews? Stop spouting nonsense and own it, you’re just as hungry for fame and fortune as any other young movie star.
Agree. Very recently i heard her talk about how she could care less about fashion and was quite condescending towards those who do care, which is the majority of society, male and female, so it really begs the question why are you at the fucking MET BALL if you’re so above it and fame which she vehemently states is so not her. il reiterate a statement i already made about her “The biggest issue i have with her is the high opinion she has of herself as a true artist. She seems to hate commercialism and being strategic in picking roles when blatantly she’s a participant doing that crap divergent and the films to follow (splitting up a piss poor book into two films to capitalize and make MONEY) involvement with spiderman 2 why bother be in 3 scenes with no character development or real purpose without the acceptable excuse of being strategic and it aiding you to green light passion projects . No she’s such an artiste and individual she would never succumb to the man…..
i would consider Mia Wasikowska to be a true artist, she does minimal publicity cause she doesn’t want fame and make choices that are unique and interesting and not Shailene who’s word and action don’t reflect one another. ugh.
It’s the hypocrisy that gnaws at me, the inherent contradiction of being a nature-loving-hippy/Hollywood actress.
I have a friend (who I bring up often on Shailene posts) who believes in all the things Shailene talks about (she’s also a feminist BTW) but the difference between her and Shailene is my friend LIVES it and has been living it for her whole life. I’m talking living a yurt, foraging, shamanism, herbalism, etc.
She doesn’t wear makeup and only wears second-hand or eco-friendly clothes. She is the REAL DEAL. She couldn’t GAF about Hollywood, celeb gossip, or the consumerist lifestyle that Shailene seems to embrace. My friend wouldn’t even consider that way of life because it’s in direct contradiction with her beliefs.
The more I read about Shailene, the more glaring the hypocrisy becomes.
I just don’t see much that’s genuine about this chick.
@TOK
Nothing is genuine at all about her, that is for sure…
Shailene only wears vintage and natural clothes? Meaning a Valentino dress with buttlerflies on it? Lol
What a meaningless, silly lady!
Who did say they’re role model?
They’re singers and actresses, not role models.
They’re not supposed to be intellectuals.
If you look at them for advice in life rather go to a library.
It doesn’t take an intellectual to understand the basic concept of feminism-it really only takes a first grade education.
It drives me mad when successful women say they aren’t feminists – do they realise that, thanks to feminism, that’s why they’re a) permitted to have a job and b) allowed to speak and be heard by thousands of people ? Women in the UK have had the vote for less than a hundred years. Even in my lifetime, women weren’t allowed to get mortgages or bank loans without a male guarantor (and I’m not that old, though I feel like a crone listening to this slip of a woman).
Such short memories and no clue about what happened in history. Maybe she should speak to her grandmothers and great-grandmothers about what life for women was like before feminism. Or like another commenter suggested – look up Wikipedia’s entry on feminism ! And I’m a librarian – I don’t chuck around Wikipedia recommendations lightly !
Yes, exactly. She has no clue that she can do what she is doing only because many feminists fought for those rights in the past.
Oh, for Pete’s sake. Until now, I have defended all of the ridiculous things she has said because she’s right in middle of that “we all think our thoughts are deep, when in actuality they’re just stupid observations that 10 or 20 years later we wish we’d never said” phase of her life, but I cannot abide any woman who declares that she’s not a feminist. This patriarchal society has redefined “feminism” as hairy man-haters who will die a spinster with 20 cats for my generation and the one after that (or are we all still considered Generation Y?) and instead of pushing back against it, they’re all nodding and agreeing and going out into the world like good little Stepford Wives. I think she should spend the next 10 years earning considerably less than each of her male co-workers, and then we’ll see if she’s still “not a feminist.”
The irony of her making this declaration while promoting a movie where she plays a strong female character who spends most of the book bucking the power structure and trying to be the top ranked candidate (which involves besting her male counterparts) in her training program is literally causing me pain.
I am in the same boat, K.B.. I have defended her kookiness because it has seemed so harmless up to this point, but this nonsense that she is spreading is INCREDIBLY harmful.
wow, if she keeps it up at this pace she’ll have a lot to be embarassed of once she hits 30.
She’s not necessarily going to be more self-aware when she’s 30. I know an awful, awful lot of former Shailenes. They don’t necessarily stick with the earth mother thing as they get older, but there doesn’t seem to be much enlightenment, either. They just mature into anti-vaxxers or women who lecture other women for not making their own baby food, or they do a 180 and become very concerned with status and material goods.
I echo everyone’s thoughts above – don’t think I could say “what a moron” any more eloquently.
I would however like to add that The Other Woman was one the least feminist movies I’ve ever seen. No spoilers for anyone who’s still wanting to see it but, the treatment of Kate Upton’s character and how her story ends up pretty much proves that although the (female) screenwriter probably started out with a “yay sisterhood” first draft, the male-dominated Hollywood development process pretty much stamped out any chance this film had of not portraying its women like shrieky, pratfall-happy dumb dumbs.
It didn’t pass the Bechdel test either, did it?
She doesn’t seem particularly well-read. I’m not that much younger than her and I know what feminism means. Then again, I’m a college student that took a gender class. Maybe if she did, she would think otherwise. Or even talk to some of her feminist peers.
When she was going on about eating I was wondering where she got her info from. I think she said the Internet. Which…there’s a lot of information on the web, but there’s also a lot of misinformation.
That said, I tend to think she’ll grow out it whatever she does. I don’t see her hunting for water if she has little kids at home. (Though she’ll have nannies, so…)
I was a feminist when I was a teenager and I didn’t even know it until a teacher called me one. I was always defending my girls even though no other girl would defend my ass or other girls regarding sexuality etc. I was always fighting (almost literally) with all the guys in my class (even the nice guys were raging when I mentioned a married woman should be allowed to continue to wear skirts *gasp*).
It’s a lonely battle but I don’t care. One female teacher called me a feminist (in a good way) and since I felt I was fighting for something good, I immediately knew that I was indeed a feminist. I started reading about it myself. Everybody should learn about feminism. It should be standard. Maybe girls won’t feel ashamed to call themselves feminist once they realise it has nothing to do with how they look or who they’re sexually attracted to. The lack of interest frightens me.
Point is, you don’t need to be academically trained to pick up a book or go to a website.
No, you’re right, I didn’t think of it that way. I was a feminist beforehand, and I only learned more through the class I took. I wrote that wrong. She does seem to think a lot more deeply about environmental problems than I do, which is admirable.
But like you said, she doesn’t need to go to college to learn and be a feminist. She can buy a copy of The Feminine Mystique anytime she wants.
I really need to be mindful of how I write sometimes because I’m too passionate and it can be viewed as aggressive. I didn’t disagree with your point of view, I just wanted to add you need to have an education to learn things 🙂
I also agree that she thinks about the environment and she obviously studies it so we know she’s capable and willing to learn things. If only she would put that effort into other important areas we wouldn’t be having this discussion now!
Shailene was my new fave young actor and 2014 really came for in a bad way. Like bye gurl. So disappointing.
What do you mean, a married woman should be allowed to wear skirts? Is that a cultural thing? I’ve never heard of it.
@Virgilia “a married woman should be allowed to wear skirts”, I think Artemis means that some people think that when a woman gets married she should dress “accordingly”… For instance, not wear mini-skirts – you’re a married woman now”…
I also see that type of behaviour / mentality in smaller towns in my country- for instance, a woman whose husband died and is in her 60’s, must wear black for the rest of her life, otherwise people will call her a “happy widow”… Idiotic mentalities…
Is that it @Artemis?
@Nighty & VC:
Correct Nighty :). They were arguing that a girlfriend can wear skirts but not after marriage because she would be their wife so why wear a skirt? That’s just to flirt with other men Uuuughhhhh.
Well, I do come from a small country (Belgium) but we are/should be more advanced than that. We have a good education system and of the best universities so there is no excuse. They were cro-magnon douchebags who fuelled each others sexism. Not that my opinion mattered because I was ‘ugly and a feminist’ so there’s that 😀
@Nighty
I am originally from Italy and in some regions women must wear black for a certain time after their husbands’ death, no matter how old they are. In the Italian law system there is now a particular kind of law which could be translated in “female homicide” because it is related to the high number of women killed by husbands/boyfriends/partners or exes.
She’s all about sunning her vagina, but isn’t enlightened about what being a feminist really means?
My Mother is a modern thinking hippy type (much as Shailene claims to be) and a feminist. I recall her telling me from a very young age not to let ANYone tell me I can’t do something simply because I’m a female. She said I can do anything I set my mind to. That is the essence of feminism. Of course I realized (often the hard way) what the rest of it meant as I grew older. If you really think about it the women’s rights movement is not that old and the progress has been slow. It seems we gain something then the powers that be want to backtrack. It’s frustrating. These young ladies need some solid advice from older generations about the movement instead of taking things for granted. Pick up a book or at the very least google Gloria Steinem or Women’s Lib. It’s not that difficult.
That’s pretty much what my mom says—she’s never said the word feminist, but that’s the entire gist of what I’ve been taught. I’ve never been told that I can’t do something because I’m a woman. All of us–male and female–have all been taught to be on our own two feet, and not depend on other people to take care of us.
I want to become famous just so I can scream “I’m a Feminist! Feminism is awesome!” in every interview forever.
I don’t know how we as women expect men to respect us because we don’t even seem to respect each other.
Praying for her soul if she thinks that women sitting in a circle and singing kumbaya will make make men respect them. Like, no. Men should be expected to treat women with respect REGARDLESS of how certain women (not all!) treat each other anyway, gtfoh!
I agree totally.
Just because someone can make millions dollars saying the words that someone else wrote does not make them any smarter or any more well informed than the average person. We need to stop expecting these people to have life changing insights into the human condition or life in general just because the make a lot of money.
Has reading been outlawed? These lame-brains, Cam included, act as if it’s verboten. READ!!!
Guys, she’s 22. My understanding of feminism, how I felt about it, and who I was/am was drastically, fundamentally different ten years ago (when I was that age). I mean, sure. Maybe she should be a little better informed considering her role model status that comes with heading up a big YA franchise, but can’t we be a little gentler on the criticism? The girl seems to be, in general, a sweet kid.
Awwww. You’re nice. I sort of agree with you on the one hand, but on the other . . . . . . . no.
Yes, people’s views change and mature, as they should, and she might well be embarrassed in ten years when she reads some of the things she said today. But that’s just it. She’s got a voice, and she should be careful how she uses it.
THIS^^^^
Exactly. What might seem innocent is actually quite damaging.
If you have the public platform, you have a responsibility to not be misinformed.
@Goodnames:
Awwww. You’re nice. I sort of agree with you on the one hand, but on the other . . . . . . . no.
Lmao, drag ha a little bit!
Fact is everybody knows the WORD feminism yet nobody bothers to learn the MEANING. That’s sheer laziness, staying willfully ignorant. Especially because people just love to share their ignorance on this topic a little too much but are offended or confused when you call them out on their stupidity. They care yet they don’t at the same time. It’s baffling!
It’s exactly because she’s so knowledgeable about other things like the environment, that you would expect something more from her. She obviously heard about it yet she didn’t bother to learn about it. Chile plea…You’re a female lead in Hollywood franchise, please educate yourself about feminism because you represent it and you don’t even realise it Shai-Cray.
Sweet doesn’t excuse stupid.
Sorry, no pass just cause she’s 22. 22 isn’t a kid. 22 is old enough to vote, old enough to graduate from college, old enough to know what feminism is.
Honestly, it’s like if someone asked “are you a socialist?” and she replied, “Yeah, I love parties!” So, so dumb.
LOL @ “yeah I love parties!”
LOL!!
Londerland, that was a brilliant comparison!
I knew what feminism stood for when I was 22 – that was almost 40 years ago. I lived through the sixties and seventies, saw and experienced the painful and slow gains that women were fighting for to build credibility, respect and equality. So for some young know-it-all Hollywood twit to spout the nonsense she’s spouting just makes me angry. We paved the way for you honey, so please Read Betty Friedan or Gloria Steinem or Germaine Greer before you make idiotic statements like you seem to be doing every time you open your mouth.
+1000
I don’t feel very gentle about her right now.
I disagree. She should know at 22. It should have come up in her history class in high school. There is a lot of young women who do know. Lorde does. Emma Stone was talking about recently and she’s only a couple years older. Selena Gomez does advocacy for women’s issues.
When I was 22, I was both better informed than her and vastly less confident that I had the right answers. I can forgive her the first to some extent, since she’s been working and may not have been exposed to as much discussion about philosophical and ideological issues (though in the time it takes her to forage, she could read a Wikipedia article about an issue lots of young stars are asked about). I will hold the second against her. I’d find her a lot more tolerable if her woodland child lecturing came with a dash of “of course, I might be wrong.”
I’m 21 and know what it means. I’ve known it since I was around 13. I could give her a pass if she was 15. 22 is way to old for not knowing something like that.
Three worst labels in America: feminist, socialist, atheist.
Well I’m definitely two out of the three..some might even say I’m all three.
No wonder everyone hates me.
Time for a voddie?
So if another hater likes you, does that mean you’re just “meh”?
Nobody hates the Kitten!
I’m just gonna sit in the corner with my double voddie-my only friend.
*sniffs*
Well, then we’re a “sisterhood”… I’m all 3 @kitten.. .. Let’s dance around the bondfire, shall we???
Me too, Kitten. I think the old guard just fears us. 😉
P Power!
The Christian right has brainwashed everyone into thinking these things are evil. Sick. of. it.
The extreme Christian right. I know many Christian women who are enlightened and feminist. And they even deign to hang around me, a lowly pagan. 🙂
I’m Christian, feminist and pro-choice, so please don’t blame all of us for a very vocal, embarrassing segment of our population. It’s very sad for me, because I think my religion has flooded with people and leaders who are steeped in ignorance and hate. I still think the majority of Christians are tolerant and loving, but you only hear about the ones who say things that are outrageous, like submit to your husband, and therefore ” newsworthy.”
Double post
+ 1 GoodNames
My uncle is (VERY) Christian, feminist, pro-choice and very outspoken in favor of gay rights.
It’s the extremists that ruin everything.
I consider myself to be Christian left, personally.
Proud to be one of the most hated people in America. Not sure whether I’m a true atheist, but I don’t like organized religion. Does that count?
Can’t edit, but I meant to say I don’t like the God of organized religion.
@bluhare-“spiritual” maybe?
Do you worship a deity? Do you own a holy text? Do you attend a place of worship? That’s religion.
Atheism is none of those things.
TOK, in order: No, no, no. Unless you count my dictionary of Yiddish insults as a holy text, and the Nordstrom shoe sale as a place of worship.
LOL!
Does Nordstrom have an outerwear sale? Jackets are for me what shoes are for you.
I’m two of those, and pretty sympathetic to a third one. Oh, well. I can be “evil” in good company!
I’m not American but I’m proud to be a feminist and I lean heavily towards the other two. I’m good with being me.
That’s what feminism is you twat. It’s about equality. It has nothing to do with “Women are the better sex”.
Men can be feminist too, Shailene. Feminist is not equal feminine.
I’m a feminist BECAUSE I love men. I have sons and I want them to grow up in a world where they are fully free to be themselves and that can only happen if women are too.
I honestly blame her parents — that there is some bad raising.
Good point, Lisa
*claps*
I will fall in love with the first starlet that knows what the word means. Not some hippy dippy dumb ass.
@Magpie is the name of a comic book caracter… 🙂
And for the crush part, definitely someone who knows what it means… 🙂
waiting…
Goodbye
What a great post and comments! What continues to kill me with some of the female talking heads- if not for those early female broadcasters( and no small number of them were feminists) where would you be?
Now, back to Met Gala posts!
http://www.buzzfeed.com/kellyoakes/are-you-a-feminist
Clickef this link and skipped the article to just say:
Who gives a f*ck about Shalaine Woodley?!!
Can someone please tell me why we automatically assume famous people are role models? She hasn’t earned that kind of image for me. There is no pedestal in my mind that she belongs on. Her opinions mean no more to me than anyone else’s, famous or not.
It’s really unfortunate, though, that young girls will see all this and maybe get the wrong idea about what ‘feminist’ really means. Far too many women seem to equate it with being lesbian or wanting to “remove men from power”. Ridiculous.
Really, equate it with being lesbian? Wow…. Unfortunately, yes, young women will listen to what she’s saying and get the wrong idea… And there’s nothing we can do… About these famous people being role models… it’s what they are for so many, people wnat to be famous like them… Look at Bieber or Miley.. I’d be scared if I had children and they liked these “famous role models”… 🙁
No one assumes celebrities should be role models but that doesn’t mean that there aren’t young women who look up to them or emulate their behavior.
You can’t always choose who your children will idolize but it doesn’t mean you can’t have an opinion about their idols.
That’s all that’s happening here-people have an opinion on what this chick has to say. I don’t think any of us are so deluded as to think that she SHOULD be looked up to-yet many teens may still look up to her.
*shrugs*
OT: perfect response. We’re not looking for role models…but it would be nice if one was smart enough to be.
Oh dear, not another one.
Wow, that is sad. You’re definitely on point about the definition. If she only understood! Equal pay for equal work, equal opportunities etc…You’d really have to be off your rocker not to believe in these things.
As long as a person supports equal rights, is it really *that* bad to reject the label itself?
The fact that every single one of these celebs is giving a different definition of what they think feminism is just shows how loaded and even meaningless the word has become. Everybody here has a similar idea of what the word is *supposed* to mean but the rest of the world seems to have a million other definitions, so I honestly can’t blame people for wanting to shy away from the label.
At the end of the day, shouldn’t the ideals be more important than the semantics?
As someone said very well on a post above… They could just say they believe in equality and not mention the word feminism.
But saying you’re not a feminist and then advocate for the beliefs behind it shows ignorance….
A properly conducted poll (by an independent polling organisation, though it was commissioned by Ms) found 55% of women in the USA identify as feminist – and the younger they are, the more likely. It also found women of colour were more likely to say they were feminists, perhaps because the intersectionality of the discrimination they have to handle underlines both.
http://www.msmagazine.com/winter2013/feministfactor.asp
I think the media endlessly tell us most women don’t think of themselves as feminist. That it’s an unpopular term. And young celebrities seem afraid of alienating by using the label, too. But that may not be reflective of reality – I know quite a lot of young women who aren’t troubled by that identity, if the question is asked.
Rebecca West once commented that, “I myself have never been able to find out precisely what feminism is; I only know that people call me a feminist whenever I express sentiments that differentiate me from a doormat or a prostitute.” More pithily, “feminism is the radical notion that women are people.”
It’s really that simple.
It’s funny that she acts like she’s so edgy and unique, but yet she wears the same fashions as all the other young celebrities and even did the pixie cut that all the young actresses seem to be getting lately.
Ugh.
On another note, I can’t stand her and I HATE that hair cut on her as well. The highlights are also not helping it.
Did it ever even once occur to any of the above posters who are getting really unecessarily, over-the-top-upset about a comment that an actress (and total stranger to you all) made regarding her feelings about feminism was made because it is based on Shailene’s own personal experiences and hers alone? Is she not allowed to have & voice her own opinions if they differ from many of yours? That being said, many women who proudly refer to themselves as feminists ARE perpetually dissatisfied, militant and make it a point to belittle men. I’ve met more of these women myself over the years than I care to mention. I mean hell, I could even point out over a dozen of them just from the comment section on this post alone.
And while no, all those things do not at all define the true meaning of feminism any more than say the FLDS defines being Mormon, you can’t just pretend that those descriptions I’ve given don’t exist, that everyone should ignore them altogether because they’re unflattering, or, better yet, entirely blame the twisting of the meaning of the word on Conservatives. (I mean really, what the f**k is that one about?)
If countless young women today have a twisted sense of the word it is-at the very least in part-because many of those who bear the label are damaging it themselves. Instead of pointing the finger at everyone else, why not band together to make sure that young men and women are both so completely taught the proper meaning of the word & movement that there is no room for error? I mean, when did yelling or a mob mentality ever accomplish anything positive?
And one last thing: feminism is/has always been/should always remain about choices and freedom. Every.single.time there’s an internet post about a woman saying that (gasp!) she does not define or see herself as a feminist everyone starts freaking out and name calling. It’s nuts! Why does all that talk about personal freedom and supporting one another always fly right out the window? Sigh.
If it weren’t for those grumpy, cranky feminists Miss Shailene and her ilk wouldn’t have the right to vote, equal protection under the law, ownership of her freaking body, basic reproductive freedoms, or even the right to the paycheck she works for. She needs to learn about her own history and maybe even read a darn newspaper to see how women less privileged than herself in this country, much less the world, are treated economically and through the criminal justice system. Until she can apprehend that she needs to sit down and shut up because she certainly doesn’t deserve the rights those cranky feminists won for her.
One more thing — your whole little diatribe sounds a little too much like “why don’t you smile, honey.” Ick.
She can have her *opinion* but it would help if she wouldn’t label it as something that it isn’t, ie feminism. Most of the damage to the feminist movement HAS been done by conservatives looking to rob it of its power (like Rush Limbaugh with the ‘feminazis’ thing).
Also all I ever see in this comments section is a bunch of awesome, smart women who aren’t afraid to call it like it is. They would fight for your rights all day and night and you go straight for the ‘angry, hairy armpitted lesbian’ trope. Nice.
I’d say the Andrea Dworkins of the world did more damage to the branding of the feminist movement than the Rush Limbaughs.
Star — what’s wrong with andrea dworkin? She not petite enough for you?
No, it is Dworkin’s misandry that I take issue with. It is the fact that the feminist movement allowed monsters like Dworkin to use feminism as a vessel to spew their hatred that gave the general population the impression that ALL feminists hated men. And instead of standing up to these man-haters, you tacitly approved of their rhetoric through your silence.
This is why young women are disinclined to identify with the term ‘feminist’ – because the Dworkins of the world made it into something ugly. You (the feminists) should despise her; it says a lot that you don’t.
Star — you want me to despise a woman who spoke out against men — and only those — who rape, abuse and exploit women? Are you feeling quite all right? Are you at all familiar with the entire body of Dworkin’s work ? With her life story? I think not — it’s just much easier to rely on that cozy man-hating feminist trope.
Just curious who else you — whoever the heck you are — should stand up against?
Thanks for the laugh, P.J. It’s so adorable how you’re treating Shailene’s comments like they come from a place of well-reasoned introspection—or, you know, actual knowledge.
Lisa and Ange, beautifully said!
Yet here you are getting bent out of shape at the opinions of people YOU don’t know, P.J.
A lot of women here have had to fight the uphill battle against sexism throughout our lives. We are the ones well acquainted with feminism because we have walked the walk and lived the life (“why do you want to be a doctor, Brenna? Just become a nurse and marry a doctor” I was told on numerous occasions during my education.) Ms Woodley can THINK feminism is about not liking men, or about taking away power from men, but she is flat out WRONG and there is nothing wrong with her being called out on that.
We all have voices, and we all use them.
Have you ever been told that it doesn’t matter what you make because you don’t have to support a family? Have you ever been told that you can’t have that job because the other (male) managers won’t like it? Have you ever been in a position of having to put up with men leering and making jokes at meetings? Have you ever had your (married) manager proposition you at the office Christmas party? If you have, and you still aren’t a feminist, I don’t know what I can say. If you haven’t, then the people like me who had ALL THESE THINGS HAPPEN fought your battle for you.
You’re welcome.
Gals and gentlegals….gentlemen, as a feminist (amongst other -ists), I agree with all your points. But maybe having said them, we should address some of P.J’s concerns instead. To quote a cliche Rome wasn’t built in a day.
Let me start by stating why I disagree with Shailene’s comments. I am annoyed that Shailene is redefining a term without knowing what the term meant in the first place. I know words are nothing, action’s speak louder…….etcetra, but until the Women’s Movement chooses to codify manhating/childless/birkenstock/lesbianism as its only membership requirements, then I still hold the original definition of feminism as the true definition.
It is under this definition, that all the gains we have, were fought and won. So maybe we should have another label for those who might be using feminism as an umbrella for nastiness?
Had Shailene brought up some evidence that the original members – as a majority, not some wayward member – had defined feminism as reverse-gender discrimination, I would have less to disagree with her about. If she had done that, I would be worrying about what I had supported being an umbrella for something more nasty.
But as it stands, she didn’t state why she found the ‘true’ definition of feminism problematic/false and she identified with a label that = feminism.
I mean, if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck , and its species is duck……can we rightfully call it anything but a duck?
“So maybe we should have another label for those who might be using feminism as an umbrella for nastiness?”
Exactly.
I understand your POV. If the loudest members of a group are mean, angry, unfulfilled, why should anyone be interested in joining that group. And I agree that feminism has bad eggs within the group, and that those members, perhaps because of their own shrillness or because they are in some sort of spotlight that magnifies the reach of their nastiness, have become the flag-bearers of this group. I find this deeply sad but not surprising. Just like during the civil rights movements, for every handful of people who live and support a healthy respect towards all, there are others, hopefully a smaller handful, who use the label/movement as an umbrella for their spite.
But just as we didn’t dismiss the Civil Right’s movement even though there were people who called themselves ‘Civil RIght Activist” but wanted to kill all white men, we cannot dismiss feminism as being wrong, or bad or misguided. Bad eggs always exist, they are the weeds we must navigate through.
However this does not mean that those of us who belong to the group should simply shake our heads at these bad eggs, or worse dismiss the concerns of those who they’ve impacted and/or hurt. P.J is right that we have a duty to fight back with truth and good examples, to listen to those who have legitimate concerns and to show them how Feminism as a group/movement is fundamentally against actions/laws/attitudes that seek to reduce the respect and humanity that every man and woman, deserves. And to also show them how Feminist ideals has/and will continue to, work to protect them against it.
Not everyone grew up with a relative who understands what Feminism truly means and passed it on them. So when they are questions, we should answer.
Well said.
As a loud and proud feminist, thank you for all the wonderful comments from the sisterhood!
Gives me faith which lately has been diminished by this latest generation of young women who unfortunately have the public attention and the microphone to loudly protest a concept that they know very little about – starting with a basic knowledge of the proper definition of what feminism even means! A few years ago, when my daughter was a teenager and getting flack from her female friends about their perceived negative associations with feminism, I took the opportunity when they were in need of a ride and there fore trapped in my car, to explain to them all the reasons they should be thankful to feminists – I only wish some of these young “entertainers” were along for the trip!
Is equality, equal pay for equal work and equal importance, equal representation and, no to stereotypes and sexualization so hard to understand? But thank you to Beyonce, Miley, Katy, Selena, Shailene etc. for opening up this discussion with your combined ignorance showing the glaring truth of how much work is still needed to be done. And hats off to my beautiful 23 year old daughter Dani who is years and miles ahead of them all!!!♥
I’m nearly 50, and have never been asked if I was a feminist. Why has that suddenly became a question to lob at all female celebrities, and when they answer it in a way others don’t approve of, it’s treated like a McCarthy era type questioning? I was raised with quite a few radical feminists myself, and if asked, my only response would be that I support equality for all. I’m not a religious person, vaguely remember Limbaugh saying the whole “feminazi” thing, and can only speak for myself in saying my distaste for the word comes from my late 60s-early 70s influences. They did not instill in me a desire to emulate their stances. I’ve never felt “lesser” than anyone, male or female, personally. Another issue I feel causes a problem, is this whole “celebrities as a role model,” AKA, lazy parenting. Teach your children about true heroes and role models, it is not the job or function of these folks to educate or be an object to emulate.
The terrible combination of being under-educated and not very smart in the first place.
+1
add to that constantly being told how great, smart and interesting you are by your handlers
it’s a recipe for painful eye-rolling
*face palm
Urgh… I weep for the future.
Side note : why all of a sudden are female celebrities being asked this question??
Of course, part of the problem is there is no hard and fast definition of feminism. There are different classes of feminism. There are the extreme ones that want to do exactly what this smug little girl says. There are those who say men and women should embrace our differences and grow stronger together. There are those who say there are no real differences between women and men. And more. Personally I believe in equal treatment and women getting to do what makes them happy (whether it’s a career in science or being a stay at home mom-both are valid)>
At least now that Divergent is stinking up theatres, the press has laid off the whole “Next Jlaw!!!” thing a bit.
Oh my God. She doesn’t have a single clue what feminism is. Can someone please educate her?